Someone asked me the question below and here is my response for anyone who is interested. Maybe other people would make other points--Bernie Question: Thank you for interesting information. But I can not understand one thing: "... 5 Dinaric-North people are S17250- and 7 Dinaric-North people are S17250+. And *all 5 Dinaric-South people who have done the test are S17250+"* How is it possible? Some Dinaric-North people (S17250+) is closer to Dinaric-South people than the other Dinaric-North people (S17250-)? Answer: That is a good question. The Dinaric-North and Dinaric-South groups are "clusters" based on two STR marker values, DYS448 and DYS449. There is a strong correlation: when a I-CTS5966 "Dinaric" man has a low value for DYS448 he almost always has a low marker value for DYS449. Most people in I-P37 have the value DYS448=20, for example, this is the common value in the I-L161 "Isles" group. But the Dinaric-South group has the rare DYS448=19 value. I think that the ancestor of all Dinaric people had the DYS448=20 value and more recently a man with DYS448=19 was the ancestor of most of the Dinaric-South people. I think that Dinaric-South is a group that is almost all descended from a common ancestor and I think that the Dinaric-South group contains almost all the male-line descendants of that ancestor. This is what we call a clade. (It is not a perfect clade because the STR markers can change at any generation). On the other hand, Dinaric-North has the common value DYS448=20 and I don't think Dinaric-North is a clade. Probably there are many clades within the Dinarics with DYS448=20, but unfortunately we can't see any patterns of rare marker values. In the case of Dinaric-South we are lucky and we can see the clade from the marker value DYS448=19 (which is correlated with DYS449=30 or another low value). To put it another way, I think the pattern for Dinaric-North (DYS448=20 and DYS449=32 or another high value) is really the absence of a pattern. And we could call Dinaric-North something like "Dinaric-generic". But by using the Dinaric-North and Dinaric-South names we are giving the important information that the people with DYS448=19 and low DYS449 are found mostly in Southeastern Europe (they are also found in western places like Germany, but all Dinarics are not so common in Germany). I hope this is useful to you. These are just my thoughts and I may have made some mistakes, Bernie