I've recently discovered still another reason, and it's so easy to overcome! I suddenly realized that many people who express interest are terrified of using the internet to place orders. Now I just offer to place the order for them, go to the GAP, select "Add one or more members," choose Invoice mode and it's done. Such a simple fix. Doris On Wed, Jun 16, 2010 at 3:01 AM, <y-dna-projects-request@rootsweb.com>wrote: > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Reasons for not testing (Diana Gale Matthiesen) > 2. Re: R Deep Clade tests (Aaron Hill) > 3. Re: R Deep Clade tests (Karen Johnson) > 4. Re: R Deep Clade tests (Diana Gale Matthiesen) > 5. Re: R Deep Clade tests (dnalister@comcast.net) > 6. Re: R Deep Clade tests (Diana Gale Matthiesen) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 08:25:20 -0400 > From: "Diana Gale Matthiesen" <DianaGM@dgmweb.net> > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] Reasons for not testing > To: <y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com> > Message-ID: <897AE96DDDC14CCAAD8B0FC6EDEC2C26@HP> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > If there is anything that divides people, it's religion, so I'm calling a > halt > to this thread. Anyone who posts to it further will be put on moderation. > If > you have any more to say on this topic, to me or anyone else, please take > it > offlist. I have the last word: > > Yes, some people are against DNA testing because evolution challenges their > religious beliefs. They are not likely to join your project and be tested. > > Diana > Y-DNA-PROJECTS Listadmin > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com On Behalf Of RT > > Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 2:50 AM > > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] Reasons for not testing > > > > Re a a scientific theory that contradicts their > > interpretations of religious scriptures > <snip> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 13:19:18 -0700 > From: Aaron Hill <hillaj@eou.edu> > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: > <AANLkTilKYFhIg4IuguXKuKP7KrK2ui7bIGfajkQztx4o@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Most 'Deep Clade' Tests aren't worth the money. Most haplogroups and > subclades can be accurately determined with enough STR markers. The more > STR > testing the better. For example, if DYS 455 is 8, then the person is > overwhelmingly likely to be haplogroup I1. > > Aaron > > On Mon, Jun 14, 2010 at 5:05 PM, fred westcott <westcott.fred@gmail.com > >wrote: > > > What can I expect on an R Deep Clade test? Does FT test SNP's only > > back to R to confirm what they have predicted, in my case R1b1b2 ? Or > > do they continue testing as far as they can go down the branches ? > > And if so is it possible that beyond M269 if I test negative for L23 > > L49 that I stay at R1b1b2 ? Do some people deadend here,i.e. their > > branch has no further mutations ? Or is it a case of as yet > > undiscovered SNP's ? > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 17:22:18 -0400 > From: Karen Johnson <karenj@ca.inter.net> > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <201006152122.o5FLMT2j031584@mail.rootsweb.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > Diana > When I had my son tested all they checked was M222, and as he was > positive, they just stopped there. After I complained, they added L21. > > Karen > > > >When you order deep SNP testing, FTDNA will look at your haplotype > >and estimate > >what your haplogroup probably is, then design a testing strategy that will > >determine your haplogroup using the fewest possible tests, to keep the > price > >down. If you are deduced to be R1b1b2, they will likely begin the > >testing with > >M269. > >http://dgmweb.net/DNA/SNPcharts/R1b_2010-02-12.shtml > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2010 21:40:17 -0400 > From: "Diana Gale Matthiesen" <DianaGM@dgmweb.net> > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > To: <y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com> > Message-ID: <87E7330B164642E7A64104B4C67A8FEE@HP> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > L21 is upstream of M222: > http://dgmweb.net/DNA/SNPcharts/R1b_2010-02-12.shtml > If you were positive for M222, you didn't need to test L21. IMO, they were > being very gracious by accommodating you. > > This is what I meant when I said they will deduce your haplogroup via your > haplotype, then test the fewest needed SNPs to prove it. If they tested > everyone for all their upstream SNPs (i.e., if they began with M207 and > worked > their way down the haplotree), deep SNP testing would be much more > expensive. > > Diana > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com On Behalf Of Karen Johnson > > Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 5:22 PM > > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > > > > Diana > > When I had my son tested all they checked was M222, and as he was > > positive, they just stopped there. After I complained, they > > added L21. > > > > Karen > > > > > > > When you order deep SNP testing, FTDNA will look at your > > > haplotype and estimate what your haplogroup probably is, > > > then design a testing strategy that will determine your > > > haplogroup using the fewest possible tests, to keep the > > > price down. If you are deduced to be R1b1b2, they will > > > likely begin the testing with M269. > > >http://dgmweb.net/DNA/SNPcharts/R1b_2010-02-12.shtml > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2010 01:48:39 +0000 (UTC) > From: dnalister@comcast.net > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: > < > 86438502.5714371276652919249.JavaMail.root@sz0002a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > They seem to be willing to test a second SNP when they guess right and get > a downstream positive result on their first try, but I think it might be > good strategy to wait until a SNP even further downstream is discovered, and > then see if they will test for that one. Since SNPs can occur at more than > one place in the tree, it's a good policy to at least eventually end up with > results for the most downstream SNP known for a particular branch as well as > one immediately above it on the tree. > > Kirsten > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Diana Gale Matthiesen" <DianaGM@dgmweb.net> > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 9:40:17 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > > L21 is upstream of M222: > http://dgmweb.net/DNA/SNPcharts/R1b_2010-02-12.shtml > If you were positive for M222, you didn't need to test L21. IMO, they were > being very gracious by accommodating you. > > This is what I meant when I said they will deduce your haplogroup via your > haplotype, then test the fewest needed SNPs to prove it. If they tested > everyone for all their upstream SNPs (i.e., if they began with M207 and > worked > their way down the haplotree), deep SNP testing would be much more > expensive. > > Diana > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com On Behalf Of Karen Johnson > > Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 5:22 PM > > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > > > > Diana > > When I had my son tested all they checked was M222, and as he was > > positive, they just stopped there. After I complained, they > > added L21. > > > > Karen > > > > > > > When you order deep SNP testing, FTDNA will look at your > > > haplotype and estimate what your haplogroup probably is, > > > then design a testing strategy that will determine your > > > haplogroup using the fewest possible tests, to keep the > > > price down. If you are deduced to be R1b1b2, they will > > > likely begin the testing with M269. > > >http://dgmweb.net/DNA/SNPcharts/R1b_2010-02-12.shtml > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > Y-DNA-PROJECTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2010 00:35:42 -0400 > From: "Diana Gale Matthiesen" <DianaGM@dgmweb.net> > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > To: <y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com> > Message-ID: <943A079084DC4D4E9E1F56AD7FD62410@HP> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > It's your prerogative to wait to be deep SNP tested until more SNPs are > discovered, but the discovery process is going to go on for years. At what > point do you dive in? And if everyone sits back and waits for that time, > the > hunt for new SNPs will end. If people don't get SNP tested along the > way, > there will be no money to do the research -- and no commercial incentive to > do > it. If you want commercial labs to keep looking for new, usable tests, you > have > to give them a reason to make the investment by taking the tests they > develop. > We went from 12 to 25 to 37 to 67 STR markers because genealogists were > clamoring for more markers -- and obviously willing to pay for them. > > Your deep SNP testing only covers the SNPs that are known at the time you > test. > If more downstream SNPs are discovered later, you will be asked to pay for > the > individual tests as the SNPs are discovered. If you want to buy a "SNP > annuity" > that will guarantee they continue to test your sample for new SNPs, > indefinitely, it will cost you much more to be tested. > > There's no harm in testing upstream SNPs, but there's typically no need to > do > it, and certainly no need to raise the price of SNP testing for everyone to > do > it for everyone. As I said, I think they were generous to give a test that > was > unnecessary, just to keep a customer happy. > > Diana > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: y-dna-projects-bounces@rootsweb.com On Behalf Of > dnalister@comcast.net > > Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 2010 9:49 PM > > To: y-dna-projects@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [Y-DNA-projects] R Deep Clade tests > > > > They seem to be willing to test a second SNP when they guess > > right and get a downstream positive result on their first > > try, but I think it might be good strategy to wait until a > > SNP even further downstream is discovered, and then see if > > they will test for that one. Since SNPs can occur at more > > than one place in the tree, it's a good policy to at least > > eventually end up with results for the most downstream SNP > > known for a particular branch as well as one immediately > > above it on the tree. > > > > Kirsten > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > End of Y-DNA-PROJECTS Digest, Vol 3, Issue 93 > ********************************************* >