It sound like FTDNA is injudiciously biting the hands that have so obligingly fed it. Please excuse me for rubbing it in, but we simply don't have such problems with our projects (called "groups') at Ancestry.com. As project administrator there, I exercise full approval authority. I'm able to display test results in multiple configurations that I consider helpful. And I fully control material contributed to our group's home page. It's rare when things don't run smoothly; and when they don't, we enjoy the benefit of consistently friendly, responsive and cooperative assistance. Moreover, searches for matches are far easier within Ancestry.com's public data base, and we have the benefit of a superior lab, which provides us more precise test results (including partial STR repeats when applicable) in convenient numerical order. Charles Acree

Charles, Can you elaborate where this "public data base" that can be searched for matches at Ancestry is located? When I have searched Ancestry's DNA links all I get is a name of the person who tested, and (maybe) a haplogroup, and no marker values to compare. For an uncommon surname project I run through FTDNA, only one person of that surname has tested with Ancestry and they are E1b1b1, which makes me suspect they are probably a match with my lineage, but I see no way to see there markers to know for sure, and no way to contact that person. For other surnames, I see multiple "groups" for the same surname. To see the actual results you have to "join" all those groups. I have 27 surnames in which someone with whom I share a common ancestor has tested with FTDNA, and that I follow the projects. There are at least that many more surnames that I wish someone would test. When you take 50 different surnames, and consider all the multiple surname projects you have to "join" at Ancestry just to see the results that's well over 100 projects to join. I consider that chaos the way Ancestry does DNA. Yes, there may be individual projects that are done well (but not for any of my surnames) and having to "join" 100 different projects to see results is ridiculous. For the few I have tried to "join" I usually never get a response from the administrator. Ancestry's "groups" appear more oriented toward if it's not your surname, you can't join and you can't see the results. From what I have seen, Ancestry seems to think people are interested in only their surname, and not the hundreds of other surnames in their ancestry. Rick Saunders ________________________________ From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Charles Acree Sent: Friday, December 03, 2010 4:09 PM To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] join authorization It sound like FTDNA is injudiciously biting the hands that have so obligingly fed it. Please excuse me for rubbing it in, but we simply don't have such problems with our projects (called "groups') at Ancestry.com. As project administrator there, I exercise full approval authority. I'm able to display test results in multiple configurations that I consider helpful. And I fully control material contributed to our group's home page. It's rare when things don't run smoothly; and when they don't, we enjoy the benefit of consistently friendly, responsive and cooperative assistance. Moreover, searches for matches are far easier within Ancestry.com's public data base, and we have the benefit of a superior lab, which provides us more precise test results (including partial STR repeats when applicable) in convenient numerical order. Charles Acree ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ________________________________ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1170 / Virus Database: 426/3294 - Release Date: 12/03/10

I have "authority" over my group, too. What I can't control is whether or not someone gives me their lineage. What do you do if someone doesn't give you their lineage? Withholding membership is the *only* leverage I have, short of kicking them out of the project, which isn't the desired goal. As for Ancestry.com being a "superior lab," I won't bite on that one. Diana > -----Original Message----- > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:y-dna-projects- > bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Charles Acree > Sent: Friday, December 03, 2010 6:09 PM > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] join authorization > > It sound like FTDNA is injudiciously biting the hands that have so obligingly fed it. > Please excuse me for rubbing it in, but we simply don't have such problems with our > projects (called "groups') at Ancestry.com. > > As project administrator there, I exercise full approval authority. I'm able to display test > results in multiple configurations that I consider helpful. And I fully control material > contributed to our group's home page. It's rare when things don't run smoothly; and > when they don't, we enjoy the benefit of consistently friendly, responsive and > cooperative assistance. Moreover, searches for matches are far easier within > Ancestry.com's public data base, and we have the benefit of a superior lab, which > provides us more precise test results (including partial STR repeats when applicable) in > convenient numerical order. > > Charles Acree >

Diane, I respectfully disagree with you. Why must there be reciprocity in a voluntary project? Why must you have leverage over researchers who do not wish to disclose their research? Why must you kick them out if they don't cooperate with your demands? I will agree with you if you're implying that it's frustrating to see 67 alleles without knowing the pedigree associated with the contributor. But it's fallacious reasoning to suggest that participants who don't reveal should not be helped. It's not an either-or; it's a logical choice and one all of us reserve the right to exercise. Put it another way: What is the breadth and depth of data are you willing to disclose to participants who provide fully to you their Y-DNA results? Do you reciprocate and offer them all of your research including those persons still living, or just the deceased? Regards, Gregory Morley On Dec 3, 2010, at 7:23 PM, Diana Gale Matthiesen wrote: I have "authority" over my group, too. What I can't control is whether or not someone gives me their lineage. What do you do if someone doesn't give you their lineage? Withholding membership is the *only* leverage I have, short of kicking them out of the project, which isn't the desired goal. As for Ancestry.com being a "superior lab," I won't bite on that one. Diana > -----Original Message----- > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:y-dna-projects- > bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Charles Acree > Sent: Friday, December 03, 2010 6:09 PM > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] join authorization > > It sound like FTDNA is injudiciously biting the hands that have so obligingly fed it. > Please excuse me for rubbing it in, but we simply don't have such problems with our > projects (called "groups') at Ancestry.com. > > As project administrator there, I exercise full approval authority. I'm able to display test > results in multiple configurations that I consider helpful. And I fully control material > contributed to our group's home page. It's rare when things don't run smoothly; and > when they don't, we enjoy the benefit of consistently friendly, responsive and > cooperative assistance. Moreover, searches for matches are far easier within > Ancestry.com's public data base, and we have the benefit of a superior lab, which > provides us more precise test results (including partial STR repeats when applicable) in > convenient numerical order. > > Charles Acree > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I'm John Blair, Project Administrator for the Blair DNA Project and I completely agree with Diane. The purpose of the Blair DNA Project is to further the genealogical research of the Blair surname (through DNA testing), not simply to provide discounted DNA tests to people with the surname Blair. The Blair DNA Project is a give and take proposition. In order to get something out of the project you must be willing to put something into the project. The primary thing that a participant must put into the project (besides his DNA) is his pedigree chart. He must also allow me to post his kit number, test results, and oldest known Blair ancestor on the Blair DNA website. In return, I promise not give out any other information without the participant's written permission. All participants (especially those with matches) are strongly encouraged to fill out and sign an Information Release Form, allowing me to publish their name, email address and pedigree chart (minus living information). If they don't want their name and email address published I will act as the contact and direct specific member queries to them. If a person is not willing to abide by these requirement or won't provide the pedigree information they will not be allowed in the project and can buy their DNA test directly from FTDNA or some other company and pay the full non-project price. /*Scottish DNA - Better than Life Insurance* /*John* ------------------------------------ John A. Blair Haywards Heath, England _http://blairdna.com_ _mailto:j_blair@blairdna.com_ BLAIR DNA Project Administrator On 12/4/2010 3:29 AM, Gregory Morley wrote: > Diane, I respectfully disagree with you. Why must there be reciprocity in a voluntary project? Why must you have leverage over researchers who do not wish to disclose their research? Why must you kick them out if they don't cooperate with your demands? > > I will agree with you if you're implying that it's frustrating to see 67 alleles without knowing the pedigree associated with the contributor. But it's fallacious reasoning to suggest that participants who don't reveal should not be helped. It's not an either-or; it's a logical choice and one all of us reserve the right to exercise. > > Put it another way: What is the breadth and depth of data are you willing to disclose to participants who provide fully to you their Y-DNA results? Do you reciprocate and offer them all of your research including those persons still living, or just the deceased? > > Regards, > > Gregory Morley > > > > On Dec 3, 2010, at 7:23 PM, Diana Gale Matthiesen wrote: > > I have "authority" over my group, too. What I can't control is whether or not > someone gives me their lineage. What do you do if someone doesn't give you > their lineage? Withholding membership is the *only* leverage I have, short of > kicking them out of the project, which isn't the desired goal. > > As for Ancestry.com being a "superior lab," I won't bite on that one. > > Diana > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:y-dna-projects- >> bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Charles Acree >> Sent: Friday, December 03, 2010 6:09 PM >> To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com >> Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] join authorization >> >> It sound like FTDNA is injudiciously biting the hands that have so obligingly >> > fed it. > >> Please excuse me for rubbing it in, but we simply don't have such problems >> > with our > >> projects (called "groups') at Ancestry.com. >> >> As project administrator there, I exercise full approval authority. I'm able >> > to display test > >> results in multiple configurations that I consider helpful. And I fully >> > control material > >> contributed to our group's home page. It's rare when things don't run >> > smoothly; and > >> when they don't, we enjoy the benefit of consistently friendly, responsive and >> cooperative assistance. Moreover, searches for matches are far easier within >> Ancestry.com's public data base, and we have the benefit of a superior lab, >> > which > >> provides us more precise test results (including partial STR repeats when >> > applicable) in > >> convenient numerical order. >> >> Charles Acree >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > >