Hello Terry, I commend you for your efforts, but I'm afraid I see problems here. I'm the admin of the STRAUB Y-DNA Surname Project, and STRAUB #23492 is my Hg I1-AS5 first cousin. If you search on his kit number, you get a list of STRAUB, STROUP, STROPP, CRUMP, and BELEW: http://www.goggo.com/cgi-bin/branchFind.cgi?Kit=23492 Everyone on this list (as of this morning) is a member of the same family in my STRAUB project, and they are matching at high STR marker levels (107/111 or better): http://dgmweb.net/DNA/Straub/StraubDNA-results-HgI1-AS5.html Several have been deep SNP tested, and one has been exhaustively SNP tested, even to the extent of discovering L592+ in a WTY. Unless a new SNP is discovered and needs testing, I see no reason for any of them to be further SNP tested, and I especially don't see any reason for any of them to test a SNP upstream of Z58: http://dgmweb.net/DNA/General/SNP-maxout-HgI1.html#L592 I'm sorry to be a wet blanket, here, but I really don't see how this decision can be automated, at all. There are other factors to take into account, such as, "Have any other members of this family been SNP tested, and what were their results?" If someone can't figure out, for themselves, what they need to test, my best advice is to ask on this list - or privately ask one of the admins of the Hg I1 project. Diana > From: Behalf Of Terry > Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2012 11:46 PM > > There are common questions that people often have in regards to > their > 67-marker STR test results. > > Such as place of geographic origin, likely SNP mutations, or close > haplotype matches etc. > > To answer such questions it helps to know where someone's 67-marker > STR > result fits in with everyone else's result. A rational way of > organising > results is to compute a hierarchical cluster tree, and then > systematically > label each person in that tree according to an STR "Branch Code". > This > Branch Code labelling system is very similar to the "Henry System" > used in > genealogy for numbering the known descendants of an ancestor. > > Easiest to see what I mean, by checking out the tool at: > > http://www.goggo.com/cgi-bin/branchFind.cgi > > You can enter your FTDNA Kit Number or Ysearch ID (currently only > works for > haplogroups I1 and I2), and if the entry is valid, you will get your > Branch > Code, and then the following output: > > 1) a short list of close matches, and the estimated time-frame for > the > common ancestor of the very closest match; > > 2) a map showing the frequency of occurrence of your Branch Code > in all > countries/regions across Europe; > > 3) a list of SNP mutation pathways, with suggestions for your > likely path > based on your Branch Code. > > Finally, there is a link that discusses the simple methodology I > used, and > that link also gives additional details such as the computed tree > showing > the "big picture" view of how people in y-Haplogroups I1 and I2 are > connected. > > Eventually, I may add y-Haplogroups R1b and R1a. > > In the meantime, for I1 and I2 people, let me know how you go. > > Terry

Diana, Wow - I think you have completely underestimated the utility of the tool. Undoubtedly, you know a great deal about your own project and where your project members originate from, and the various SNP that they might carry. That is great. With the tool that I posted - as a free service - it takes as input the 67-marker STR values and nothing else, and from that the tool gives some facts about geographic distribution and SNP allele status. In the example you cited, the tool would have said that the individual would probably have Germany as a place of ancestry (which is correct as it turns out), and it also says that they would be Z58+ (which is correct in your example), and that they would be Z139+/Z138+ with 80% chance (as it turns out, your example is in the 20% minority). And the tool gives a list of close STR matching people, and is full of people with the same surname - information that the tool did not use. If the individual had been adopted and didn't know any family history, and was not a member of your specific project, then the tool would have found that other surname. So the tool got things right for your particular example - perhaps your knew all that information anyway. But the tool can do that for *anyone*, provided I have their kit number and STR data (which is limited to many I1 and I2 people at present) to create the tree. Surely the output is useful? Why are you so negative about an honest and sincere effort on my part to share some useful information to all I1 and I2 people? Perhaps I shouldn't waste my time and do the same thing for R1b and R1a people? Terry On Fri, Mar 2, 2012 at 9:03 PM, Diana Matthiesen <Diana@danishdemes.org>wrote: > Hello Terry, > > I commend you for your efforts, but I'm afraid I see problems here. > > I'm the admin of the STRAUB Y-DNA Surname Project, and STRAUB #23492 > is my Hg I1-AS5 first cousin. If you search on his kit number, you > get a list of STRAUB, STROUP, STROPP, CRUMP, and BELEW: > http://www.goggo.com/cgi-bin/branchFind.cgi?Kit=23492 > > Everyone on this list (as of this morning) is a member of the same > family in my STRAUB project, and they are matching at high STR marker > levels (107/111 or better): > http://dgmweb.net/DNA/Straub/StraubDNA-results-HgI1-AS5.html > > Several have been deep SNP tested, and one has been exhaustively SNP > tested, even to the extent of discovering L592+ in a WTY. Unless a > new SNP is discovered and needs testing, I see no reason for any of > them to be further SNP tested, and I especially don't see any reason > for any of them to test a SNP upstream of Z58: > http://dgmweb.net/DNA/General/SNP-maxout-HgI1.html#L592 > > I'm sorry to be a wet blanket, here, but I really don't see how this > decision can be automated, at all. There are other factors to take > into account, such as, "Have any other members of this family been SNP > tested, and what were their results?" > > If someone can't figure out, for themselves, what they need to test, > my best advice is to ask on this list - or privately ask one of the > admins of the Hg I1 project. > > Diana > > > > > From: Behalf Of Terry > > Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2012 11:46 PM > > > > There are common questions that people often have in regards to > > their > > 67-marker STR test results. > > > > Such as place of geographic origin, likely SNP mutations, or close > > haplotype matches etc. > > > > To answer such questions it helps to know where someone's 67-marker > > STR > > result fits in with everyone else's result. A rational way of > > organising > > results is to compute a hierarchical cluster tree, and then > > systematically > > label each person in that tree according to an STR "Branch Code". > > This > > Branch Code labelling system is very similar to the "Henry System" > > used in > > genealogy for numbering the known descendants of an ancestor. > > > > Easiest to see what I mean, by checking out the tool at: > > > > http://www.goggo.com/cgi-bin/branchFind.cgi > > > > You can enter your FTDNA Kit Number or Ysearch ID (currently only > > works for > > haplogroups I1 and I2), and if the entry is valid, you will get your > > Branch > > Code, and then the following output: > > > > 1) a short list of close matches, and the estimated time-frame for > > the > > common ancestor of the very closest match; > > > > 2) a map showing the frequency of occurrence of your Branch Code > > in all > > countries/regions across Europe; > > > > 3) a list of SNP mutation pathways, with suggestions for your > > likely path > > based on your Branch Code. > > > > Finally, there is a link that discusses the simple methodology I > > used, and > > that link also gives additional details such as the computed tree > > showing > > the "big picture" view of how people in y-Haplogroups I1 and I2 are > > connected. > > > > Eventually, I may add y-Haplogroups R1b and R1a. > > > > In the meantime, for I1 and I2 people, let me know how you go. > > > > Terry > > > >