Gang, I've got a very homogeneous R1b1b2 family at 37 markers for all 16 members. I've just succeeded in prying a 10,000 person GEDCOM out of them, which covers half the family, and am working on obtaining the other brother's descendancy as well. We've got ten American generations, more or less, to work with, beginning c. 1730. If they can be persuaded to extend to 67 markers, we should be able to see some branching, shouldn't we? Lisa