Yes, that's what makes the world go around --- different approaches.... I counted snp tests already in the order pipeline --- last night there were 17 for L380 and 7 for L319. And we already know from other WTY chromat inspections that L380 is derived for one M223+ Continental as well as the original Roots WTY L319 is found to be negative in two other WTY chromat inspections of L801+ and L623+ people. In light of this information and the large number of tests for L380 and L319 in the pipeline already, I think caution is called for in ordering more of these tests unless one is a special case. We have had a couple fiascos in my opinion for which substantial monies were spent --- Z77 and V218 --- because large numbers of orders were made before the evidence gathered about the snp locations in the tree. When really important snp tests are needed, I think it important that the credibilities of those urging such tests be in good order. Ken -----Original Message----- From: Aaron Salles Torres Sent: Monday, November 21, 2011 8:09 AM To: y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] Test Results - Ian Gammage Kit 27192 I suppose there are different approaches to this issue. I am of the mindset that if a "new" SNP is available for purchase, it's best to have it tested by representatives of the various subgroups (even when it appears to be positive across the board). At the very least, this is useful to double-check results and to create a stronger foundation for future conclusions. With regards to L319, we will never know if it falls outside of the current STR-based divisions of Roots if people in that group do not test for it. Maybe these STR-based subgroups reflect convergence and not actually shared ancestry? We've had a similar case with P95, in which individuals were presumed to be P95+ based on their STR results but turned out to be P95- after testing. Maybe individuals who are presumed to be L319- are L319+? We'll never know if we simply ignore this SNP... As project administrator, I will always encourage testing of new SNP's by volunteers. The knowledge and certainty we gain are worth more than the $29 we'd save if we refused to test. Aaron Torres Re: [yDNAhgI] Test Results - Ian Gammage Kit 27192 Sunday, November 20, 2011 4:42 PM From: "Kenneth Nordtvedt" <knordtvedt@bresnan.net> To: y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com L380 was read as + positive, derived in an M223+ person outside of Roots --- suggesting it is universal in Roots. And L319 has been read from chromats to be - negative, ancestral for another in the same Roots clade as original L319+ So I think people in Roots ordering these snps is a questionable or "long-shot" venture. Ken -----Original Message----- From: Ian Gammage Sent: Sunday, November 20, 2011 3:38 PM To: y-dna-haplogroup-i@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [yDNAhgI] Test Results - Ian Gammage Kit 27192 Thank Aaron, Given Ken's comment what would these tests add in my case? He has me as basic M223*. Would these two fall into a category similar to L801? Cheers, Ian ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to Y-DNA-HAPLOGROUP-I-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message