This seems to be turning into a World War III List!!! Should we stop it now, but learn something from these exchanges? John -> -----Original Message----- -> From: .... valentine53179 [mailto:valentine53179@gmail.com] -> Sent: 15 January 2006 23:23 -> To: WORLDWAR2-L@rootsweb.com -> Subject: [WORLD WAR II] citations and references -> -> -> as with all on the list... -> you are entitled to your opinion.. -> -> you apparently did not read the earlier posts.. -> nor the post that clearly said that suchNsuchwas NOT on SUCHnSUCH data -> base when IN FACT it was.. -> now -> one can PAY for whatever services you might wish to subscribe to -> or -> one can LEARN to do research on their own... -> and -> be successful at it.. -> -> and one can learn about urls here on this list and learn about what is -> and is not avaialble to them via conversations and contributions.. -> FREE contributions by the list members who have done this for a long -> time... -> -> violated a researchers code of ethics? -> or not followed proper procedures? -> -> well gee, that seems does fit snowfrog to a T.... -> stating information without a miniscule bit of source...... -> and it was so simple a thing to do... -> as clearly it was expressed on a url provided by yet another lister at -> wwII memorial and ambc.... -> that was all it took... -> another simple copy and paste.... -> and yet -> it was not given and on top of it FOUGHT AGAINST giving the info!. -> -> -> it should be noted that not all people TAKE IT UPON THEMSELVES to do -> more research and too -> the posts on this list are in the archives for a very long time.... -> both with accuracy and INaccuracy and many naked in their -> presentation.... -> -> there are many new people on this list... -> many who have no idea that there are many free and available -> items on the net... -> and too -> many of these items are not found with search engines because of the -> heirarchy that they reside in on their web pages... -> -> not to mention that some items are seen by PEOPLE in the form of -> graphics and not searchable by spiderbots and such.... -> all of this evidenced with the info that wa posted to the list -> regarding the DElong exercise... -> -> giving people the SOURCES for the information that is being PRESENTED -> is NOT HANDING anything to a researcher... it is making the -> information complete.. -> it is not even above and beyond the call of duty.. it is standard -> practice... giving CREDIT where credit is due... else it is -> plagarism.... ! a nice word for THEFT! -> -> i know, i know snowfrog felt the need to play the game and drop years -> of experience... he is a young one to my work for over 40 years... -> longer that just about anyone on this list... i have done this work -> both with and without computers... and i might add FOR FREE....both on -> and off lists... -> -> you will notice too that i did not GIVE an answer to the -> original poster... -> I gave hime information to go and FIND data for himself... -> all of which were sites that i checked out... -> you know the old concept of eating fish or knowing how to fish -> for fish, right? -> -> -> for anyone to not follow basic and accepted practices of citation is -> absurd... for anyone to support anyone else who does not follow -> accepted practices is just as absurd.... -> -> it seems that this recent writer confuses links - where one can look -> for information - is something that needs to be cited (not!) .... the -> point has been missed... when specific information such as was -> presented regarding delong is presented as a stand alone statement -> without citation is WRONG... perhaps the url where the name could have -> been found would have been more appropriate and then snowfrog would on -> ly have had to do one copyPaste! -> -> too if the url had been given, just how many people on the list might -> have gone there and checked for their own family names... -> I wonder how many DID go to the link where delong and his mother were -> presented as a graphic? -> How many figured out how to get to their alphabetic letter or looked -> at the title page or the index and found the information about POWs? -> -> the list is for learning... -> on several occasions in these last two days -> i sent in posts asking for the source/REsource to be noted... -> sure, the original submitted took offense... -> because they failed at the basics in documentation... -> it is not library science at stake... -> it is a FULLY documented chart n family history that IS at stake.. -> experienced researchs ALL know that citation and documentation -> are requied... -> -> if this recent writer had read the material from the beginning of the -> thread - whcih can be done when the Threaded Archives is again -> uptodate (rootsweb is having problems with archiver), i think they -> will find that more than just a commentary about citation was -> presented to the list.... -> -> i presume -> that everyone on the list knows how to get to the threaded archives... -> -> -> if you dont, then click on this address and ask valentine53179@gmail.com -> -> -> -> -> -> -> On 1/15/06, s k <jackflack3@yahoo.com> wrote: -> > Yet everyone should note that the original poster Bill -> > White who asked about Delong is probably afraid to -> > check back in because helpful posters have violated a -> > researches code of ethics amd have not followed proper -> > procedures? -> > -> > In most cases this list and others like it are about a -> > family member looking for information on relatives who -> > have served in the armed forces. It's about helping -> > someone out and not getting lectured on library -> > science. Most posters have no idea where to start and -> > any historical data is appreciated. -> > -> > Snowfrog has done a great service here for a long -> > time. When I was looking for info on a great uncle -> > killed on Peleliu I did not automatically assume that -> > the information that I received from bulletin board / -> > lists respondents was correct. I took it upon myself -> > to research and to follow up with other sources of -> > information. -> > -> > If you want to use the resources of the internet to -> > look for a military history of a relative then fine. -> > If you want someone to do all the work for you with -> > references and citations then you can pay for it. -> > -> > Other sites that are very helpful with no lecturing -> > just good helpful information. -> > -> > http://members.aol.com/dadswar/ -> > -> > http://genforum.genealogy.com/wwii/ -> > -> > http://ww2.vet.org/default.asp -> > -> > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec?htx=board&r=an&p=topics.Military.wwii -> > -> > -> > -> > -> > -> > -> > -> > --- ".... valentine53179" <valentine53179@hotmail.com> -> > wrote: -> > -> > > you can say that you are giving information that is -> > > based on your military experience..... -> > > rather, it is information that you gleaned from -> > > SOMEWHERE... -> > > you failed to cite sources... and I made note of -> > > it... -> > > you have done a disservice to the list and the -> > > person asking for the query and now are trying to -> > > qualify it...... -> > > with all of your 20 years of research experience, -> > > you, of all people, should know better..... -> > > -> > > ----- Original Message ----- -> > > From: -> > > Snowfrog1961@aol.com<mailto:Snowfrog1961@aol.com> -> > > To: -> > > -> > WORLDWAR2-L@rootsweb.com<mailto:WORLDWAR2-L@rootsweb.com> -> > > -> > > Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 7:45 PM -> > > Subject: Re: [WORLD WAR II] Re: K Company 3rd -> > > Battalion 5th Marine Regiment 1st Marine... -> > > -> > > -> > > If the person asking the question wishes to know -> > > my sources, then I am happy -> > > to provide them based on my 20 years of military -> > > research experience -> > > However, recently it seems that you are demanding -> > > sources in regards to questions -> > > neither asked by you or answers directed to you. -> > > I find your comments to be -> > > entirely off topic and unnecessary. Back to the -> > > questions, for which this -> > > forum exists. Moderator attention please! -> > > -> -> -> ==== WORLDWAR2 Mailing List ==== -> We are an international list! Please, always tell the list what -> country your ancestor is from. This helps all of us, especially -> you! If you give dates please help us understand the date you -> are referring to. For example: 4 Nov 1944 or Nov 4, 1944. -> -> ============================== -> View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find -> marriage announcements and more. Learn more: -> http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx -> -> -- -> No virus found in this incoming message. -> Checked by AVG Free Edition. -> Version: 7.1.361 / Virus Database: 267.14.17/229 - Release Date: -> 13/01/2006 -> -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.361 / Virus Database: 267.14.17/229 - Release Date: 13/01/2006