Thanks for your reply and the Gen outline Paul, So far, Chuck Gleason hasn't replied, but I am still most interested in the early Whites, particularly in the John White era of the late 1500s. I would be very appreciative of your direct line w/ or w/o siblings. Do you believe your White books are either the ones mentioned by Chuck Gleason (back throught 1087, etc) or the EBay books mentioned below? I also have the colorful John White Arms bestowed on him by Sir Walter Raleigh, which I'll be pleased to email you as an attachment if you wish. If you would consider, I would also send you a check which you could deposit to hold as a deposit for safe return of the Richard White books, and of course, I'll also send you whatever I am able to connect up. If you are the descendant of John White, the father of Eleanor White md Ananis Dare abt 1580s, the parents of Virginia Dare, first citizen of America, then your dna might be found in any descendant of Virginia Dare. A descendant of Virginia Dare would, in my opinion, be 'most likely' related to the 'tribe(s)' of Native Americans who assisted the Lost Colony, one of which could well be the Croatans. Thus, if we stretch this as thin as necessary, and if dna identification technology develops in the future as quickly as it is developing now, eventually, we could identify descendants of the Lost Colony, including potentially, and theoretically, the descendants of America's first citizen, Virginia Dare. A tall order, to be sure, but, as they say, 'Dare to Dream' ! (Pls overlook the pun on 'Dare - to 'dare' and Virginia Dare) Barry Wetherington Included below here is some RAW SPECULATION: PS: And you haven't even been subjected to our theory of the potential relationship between Virginia Dare: http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/surname/d/dare.html & Pocahontas: http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/other/Ethnic-Native/POCAHONTAS.html separated by abt 9 years of age and abt 100 miles of connected inland rivers - does your eye picture the almost iconic image of Poca paddling her canoe, perhaps to visit the 'escaped' Virginia Dare? Perhaps her sibling, or aunt? etc. Poca b abt 17 Sep 1595 d 21 Mar 1616/17 md John Rolfe b 6 May 1585 d 1622 Virginia Dare b 1587 Lost Colony NC [FYI - here is a quasi official UK Poca file that can be ordered online, seemingly for a reasonable price: http://catalogue.pro.gov.uk/ "HO 45/14558BURIALS (including CREMATIONS and EXHUMATIONS): Search for remains of Princess Pocahontas. 1909-1932"] ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 5:41 PM Subject: Re: [WHITE] White Family History on ebay Gen John White I just now got around to reading this. Did you get the information you sought? I am a descendant of the John White you spoke of. My direct line of descent has been proven, even into England and "beyond". I do have a couple of books written by Richard White, not a real lot of information in them about "every day" life, but it does list the line of descent, but leaves out most of the "siblings" in the line. 73 Paul Plasters Grandson of Bonnie Clare White. On Sat, 17 Jan 2004 23:09:06 -0500 "Barry Wetherington" <[email protected]> writes: If someone will buy it (White Family History on ebay), I'll send them $10 to be able to use the book for a couple weeks, and I'll share whatever comes of it. I'm looking for the ancestry of Virginia Dare b1587, America's first citizen, and her ancestry, including mother Eleanor (White) Dare, and grandfather John White, selected by Sir Walter Raleigh to be the leader of what became the Lost Colony in Jamestown VA. I'm also a Dare descendant. (I also am seeking Chuck Gleason who researched the history of the Whites back into the middle ages). & Thanks for finding & posting it Grannie. Barry C Barry Wetherington POBox 1208 Birmingham MIch 48012 248-792-2109H ----- Original Message ----- From: "A-T-K's Grannie" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, January 17, 2004 5:18 PM Subject: [WHITE] White Family History on ebay Book ¿ White Family History http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2979105862 This book is made up of White family information that has been extracted from a number of sources. The book is a basic history of the surname itself. Much of the volume is also a basic text on America¿s early history and genealogical sources. Materials that refer directly to the White family include: Early references to the name in the British Isles; Possible origins of the name; A description of four White family coats of arms with illustrations; A listing of about 102 White that immigrated to America in the 17th and 18th centuries; A listing of 35 marriages from the seventeenth century taking place in: Connecticut, Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, and New York. Also found is a listing of nine prominent colonists with biographical information; A listing of 1570 White heads of family (with county of residence) taken from the census of 1790 for the states of: Connecticut, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Hampshire, New York, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Vermont, and Virginia; One hundred twenty-seven additional names, from a reconstructed 1800 census (from taxpayer lists) for the state of Kentucky are included. Military history data (usually with birth, and death dates as well as the spouse¿s name) is found for 16 men who fought in King Phillip¿s War as well as that for 304 White Revolutionary War veterans. This data was taken from the DAR Patriot Index; Hoyt¿s Index to Revolutionary War Pension Applications and Heitman¿s Historical Register of Officers of the Continental Army During the War of the Revolution. Military data for 143 soldiers of the War of 1812 is also included, as well as that for eleven soldiers of the Mexican War and 71 soldiers of both the Union and Confederacy in the Civil War. Short biographical sketches are given a number of White who have been prominent in their positions. A listing of 37 White place names fills out the White data in the volume. Historical data and genealogical source information found in the volume includes: A listing of reference books useful in composing the history of a family name or coat of arms. A section of the book is made up of the history of early immigration to America; A listing of reference books pertaining to immigration to America, marriage records, military related records, and sources of biographical records is found, as well as a listing of State and Federal Sources of genealogical information. This volume has data in it that deals with individuals by the White family name, can be very helpful in compiling a family history, and can be an interesting addition to one¿s surname oriented materials. Soft cover, perfect bound, 188 pp, published 1972 by American Genealogical Research Institute, Washington D.C. The volume is in good condition. Do not bid on this item if you are expecting a full ¿family history.¿ ==== WHITE Mailing List ==== WHITE UNSUBSCRIPTION DIRECTIONS [email protected] NSUBSCRIBE [in subject line] [email protected] UNSUBSCRIBE [in subject line] ================================== http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/ifetch2?/u1/textindices/P/POCAHONTAS+2003+69570399+F ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 21:50:25 -0800 From: "Barry Wetherington" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Subject: [Poca] Poca's NA Gen? Poca's NA Gen!? Barry King Wahunsonacock POWHATAN 17 Jun 1545 - 1618 ID Number: I38147 TITLE: King OCCUPATION: Chief of a federation of Algonquian Indian tribes RESIDENCE: Tidewater Region of VA now Gloucester Co. VA BIRTH: 17 Jun 1545, Algonquian village of Powhatan, James River VA DEATH: 1618 RESOURCES: See: [S1387] [S1424] [S1561] Father: "Dashing Stream" Mother: "Scent Flower" http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mysouthernfamily/myff/d0096/g0000033.html#I38147 Family 1 : Matatiske or Nonoma +Cleopatra POWHATEN +Matoaka (Rebecca) Pocahontas POWHATEN Nantiquaus POWHATEN Matachannu POWHATEN Notes "Old Churches, Ministers, and Families of Virginia. Article XXVIII. Gloucester, the Residence of Powhatan and Pocahontas. We are now in the region where by general consent the chief residence of King Powhatan has been placed, after discussion and accurate investigation. Mr. Howe, in his laborious though sometimes inaccurate History of Virginia, quotes from Captain John Smith as saying that "twenty-five miles lower (than what is now West Point, the junction of the Pamunkey and Mattapony) on the north side of this river (York River) is Werowocomico, where their great king inhabited when I was delivered to him a prisoner," and where Smith in another place says "for the most part he was resident." Mr. Howe says, "Upon a short visit made to that part of Gloucester county a year or two ago, I was satisfied that Shelly, the seat of Mrs. Mann Page, is the famous Werowocomico. Shelly adjoins Rosewell, formerly the seat of John Page, (sometime Governor of Virginia), and was originally part of the Rosewell plantation; and I learned from Mrs. Page, of Shelly, that Governor Page always held Shelly to be the ancient Werowocomico, and accordingly he at first gave it that name, but afterward, on account of the inconvenient length of the word, dropped it and adopted the title of Shelly, on account of the extraordinary accumulation of shells found there. The enormous beds of oyster-shells deposited there, especially in front of the Shelly House, indicate it to have been a place of great resort among the natives. The situation is highly picturesque and beautiful; and, looking as it does on the lovely and majestic York, it would seem of all others to have been the befitting residence of the lordly Powhatan." Our worthy fellow-citizen, Mr. Charles Campbell, of Petersburg, after having adopted the above opinion, has renounced it in favour of another place only two or three miles, I believe, lower down York River. On paying a visit a few years since to Shelly and the neighbourhood, for the purpose of examining the question, he became satisfied that Timberneck Bay, in Gloucester, the ancient seat of the Manns, only a mile from Shelly, is the famous spot. Smith, he says, in his work "Newes from Virginia," says "the bay where Powhatan dwelleth hath three creeks in it." "I have visited," says Mr. Campbell, "that part of Gloucester county, and am satisfied that Timberneck Bay is the one referred to by Mr. Smith. On the east bank of this bay stands an old chimney known as 'Powhatan's chimney,' and its site corresponds with Werowocomico as laid down in Smith's map." Mr. Campbell supposes this to be the chimney of the house built by the Colonists to propitiate the favour of Powhatan, and says he is supported by tradition. May not the two opinions be reconciled in the following manner? Shelly may have been the original place of his residence or of his frequent residence; but when it was offered to build him a house after the English fashion, he may have preferred a situation a few miles off, for reasons best known to his royal majesty. And now, although I have already introduced some documents touching Powhatan and Pocahontas into my article on Jamestown and Henrico, yet, as there is another most worthy of preservation and use, I will do my part toward its perpetuity by inserting it in this place. It is the famous letter of Captain Smith to Queen Anne, soliciting her attention to Pocahontas when in England,--a letter not easily surpassed by any one in any age. "To the Most High and Virtuous Princess, Queen Anne, of Great Britain:* "Most Admired Madam:--The love I bear my God, my King, and my Church, hath so often emboldened me in the worst of extreme dangers, that now honesty doth constrain me to presume thus far beyond myself, to present to your Majesty this short discourse. If ingratitude be a deadly poison to all honest virtues, I must be guilty of that crime if I should omit any means to be thankful. So it was, that about ten years ago, being in Virginia, and being taken prisoner by the power of Powhatan, their chief king, I received from this great savage exceeding great courtesy,--especially from his son, Nantiquaus, the manliest, comeliest, boldest spirit I ever saw in a savage, and his sister Pocahontas, the king's most dear and beloved daughter, being but a child of twelve or thirteen years of age, whose compassionate, pitiful heart of my desperate estate gave me much cause to respect her. I being the first Christian this proud king and his grim attendants ever saw, and thus enthralled in their power, I cannot say I felt the least occasion of want that was in the power of those, my mortal foes, to prevent, notwithstanding all their threats. After some six weeks' fattening among these savage courtiers, at the minute of my execution she hazarded the beating out of her own brains to save mine; and not only that, but so prevailed with her father that I was safely conducted to Jamestown, where I found about eight-and-thirty miserable, poor, and sick creatures to keep possession of all those large territories in Virginia. Such was the weakness of this poor Commonwealth, as had not the savages fed us, we directly had starved. And this relief, most gracious Queen, was commonly brought us by the Lady Pocahontas. "Notwithstanding all those passages, when inconstant fortune turned our peace to war, this tender virgin would still not spare to dare to visit us; and by her our fears have been often appeased and our wants still supplied. Were it the policy of her father thus to employ her, or the ordinance of God thus to make her his instrument, or her extraordinary affection to our nation, I know not. But of this I am sure; when her father, with the utmost of his policy and power, sought to surprise me, having but eighteen with me, the dark night could not affright her from coming through the irksome woods, and, with watered eyes, gave me intelligence with her best advice to escape his fury, which had he seen, he had surely slain her. "Jamestown, with her wild train, she as freely visited as her father's habitation; and during the time of two or three years, she, next under God, was still the instrument to preserve this Colony from death, famine, and utter confusion, which in those times had once been dissolved, Virginia might have lain as it was at our first arrival till this day. Since then this business, having been turned and varied by many accidents from what I left it, is most certain; after a long and troublesome war, since my departure, betwixt her father and our Colony, all which time she was not heard of. About two years after, she herself was taken prisoner, being so detained near two years longer; the Colony by that means was relieved, peace concluded, and at last, rejecting her barbarous condition, she was married to an English gentleman, the first Virginian who ever spake English, or had a child in marriage by an Englishman,--a matter surely, if my meaning be truly considered and well understood, well worthy a prince's information. Thus, most gracious lady, I have related to your Majesty what, at your best leisure, our approved histories will recount to you at large, as done in your Majesty's life. And, however this might be presented you from a more worthy pen, it cannot from a more honest heart. "As yet, I never begged any thing of the State; and it is my want of ability and her exceeding deserts, your birth, means, and authority, her birth, virtue, want, and simplicity, doth make me thus bold humbly to beseech your Majesty to take this knowledge of her, though it be from one so unworthy to be the reporter as myself, her husband's estate not being able to make her fit to attend your Majesty. The most and least I can do is to tell you this, and the rather of her being of so great a spirit, however her stature. If she should not be well received, seeing this kingdom may rightly have a kingdom by her means, her present love to us and Christianity might turn to such scorn and fury as to divert all this good to the worst of evil; when, finding that so great a Queen should do her more honour than she imagines, for having been kind to her subjects and servants, would so ravish her with content as to endear her dearest blood to effect that your Majesty and all the King's most honest subjects most earnestly desire. And so I humbly kiss your gracious hands, &c. "Signed, John Smith." son of Dashing Stream + Scent Flower 2nd wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Winganuske 3rd wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Ashetoiske 4th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Amopotoiske 5th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Ottopomtacke 6th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Attossocomiske 7th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Ponnoiske 8th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Appomosiscut 9th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Appimmonoiske 10th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Ortoughnoiske 11th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Oweroughwough 12th wife of Wahunsonacock Powhatan: m. Ottermiske" Children: Taux POWHATAN Mantequos POWHATAN Matachanna POWHATAN Namontack POWHATAN Matoaka "Pocahontas" POWHATAN b: ABT. 17 SEP 1595 d: ABT. 21 MAR 1616/17 + KOCOUM + John ROLFE b: 6 MAY 1585 d: 1622 Marriages: Marriage 1 ATTOSSOCOMISKE; Marriage 2 MATATISKE mother of children on this card. Marriage 3 PONNOISKE Marriage 4 APPOMOSISCUT Marriage 5 APPIMMONOISKE Marriage 6 WINGANUSKE Marriage 7 ORTOUGHNOISKE Marriage 8 OWEROUGHWOUGH Marriage 9 OTTERMISKE Marriage 10 ASHETOISKE Marriage 11 AMOPOTOISKE Marriage 12 OTTOPOMTACKE [S1424] [S1236] - --------------------------------------------- __ | __| | | | |__ | _"Dashing Stream"____| | | | | __ | | | | |__| | | | |__ | | |--Wahunsonacock POWHATEN | (1545 - 1618) | __ | | | __| | | | | | |__ | | |_"Scent Flower"______| | | __ | | |__| | |__ - ---------------------------------------------- Sources [S1387] [S1424] [S1561] [S1424] [S1236] - ---------------------------------------- INDEX Back to My Southern Family Home Page © 1995, 1997, 1998, 2000. Josephine Lindsay Bass and Becky Bonner. All rights reserved. - ------------------------------------- HTML created by GED2HTML v3.6-WIN95 (Jan 18 2000) on 08/04/02 12:42:34 AM Central Standard Time. - -------------------------- Tabitha POYTHRESS ABT 1730 - ____ ID Number: I57601 RESIDENCE: VA BIRTH: ABT 1730 RESOURCES: See: [S2059] Family 1 : Henry RANDOLPH Peter RANDOLPH ================================The Croatan Indians of Sampson County, North Carolina; Their Origin and Racial Status; A Plea for Separate Schools, by George Edwin Butler Published: Durham, N.C., Seeman Printery, 1916 Note: Has some genealogies - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- [image caption: THE CROATAN NORMAL SCHOOL AT PEMBROKE, N. C. The first Croatan Indian School established and supported by the State] The Croatan Indians of Sampson County, North Carolina Their Origin and Racial Status A Plea for Separate Schools By GEO. E. BUTLER CLINTON, NORTH CAROLINA THE SEEMAN PRINTERY DURHAM, N. C. 1916 Page 1 CONTENTS A Petition of the Indians of Sampson County . . . 5 HISTORICAL SKETCH OF THE INDIANS OF SAMPSON AND ADJOINING COUNTIES Historical . . . 9 The Croatans . . . 10 White's Lost Colony . . . 10 Their Wanderings and Location . . . 17 Political and Educational History . . . 23 First Separate Schools for Croatans . . . 27 Marriage with Negroes Forbidden . . . 28 Separate Schools in Other Counties . . . 28 Separate Schools in Sampson . . . 31 Why the Indian School in Sampson was Repealed . . . 31 Indian Tax Payers in Sampson . . . 32 Easily Recognized as Indians . . . 33 They Were Never Slaves . . . 34 Formerly Eroneously Classed as Negroes . . . 34 Laws of State Recognize Them as Separate Race . . . 35 State Provides Colleges for Whites and Negroes but not for Indians . . 36 Indians Justly Proud of Their History . . . 36 Better Educational Facilities Should be Provided . . . 37 Indian Taxes in Sampson . . . 38 Sampson Exceeds all Other Counties, Except Robeson, in Indian Polls and Property . . . 39 Family Relationship Between Robeson and Sampson Croatans . . . 40