A vote sounds good to me - Marcia has been known to have great ideas, and this seems to be one of them. I have left instructions to my granddaughter who is the only one of my family with computer smarts to send a message to WigenWeb if I am found dead (VBG). But I do think that address and phone number is a good thing to do. Shelley Marathon and Lincoln Counties

Debie, I wasn't pointing fingers or suggesting that you hold back (as a matter of fact, I've never ever been to the Sheboygan and Calumet sites). I was just making a general comment to Shari's message. Michelle Debie & Joe wrote: > Ummmm..... Just to clarify something for my own peace of mind. I do not > charge for any look ups, I live to far from Calumet county to do it > regularly, but I do e-mail my list if I am going in the event someone may > need something. I am not holding back content for either county, there just > isn't as much being contributed for Calumet as for Sheboygan and their > libraries in Calumet don't offer much either. > > Debie Blindauer > > Sheboygan & Calumet Counties > > ==== WIGEN Mailing List ==== > Celebrate Wisconsin! > Visit the Langlade County WIGenWeb Project Pages > http://www.rootsweb.com/~wilangla/welcome.html -- Frank & Michelle Laycock kengenweb@core.com Kenosha County Coordinators WIGenWeb Project

Deb, its not you I'm referring to. I know how hard you work on putting content on your site. It's the ones who put up the bare minimum and then charge for lookups that I have a problem with. And I don't mean charging for copies of vital records...I just supply some of the data on them, and if it matches what they're looking for, they can order the certificate themselves. I mean charging for doing lookups that are necessary because the cc has put virtually nothing online, which to me looks like a thinly veiled attempt to line their pockets through their affiliations with the USGenWeb Project and rootsweb. Shari Milks, cc Manitowoc county

Ummmm..... Just to clarify something for my own peace of mind. I do not charge for any look ups, I live to far from Calumet county to do it regularly, but I do e-mail my list if I am going in the event someone may need something. I am not holding back content for either county, there just isn't as much being contributed for Calumet as for Sheboygan and their libraries in Calumet don't offer much either. Debie Blindauer Sheboygan & Calumet Counties

Shari, I agree with you. As a new CC, I would like to comment. I have had so many friendly and willing people help me on the Rootsweb sites and I would just "cry" to see Rootsweb become a pay site. Also, I believe firmly that CC's should not put very little content and charge to do lookups. If a CC is going to run a genealogy business they should create their own web site advertising their services and not use the GenWeb sites (even with a link) for their own purposes. I realize that they are not making a whole lot of money with their research service, but the point of free genealogy is that it is free. A CC should give the site the attention that it deserves. Withholding content defeats the purpose of the project. If a CC resorts to this attitude, then he/she is not 'volunteering' to RootsWeb. I do, however, feel that a CC should withhold content in the instance of copyrighted material. I think that if someone submitted something to the site in which the source is a book or other published material I would check with the owner of the work before posting. For example, I have access to some published family histories at the Kenosha Public Library that it would be easy to scan and add to the site. I would never do this without first contacting the author/researcher. Thank you for letting me put in my 2 cents! Michelle Laycock kengenweb@core.com Kenosha County Coordinators WIGenWeb Project Shari Milks wrote: > My main complaint is with cc's who put very little content on their pages then charge to do lookups. I feel this is out of line with what our main objective is...free genealogy on the internet. My volunteers and I do not charge for a lookup whatsoever, and we see to it as much material is put online as physically possible...our fingers can only type so fast. To me, this practice doesn't hold with "free genealogy". > Shari Milks cc Manitowoc county > > ==== WIGEN Mailing List ==== > Celebrate Wisconsin! > Visit the Lincoln County WIGenWeb Project Pages > http://www.rootsweb.com/~wilincol/

Tina, Would it be possible to let those of us who can't make the discussion know what comes out of it? Being a mom of 6 boys with a husband that works third shift, there is no way I can make those meetings at night. I have tried several times and it just doesn't happen. However, I would like to know what comes of it. Thanks, Debie Blindauer Sheboygan & Calumet Counties

My main complaint is with cc's who put very little content on their pages then charge to do lookups. I feel this is out of line with what our main objective is...free genealogy on the internet. My volunteers and I do not charge for a lookup whatsoever, and we see to it as much material is put online as physically possible...our fingers can only type so fast. To me, this practice doesn't hold with "free genealogy". Shari Milks cc Manitowoc county

Hi All, Me again, Correct me if I am wrong, but I got the impression that this wasn't just a brief attempt at contacting these CC's, right? I am assuming these sites have sat idle for many, many months? Even looking at the worse case scenario here, is it feasible that after being off the computer for that long or ill or whatever the case may be that a CC is going to worry about the county? I don't have a problem giving my snail mail address or even my phone number for that fact, but here is the problem I would encounter. Should my computer blow up and I not be able to get on-line and a few months go by and let's say Tina called my house. I stand a snowballs chance in hell of ever receiving that message, unless I am lucky enough to have her get the answering machine and then of course I would have to get the message before my oldest boys. I have two teens in my house and a third coming, I have worked long and hard to get them to remember to give me messages, they are now to the point that if it is a friend of mine, and they recognize the name, I stand a better chance of them remembering to tell me of a phone call. Just last week I was lucky enough to finally obtain a message my oldest son wrote down a little more then 3 months ago from the insurance company seeking additional information on a claim. He happened to be cleaning out his backpack and found this. See my point? I understand the complainers also. People who need to really get a life. I had one go so far one time to be contacting the CC for Manitowoc county asking if she had any influence over me to get me to put more stuff up on Calumet county. Calumet is nearly as small a county as you can get, you can almost spit from one side of the county and reach the other. There just isn't a whole lot of info out there as opposed to Sheboygan county. I have traveled to the libraries in Calumet county, I have tried working with the R. of D. to obtain the vital indexes, it has just been a nightmare. Unlike Sheboygan which currently carries over 900+ pages of information, my little Calumet has a mere 184 pages. So, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if Tina has heard alot of complaining about my little Calumet, but at least I respond and I think that is the issue here. One more point before I close this boring letter, if the person was unable to receive their e-mail, broken computer, hospital, whatever the case may be, wouldn't the e-mail pile to the point of bouncing? We have two internet accounts here, the "kids" computer is old and on it's last leg, my husband's e-mail wasn't able to be accessed for more then 30 days and it bounced bigtime. Tina didn't say she was getting returned mail that was bouncing. Can I ask how many counties and which ones we are talking about this round? Oh, one more thing, MAK, let's face it, you have never been Miss Popularity<VBG>, as for me, I am Mrs. Complainer, Debie Blindauer Sheboygan & Calumet Counties

Shall keep my mouth shut and worries to myself in the future. Sorry to have upset anyone. My deepest apologies to everyone for even mentioning it. Jan ----- Original Message ----- From: <WIGenWebProject@aol.com> To: <WIGEN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2001 7:13 PM Subject: Re: [WIGEN-L] Daily Board Show > Hi all, > > The Daily Board Show is a representative view of what happens within the > USGenWeb Project and to be perfectly honest, doesn't aways represent the > project well.. One ladies opinion. My personal opinion is that the work that > we do here with WIGenWeb, and the energy that we all expend with the WIGenWeb > Project.. stands for it self as a true indication of what we do... In other > words, don't believe all you read, take it in context, take a deep breath, > and continue on. > > I personally, don't take much stock in what I read there. I am of the belief > that those of you that have sites at Rootsweb can honor their word that the > sites will remain free to the USGenWeb Project. I hate borrowing trouble, > and I honestly do not see any indication to worry. If it becomes a worry, > know that I will address it here and bring it up for discussion. At this > time, I do not see it as a topic of discussion.. If any of you have futher > concerns please contact me, and I will assist. > > Tina > > > ==== WIGEN Mailing List ==== > Celebrate Wisconsin! > Visit the Marquette WIGenWeb Project Pages > http://www.rootsweb.com/~wimarque/wimarque.htm > >

Tina and all, Well, I read everyones responses and after thinking about it, had a question or two which may not make me MISS popularity, but someone has to think about the other side of the coin (grin)... As a CC, I have copyrighted all my pages, and belong to 4 other organizations with WoodCoWI pages, and PAY Rootsweb as a sponser for my site. Yes, the info belongs to the sumibtters... But, when you "take" away a county, what happens to those pages? The next cc can't just take them without permission and now you are left with a site with NOTHING ON IT until the new person can get up to speed (Most of us have taken years to get this information we have up there.) Also, what about the person in the middle of a crisis and is unable to contact you??? For example, I am single, and if I were hospitalized, you wouldn't know, because I would be in hospital, not on the internet (grin), and I (my family and friends) probably wouldn't be worried about pages I am doing as a volunteer, as I hope they would be focused on ME. And even then, most of them can't spell computer much less internet? What if our computer dies, in the middle of the night, when everything is closed and wipes out years of work (Happened to me this Saturday night after two earthquakes and a thundershow storm within 8 hours of each other, guess the computer just gave up! Good news is, I am "rich" enough that I could get it fixed right away!) Also, think of our older volunteers, who have heart attacks or long term health issues that flare up on occassion, or loved ones die or become critically ill, or sustain broken body parts. Is the prevailing attitude, well, if they don't response then "screw em", give their county away, fair in all cases??? Also, what about people who bitch just to be bitching??? I have had people write to me and demand that I put up more information on the sites, that I was too slow... I don't think it is reasonable to expect us to have quotas on how much information we put up or how often. We are here to help promote FREE genealogy, not be unpaid slaves. Some cc's are fortunate, like Portage county whose volunteers have submitted massive amounts of information, and when they query, give a page of information on their ancestor and ask for others to contact them if they want even more information. Then, there are CCs with counties like Wood, well, they expect me to do EVERYTHING, and provide nothing... I get comments like please send me information on all SMITH surnames to include birth, death, marriages, census and immigration information... (I swear this is true!!! And I hear some of you cc's laughing out loud, cause you get them too...) My suggestion is quite simple, Tina. You are the most reasonable and fair minded person. You know the majority of us CCs and therefore are the best qualified to know who the slackers are and who the workers are... I think that most of us count on that fairness... But part of the problem we encounter, is that on the internet, if our server goes down, we are operating in the dark... That is, NO ONE can contact us, as they don't have our mailing address or phone number... And we can't contact you, cause we don't have your mailing address or phone number. Another part of the problem, is that there is no set policy, so whatever you do do, someone is going to be upset and angry... Instead of rehashing this over and over, how about we take a vote to add a policy to our page guidelines at http://www.rootsweb.com/~wigenweb/volunteer.html Whatever we decide as a group, would then be policy and your life would be easier when making determinations, as it would be the policy. Now, here are my suggestions for consideration by all the other cc's: 1) Require that to be a cc, we had to give our mailing address and phone number as an alternate means of communication to the SC, and update them as they change. 2) In the event our sites were dormant for a period of three months, and no communication was made to the SC, that cc would forfeit rights to the county(s) in question. These are just my suggestions, which should be discussed and if it sounds like a good idea, then vote on it. Last I counted, there are 72 counties, so a simple majority would be that 37 counties agree a policy should be added to the guidelines... Just my thoughts. R/S MAK --- WIGEN-D-request@rootsweb.com wrote: ===== =========================== MAK = "Mar sea ah Ann Keel" MAKs Sites http://www.rootsweb.com/~wiwood/links/MAK.html =========================== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/

I have typed this emailed three times and deleted before sending-but just can't help myself in responding and I certainly hope NO ONE takes this the wrong way-but "Why are we re-hashing this again?" This has been discussed here several times and after reading the CC responses again-it appears no one has changed their minds about how they feel on the subject. I know it is a hard position for you to be in Tina-but some of us have given our in put on this before and I think you need to just take the plunge and do what you feel is right. I know no one likes to tell someone else they are not doing an appropriate job for whatever reasons-but some times it has to be done. Again my opinion is if there hasn't been any change in the site for over six months, there have been complaints and after the you tried to contact the CC without response-I say time for a new CC. I feel in six months time the CC (no matter what the circumstances might be) could atleast have emailed the State Coordinator, Tina or had someone else email telling Tina what is going on, etc. As I remember a certain situation with a county was discussed before where the county hadn't had any change what-so-ever for over a year and when the CC was contacted by other CC's and Tina there was no response. In a situation like this I repeat-I think the county should be placed for adoption. Paula WaupacaCC _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Thanks Tina Paula WaupacaCC >From: WIGenWebProject@aol.com Reply-To: WIGEN-L@rootsweb.com To: >WIGEN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [WIGEN-L] Daily Board Show Date: Mon, 12 >Feb 2001 22:13:00 EST > >Hi all, > >The Daily Board Show is a representative view of what happens within the >USGenWeb Project and to be perfectly honest, doesn't aways represent the >project well.. One ladies opinion. My personal opinion is that the work >that we do here with WIGenWeb, and the energy that we all expend with the >WIGenWeb Project.. stands for it self as a true indication of what we do... >In other words, don't believe all you read, take it in context, take a deep >breath, and continue on. > >I personally, don't take much stock in what I read there. I am of the >belief that those of you that have sites at Rootsweb can honor their word >that the sites will remain free to the USGenWeb Project. I hate borrowing >trouble, and I honestly do not see any indication to worry. If it becomes a >worry, know that I will address it here and bring it up for discussion. At >this time, I do not see it as a topic of discussion.. If any of you have >futher concerns please contact me, and I will assist. > >Tina > > >==== WIGEN Mailing List ==== Celebrate Wisconsin! Visit the Marquette >WIGenWeb Project Pages http://www.rootsweb.com/~wimarque/wimarque.htm > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Didn't we have a similar problem when our state host disappeared? I think that when there is no response for a period of time, that county should be put back up for adoption. Shelley Marathon and Lincoln

At 08:14 PM 2/12/01 EST, you wrote: >Hi all, > >Remember when, we all hashed out the guidelines for maintaining >WIGenWeb Project pages, how we all voted and came to the conclusion >that what was posted on >http://www.rootsweb.com/~wigenweb/volunteer-pages.html was what the >majority of folks could live with? Well, I have a dilemma.. and I >choose to bring it to all of you. I need your input. > >It has been brought to my attention that some of the County sites are >showing non-host involvement. None that I have announced lately, all >of those contacted me and worked with me to place their counties up >for adoption. > >But, others have not.. Hate to admit it, but it be so :-( I have >contacted the hosts in question, and asked for a response, offered >help, done everything that I can think of to assist. Sometimes I get >an answer, many times I don't. It is the case of "I don't's", that I >need help with. How about asking here if anyone has heard from such and such person for such and such county? Sometimes (shock) CCs talk to each other and may mention off hand that they're gonna be away, have been sick, have had PC problems, and lots of other stuff. Another possibility is to find out if they host counties in other states where they may have changed their address but not here. It does happen as I continue 2 years later to find an address here and there that I missed on my change of address. Tim

Hi all, The Daily Board Show is a representative view of what happens within the USGenWeb Project and to be perfectly honest, doesn't aways represent the project well.. One ladies opinion. My personal opinion is that the work that we do here with WIGenWeb, and the energy that we all expend with the WIGenWeb Project.. stands for it self as a true indication of what we do... In other words, don't believe all you read, take it in context, take a deep breath, and continue on. I personally, don't take much stock in what I read there. I am of the belief that those of you that have sites at Rootsweb can honor their word that the sites will remain free to the USGenWeb Project. I hate borrowing trouble, and I honestly do not see any indication to worry. If it becomes a worry, know that I will address it here and bring it up for discussion. At this time, I do not see it as a topic of discussion.. If any of you have futher concerns please contact me, and I will assist. Tina

Understood Debie, thanks for the clarification.. Please know that this discussion for my part is not reflective of all the hard work and attention you all give. Tina In a message dated 2/12/01 8:58:27 PM Eastern Standard Time, sebring@excel.net writes: > Tina, > Please don't think I am trying to make an excuse for these CC's, I > don't > want to leave that kind of impression because I am not. My point to all of > this without going into major details is last year I was dealing with and > taking care of my mother who was diagnosed with a brain tumor. I didn't > have much time to place anything on my webpages and even after her passing > I found it very hard to get back into the swing of things, but I always > responded to e-mail and I did try to get something on-line when time > permitted. > What I meant to be saying in my last letter and I guess it didn't come > out > correctly, was that I feel you have done all you can do, if you have made > several attempts to contact and even listed dates for reply, then it is my > opinion they simply don't want to be involved anymore and you have been as > fair as anyone can be. It's time to place the county for adoption then in > my opinion. > > I hope this came out making more sense now, <g> > > Debie Blindauer >

Jan, Just my thoughts.. to be perfectly honest I don't "police" all of you.. I get concerned when I hear from visitors and contributors.. Some non-reponses are just a perpetual problem, and I guess I just need a majority rule. I can tell you all, that there is much interest in WIGenWeb Project .. with the counties that have been placed up for adoption.. one has been taken, and some of the others have had interest expressed. That is a good thing! My mission.. is to get a concensus from all of you, so that together we can continue to make WIGenWeb Project the Very Best! Tina In a message dated 2/12/01 8:52:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, cristian@netonecom.net writes: > Hi Tina, > > I think that two notifications are sufficient. Would think that most > people, if they had a problem would let you know. And sometimes we do have > things that come up. But, if they can't respond to you - do you think > they are responding to the questions that all of us get? > > I'd give them one last email and give them a definitive date and then put > them up for adoption. You never know there just might be someone out > there just looking to pick up one of those sites. > > Just my two cents worth..... > > Jan > Ashland, Bayfield, Waukesha and Waushara > > > > >

Anyone see the Daily Board Show today? Do you think we have any cause for concern with the recent layoffs at Ancestry and their money problems? As in anyone think it will have an impact on our free websites? Might be a good topic for Wednesday night's chat....... Jan

Jan- I didn't see that and what is the Daily Board Show? Paula WaupacaCC >From: "J. Cortez" <cristian@netonecom.net> >Reply-To: WIGEN-L@rootsweb.com >To: WIGEN-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [WIGEN-L] Daily Board Show >Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 20:54:02 -0800 > >Anyone see the Daily Board Show today? Do you think we have any cause for >concern with the recent layoffs at Ancestry and their money problems? As >in anyone think it will have an impact on our free websites? > >Might be a good topic for Wednesday night's chat....... > >Jan > > >==== WIGEN Mailing List ==== >Celebrate Wisconsin! >Visit the Marinette WIGenWeb Project Pages >http://www.rootsweb.com/~wimarine/ > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Hi Tina, I think that two notifications are sufficient. Would think that most people, if they had a problem would let you know. And sometimes we do have things that come up. But, if they can't respond to you - do you think they are responding to the questions that all of us get? I'd give them one last email and give them a definitive date and then put them up for adoption. You never know there just might be someone out there just looking to pick up one of those sites. Just my two cents worth..... Jan Ashland, Bayfield, Waukesha and Waushara