Mike, thanks for telling Rick exactly what I was going to tell him! This happened with a man in one of my surname projects as well. Susan (Wales DNA project co-admin) Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Mike W <mwwdna@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Jun 2010 01:29:30 To: <y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R1b1b2 (was roll call) Rick, That was my original approach as well.  I tested 12 at. Nat"l Geno then upgraded to 25. I had no close matches.  I got frustrated and did nothing for awhile. I upgraded to 37 during a sale. I noticed that some my closest people at 25 (albeit not very close) dropped off and a new person appeared. I thought there was no reason to go further but people asked me what my DYS492 was.  Finally I bit the bullet for 67. All prior surnames dropped off but the one new guy at 37.  Two others with his surname also showed up as well as another surname. A pattern became clear as far as a specific region in Wales AND it matched my family folklore. I discovered the STR signature of my cluster.  It turns out the markers from 38 to 67 are critical to many R1b1b2 clusters. All STR's are not equal. On 6/12/10, Fredric Z. Saunders <fzsaund@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > As with everything, there are exceptions. I know what you are saying, as I > have a number of R1b1b2 in one of my projects that are not related to each > other that it takes a minimum 37 markers to tell to which lineage they > belong. > > On the other hand, there are people like me that are projected as R1b1b2 and > have ZERO matches with ANY surname.  I have tested to 37 markers, and don't > match anyone of ANY surname at 12 markers, much less 37. Testing to 67 or > doing a deep clade test isn't going to do anything for me. > > Rick Saunders > > -----Original Message----- > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Mike W > Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2010 5:57 PM > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] Roll Call > > I will dig up some facts but R1b1b2 is truly congested. Deep clade R > testing is a must unless a brother or male cousin has already done so. > With the FTDNA's prediction system, if you are predicted R1b1 or > R1b1b2 you should deep clade test.  Of course STR testing is even more > important.  Sorry but R1b1b2 should go to 67 markers. Do this before > deep clade testing IMHO.   Mike W > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Sent from my mobile device ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

It has happened to me, too, except that the closest relatives are not even classified as matches at the 67 marker level, but when you look at the similarities in 67 marker results, you can see a pattern that is shared by the closest relatives in the databases. Kirsten ----- Original Message ----- From: "Susan Rosine" <basenjiluvr@msn.com> To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2010 9:46:35 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R1b1b2 (was roll call) Mike, thanks for telling Rick exactly what I was going to tell him! This happened with a man in one of my surname projects as well. Susan (Wales DNA project co-admin) Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Mike W <mwwdna@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Jun 2010 01:29:30 To: <y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R1b1b2 (was roll call) Rick, That was my original approach as well. I tested 12 at. Nat"l Geno then upgraded to 25. I had no close matches. I got frustrated and did nothing for awhile. I upgraded to 37 during a sale. I noticed that some my closest people at 25 (albeit not very close) dropped off and a new person appeared. I thought there was no reason to go further but people asked me what my DYS492 was. Finally I bit the bullet for 67. All prior surnames dropped off but the one new guy at 37. Two others with his surname also showed up as well as another surname. A pattern became clear as far as a specific region in Wales AND it matched my family folklore. I discovered the STR signature of my cluster. It turns out the markers from 38 to 67 are critical to many R1b1b2 clusters. All STR's are not equal. On 6/12/10, Fredric Z. Saunders <fzsaund@ix.netcom.com> wrote: > As with everything, there are exceptions. I know what you are saying, as I > have a number of R1b1b2 in one of my projects that are not related to each > other that it takes a minimum 37 markers to tell to which lineage they > belong. > > On the other hand, there are people like me that are projected as R1b1b2 and > have ZERO matches with ANY surname. I have tested to 37 markers, and don't > match anyone of ANY surname at 12 markers, much less 37. Testing to 67 or > doing a deep clade test isn't going to do anything for me. > > Rick Saunders > > -----Original Message----- > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Mike W > Sent: Saturday, June 12, 2010 5:57 PM > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] Roll Call > > I will dig up some facts but R1b1b2 is truly congested. Deep clade R > testing is a must unless a brother or male cousin has already done so. > With the FTDNA's prediction system, if you are predicted R1b1 or > R1b1b2 you should deep clade test. Of course STR testing is even more > important. Sorry but R1b1b2 should go to 67 markers. Do this before > deep clade testing IMHO. Mike W > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Sent from my mobile device ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message