Anita, Do you know how to order the T-shirts? I would love to get a couple of them! SheilaM ----- Original Message ----- From: <Atnvolsgirl@wmconnect.com> To: <WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, June 16, 2006 12:50 AM Subject: Re: [WVLOGAN] OTS > Gracie, > > The other morning I was flipping channels and came across Imus. He was > showing off a T-shirt that he was wearing. > > Across the top, there was a picture of Indians on horseback with head > dresses > on and across the bottom it read, "HOMELAND SECURITY: Fighting terrorists > since 1492!" > > I loved it. My sister is living on a reservation in Oregon and I love > hearing the stories of how they honor their deceased, and stories of life > on the > "res".. > > Anita McClung > Fayette County, WV > > > ============================== > Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the > areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. > Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx > >

My Aunt asked my Great Aunt if she could ask her some questions about her life. She said, "I'll tell you anything you want to know. I am not always proud of what I've done but I did it. I wont hide it. The only person I have to worry about is God and I can't hid it from Him, he already knows." I'm with her! Peggy

Since we're on family secrets. Question for you all, what do you do about listing a parent when they were never wed?. My grandmother never told me her father, and I was told not to ask. Death certificate said unknown. But, it was known who the father was, and I have a letter from one of the father's family telling me the truth. Besides some of the rest of the family knew or suspected who the father was. Would you list this parent on your genealogy or leave the parentage blank? I hate having a hole in my lineage. My grandmother's mother never married and only had the one child. Robyn

It's worked for The Royals for centuries. Sue At 03:55 PM 6/20/06 -0400, you wrote: >My McClungs must have thought they were royalty. There was so much >intermarriage among this clan that I am kin to myself several times >over. My third >great grandfather married the daughter of my second great grandpa! I went to >Nicholas County (WV) several years ago and spoke with a distant relative. He >told me that he and his brothers used to drive to Fayette County to pick >up girls >for fear they would fall in love only to find out later they were kin! > >Anita > > >============================== >Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. >New content added every business day. Learn more: >http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx

I say post it on the parents seeking siblings and siblings seeking parents web pages. That way the info is there if he comes looking, and you've done your part. That was kind of your husband. I'd do everything possible to grant his request. Sue At 05:57 PM 6/20/06 -0700, you wrote: >LuAnne, > >I certainly agree with you on living people or living children. > >My late husband wanted me to find the mother of his son that he denied at >birth. He lived with great remorse for the rest of his life that he had >been such a jerk. I was never able to find her or the boy then...20 years >ago. Now I might be able to but I don't know what she told the >boy...maybe his father "died at war" or something. Maybe he thought her >first husband was his father. > >My daughter really wants me to keep trying to reach her half brother but >my son thinks we should let sleeping dogs lie. Even if I could find his >mother I would talk to her about it but not to the 45 yr old man without >her OK. To do so would be very, very wrong. > >I have his birth certificate under both of his parents' names. > >Carole > > >============================== >Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the >last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: >http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

I have my mothers family way back into the 1600s and there may have been some 1st cousins getting married in the early 1700s but not later. We have more than our fair share of ADHD (that's how Uncle Buzzy got his name), depression and substance abuse. We used to call it alcoholism but the last generation stepped up their use and branched out. So far no bi-polar but I have friends and some shirttail relatives with it in their family and I can't think of anything more devastating when it is uncontrolled. My heart goes out to families to have to deal with it. We have a string of real renegades that I think came down our Vance line. I've heard other say the same thing.

> I've often thought that children really should carry their mother's names, > since there is seldom doubt about that! ;-) Some cultures pass the family name and wealth down through the female line. With the Jews the religion goes through the female line....if the mother isn't Jewish then the children aren't considered Jews. That comes from centuries of raping and pillaging as armies went back and forth through the Holy Land. Rape victims weren't considered at fault the way they sometimes are now. Speaking of armies....there was a neat article in the paper the other day about a DNA study where they are looking for descendants of Genghis Khan. I'm not sure how many sons he had by his wives and concubines but he and his boys made sure they spread their seed in every country they conquered. They are everywhere! I know.....this is way off topic.

I tend to think there is some problem when cousins marry. On both my maternal and paternal sides cousins married several generations back and I know of several cases of bi-polar, ADHD, depression and alcoholism. I suspect there is some connection. Of course, it does make genealogy a little easier when you get back 6 or 7 generations and have the same set of parents down a couple of times. I enjoy all the conversation here, its great. Vernia

Back in them days 1st cousins was the normal. They didn't have cars, planes and trains to take them all over to meet new people besides cousins. K ----- Original Message ----- From: "Carole Hammond" <carole.hammond@comcast.net> To: <WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [WVLOGAN] secrets - ydna >>>First cousin marriages were once common especially in the South.<< > > I think that the powers-that-be have decided that there isn't much more of > a chance to get birth defects with first cousins than it is with unrelated > people. > > My husband's grandparents were first cousins and there's nothing wrong > with his family....twitch, twitch. ;o) > > > ============================== > View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find > marriage announcements and more. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx > >

I've often thought that children really should carry their mother's names, since there is seldom doubt about that! ;-) -----Original Message----- From: Carole Hammond [mailto:carole.hammond@comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 6:00 PM To: WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: RE: [WVLOGAN] Secrets At least we usually know who our mothers are. I think....

>>I have encountered people who took the yDNA to find their ancestors and >>matched another surname altogether.<< At least we usually know who our mothers are. I think....

LuAnne, I certainly agree with you on living people or living children. My late husband wanted me to find the mother of his son that he denied at birth. He lived with great remorse for the rest of his life that he had been such a jerk. I was never able to find her or the boy then...20 years ago. Now I might be able to but I don't know what she told the boy...maybe his father "died at war" or something. Maybe he thought her first husband was his father. My daughter really wants me to keep trying to reach her half brother but my son thinks we should let sleeping dogs lie. Even if I could find his mother I would talk to her about it but not to the 45 yr old man without her OK. To do so would be very, very wrong. I have his birth certificate under both of his parents' names. Carole

Weed eat on, Gracie!!! ;o) I'm with you!

>>First cousin marriages were once common especially in the South.<< I think that the powers-that-be have decided that there isn't much more of a chance to get birth defects with first cousins than it is with unrelated people. My husband's grandparents were first cousins and there's nothing wrong with his family....twitch, twitch. ;o)

----- Original Message ----- From: <rcs5@bellsouth.net> To: <WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 11:59 AM Subject: [WVLOGAN] secrets - ydna > It would be a big shock to find you match a different surname altogether. > A man contacted me because his ydna matched the surname Berry and that is > not his name. That was my maternal grandmother's maiden name. My > maternal lines cluster in Eastern KY and southern Jackson Co., WVa. I was > very glad mine came back matching three Stewart men after hearing about > men who did not match their surname. > > Incest - how would we know if it did exist in our lines. The man who > wrote about the Stewarts in Kith and Kin for Boone Co. privately told a > descendent he found incest in my Stewarts. I have looked and looked and > can't find a thing that would indicate incest. > > First cousin marriages were once common especially in the South. Just a > year ago two second cousins in my maternal lines married - Berrys again. > There was some talk of course, but why not? Rick > > > > ============================== > Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. > New content added every business day. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx > >

Heck here in good old Virginia.. Today mind you... 1st cousins can marry and do! As I recall, the only folks you can't marry are parents, brothers/sisters, aunts, uncles and grandparents. Laura -----Original Message----- From: rcs5@bellsouth.net [mailto:rcs5@bellsouth.net] Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 2:59 PM To: WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [WVLOGAN] secrets - ydna It would be a big shock to find you match a different surname altogether. A man contacted me because his ydna matched the surname Berry and that is not his name. That was my maternal grandmother's maiden name. My maternal lines cluster in Eastern KY and southern Jackson Co., WVa. I was very glad mine came back matching three Stewart men after hearing about men who did not match their surname. Incest - how would we know if it did exist in our lines. The man who wrote about the Stewarts in Kith and Kin for Boone Co. privately told a descendent he found incest in my Stewarts. I have looked and looked and can't find a thing that would indicate incest. First cousin marriages were once common especially in the South. Just a year ago two second cousins in my maternal lines married - Berrys again. There was some talk of course, but why not? Rick ============================== Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. New content added every business day. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx

Hello Shelby - The Mullinses and Burgesses married just as much. I think they knew how close in was safe. Then I look around at some family members and wonder. Grin. Cousin Rick > > From: BurgessWV@aol.com > Date: 2006/06/20 Tue PM 03:28:16 EDT > To: WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [WVLOGAN] secrets - ydna > > Cousin Rick; > When you look at all the Burgess,s & McNeelys marrying, its hard to see why > incest didnt happen. But I guess the older folks told them who was kin to whom. > The ancestors had livestock and knew what would happen if farm animals > intrabred is another reason.Usually, the offspring would be lame, but not all the > time. > I have a neighbor here in Cleveland who told me she had to leave Harts Creek > to get married; She was close kin to every one else on the creek,ha > > Shelby > > > ============================== > Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. > Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx > >

Gracie.. Nah... We all have them moments.. Laura -----Original Message----- From: gracie [mailto:g.winters@sbcglobal.net] Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:55 AM To: WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [WVLOGAN] Secrets Oh, come on, ya'll, get out of the 1950s. In this day, there are single parents, sperm banks, gay marriages, cloning, etc. Genealogy is about telling the truth and showing proof, geez, just made a rhyme. rofl We all work so hard to make sure we have the right information on everything else. Shoot , just put in the mother and if you know the father , put him in, don't worry about a marriage licence. So much of the time we don't have those for the ones who did marry. So our ancestors weren't perfect, neither are we. Quit tiptoeing around about descretions over 100 years ago. Tis a better subject than the wars in mho. I know, wars are a part of genie too. I just don't like to think about them. I have such a delicate personality. (Now really on the floor laughing) Sorry for being so blunt but I just came in from weedeating(not my favorite job) and I am sweaty, itchy, and the other itchy word. The one with the B. Gracie hoping I don't get banned for this one. ----- Original Message ----- From: "suebod" <suebod@tampabay.rr.com> To: <WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 8:09 AM Subject: [WVLOGAN] Secrets > The elders may want to keep this stuff hidden in the closet but if > their child needed a kidney transplant or a full medical history would > save a grandchild, and these are things I've run into helping other > families, bet grandma would spill the beans as to who's the daddy. > > When you're 65, you don't want money from your 89 year old biological > father, but you would like to know if he and all his family had > diabetes, gout or heart disease. > > Sue > > > At 09:28 PM 6/19/06 -0700, you wrote: > >>>One of my Logan Co. gg grandfathers had a child born to a young > >>>lady prior to 1861 - maybe late 1850s. She was listed as his next > >>>of kin on his military papers. How do you all handle this sort of > >>>thing?<< > > > > > >============================== > >Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. New > >content added every business day. Learn more: > >http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx > > > > ============================== > View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find > marriage announcements and more. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx > ============================== View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find marriage announcements and more. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx

You all are so funny, good attitudes about all this. Cuz Gracie ----- Original Message ----- From: <rcs5@bellsouth.net> To: <WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 3:48 PM Subject: Re: Re: [WVLOGAN] secrets - ydna > Hello Shelby - The Mullinses and Burgesses married just as much. I think they knew how close in was safe. Then I look around at some family members and wonder. Grin. Cousin Rick > > > > From: BurgessWV@aol.com > > Date: 2006/06/20 Tue PM 03:28:16 EDT > > To: WVLOGAN-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [WVLOGAN] secrets - ydna > > > > Cousin Rick; > > When you look at all the Burgess,s & McNeelys marrying, its hard to see why > > incest didnt happen. But I guess the older folks told them who was kin to whom. > > The ancestors had livestock and knew what would happen if farm animals > > intrabred is another reason.Usually, the offspring would be lame, but not all the > > time. > > I have a neighbor here in Cleveland who told me she had to leave Harts Creek > > to get married; She was close kin to every one else on the creek,ha > > > > Shelby > > > > > > ============================== > > Census images 1901, 1891, 1881 and 1871, plus so much more. > > Ancestry.com's United Kingdom & Ireland Collection. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13968/rd.ashx > > > > > > > ============================== > Search Family and Local Histories for stories about your family and the > areas they lived. Over 85 million names added in the last 12 months. > Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13966/rd.ashx >

My McClungs must have thought they were royalty. There was so much intermarriage among this clan that I am kin to myself several times over. My third great grandfather married the daughter of my second great grandpa! I went to Nicholas County (WV) several years ago and spoke with a distant relative. He told me that he and his brothers used to drive to Fayette County to pick up girls for fear they would fall in love only to find out later they were kin! Anita