Cuz B, Please send me a copy too. My head is spinning from trying to unscramble Sir John's little tome. My hat is off to you, and to anyone else who can make sense of it. Earl Earl

Becky, could I have a copy of the table. I do ha ve excel. Thanks Mary Winn Anderson ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Thill Group Inc" <ttg-inc@comcast.net> To: <WINN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 2:07 AM Subject: Re: [WINN] Re: WINN-D Digest V03 #220 > Sorry I don't do Fax... It is only a one page chart. > Cuz B > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <JDoug30627@aol.com> > To: <WINN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 12:40 AM > Subject: [WINN] Re: WINN-D Digest V03 #220 > > > > Becky, I surely would like to have a copy of the Wynne Diaries---but I > don't > > have Excel. I don't know how long it is, but was wondering if it is short > > enough to Fax - I do have a Fax. I'll wait for your answer. Thanks, J > Wynn > > Doughtie > > >

This was a response from my Cuz Connie, who is working on all the lines. I thought it would be of interest. Hugs Cuz B READ BELOW ----- Original Message ----- From: <GramereC@aol.com> To: <WYNNE-GENEALOGY-SOCIETY-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2003 3:17 AM Subject: Re: [WGS] The History of the Gwydir Family" written by Sir John Wynne, Knt. a... > Well it isn't really a Southern Book either. > > Our line is there with Robin's heiress and Ithel Vycahn. Then we come forward > the next generation there are two sons. One is our line the other is Evan's > of Northup Co. Flintshire. > > Our line Cynric ap Ithel Vychan then has three sons. John of military notice > Bosworth Feild, Rhys whose grandsons inherit John's land at Chilton, and Harri > of our direct line. > > Side trip here. The Wynne Diaries come back to Ithel Vycahn. Ithel Vychans > great grand son Richard remained at Holt while Richards son William succeeded > John at Chilton. The Wynne Diaries document this. > > These are also some of the Southern Wynne lines that we have just pulled out > this year. By we I mean our WGS. IT has been a group effort between Becky, > Ellen and myself to untangle these lines. > > Ithely Vycahn is Dr. Thomas Wynnes GGGGGGrandfather. Harri above is his > GGGGrandfather. Our Line Ithel Vychan, Cynric, Harri (brothers Rees and John), John > Wynne, Rees (1538), John (1570), Thomas (1589), and Thomas(1627). >

"The History of the Gwydir Family" written by Sir John Wynne, Knt. and Bart, ut creditur & Patet. Oswestry, 1878 Which I consider a "Southern" book as it pertains to what most think is the lines to the southern cuz's.... but I found a interesting generation.... Interesting note.... on the Table II [following page 28] it shows the family line: 1. David ap Gruffith ap Cariadog d = Evp [Eve], da. of Gruffith Vaughan b. 2. Howell ap David = Eva, or Myfanwy [dau. of Evan or Ievan, son of Howell ap Meredith of Evioneth] 3. Meredith ap Howell = Morvydd, da. of Jevan ap David ap Trahayarn Goch of the house of Rhys ap Tudor. She died 1416 4. Robert ap Meredith when he was almost 80 married Angharad, da. of David ap L'yn, &c [She mar. 2ndly Meredith ap Rhys ap Ievan [Llwyd. &c] j 4. Jevan ap Meredith, married Llelki, dau. of Howel Sele. k 4. Robin = 5. A da. wife of Ithel Vaughan 4. Marsli, wife of Jenkin Conwey ancestor of the Conways. This is the generation I find interesting!! 4. Robin = 5. A da. wife of Ithel Vaughan Dr. Thomas Wynne is related to this Ithel Vaughan . 1 Ithel Vychan [Vaughan] ap [Kynveig] Cynwrig b.: 1440 Bodfari, Yskeiviog [village and parish], Flintshire Co., Wales .. +Angharad verch Robin b: 1440 Holt and Northop m: 1459 .. 2 Cynwrig [Cynric Sais] ap Ithel Vychan b: Abt. 1461 Bodfari, Ysceifiog, Flintshire Co., Wales d: Aft. 1490 .... +Tanglwystl Llwyd ferch Gruffydd Llwyd b: Abt. 1465 Bodfari, Ysciefiog, Flintshire Co., Wales m: Abt. 1480 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales .3 Harri Wynne ap Cynwrig b: Abt. 1485 Bron Fadoc, Ysceifiog, North Wales ...... +Alis [Ales, Alice] Thelwall b: 1485 Plas Y Ward nr Ruthin, Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales m: Abt. 1500 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales d: Plas Y Ward nr Ruthin, Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales .. 4 John Wynne ap Harri b: Abt. 1501 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales d: 1572 Upkeiviog ........ +Katherine [Jenkins] ferch Ithel b: Abt. 1500 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales m: Abt. 1527 d: Abt. 1563 ... 5 Rhys ap John Wynne b: 1538 Yskeiviog, Flintshire Co., North Wales d: Aft. 1592 Yskeiviog, Flintshire Co. North Wales .......... +Katherine b: Abt. 1543 Yskeiviog, Flintshire Co. North Wales m: 1563 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales .. 6 John ap Rhys b: 1570 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales d: 1638 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales ............. +Grace Morgan b: Abt. 1570 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales m: October 29, 1588 Bodfari Church, Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales ... 7 Thomas ap John Wyn b: December 26, 1589 Bron Fadoc (Estate), Caerwys (Twp.), Ysceifiog (Parish), Flintshire (Cty.), North Wales d: October 7, 1633 Bodfari, North Wales ............... +Mrs Thomas ap John Wyn b: Abt. 1589 m: 1616 Ysceifiog, Flintshire, Wales .... 8 Thomas Wynne b: July 20, 1627 Bron Fadoc (Estate), Caerwys (Twp.), Ysceifiog (Parish), Flintshire (Cty.), North Wales d: March 16, 1691/92 Philadelphia, Philadelphia Cty., PA. ................. +Martha Elizabeth Buttall b: 1627 Clwyd, Wrexham, Denbighshire, Wales m: 1655 Wrexham, Denbighshire, Wales d: Bet. June - July 1676 Wales And yeah Connie I know you probably already noticed that as you had worked with me on the Ithel Vaughan part and talked of this. Hugs Cuz B ttg-inc@comcast.net http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~ttg13/

I too would like a copy of the chart. Bob Blackwell

I would love a copy of the excel chart, if possible. Melanie

Hi All, Becky has distributed a copy of the pedigree from Ann Fremantle's The Wynne Diaries, but there is some additional info you may find of interest. If you discard the reference at the top to John Wynne being a brother to Richard Wynne [II], the rest of the chart is accurate. Down in the middle of the chart, off to the left side, you will find one "Giustiniana Wynne", dau. of Richard Wynne [IV], b.1744. If you don't already recognize the name you should check out either 'The New Yorker' Aug. 18 & 25, 2003 issue for an article by Andrea di Robilant, the author of a recently published book title "A Venetian Affair". This book is the latest addition to a long-running story about Giustiniana, her long & troubled love affair with a Venetian gent, Andra Memmo, and her involvement with Casanova -- She was called "Mlle. XCV" in his 'Memoirs'. This story began with a book by B. Brunelli, "Casanova Loved Her" (1929) which was based largely on a set of letters from Giustiniana to her lover, Memmo. Then, in 1955, J. Rives Childs found a second bathc of these letters and published a book "Justienne" in 1959; He revised it later as "Casanova: A New Perspective" (1988). Now comes di Robilant, a desc. of Andrea Memmo, who found even more letters and has published a very interesting account of the whole story. Richard Wynne [IV], father of Giustiniana, had become a very rich man as this Shrewsbury Wynne family had prospered greatly in England's booming international trade enterprises. But Richard's first wife died, leaving him distraught and childless. He left England for Europe and came to Venice where he met, supposedly via a gondolier, a pretty young Greek-Italian woman, Anna Gazzini. The result was a daughter, Giustiniana, who was legitimized when Richard marr. Anna, and went on to produce four more chn. Giustiniana was reportedly a beauty and a charmer and while still under 20 had begun the secretive affair with Memmo. They could not marry because of objections from both families, but corresponded secretly over many years, even thru the times when Anna took the family to England to establish her right to their inheritance after the death of Richard Wynne [IV]. The latest book is a fascinating tale of the life and times of these families. Tho Giustiniana never married Memmo, she did marry an aged Austrian diplomat, Count von Rosenberg, but the old Count could never prove the Wynne's claim to English or Welsh nobility, and therefore, Giustiniana was never accepted at the Austrian court. Therein lies an important fact: Altho this Montgomeryshire Wynne line repeatedly claimed the right to bear the arms of 'three eagles in fesse' of Owain Gwynedd, they neve succeeded in proving their claim. If they couldn't do it back in the 18th cent., it would be most hard for us to do so now. But Giustiniana soldiered on and made a good name for herself as a writer, finally returning to Venice, where she died in 1791. J. Rives Childs, who was an American Foreign Service Officer for whom writing was a hobby, tried to trace the footsteps of the Thomas Wynne (shown on the chart) who came to Va. "and had issue". He reported on this in an article -- Va. Mag. of Hist & Biog., v.72 'The Wynne Family of Gwydir and Va.' -- but got confused by the lack of much info in Va. about Wynnes other than the line of Col. Robert Wynne, so never could get a handle on the problem. By the way, Thomas' coming to Va. is "proved" in the acceptance of The College of Arms of the family's statement. Myles Johnson

Becky, I would also appreciate a copy of the chart at your convenience. Happy holidays, Thanks, Faye ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Thill Group Inc" <ttg-inc@comcast.net> To: <WINN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 12:52 PM Subject: [WINN] Please Note... The Wynne Diaries... Chart Table 1 > Dear Cuz's, > Please note that Fremantle's chart is not totally true... This was again > pointed out to me by one of our Guru's, Cuz Myles. > NOTE: Sir John Wynne was not connected to this family. It is an error > and do not perpetuate it please. > Also: Proven fact that one Thomas Wynne did come to Va. and have issue. > > I am going to take this time to remind everyone, just because you find > something in a book does not mean it is true. Nor does it mean it is proven. > It just means that someone wrote it in a book. Yes it is wonderful to have > these hints to help us work on things, but with out documents to back them > up they are just a nice story in a book. > > Thanks > Cuz B > ttg-inc@comcast.net > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~ttg13/ >

Becky, I would like to have a copy of the chart. Don Winn dwinn@tn4u.com -----Original Message----- From: The Thill Group Inc [mailto:ttg-inc@comcast.net] Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 12:52 PM To: WINN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [WINN] Please Note... The Wynne Diaries... Chart Table 1 Dear Cuz's, Please note that Fremantle's chart is not totally true... This was again pointed out to me by one of our Guru's, Cuz Myles. NOTE: Sir John Wynne was not connected to this family. It is an error and do not perpetuate it please. Also: Proven fact that one Thomas Wynne did come to Va. and have issue. I am going to take this time to remind everyone, just because you find something in a book does not mean it is true. Nor does it mean it is proven. It just means that someone wrote it in a book. Yes it is wonderful to have these hints to help us work on things, but with out documents to back them up they are just a nice story in a book. Thanks Cuz B ttg-inc@comcast.net http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~ttg13/

Dear Barbara, I still think you belong to us Northern Wynne's who come off of Dr. Thomas Wynne but still haven't found your connection yet...sigh one day you and I will both do the Desk top dance when we find it won't we!!! Happy Holidays Cuz B ttg-inc@comcast.net ----- Original Message ----- From: <barbsidler@earthlink.net> To: <WINN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 2:39 PM Subject: [WINN] Winn family not in the southern US > This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. > > Surnames: Winn > Classification: Query > > Message Board URL: > > http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/FgWBAEB/716 > > Message Board Post: > > I am looking for information on the Winn families that were in the northern half aof the US in the late 1700's through 1840 or so. There is so much information on the Winn families from Virginia but but I can make no connection .. I only have one name, Elizabeth Winn, born in Ohio around 1817, parents born in Pennsylvania. She named her children Adelia, Emma Maline, and William Henry. If anyone has a Winn family in Pennsylvania, Ohio , Indiana or Wisconsin, please let me know so I can try those braches too. > Barbara Sidler > >

My cousins took a trip to Lunenburg Co.,VA to go thru the court records and have sent me the following. Some of these are known to me, others are not. Does anyone out there relate to these? 1. Indenture of feoffment ( conveyance of fee interest) by William Wynne, February Court 1748. Order Book 2, pg. 107 2 William Wynne commissioned by the Governor to be Lieutenant Colonel of Foot in Lunenburg County- subscribed oath, July Court 1750. Order Book 2, pg. 326 3. Samuel Wynne licensed to keep an ordinary at this dwelling house for one year. Oct. Court 1748. Order Book 2, p.84 4. Deed for 100 acres in Lunenburg Co. by Samuel Winn of Lunenburg county to Daniel Winn of Prince George Co., dated Nov. 4 ,1752 the same having been granted to said Samuel Winn by patent bearing date at Williamsburg August 17, 1752. Acknowledgement by Samuel Winn of receipt of 190 (pounds) consideration dated Nov.4, 1752. Certified and recorded Feb. 6, 1753, making reference to acts and deed of theabove named Samuel Wynne. (note spelling change). Record Book 3 (1752-1759), pp.226-228. 5. Deed of 162 acres of land in Lunenburg County by William Reed to Peter Wynne of Amelia County, dated Dec. 13, 1749, recorded Jan. 2, 1749 ( a note- "old style" should be 1750). Deed Book 1, pp 470-472. 6. Deed of 726 acres by Thomas Winn to John Winn, dated April 8, 1762, recorded May 4, 1762, being part of a tract of 2,959 acres granted to Thomas Winn by patent dated Aug.7, 1761 ( Witnessed by John Winn, Daniel Winn and another John Winn) Deed of 1,490(?) acres by Thomas Winn to Daniel Winn, being part of a tract of 2, 959 acres granted Thomas Winn (can't read the rest)---(witnessed by John Winn, another John Winn and yet another John Winn) Deed Book 1, pp 231-234 (bottom line or lines missing from photocopy of page 232) 7. Road survey order to Thomas Wynne, April Court 1748. Order Book 2,(?) p. 397. 8. Indenture of feoffment by John Winn and wife Ann to Richard Hazzard. Thomas Wynne oath as Captian of Foot. John Wynne oath as Lieutenant under Thomas Wynne. August Court 1755. Order book 3 (1754-55) p.400. 9. John Winn will dated March 8, 1768 and filed May 12, 1768 mentions wife Susannah Winn, Children Harrison Winn, Betty Winn and "the child my wife is now big with". Will Book 2, pg 326 10.. Inventory of the estate of John Winn dated Sep. 16, 1768, recorded Aug. 10, 1769. Will Book 2, pp 344-345. Will of Thomas Winn dated Sept. 18,1779 and filed April 12, 1781, mention of wife Sarah Winn, sons Bannister Winn, Edmund Winn, Wahsington Winn and daughter Henrietta Maria Winn. Will Book 3, pp75-76. This info is on the first 2 pages he sent me. I'll copy and forward the rest later. All of the counties mentioned are in Virginia. Merry Christmas to all....hope you find a relative in among this information. Carolyn Markie " a Southern Winn"

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Surnames: Winn Classification: Query Message Board URL: http://boards.ancestry.com/mbexec/msg/an/FgWBAEB/716 Message Board Post: I am looking for information on the Winn families that were in the northern half aof the US in the late 1700's through 1840 or so. There is so much information on the Winn families from Virginia but but I can make no connection .. I only have one name, Elizabeth Winn, born in Ohio around 1817, parents born in Pennsylvania. She named her children Adelia, Emma Maline, and William Henry. If anyone has a Winn family in Pennsylvania, Ohio , Indiana or Wisconsin, please let me know so I can try those braches too. Barbara Sidler

Dear Cuz's, Please note that Fremantle's chart is not totally true... This was again pointed out to me by one of our Guru's, Cuz Myles. NOTE: Sir John Wynne was not connected to this family. It is an error and do not perpetuate it please. Also: Proven fact that one Thomas Wynne did come to Va. and have issue. I am going to take this time to remind everyone, just because you find something in a book does not mean it is true. Nor does it mean it is proven. It just means that someone wrote it in a book. Yes it is wonderful to have these hints to help us work on things, but with out documents to back them up they are just a nice story in a book. Thanks Cuz B ttg-inc@comcast.net http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~ttg13/

Merry Christmas to all ! I would like a copy please. San Antonio Tx. The Alcoser Family

I would like a copy. Cicely Wynne (Winn) Houston ----- Original Message ----- From: <Rrac1@aol.com> To: <WINN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 8:38 AM Subject: Re: [WINN] Excel chart of The Wynne Diaries Table I > Merry Christmas to all ! > > I would like a copy please. > > San Antonio Tx. > The Alcoser Family >

Becky, I would like to have one also. Thanks Elizabeth martin

Becky, Please send me one also. Thanks and Merry Christmas! Debra Winn Southerland d8081@aol.com

Becky, I surely would like to have a copy of the Wynne Diaries---but I don't have Excel. I don't know how long it is, but was wondering if it is short enough to Fax - I do have a Fax. I'll wait for your answer. Thanks, J Wynn Doughtie

Sorry I don't do Fax... It is only a one page chart. Cuz B ----- Original Message ----- From: <JDoug30627@aol.com> To: <WINN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2003 12:40 AM Subject: [WINN] Re: WINN-D Digest V03 #220 > Becky, I surely would like to have a copy of the Wynne Diaries---but I don't > have Excel. I don't know how long it is, but was wondering if it is short > enough to Fax - I do have a Fax. I'll wait for your answer. Thanks, J Wynn > Doughtie >

CuzB: I'd appreciate a copy. Bob McDougal The Thill Group Inc wrote: > > Should anyone want the Table 1 of the Wynne Diaries I have made it up in > Excel... if you don't have Excel you can't view it. Let me know if you want > a copy > Cuz B > ttg-inc@comcast.net > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~ttg13/