He has emailed me twice since the first message, and it seems the problem is that he got totally invested in the "big family myth" and isn't prepared to let it go. There's more to it than just the fact that these are two different families based on the GD of their STR haplotypes, even though both are Hg I2. The little myth was that the two families are one; the big myth connects us to an illustrious family that is Hg R1b. And he still thinks I'm wrong. When I suggested he didn't appreciate the probabilities involved, he countered that he's a statistician as well as a geneticist. Well, what a combo, he must be right! Appealing to one's credentials is considered a logical fallacy because even experts can be wrong. There's an almost unbelievable example pertaining to genetics in the item at Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority I'd be happy to explain the situation to him in as much detail as it takes, but I have to admit I begrudge the time to someone who's been so unpleasant to me. (I also think nothing I could say would change his mind.) Thankfully, he's not descended from a RAZEY/RASEY on a patrilineal line, so I won't have to deal with him as a project member. (Feeling like I dodged a bullet.) Diana > From: Elizabeth Britton > Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 4:39 PM > To: y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] Am I in error regarding RASEY-RAZEE non-match? > > > > Not necessarily--authority is rather like any sort of label--the quality of > the underlying product guarantees the label, and not the other way around. > I'd ask him to explain why he thinks that a GD of 16 or 30 implies a > relationship within genealogical time when no one else in the field would > agree--that is, if you decide he's worth trying to convert. He won't give a > reason, of course, because he doesn't have one--he had hoped instead to scare > you with his credentials, and that is what I found so amusing. > > I've had one bad experience of this kind, but it involved different > Haplogroups and not GD; however, that story ended as well as such a story can > end and the family in question is still active in my project. > > Some take it hard when they discover that their line isn't what they thought > it was or what their research indicated, and the unexpected result leaves > scars that never go away, while others take the shock in stride and recover > quickly. I've often wondered how I would have reacted if I've uncovered a > break in my line. > > Lindsey

"it seems the problem is that he got totally invested in the "big family myth" and isn't prepared to let it go....the big myth connects us to an illustrious family that is Hg R1b." LOL...I've got the same kind of myth in my own family that my immigrant ancestor William Simonds (1611-1672) of Woburn, MA was the grandson of a gentleman named William Symonds (d. 1606) who had a coat of arms, was a mayor and alderman of Winchester, is buried in Winchester cathedral, and left a very large estate. Unfortunately, the immigrant to America, William Simonds of Woburn, MA was probably an indentured servant and married a woman who also came to America as an indentured servant. He was also probably illiterate since in numerous Massachusetts court records, he always signed his name with as "X" unlike a number of other people in Woburn, MA. None of this fits the profile of someone from the landed gentry. But this totally unsupported notion that he did come from the landed gentry is a myth that many people want to believe in and which ought to be debunked. Matthew Simonds > From: DianaGM@dgmweb.net > To: y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com > Date: Mon, 9 Jun 2014 01:45:31 -0400 > Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] Am I in error regarding RASEY-RAZEE non-match? > > He has emailed me twice since the first message, and it seems the problem is > that he got totally invested in the "big family myth" and isn't prepared to let > it go. > > There's more to it than just the fact that these are two different families > based on the GD of their STR haplotypes, even though both are Hg I2. The little > myth was that the two families are one; the big myth connects us to an > illustrious family that is Hg R1b. And he still thinks I'm wrong. > > When I suggested he didn't appreciate the probabilities involved, he countered > that he's a statistician as well as a geneticist. Well, what a combo, he must > be right! > > Appealing to one's credentials is considered a logical fallacy because even > experts can be wrong. There's an almost unbelievable example pertaining to > genetics in the item at Wikipedia: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_authority > > I'd be happy to explain the situation to him in as much detail as it takes, but > I have to admit I begrudge the time to someone who's been so unpleasant to me. > (I also think nothing I could say would change his mind.) Thankfully, he's not > descended from a RAZEY/RASEY on a patrilineal line, so I won't have to deal with > him as a project member. (Feeling like I dodged a bullet.) > > Diana > > > > From: Elizabeth Britton > > Sent: Sunday, June 08, 2014 4:39 PM > > To: y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] Am I in error regarding RASEY-RAZEE non-match? > > > > > > > > Not necessarily--authority is rather like any sort of label--the quality of > > the underlying product guarantees the label, and not the other way around. > > I'd ask him to explain why he thinks that a GD of 16 or 30 implies a > > relationship within genealogical time when no one else in the field would > > agree--that is, if you decide he's worth trying to convert. He won't give a > > reason, of course, because he doesn't have one--he had hoped instead to scare > > you with his credentials, and that is what I found so amusing. > > > > I've had one bad experience of this kind, but it involved different > > Haplogroups and not GD; however, that story ended as well as such a story can > > end and the family in question is still active in my project. > > > > Some take it hard when they discover that their line isn't what they thought > > it was or what their research indicated, and the unexpected result leaves > > scars that never go away, while others take the shock in stride and recover > > quickly. I've often wondered how I would have reacted if I've uncovered a > > break in my line. > > > > Lindsey > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-HAPLOGROUP-I-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message