Greetings one and all, I just updated the Moreland Family Cemetery to be the Moreland / McCauley Family Cemetery. But I haven't given up on the thought that there is a McCauley Cemetery out there near the Old McCauley Homestead. Wayne of Capon Bridge At 06:07 PM 10/17/2002 -0400, you wrote: >Greetings one and all. > >I came across three cemeteries today, two of them thanks to Izetta Barbour. > >So watch your emails tonight and see what and how I saw. > >Updates will be the: > >Bloxham Cemetery (thanks Izetta) >Saville Cemetery (thanks Izetta) >Pepper Cemetery (new) >Nelson Cemetery (update) >Moreland Cemetery (update) > >Visits with Tim Reid and Iris Dell Kline. > >More later. > >Wayne of Capon Bridge > >At 05:00 PM 10/10/2002 -0400, you wrote: >>I have reference (from Kerns: Historical Records of Old Frederick and >>Hampshire Counties) to an ancestor, Barbara Foltz Haines (wife of Jacob >>Haines), buried in 1899 on Mouser's Ridge (I believe that is near >>Slanesville). Any idea which cemetery that might be?? >> >>Nancy > >Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm >My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm

Izetta, Marilyn told me where to look. It was no where near the John Whitacre place. I will ask Mary Smith for sure, but Marilyn said the old McCauley place was down Timber Mt. Rd. The house burnt down, but they built a cider block place in it's location. I will also go to the area and see if I can find the house and ask around. Not too far from the Central Methodist Church / Cemetery. Yes it could be possible that the stones could be McCauley as I was told by Marilyn that this is the cemetery she meant when she was talking to you. I will be changing my website to show this as the Moreland & McCauley Cemetery. Wayne of Capon Bridge At 08:31 PM 10/17/2002 -0700, you wrote: >Wayne, that sounds possible, Do you think maybe she could be talking about >the place we said there was the two chimney's standing and they rebuilt some >where else?. Did Marilyn say that she would show you where she thinks maybe >it might be?. > >It could possibly be that those slate markers in the Moreland cemetery could >be some McCauley's. Maybe Mrs. Smith will know something, I feel sure they >have to be somewhere around there. You know the old saying, never leave a >stone unturned. As much luck as you are having finding all of the out of >the way cemeteries, I feel sure that one " lucky day" you are going to walk >upon some McCauley's in one of them. >Izetta >----- Original Message ----- >From: "R. Wayne McGahuey" <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2002 4:17 PM >Subject: [WVHAMPSH-L] Cemeterying: -MCCAULEY- Hampshire County 250 Cemetery >Project > > > > Greetings one and all, > > > > For the past couple of weeks Izetta Barbour and I have been looking for >the > > old McCauley Homestead and Family Cemetery, and so far, no luck. We have > > walked through cow pastures, woods, stickers and hill, and no luck in > > finding either the house or the cemetery. > > > > I do have a few lead, and Izetta, I hope you will break into this > > conversation and let me know what you think. > > I have talked to Marilyn Conneway, my mailman's wife. I was told that >she > > may know where the Old McCauley Family Cemetery was located. The told me > > that she believed that it was the same cemetery that the Morelands are > > buried in down Timber Mt. Road. > > Izetta, remember you went to that one this last weekend, climbing the >fence > > and fighting a snake. Marilyn continued to tell me that the lady that > > owns the fruit stand at the top of Cooper Mt. was a McCauley, and she >would > > be able to help more. Also the old McCauley home was located just down > > Timber Mt. Road. It had burnt down and has been replaced. I will get > > with Mrs. Smith the fruit stand lady and see if she can supply me with >more > > information. > > > > Fun Fun Fun. > > > > Wayne of Capon Bridge > > > > > > > > > > Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm > > My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm > > > > > > >--- >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.394 / Virus Database: 224 - Release Date: 10/3/02 Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm

Wayne, that sounds possible, Do you think maybe she could be talking about the place we said there was the two chimney's standing and they rebuilt some where else?. Did Marilyn say that she would show you where she thinks maybe it might be?. It could possibly be that those slate markers in the Moreland cemetery could be some McCauley's. Maybe Mrs. Smith will know something, I feel sure they have to be somewhere around there. You know the old saying, never leave a stone unturned. As much luck as you are having finding all of the out of the way cemeteries, I feel sure that one " lucky day" you are going to walk upon some McCauley's in one of them. Izetta ----- Original Message ----- From: "R. Wayne McGahuey" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2002 4:17 PM Subject: [WVHAMPSH-L] Cemeterying: -MCCAULEY- Hampshire County 250 Cemetery Project > Greetings one and all, > > For the past couple of weeks Izetta Barbour and I have been looking for the > old McCauley Homestead and Family Cemetery, and so far, no luck. We have > walked through cow pastures, woods, stickers and hill, and no luck in > finding either the house or the cemetery. > > I do have a few lead, and Izetta, I hope you will break into this > conversation and let me know what you think. > I have talked to Marilyn Conneway, my mailman's wife. I was told that she > may know where the Old McCauley Family Cemetery was located. The told me > that she believed that it was the same cemetery that the Morelands are > buried in down Timber Mt. Road. > Izetta, remember you went to that one this last weekend, climbing the fence > and fighting a snake. Marilyn continued to tell me that the lady that > owns the fruit stand at the top of Cooper Mt. was a McCauley, and she would > be able to help more. Also the old McCauley home was located just down > Timber Mt. Road. It had burnt down and has been replaced. I will get > with Mrs. Smith the fruit stand lady and see if she can supply me with more > information. > > Fun Fun Fun. > > Wayne of Capon Bridge > > > > > Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm > My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm > > --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.394 / Virus Database: 224 - Release Date: 10/3/02

Greetings one and all, For the past couple of weeks Izetta Barbour and I have been looking for the old McCauley Homestead and Family Cemetery, and so far, no luck. We have walked through cow pastures, woods, stickers and hill, and no luck in finding either the house or the cemetery. I do have a few lead, and Izetta, I hope you will break into this conversation and let me know what you think. I have talked to Marilyn Conneway, my mailman's wife. I was told that she may know where the Old McCauley Family Cemetery was located. The told me that she believed that it was the same cemetery that the Morelands are buried in down Timber Mt. Road. Izetta, remember you went to that one this last weekend, climbing the fence and fighting a snake. Marilyn continued to tell me that the lady that owns the fruit stand at the top of Cooper Mt. was a McCauley, and she would be able to help more. Also the old McCauley home was located just down Timber Mt. Road. It had burnt down and has been replaced. I will get with Mrs. Smith the fruit stand lady and see if she can supply me with more information. Fun Fun Fun. Wayne of Capon Bridge Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm

Greetings one and all, If you go to the NELSON Family Cemetery page you will see that I added the following note: I have talked to a long time residents of Dillions Run, and found that when they were children, they played around the pastures and was sure there was more then just one grave there on the hill. So I will get back and talk with the Morelands and see if I can go search through the woods a bit more. Wayne of Capon Bridge Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm

Greetings one and all. I came across three cemeteries today, two of them thanks to Izetta Barbour. So watch your emails tonight and see what and how I saw. Updates will be the: Bloxham Cemetery (thanks Izetta) Saville Cemetery (thanks Izetta) Pepper Cemetery (new) Nelson Cemetery (update) Moreland Cemetery (update) Visits with Tim Reid and Iris Dell Kline. More later. Wayne of Capon Bridge At 05:00 PM 10/10/2002 -0400, you wrote: >I have reference (from Kerns: Historical Records of Old Frederick and >Hampshire Counties) to an ancestor, Barbara Foltz Haines (wife of Jacob >Haines), buried in 1899 on Mouser's Ridge (I believe that is near >Slanesville). Any idea which cemetery that might be?? > >Nancy Hampshire Co. website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/hampco/index.htm My Homepage website: http://members.citynet.net/rwayne/index.htm

Hi again, David, I believe my Harpole's were German also - the name was supposed to originally be "Herboldt". Should have mentioned that first time around, but the marriage I mentioned I believe is to a Harpole. I am working somewhat (checking information I find against the family tree information) from posted information from the Harpole Family in America book, which states the family came into PA in 1738. I have Herboldts in this area in 1738 through about 1751 or so (need to do more PA research) in Augusta VA region in the 1770-1780's, WV after this, and into Wilson and Sumner CO TN by 1796-early 1800's. I have a couple of Herbolts in Indiana in the 1850 census who stated they were born in PA in the 1780's. The majority of the family seem to be using the Harpold name in IN - I think they are related. Working on this now. I will try and locate my Moser stuff - I have several records with Moser, and am sure they were pretty "tight" - at least in TN. My Harpoles moved all over the country, and I am keeping busy trying to track all of 'em down. Any DeWeiss/Dewis, etc. families in PA? I found Herbolts with that family a few times in PA. Best regards, Bonnie David Athey wrote: >Hi Bonnie, > >My Mosers were Pennsylvania German Americans (Bedford County). My gggrandfather >Daniel Miller married Hester Moser, daughter of Philip and Catherine Exline Moser. >Philip was the son of Michael Moser, purportedly the son of German immigrant Johan >Martin Moser (I have not yet documented this last link). I do not have an Adam Moser >in my records, so I can't say if there is a connection. > >David A. > >Bonnie Schwarz wrote: > >>Hi David - sorry to intrude here, but the Moser name caught my eye. I >>have Moser in my Harpole family, also from WV into TN. I would have to >>go dig it up now, but I have Moser's as witnesses, securities, etc. on >>Harpole legal doc's, and I believe I saw that an Adam Moser married a >>Susannah? Harpole. I believe this was in early Wilson or Sumner TN. >>Doesn't appear that the Moser's went traveling with the Harpole's out of >>TN. >> >>Bonnie Schwarz >> >>David Athey wrote: >> >>>Neil, >>> >>>Yes, I know what you mean about fluid spellings. I recorded some tombstones >>> >>>from a family cemetery of my Moser branch, and found the names engraved on the >> >>>stones as Musser, Moser, and Moses - and these were all members of one immediate >>>family - mother, father, sisters, and brothers. >>> >>>David A. >>> >>> >>> > >

Very well said!! I know my in my Kifer line, my 3rd G Grandfather, George's tombstone reads GEORGE KEIFFER, and a few years later when his wife died , hers (right beside of his) reads CATHERINE KIFER. Some of the current family's spell their names as Kifer, Kiefer, Keefer. My dad's two elderly cousins, SISTERS, spelled their names different. We always thought that either the children of George & Catherine wanted to keep the cost down on the stone, OR, the ones in charge couldn't spell good. Some of the children were very well versed, others couldn't even read or write. macbd1 wrote: > Hi Becci, David and all, > > Some thoughts concerning your postings from my experiences and studies: > Many English-edgeekated clerics of colonial times and later undoubtedly had > no clue as to their impact on the history of American surnames, or the > resulting good-natured differences (sometimes confrontations?) amongst > 'cousins' of one descendant who currently spell their surnames differently, > with each claiming 'their' name is the correct spelling. Records left by > many ships' captains, census-takers, clerks of various courts (or courts in > different locales) for land deeds, wills, estates, jury lists, court > proceedings, and by different military clerks and commanding officers for > enlistment, pay, discharge records or unit rosters, and by later court > clerks for preparing Rev War pension applications (who needed to use the > original military clerk's 'official' spelling to prevent procedural problems > and possible pension denial), or church clerics' records, and even history > book authors are amongst those that contributed to such differences in > surname spellings. Beyond this, there is the anglization and Americanism of > English spelling and the many clerics who simply 'speld'm the way they > thought they heard'm be'n pernunced,' or how they had seen a certain > sound-like name spelled by another cleric. This may apply to given names as > well: for example, a husband with his two oldest sons is hunting or working > in the field when a 'careful' census-taker asks his wife (back at the house) > for the ages, first and middle names, if any, of all family members, along > with other questions, while the 3-month old baby needs to nurture, three > other young'ns are gathered about the census-taker chattering and the others > are God only knows where. The request for given names would of course apply > only for 1850 or later. > > I believe it was Andrew Jackson who exclaimed, as best I can recall today, > that he didn't trust a man who always spelled a word the same. This helps > to explain how many felt about English education of early times. Beyond > this, many if not most immigrants in frontier areas were English-illiterate. > So...how were such people to finally decide for themselves how their name > should be spelled -- and when descendants migrated to different areas, > differences undoubtedly resulted from their considering different knowledge > sources. My thoughts focus primarily on the 1700's and early 1800's in > America. > > My earliest proved ancestor's surname in 1760 and later was spelled in > various records by many variants of McDaniel, McDonald and McDonell. A Rev > War military enlistment clerk spelled his name McDaniel which 'stuck' for > many descendants. With his Ulster-Scot language and Scots' brogue I am > guessing he pronounced his name with a 'lazy' or 'quiet' > barely-opened-mouthed 'short a,' like saying ' M'Danl,' rather than with > open-mouthed emphasis of 'Don' as in McDonald. At any rate 'McDaniel' was > used for his 'official' military record although within a few weeks he was > recorded as 'McDonald' in his unit's roster, by his Captain who was a > neighbor of the family in Southwestern PA. The names McDaniel and McDonald > were subsequently recorded interchangeably in census and court records, but > McDaniel was prevalent, I believe, especially when considering the county > court-clerk using 'McDaniel' for his Rev War pension application in 1833, in > Ohio -- and county history book authors picking up on this 'military name' > for their accountings of early times when writing about them during the > later 1800's. > > McDaniel (plus variants) and McDonald were used interchangeably for another > generation in my line. A son of the above ancestor moved his family to > Southern Indiana in 1836. His wife died six years later with her tombstone > clearly stating 'Mcdannel.' But when her husband died in 1864 his stone > states McDonald, as do all subsequent ones. I believe literacy and use of > more permanent granite tombstones led to more careful name spelling as time > passed. But in 1853, in contrast, a court clerk interchangeably used > McDaniel and McDonald for the same individual in a single land deed > document! (Possibly he did this intentionally to demonstrate the individual > was known, or recorded elsewhere, by both names???) > > Surnames were first used by the French, I believe, in about 1000AD; much > later in many other countries, originally recorded in the mother-language of > earliest times. Can there therefore be a 'correct' English or American > spelling for all names in the US? Does it really matter so long as > researchers can decipher who was who, or at least live with what we find as > not being purely factual? > > Neil McDonald > PS - In the large settlement of Amish in my area having so many common > names, the middle name(s) or initial(s) must be used to obtain a longer > name-combination that distinguishes between the many having the same first > and last names. At least land deeds are recorded and the US mail gets > delivered properly so long as the correct 911 rural address is used for an > individual -- I don't know how the rural mail carriers do their job in areas > where the old delivery system is still used, with only a rural route number > listed as the 'street address.' This situation may be similar to earlier > times. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Catbite" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 7:54 AM > Subject: Re: [WVHAMPSH-L] Name Transitions > > > Hi David, > > My HARTSOCK name has went through Hertzog, Herzog, Hartsook. My STECKMAN > > line has been Stockman when they came over from Germany. My 2nd Great > > Grandfather, Espy L. Steckman, also went by his middle name of Levi in the > > Washington County census, but when he moved up to Allegany, you see him as > > Espy, which is on his tombstone. > > > > On my SLIDER side, there were so many Joseph's & William's that sometimes > > they went by their middle names so as not to confuse people. They should > > have just named them something else, huh? :) > > Becci > > > > David Athey wrote: > > > > > Hi Listers, > > > > > > I have recently been pondering over my many years of research notes, and > > > one thing that struck me early on was how name transitions came about. > > > > > > With my Athey side the men had the odd habit of switching their first > > > and middle names. The first noted for the practice was my great > > > grandfather. He used the name Thomas Brant Athey. When I started > > > locating the family in censuses, I discovered that his given name was > > > David Thomas Athey, after his grandfathers David Ray and Thomas Athey. > > > So why Thomas Brant? I knew that his aunt, Mary Athey had married Levi > > > Brant, but I couldn't imagine a close relationship, because Thomas Athey > > > lived in Hampshire County and Levi and Mary Brant lived in Cumberland, > > > Maryland. But later an elderly aunt told me that she remembered that > > > Thomas had told her that the Brants had taken him in during the Civil > > > War when his father, William N. Athey was away with McNeill's Rangers > > > and times were tough. Afterwards, Thomas dropped the David and was > > > known as Thomas Brant Athey. Mystery solved! > > > > > > My grandfather always used the name Harry Athey, but when I found his > > > birth record in Mineral County, WV he is named as James H. I asked my > > > Uncle Gerald about this and he said that he thought that Harry didn't > > > know his birth name was James, but later I found him in the 1910 and > > > 1920 census and he lists himself as James H. > > > > > > My father always used the name Earl David, but his birth certificate > > > says David Earl, same as mine. So far, I haven't flipped my name. ;-) > > > > > > With my German names, transitions can be explained by Americanization: > > > > > > Wilhelm Heinrich Schneider becomes William Henry Snyder > > > Hardten becomes Harden > > > Koch becomes Cook > > > Burkhardt becomes Burkett > > > Muller becomes Miller > > > Fuchs becomes Fox > > > > > > What is the point of this posting? Never accept anything as fact until > > > you have sufficient documentation to assure you that it is a fact. > > > > > > Anybody else have any interesting names transitions?

Hi Bonnie, My Mosers were Pennsylvania German Americans (Bedford County). My gggrandfather Daniel Miller married Hester Moser, daughter of Philip and Catherine Exline Moser. Philip was the son of Michael Moser, purportedly the son of German immigrant Johan Martin Moser (I have not yet documented this last link). I do not have an Adam Moser in my records, so I can't say if there is a connection. David A. Bonnie Schwarz wrote: > Hi David - sorry to intrude here, but the Moser name caught my eye. I > have Moser in my Harpole family, also from WV into TN. I would have to > go dig it up now, but I have Moser's as witnesses, securities, etc. on > Harpole legal doc's, and I believe I saw that an Adam Moser married a > Susannah? Harpole. I believe this was in early Wilson or Sumner TN. > Doesn't appear that the Moser's went traveling with the Harpole's out of > TN. > > Bonnie Schwarz > > David Athey wrote: > > >Neil, > > > >Yes, I know what you mean about fluid spellings. I recorded some tombstones > >from a family cemetery of my Moser branch, and found the names engraved on the > >stones as Musser, Moser, and Moses - and these were all members of one immediate > >family - mother, father, sisters, and brothers. > > > >David A. > > > > > >

Lori, That is what I am searching for, a connection. I have Moses Porter b 1799 Hampshire Co. VA/WA and then he moved on about 1810 to Champaign Co. OH to live with an uncle. I do believe Moses is Philip and Sarah's child, but no proof as yet. Philip was shot and killed in 1800, When you have the time, I would appreciate any help you can give me. Good luck with your move. Thanks, Lori. Marilyn ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 11:45 PM Subject: Re: [WVHAMPSH-L] Sarah Largent/Philip Porter > Yes I have that info, I have to locate it, we are moving so everything is > kind of a mess right now....I will get to that as soon as I can.... > How are u relater to the Largent's?? or are you realted to Philip? > Nite Lori Largent

Evening Marilyn,  Yes I have that info, I have to locate it, we are moving so everything is kind of a mess right now....I will get to that as soon as I can....     How are u relater to the Largent's?? or are you realted to Philip? Nite Lori Largent

My question to the list is this - Hampshire Co., VA ca 1785 Per the items below, it appears that a minor son abt 14 years old paid money annually into the treasury of the commonwealth to hold a certain tract of land until he became 18 years old or old enough to buy the land . Has anyone encountered this before ? Does anyone have knowledge of "An Act Concerning Surveyors" ? >From the Survey - Sept 4, 1788 By virtue of an entry from Joseph Neville's office dated April 29, 1785, I have surveyed for .... >From the Land Grant - Beverly Randolph Esquire Governor of the Commonwealth of Virginia to all to whom these presents shall come greeting know ye that by virtue of an entry under the Act of Assembly Entitled "An Act Concerning Surveyors" and in consideration of the Annual Compensation of One pound five Shilling Sterling paid by ...... into the Treasury of this Commonwealth, There is granted by the said Commonwealth, Unto the said ........ a certain tract or parcel of land Containing ......Acres, by Survey bearing date the fourth day Of September one thousand Seven hundred and eighty eight. The Land Grant was issued on August 5th 1789 Bill

Hi David - sorry to intrude here, but the Moser name caught my eye. I have Moser in my Harpole family, also from WV into TN. I would have to go dig it up now, but I have Moser's as witnesses, securities, etc. on Harpole legal doc's, and I believe I saw that an Adam Moser married a Susannah? Harpole. I believe this was in early Wilson or Sumner TN. Doesn't appear that the Moser's went traveling with the Harpole's out of TN. Bonnie Schwarz David Athey wrote: >Neil, > >Yes, I know what you mean about fluid spellings. I recorded some tombstones >from a family cemetery of my Moser branch, and found the names engraved on the >stones as Musser, Moser, and Moses - and these were all members of one immediate >family - mother, father, sisters, and brothers. > >David A. > > >

Neil, Yes, I know what you mean about fluid spellings. I recorded some tombstones from a family cemetery of my Moser branch, and found the names engraved on the stones as Musser, Moser, and Moses - and these were all members of one immediate family - mother, father, sisters, and brothers. David A. macbd1 wrote: > Hi Becci, David and all, > > Some thoughts concerning your postings from my experiences and studies: > Many English-edgeekated clerics of colonial times and later undoubtedly had > no clue as to their impact on the history of American surnames, or the > resulting good-natured differences (sometimes confrontations?) amongst > 'cousins' of one descendant who currently spell their surnames differently, > with each claiming 'their' name is the correct spelling. Records left by > many ships' captains, census-takers, clerks of various courts (or courts in > different locales) for land deeds, wills, estates, jury lists, court > proceedings, and by different military clerks and commanding officers for > enlistment, pay, discharge records or unit rosters, and by later court > clerks for preparing Rev War pension applications (who needed to use the > original military clerk's 'official' spelling to prevent procedural problems > and possible pension denial), or church clerics' records, and even history > book authors are amongst those that contributed to such differences in > surname spellings. Beyond this, there is the anglization and Americanism of > English spelling and the many clerics who simply 'speld'm the way they > thought they heard'm be'n pernunced,' or how they had seen a certain > sound-like name spelled by another cleric. This may apply to given names as > well: for example, a husband with his two oldest sons is hunting or working > in the field when a 'careful' census-taker asks his wife (back at the house) > for the ages, first and middle names, if any, of all family members, along > with other questions, while the 3-month old baby needs to nurture, three > other young'ns are gathered about the census-taker chattering and the others > are God only knows where. The request for given names would of course apply > only for 1850 or later. > > I believe it was Andrew Jackson who exclaimed, as best I can recall today, > that he didn't trust a man who always spelled a word the same. This helps > to explain how many felt about English education of early times. Beyond > this, many if not most immigrants in frontier areas were English-illiterate. > So...how were such people to finally decide for themselves how their name > should be spelled -- and when descendants migrated to different areas, > differences undoubtedly resulted from their considering different knowledge > sources. My thoughts focus primarily on the 1700's and early 1800's in > America. > > My earliest proved ancestor's surname in 1760 and later was spelled in > various records by many variants of McDaniel, McDonald and McDonell. A Rev > War military enlistment clerk spelled his name McDaniel which 'stuck' for > many descendants. With his Ulster-Scot language and Scots' brogue I am > guessing he pronounced his name with a 'lazy' or 'quiet' > barely-opened-mouthed 'short a,' like saying ' M'Danl,' rather than with > open-mouthed emphasis of 'Don' as in McDonald. At any rate 'McDaniel' was > used for his 'official' military record although within a few weeks he was > recorded as 'McDonald' in his unit's roster, by his Captain who was a > neighbor of the family in Southwestern PA. The names McDaniel and McDonald > were subsequently recorded interchangeably in census and court records, but > McDaniel was prevalent, I believe, especially when considering the county > court-clerk using 'McDaniel' for his Rev War pension application in 1833, in > Ohio -- and county history book authors picking up on this 'military name' > for their accountings of early times when writing about them during the > later 1800's. > > McDaniel (plus variants) and McDonald were used interchangeably for another > generation in my line. A son of the above ancestor moved his family to > Southern Indiana in 1836. His wife died six years later with her tombstone > clearly stating 'Mcdannel.' But when her husband died in 1864 his stone > states McDonald, as do all subsequent ones. I believe literacy and use of > more permanent granite tombstones led to more careful name spelling as time > passed. But in 1853, in contrast, a court clerk interchangeably used > McDaniel and McDonald for the same individual in a single land deed > document! (Possibly he did this intentionally to demonstrate the individual > was known, or recorded elsewhere, by both names???) > > Surnames were first used by the French, I believe, in about 1000AD; much > later in many other countries, originally recorded in the mother-language of > earliest times. Can there therefore be a 'correct' English or American > spelling for all names in the US? Does it really matter so long as > researchers can decipher who was who, or at least live with what we find as > not being purely factual? > > Neil McDonald > PS - In the large settlement of Amish in my area having so many common > names, the middle name(s) or initial(s) must be used to obtain a longer > name-combination that distinguishes between the many having the same first > and last names. At least land deeds are recorded and the US mail gets > delivered properly so long as the correct 911 rural address is used for an > individual -- I don't know how the rural mail carriers do their job in areas > where the old delivery system is still used, with only a rural route number > listed as the 'street address.' This situation may be similar to earlier > times. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Catbite" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 7:54 AM > Subject: Re: [WVHAMPSH-L] Name Transitions > > > Hi David, > > My HARTSOCK name has went through Hertzog, Herzog, Hartsook. My STECKMAN > > line has been Stockman when they came over from Germany. My 2nd Great > > Grandfather, Espy L. Steckman, also went by his middle name of Levi in the > > Washington County census, but when he moved up to Allegany, you see him as > > Espy, which is on his tombstone. > > > > On my SLIDER side, there were so many Joseph's & William's that sometimes > > they went by their middle names so as not to confuse people. They should > > have just named them something else, huh? :) > > Becci > > > > David Athey wrote: > > > > > Hi Listers, > > > > > > I have recently been pondering over my many years of research notes, and > > > one thing that struck me early on was how name transitions came about. > > > > > > With my Athey side the men had the odd habit of switching their first > > > and middle names. The first noted for the practice was my great > > > grandfather. He used the name Thomas Brant Athey. When I started > > > locating the family in censuses, I discovered that his given name was > > > David Thomas Athey, after his grandfathers David Ray and Thomas Athey. > > > So why Thomas Brant? I knew that his aunt, Mary Athey had married Levi > > > Brant, but I couldn't imagine a close relationship, because Thomas Athey > > > lived in Hampshire County and Levi and Mary Brant lived in Cumberland, > > > Maryland. But later an elderly aunt told me that she remembered that > > > Thomas had told her that the Brants had taken him in during the Civil > > > War when his father, William N. Athey was away with McNeill's Rangers > > > and times were tough. Afterwards, Thomas dropped the David and was > > > known as Thomas Brant Athey. Mystery solved! > > > > > > My grandfather always used the name Harry Athey, but when I found his > > > birth record in Mineral County, WV he is named as James H. I asked my > > > Uncle Gerald about this and he said that he thought that Harry didn't > > > know his birth name was James, but later I found him in the 1910 and > > > 1920 census and he lists himself as James H. > > > > > > My father always used the name Earl David, but his birth certificate > > > says David Earl, same as mine. So far, I haven't flipped my name. ;-) > > > > > > With my German names, transitions can be explained by Americanization: > > > > > > Wilhelm Heinrich Schneider becomes William Henry Snyder > > > Hardten becomes Harden > > > Koch becomes Cook > > > Burkhardt becomes Burkett > > > Muller becomes Miller > > > Fuchs becomes Fox > > > > > > What is the point of this posting? Never accept anything as fact until > > > you have sufficient documentation to assure you that it is a fact. > > > > > > Anybody else have any interesting names transitions?

Elizabeth, Does this mean they are connected? I don't know.....but if Edward(brother of your John) is connected to the McCullough's of WV...then perhaps a look into it is in order. I would try to get to Romney, WV and Moorefield, WV and do some local searching in the Libraries in that area. If you do find more info on the McCullough's, please let me know.......I saw this previously....look at the VA land grants for McCollough/McCullock: http://eagle.vsla.edu/lonn/ Thanks for this link Lori!!!! John Peters Valatie, NY In a message dated 10/16/2002 7:18:08 AM Eastern Standard Time, [email protected] writes: > My McCulloughs did not come in time to tie into your McCulloughs, but they > may have been related since is is stated "Edward McCullough was a direct > descendant from the McCullough family of historical note in old Virginia > before that state was divided--he having been born in > Hampshire county later > West Virginia."

Lori, I am wondering if you might have any info on Philip Porter who md. Sarah Largent. Philip was killed in a hunting accident in 1800 by his bro-in-law Moses Largent. Philip left behind his wife and eight children. Do you happen to have any names of their children? Marilyn

Hi Becci, David and all, Some thoughts concerning your postings from my experiences and studies: Many English-edgeekated clerics of colonial times and later undoubtedly had no clue as to their impact on the history of American surnames, or the resulting good-natured differences (sometimes confrontations?) amongst 'cousins' of one descendant who currently spell their surnames differently, with each claiming 'their' name is the correct spelling. Records left by many ships' captains, census-takers, clerks of various courts (or courts in different locales) for land deeds, wills, estates, jury lists, court proceedings, and by different military clerks and commanding officers for enlistment, pay, discharge records or unit rosters, and by later court clerks for preparing Rev War pension applications (who needed to use the original military clerk's 'official' spelling to prevent procedural problems and possible pension denial), or church clerics' records, and even history book authors are amongst those that contributed to such differences in surname spellings. Beyond this, there is the anglization and Americanism of English spelling and the many clerics who simply 'speld'm the way they thought they heard'm be'n pernunced,' or how they had seen a certain sound-like name spelled by another cleric. This may apply to given names as well: for example, a husband with his two oldest sons is hunting or working in the field when a 'careful' census-taker asks his wife (back at the house) for the ages, first and middle names, if any, of all family members, along with other questions, while the 3-month old baby needs to nurture, three other young'ns are gathered about the census-taker chattering and the others are God only knows where. The request for given names would of course apply only for 1850 or later. I believe it was Andrew Jackson who exclaimed, as best I can recall today, that he didn't trust a man who always spelled a word the same. This helps to explain how many felt about English education of early times. Beyond this, many if not most immigrants in frontier areas were English-illiterate. So...how were such people to finally decide for themselves how their name should be spelled -- and when descendants migrated to different areas, differences undoubtedly resulted from their considering different knowledge sources. My thoughts focus primarily on the 1700's and early 1800's in America. My earliest proved ancestor's surname in 1760 and later was spelled in various records by many variants of McDaniel, McDonald and McDonell. A Rev War military enlistment clerk spelled his name McDaniel which 'stuck' for many descendants. With his Ulster-Scot language and Scots' brogue I am guessing he pronounced his name with a 'lazy' or 'quiet' barely-opened-mouthed 'short a,' like saying ' M'Danl,' rather than with open-mouthed emphasis of 'Don' as in McDonald. At any rate 'McDaniel' was used for his 'official' military record although within a few weeks he was recorded as 'McDonald' in his unit's roster, by his Captain who was a neighbor of the family in Southwestern PA. The names McDaniel and McDonald were subsequently recorded interchangeably in census and court records, but McDaniel was prevalent, I believe, especially when considering the county court-clerk using 'McDaniel' for his Rev War pension application in 1833, in Ohio -- and county history book authors picking up on this 'military name' for their accountings of early times when writing about them during the later 1800's. McDaniel (plus variants) and McDonald were used interchangeably for another generation in my line. A son of the above ancestor moved his family to Southern Indiana in 1836. His wife died six years later with her tombstone clearly stating 'Mcdannel.' But when her husband died in 1864 his stone states McDonald, as do all subsequent ones. I believe literacy and use of more permanent granite tombstones led to more careful name spelling as time passed. But in 1853, in contrast, a court clerk interchangeably used McDaniel and McDonald for the same individual in a single land deed document! (Possibly he did this intentionally to demonstrate the individual was known, or recorded elsewhere, by both names???) Surnames were first used by the French, I believe, in about 1000AD; much later in many other countries, originally recorded in the mother-language of earliest times. Can there therefore be a 'correct' English or American spelling for all names in the US? Does it really matter so long as researchers can decipher who was who, or at least live with what we find as not being purely factual? Neil McDonald PS - In the large settlement of Amish in my area having so many common names, the middle name(s) or initial(s) must be used to obtain a longer name-combination that distinguishes between the many having the same first and last names. At least land deeds are recorded and the US mail gets delivered properly so long as the correct 911 rural address is used for an individual -- I don't know how the rural mail carriers do their job in areas where the old delivery system is still used, with only a rural route number listed as the 'street address.' This situation may be similar to earlier times. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Catbite" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 7:54 AM Subject: Re: [WVHAMPSH-L] Name Transitions > Hi David, > My HARTSOCK name has went through Hertzog, Herzog, Hartsook. My STECKMAN > line has been Stockman when they came over from Germany. My 2nd Great > Grandfather, Espy L. Steckman, also went by his middle name of Levi in the > Washington County census, but when he moved up to Allegany, you see him as > Espy, which is on his tombstone. > > On my SLIDER side, there were so many Joseph's & William's that sometimes > they went by their middle names so as not to confuse people. They should > have just named them something else, huh? :) > Becci > > David Athey wrote: > > > Hi Listers, > > > > I have recently been pondering over my many years of research notes, and > > one thing that struck me early on was how name transitions came about. > > > > With my Athey side the men had the odd habit of switching their first > > and middle names. The first noted for the practice was my great > > grandfather. He used the name Thomas Brant Athey. When I started > > locating the family in censuses, I discovered that his given name was > > David Thomas Athey, after his grandfathers David Ray and Thomas Athey. > > So why Thomas Brant? I knew that his aunt, Mary Athey had married Levi > > Brant, but I couldn't imagine a close relationship, because Thomas Athey > > lived in Hampshire County and Levi and Mary Brant lived in Cumberland, > > Maryland. But later an elderly aunt told me that she remembered that > > Thomas had told her that the Brants had taken him in during the Civil > > War when his father, William N. Athey was away with McNeill's Rangers > > and times were tough. Afterwards, Thomas dropped the David and was > > known as Thomas Brant Athey. Mystery solved! > > > > My grandfather always used the name Harry Athey, but when I found his > > birth record in Mineral County, WV he is named as James H. I asked my > > Uncle Gerald about this and he said that he thought that Harry didn't > > know his birth name was James, but later I found him in the 1910 and > > 1920 census and he lists himself as James H. > > > > My father always used the name Earl David, but his birth certificate > > says David Earl, same as mine. So far, I haven't flipped my name. ;-) > > > > With my German names, transitions can be explained by Americanization: > > > > Wilhelm Heinrich Schneider becomes William Henry Snyder > > Hardten becomes Harden > > Koch becomes Cook > > Burkhardt becomes Burkett > > Muller becomes Miller > > Fuchs becomes Fox > > > > What is the point of this posting? Never accept anything as fact until > > you have sufficient documentation to assure you that it is a fact. > > > > Anybody else have any interesting names transitions?

The other Bill, Try these sites: http://search.msn.com/results.asp?RS=CHECKED&FORM=MSNH&v=1&q=Northern+neck+of+Virginia+land+grant You might have to cut and paste. This Bill (Pyles) ----- Original Message ----- From: Bill To: [email protected] Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2002 2:29 AM Subject: [WVHAMPSH-L] VA Land Grant document Hello, Could someone direct me to a web page with a photo of a actual Northern Neck Land Grant and a actual Commonwealth Land Grant ca 1750-1800 ? Not the ones that were copied/written by scribes. Thanks for your help. Bill

Hi David, My HARTSOCK name has went through Hertzog, Herzog, Hartsook. My STECKMAN line has been Stockman when they came over from Germany. My 2nd Great Grandfather, Espy L. Steckman, also went by his middle name of Levi in the Washington County census, but when he moved up to Allegany, you see him as Espy, which is on his tombstone. On my SLIDER side, there were so many Joseph's & William's that sometimes they went by their middle names so as not to confuse people. They should have just named them something else, huh? :) Becci David Athey wrote: > Hi Listers, > > I have recently been pondering over my many years of research notes, and > one thing that struck me early on was how name transitions came about. > > With my Athey side the men had the odd habit of switching their first > and middle names. The first noted for the practice was my great > grandfather. He used the name Thomas Brant Athey. When I started > locating the family in censuses, I discovered that his given name was > David Thomas Athey, after his grandfathers David Ray and Thomas Athey. > So why Thomas Brant? I knew that his aunt, Mary Athey had married Levi > Brant, but I couldn't imagine a close relationship, because Thomas Athey > lived in Hampshire County and Levi and Mary Brant lived in Cumberland, > Maryland. But later an elderly aunt told me that she remembered that > Thomas had told her that the Brants had taken him in during the Civil > War when his father, William N. Athey was away with McNeill's Rangers > and times were tough. Afterwards, Thomas dropped the David and was > known as Thomas Brant Athey. Mystery solved! > > My grandfather always used the name Harry Athey, but when I found his > birth record in Mineral County, WV he is named as James H. I asked my > Uncle Gerald about this and he said that he thought that Harry didn't > know his birth name was James, but later I found him in the 1910 and > 1920 census and he lists himself as James H. > > My father always used the name Earl David, but his birth certificate > says David Earl, same as mine. So far, I haven't flipped my name. ;-) > > With my German names, transitions can be explained by Americanization: > > Wilhelm Heinrich Schneider becomes William Henry Snyder > Hardten becomes Harden > Koch becomes Cook > Burkhardt becomes Burkett > Muller becomes Miller > Fuchs becomes Fox > > What is the point of this posting? Never accept anything as fact until > you have sufficient documentation to assure you that it is a fact. > > Anybody else have any interesting names transitions?

<A HREF="http://image.vtls.com/collections/NN.html">Click here: Virginia Land Office Patents and Grants - Northern Neck</A> Hope this site helps everyone.......has tons of Land Grant info & u can print them..... Lori LARGENT Tally, FL