Carole, it's kind of complicated! We had 13 different men submit samples, all of them descendants of Merediths (one of whom spells his surname differently) who lived in one of three Irish counties prior to 1900: Dublin, Queen's, and Carlow counties. The documentation we have does not go back far enough to prove whether or not most of them were related to any of the others, but it appeared that we could have as many as 5 different lines. The DNA results showed that two are identical on 67 markers and our documentation shows that those two are separate lines at least as far back as the mid 1700s. A third man is identical to those two at the 37 marker level--our documentation for him only goes back to about 1800. Three of the 13 turned out to be entirely different haplogroups (and each of them different from the others). Among the 10 who do show as being M253-AS4, the variability ranges from a genetic distance of 0 to 7. There doesn't seem to be anything there to help us sort out which are more closely related, as the DNA variability doesn't really fit with what we know from the records--maybe 68 to 111 will shed further light? Sharon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carole 55066" <carole55066@cfl.rr.com> To: <y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 01, 2011 3:52 PM Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] 68-111 over the cliff? > Sharon how many markers off is your bunch on the 37 & 67 marker tests? My > brother is I-205....He has one exact match at 37 a new found cousin I was > able help go back further than the 1800's ...we are 1 marker off on 67. > Then we have one other 3 off on the 37, and 4 others 4 off on the 37. > That's it...I have 6 matches total. Only the new found cousin is a 67 > marker match. 5 of us have upgraded to 67 markers. I guess I always > thought why upgrade when I know I'll be all by myself??? Maybe someone > can help me understand...would it be a help for the greater good of I1 or > something? > Thanks in advance...Carole J > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Sharon Haggerty" <smhaggerty@shaw.ca> > To: y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com > Sent: 11/1/2011 3:54 PM > Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] 68-111 over the cliff? > > I have been involved in recruiting several related people who are > M253-AS4--most of them have done 67 markers, but none have gone for 111. > The results confirmed for us the relationship between 3 lines that we > couldn't connect using genealogical/historical records. These are families > that are Welsh in origin, but whose documentation is limited to > Ireland--one > of the lines documented in Ireland back to the 1600s--the other two to the > 1700s and 1800s. Would you advise getting some of them to get the extended > results? I note that the AS4 group hasn't been getting much attention in > the > discussion lately. > > Sharon