Thanks Boe for refreshing my memory. I was aware of the Border Scots but had not associated it with Wales. Scots-Irish is a term used in America to separate the Ulster Scots from the Irish. The Ulster Scots thought they were a cut above the Irish and were here first. If your roots are in the Appalachians there is a good chance of being Scots-Irish, Ulster Scots and Border Scots. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Boe Williams" <ccshoes@bellsouth.net> To: <williams-dna@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:53 AM Subject: Re: [WILLIAMS-DNA] Family Movie on Wales > Many of the Scots-Irish were really from Wales. Most were from the border > country between Scotland and England. Howerever there were some from Wales > and some from around London. There were also some French Protestants. We > are > the only ones who refer to them as "Scots-Irish, which is an apt term, > i.e. > Scots born in Irleand. Perhaps a better name would be Ulster Scots, or > still > better, "Borderers". > > The point is, your family could have come to this country from Northern > Ireland, but still could have originally come from Wales. > > E. l. "Boe' Williams > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Frank Williams" <fwillia@bellsouth.net> > To: "Scott K. Williams" <showmemule@earthlink.net>; > <williams-dna@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 6:48 AM > Subject: Re: [WILLIAMS-DNA] Family Movie on Wales > > >> Scott, thank you for the information. I find this very interesting. > Although >> I think my Williams is Scots-Irish it could still have roots in Wales. >> Group 20 is the only one I know of that may share a Scots-Irish decent. I >> think you and I share the first 12 markers. If we have any Scots-Irish >> Williams out there I would like to hear from you. >> >> Frank Williams Group 20 Williams DNA Project >> http://williams.genealogy.fm/ >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Scott K. Williams" <showmemule@earthlink.net> >> To: <williams-dna@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 6:13 AM >> Subject: [WILLIAMS-DNA] Family Movie on Wales >> >> >> > Every family that traces its origin to Wales should see the following >> > movie: >> > >> > The Englishman Who Went Up a Hill But Came Down a Mountain (1995), >> > starring Hugh Grant, Tara Fitzgerald, Colm Meaney. (rated PG) >> > >> > The narrator begins the story: >> > >> > "For some odd reason, lost in the mists of time, there's an > extraordinary >> > shortage of last names in Wales. Almost everyone seems to be a >> > Williams, > a >> > Jones, or an Evans. To avoid widespread confusion, Welsh people often > add >> > an occupation to a name. For example, there was Williams the Petroleum, >> > and Williams the Death. There was Jones the Bottle, and Jones the Prize >> > Cabbage..." >> > >> > One reviewer does make the comment that, "Actually there is a known >> > reason: as part of their increased domination of Wales in the 16th >> > century, the English abolished the Welsh system of patronymics and >> > introduced surnames arbitrarily." >> > >> > The basic story begins in 1917 when two English Cartographers arrive at >> > the Welsh village, Ffynnon Garw, to measure the mountains height. On >> > British maps mountains were only depicted if they were 1000 meters or >> > taller, otherwise it was only a "hill". This offended the village > people, >> > who stated that their sons were fighting and dying fighting the Germans >> > (in WWI) and if they came back they would find the English have taken > our >> > mountain. "This can't happen--this is a national emergency!" >> > >> > So this movie tells the commic tale about how the village defends their >> > mountain. >> > >> > Last thing, Williams, the Petroleum (gas station mechanic) "is asked > about >> > a broken part he has removed from a car, and replies "I don't know what >> > you call it in English, but in Welsh we call it a bechingalw". > Bechingalw >> > means "whatjumacallit"." >> > >> > Blockbuster lists it among the 100 movies you must see before you die, > and >> > I highly recommend anyone with roots in Wales to see it. >> > >> > --Scott Williams >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > WILLIAMS-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the >> > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > WILLIAMS-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> -- >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.1.413 / Virus Database: 268.18.16/729 - Release Date: >> 3/21/2007 >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > WILLIAMS-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

You surely are right about the Ulster Scots feeling superior to the native Irish. I have a letter written in 1842 by Robert Donaldson ( 1769-1852) of Bulloch County, GA, in which he states "I am a Scot and I was born in Northern Ireland...." In his letter he made it clear that he didn't want to be confused with an Irishman. It is said that at least 20% of the colonist at the time of the American Revoution had some Ulster Scot ancestry and of course, there was a concentration in Applachia. There was a colony in Duplin Co, (eastern NC) in 1736 that has many descendants today. Also, one at Queensboro, Jefferson County, GA. Some were in up country S.C. as well as New York Probably most landed in Penn. and came down into the Appalacians. There supposedly was not much mixing between the native Catholic Irish and the Calvinist Scots in Ulster, but a study of the surnames indicates , in my opinion, that there was more than is commonly believed. Boe ----- Original Message ----- From: "Frank Williams" <fwillia@bellsouth.net> To: <williams-dna@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 1:30 PM Subject: Re: [WILLIAMS-DNA] Family Movie on Wales > Thanks Boe for refreshing my memory. I was aware of the Border Scots but had > not associated it with Wales. Scots-Irish is a term used in America to > separate the Ulster Scots from the Irish. The Ulster Scots thought they were > a cut above the Irish and were here first. If your roots are in the > Appalachians there is a good chance of being Scots-Irish, Ulster Scots and > Border Scots. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Boe Williams" <ccshoes@bellsouth.net> > To: <williams-dna@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 9:53 AM > Subject: Re: [WILLIAMS-DNA] Family Movie on Wales > > > > Many of the Scots-Irish were really from Wales. Most were from the border > > country between Scotland and England. Howerever there were some from Wales > > and some from around London. There were also some French Protestants. We > > are > > the only ones who refer to them as "Scots-Irish, which is an apt term, > > i.e. > > Scots born in Irleand. Perhaps a better name would be Ulster Scots, or > > still > > better, "Borderers". > > > > The point is, your family could have come to this country from Northern > > Ireland, but still could have originally come from Wales. > > > > E. l. "Boe' Williams > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Frank Williams" <fwillia@bellsouth.net> > > To: "Scott K. Williams" <showmemule@earthlink.net>; > > <williams-dna@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 6:48 AM > > Subject: Re: [WILLIAMS-DNA] Family Movie on Wales > > > > > >> Scott, thank you for the information. I find this very interesting. > > Although > >> I think my Williams is Scots-Irish it could still have roots in Wales. > >> Group 20 is the only one I know of that may share a Scots-Irish decent. I > >> think you and I share the first 12 markers. If we have any Scots-Irish > >> Williams out there I would like to hear from you. > >> > >> Frank Williams Group 20 Williams DNA Project > >> http://williams.genealogy.fm/ > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Scott K. Williams" <showmemule@earthlink.net> > >> To: <williams-dna@rootsweb.com> > >> Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2007 6:13 AM > >> Subject: [WILLIAMS-DNA] Family Movie on Wales > >> > >> > >> > Every family that traces its origin to Wales should see the following > >> > movie: > >> > > >> > The Englishman Who Went Up a Hill But Came Down a Mountain (1995), > >> > starring Hugh Grant, Tara Fitzgerald, Colm Meaney. (rated PG) > >> > > >> > The narrator begins the story: > >> > > >> > "For some odd reason, lost in the mists of time, there's an > > extraordinary > >> > shortage of last names in Wales. Almost everyone seems to be a > >> > Williams, > > a > >> > Jones, or an Evans. To avoid widespread confusion, Welsh people often > > add > >> > an occupation to a name. For example, there was Williams the Petroleum, > >> > and Williams the Death. There was Jones the Bottle, and Jones the Prize > >> > Cabbage..." > >> > > >> > One reviewer does make the comment that, "Actually there is a known > >> > reason: as part of their increased domination of Wales in the 16th > >> > century, the English abolished the Welsh system of patronymics and > >> > introduced surnames arbitrarily." > >> > > >> > The basic story begins in 1917 when two English Cartographers arrive at > >> > the Welsh village, Ffynnon Garw, to measure the mountains height. On > >> > British maps mountains were only depicted if they were 1000 meters or > >> > taller, otherwise it was only a "hill". This offended the village > > people, > >> > who stated that their sons were fighting and dying fighting the Germans > >> > (in WWI) and if they came back they would find the English have taken > > our > >> > mountain. "This can't happen--this is a national emergency!" > >> > > >> > So this movie tells the commic tale about how the village defends their > >> > mountain. > >> > > >> > Last thing, Williams, the Petroleum (gas station mechanic) "is asked > > about > >> > a broken part he has removed from a car, and replies "I don't know what > >> > you call it in English, but in Welsh we call it a bechingalw". > > Bechingalw > >> > means "whatjumacallit"." > >> > > >> > Blockbuster lists it among the 100 movies you must see before you die, > > and > >> > I highly recommend anyone with roots in Wales to see it. > >> > > >> > --Scott Williams > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ------------------------------- > >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> > WILLIAMS-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the > >> > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > WILLIAMS-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >> > >> > >> -- > >> No virus found in this incoming message. > >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. > >> Version: 7.1.413 / Virus Database: 268.18.16/729 - Release Date: > >> 3/21/2007 > >> > >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > WILLIAMS-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to WILLIAMS-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.413 / Virus Database: 268.18.16/729 - Release Date: 3/21/2007 > >