List, This list is dedicated to I haplogroup , an early group in Europe. I would like to enlarge the picture and I would like to consider an approach of the early stages, those that eventually ended in the IJK then [IJ] and I haplogroups : M89 (F) → M523 → M429 → M170 . Mount Toba is a volcano that went into eruption 73000 years ago (+/- 3000) . I know that very early stages are now in discussion but my point is that the very migratory process is to be considered near the Toba's eruption date as it might have been influenced by this cataclysm. Link 1 is a map with mount Toba, north of Sumatra island, indicated by a black spot, the blue circle depicting a wide area where the effect of the eruption was probably too strong for a survival. http://sd-4.archive-host.com/membres/images/90261920431217746/Oppenheimer-toba.jpg Let's first remind the top of the trees both for Y DNA and for mtDNA : http://sd-4.archive-host.com/membres/images/90261920431217746/Capture-arbreY-mod.JPG http://sd-4.archive-host.com/membres/images/90261920431217746/Capture-arbre-mtDNA.JPG We want to consider first the groups at the stage : [DE] and [CF] for Y DNA , M / N for mtDNA. [DE] went up to Japan. Of course, present day « [DE] » only mean that a SNP is still to be found but I take it as a strong indication that [DE] was still in an early stage when it reached Japan. Some [DE] probably stayed near the « departure point » somewhere near the persic gulf and E haplogroup (M96) evolved from there while , in Asia {DE] evolved in D (M174). [CF] was probably earlier than [DE] on the way to Asia, on the same coastal path but they might have settle near the persic gulf and only a subgroup , haplogroup C, went on towards Australia. Following the eruption and the heavy cloud of dust there might have been a short ice age and low sea levels allowing C to reach Australia. At the same time this group started moving north and there are evidences for a colonization from south (Australia) to north (Mongolia). So, what Mount Toba eruption prompted was first a cut in the main path along the coast. Expansion started over from multiple points of survey. MtDNA M is mainly along the southern route like [DE] , while N is both in Australia and also in all directions followed by F subgroups ; N mtDNA seems to follow [CF] expansion. Here is a link to the F fate : http://sd-4.archive-host.com/membres/images/90261920431217746/northern-tree.jpg I didn't draw it myself and I don't know who did ; I found it on the web. This drawing is fine, except for « R1a » and « R1b » : change it for P at the same place Q is indicated. Now, we are getting closer. Somehow, the Mount Toba eruption forced people to adapt to inland and stop exploring all coasts. As mentioned above [KIJ] is one of the main split of F and it split again in K going mainly east and [IJ] in the west. Again, just like for [DE] the interpretation is that the few [KIJ] going east evolved in K while those going west evolved in [IJ] and the parental lineages were lost. [IJ] might have been around for quite a while. Neanderthal men were still very active 50000 years ago when this group probably tried to push north ; the corresponding mtDNA N subgroup being U possibly already U5 . My question to this list would be : how old can be [IJ] ? Can it fit with the earliest modern man in Europe, say around 50 000 years ago ? Didier

Toba eruption caused the genetic bottleneck, all survivors of which lived in Africa. Some descendants later populated Eurasia. People living on the Asian coast at the time of the eruption were probably killed. It was a very long time before IJK, which appeared in Central Asia. . Haplogroup I is quite broad enough a focus for this list. Emphasis is on haplotype clusters, finding new SNP's, and anthropology since the last ice age. Yours, Dora On 3/7/2012 5:48 AM, Didier VERNADE wrote: > List, > > This list is dedicated to I haplogroup , an early group in Europe. I would like to enlarge the picture and I would like to consider an approach of the early stages, those that > eventually ended in the IJK then [IJ] and I haplogroups : M89 (F) → M523 → M429 → M170 . > > Mount Toba is a volcano that went into eruption 73000 years ago (+/- 3000) . I know that very early stages are now in discussion but my point is that the very migratory > process is to be considered near the Toba's eruption date as it might have been influenced by this cataclysm. Link 1 is a map with mount Toba, north of Sumatra island, > indicated by a black spot, the blue circle depicting a wide area where the effect of the eruption was probably too strong for a survival. > http://sd-4.archive-host.com/membres/images/90261920431217746/Oppenheimer-toba.jpg > >

No, the bottleneck theory isn't established. First, let's remind Stephen Oppenheimer and a few others ; they thought eastern survivors could only explain the data. More recently , see this blog : http://frontiers-of-anthropology.blogspot.com/2012/02/sundaland-home-of-eastern-mankind.html (actually I just don't understand how so many people started the bottleneck idea -with Africa only survivors - it's like the LGM in too many papers) There is a connection to haplogroup I as early settlements in Europe can only be on the [IJK] branch of the tree . Until recently we had some I2* . As more SNPs are allowing a better understanding of [IJ] tree we might be able to find out probable relationship with ancient lithic industries. I think this is the more difficult but also the more intersting part of the haplotype search. Dora wrote : > Toba eruption caused the genetic bottleneck, all survivors of which > lived in Africa. Some descendants later populated Eurasia. People > living on the Asian coast at the time of the eruption were probably > killed. It was a very long time before IJK, which appeared in Central > Asia. . > > Haplogroup I is quite broad enough a focus for this list. Emphasis is > on haplotype clusters, finding new SNP's, and anthropology since the > last ice age. > > Yours, > Dora > > > > On 3/7/2012 5:48 AM, Didier VERNADE wrote: > > List, > > > > This list is dedicated to I haplogroup , an early group in Europe. I would like to enlarge the picture and I would like to consider an approach of the early stages, those that > > eventually ended in the IJK then [IJ] and I haplogroups : M89 (F) → M523 → M429 → M170 . > > > > Mount Toba is a volcano that went into eruption 73000 years ago (+/- 3000) . I know that very early stages are now in discussion but my point is that the very migratory > > process is to be considered near the Toba's eruption date as it might have been influenced by this cataclysm. Link 1 is a map with mount Toba, north of Sumatra island, > > indicated by a black spot, the blue circle depicting a wide area where the effect of the eruption was probably too strong for a survival. > > http://sd-4.archive-host.com/membres/images/90261920431217746/Oppenheimer-toba.jpg > > > > > >