Hello all I wonder if someone could help with this will. Elizabeth Coulson died in Northampton late in the 19th century and left a small fortune. Her husband was a shoe manufacturer and was Mayor of Northampton in 1882/3. I have copied below an excerpt from a Warwickshire newspaper. My great grandfather, William Bird, of New Bilton Rugby was one of the beneficiaries of this will; 'He (the clerk) omitted to obtain her (Mrs Coulson's) signature and on returning later in the day with the will properly made out he found that the lady had died five minutes before his arrival. Thus the greater part of the fortune goes to the labourer (William Bird) already referred to, and the wife of the Northampton butcher. My question is, would the document that decreed that William Bird and 'the wife of the Northampton butcher' still exist? Would the 'improperly made out' will still exist? I am hoping to find out who the 'wife of the Northampton butcher' was. I hope she made better use of her money as my great granddad wasted his, it would appear, as he was buried in a pauper's grave in Leicester n 1928. Regards Janet Northampton

Many thanks to all those who replied with suggestions as to the possible fates of the six children of my non-WAR - Bristol - Criminal Family and for the information that they have found... Ann in Cairns - who confirmed the belief that the Transportee *did* marry (and quite shortly after her arrival) in Australia, but was unable to trace any of the children arriving there 'later'. She also reminded me that the two oldest (assuming both had survived) would've been old enough to obtain some sort of employment which *may* have been sufficient to keep the family together. Anne in Sheffield - who supplied a url that largely confirmed my gloomy suspicions that 1809 was too early for any real sort of chance for any sort of official 'care' would have existed (and quite coincidentally answered another running topic, that's the subject of an accompanying posting). Viv - who found the marriages of the middle two children (and the baptism of a grandchild) - establishing that at least two survived to adulthood. Paul - whose bleak suggestion "or they'd have died" at least matched my own feelings on the matter, although as yet no burials/deaths of the remaining four have come to light. Wendy - who suggested the possibilities that the parish officers might have taken the children on their mother's arrest, or that they'd lived on the streets. I've still failed to find any of them in the 1841 or 1851 Censuses - but I'm slowly plodding my way through the Indexes! I'll reply to you all individually during the day. Thanks again for the insights... Gus ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gus Tysoe" <gustysoe@tiscali.co.uk> To: <warwick@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 10:10 AM Subject: [WAR] Criminals' Children - early 1800s Hello List, Although the people 'behind' this enquiry have no known connection with WAR, I'm quietly confident that there must have been a number of WAR families where a similar set of circumstances arose... I have a gentleman who was hanged in 1805 for 'uttering' forged Bank of England Notes. Four years later, his widow was found guilty of being 'in possession' of forged Bank Notes (and some base silver coins), and was transported to Australia. At the time she was found guilty she and her late husband had baptised 6 children between 1796 and 1805 - and there is no mention in the transportation records that she was accompanied by any infant children. I've so far been unable to make any likely identification of any of them in the Censuses or the NBI. The question that I'm hoping the Collective Wisdom of the List may be able to answer is: "What was likely to've happened to those children?" There were no Social Services in 1809 to take them into "care" - and (as far as I can see) no others of the same surname in the area where the trials and baptisms were held. Help, please! Gus ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Gus; Or they'd have died. Best wishes Paul Prescott ----- Original Message ----- From: "A P L" <annepaling@hotmail.com> To: <gustysoe@tiscali.co.uk>; <warwick@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [WAR] Criminals' Children - early 1800s > If there were no family members to take them in then they would most > likely > have been placed in > Workhouses, Orphanages, or Industrial Schools, depending on their age and > sex. > > This would have been before the old Poor Law was amended in 1834. > Gilbert's > Act of 1782 would still have been in force which said that children were > still to be sent to the "poor house". A bit like "Oliver Twist" which was > written around 1837. > > http://www.workhouses.org.uk/index.html?education/early.shtml > > This page gives information on the various places children might be placed > before 1834 Act. > > > > Anne Paling > SHEFFIELD, U.K. > > > > > >>From: "Gus Tysoe" <gustysoe@tiscali.co.uk> >>To: <warwick@rootsweb.com> >>Subject: [WAR] Criminals' Children - early 1800s >>Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 10:10:11 +0100 >> >>Hello List, >> >>Although the people 'behind' this enquiry have no known connection with >>WAR, >>I'm quietly confident that there must have been a number of WAR families >>where a similar set of circumstances arose... >> >>I have a gentleman who was hanged in 1805 for 'uttering' forged Bank of >>England Notes. Four years later, his widow was found guilty of being 'in >>possession' of forged Bank Notes (and some base silver coins), and was >>transported to Australia. >> >>At the time she was found guilty she and her late husband had baptised 6 >>children between 1796 and 1805 - and there is no mention in the >>transportation records that she was accompanied by any infant children. >>I've >>so far been unable to make any likely identification of any of them in the >>Censuses or the NBI. >> >> >>The question that I'm hoping the Collective Wisdom of the List may be able >>to answer is: >> >>"What was likely to've happened to those children?" >> >>There were no Social Services in 1809 to take them into "care" - and (as >>far >>as I can see) no others of the same surname in the area where the trials >>and >>baptisms were held. >> >> >>Help, please! >> >>Gus >> >>------------------------------- >>To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>quotes >>in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Charles Holmes charged with murder in Bromsgrove,found guilty and sentenced to death Wimbledon Shooting Prize ,Ladies Corporal Bates 1st Warwick maximum score In the licensed victualler's ladies prize seconned place with 33 points Segeant Ragg of Warwick. The highest of the prizes of 10 pound in the Curtis and Harvey was won by Corporal Bates 1st Warwick and Private Versey 1st Warwick C.D Newman was appointed as Vicar of St Mary's Warwick J.R.Turner Eaton became Rural Dean of Warwick A hairdresser named Rimmer at Birmingham was yesterday week fined 5 pounds with the alternative of two months imprisonment with hard labour for stealing a quantity of hair from the head of a girl who went to have her locks dressed .

If there were no family members to take them in then they would most likely have been placed in Workhouses, Orphanages, or Industrial Schools, depending on their age and sex. This would have been before the old Poor Law was amended in 1834. Gilbert's Act of 1782 would still have been in force which said that children were still to be sent to the "poor house". A bit like "Oliver Twist" which was written around 1837. http://www.workhouses.org.uk/index.html?education/early.shtml This page gives information on the various places children might be placed before 1834 Act. Anne Paling SHEFFIELD, U.K. >From: "Gus Tysoe" <gustysoe@tiscali.co.uk> >To: <warwick@rootsweb.com> >Subject: [WAR] Criminals' Children - early 1800s >Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 10:10:11 +0100 > >Hello List, > >Although the people 'behind' this enquiry have no known connection with >WAR, >I'm quietly confident that there must have been a number of WAR families >where a similar set of circumstances arose... > >I have a gentleman who was hanged in 1805 for 'uttering' forged Bank of >England Notes. Four years later, his widow was found guilty of being 'in >possession' of forged Bank Notes (and some base silver coins), and was >transported to Australia. > >At the time she was found guilty she and her late husband had baptised 6 >children between 1796 and 1805 - and there is no mention in the >transportation records that she was accompanied by any infant children. >I've >so far been unable to make any likely identification of any of them in the >Censuses or the NBI. > > >The question that I'm hoping the Collective Wisdom of the List may be able >to answer is: > >"What was likely to've happened to those children?" > >There were no Social Services in 1809 to take them into "care" - and (as >far >as I can see) no others of the same surname in the area where the trials >and >baptisms were held. > > >Help, please! > >Gus > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >in the subject and the body of the message

The one that matches your info Nina. Name Smith Richard Alias County OXF When tried Lent assizes Crime sheep stealing Sentence death 1812 HO 27/8 Cheers Wendy Thanks to all who emailed me with help and websites to try and find my ancestor - allegedly hanged for sheep stealing.

Hello List, Although the people 'behind' this enquiry have no known connection with WAR, I'm quietly confident that there must have been a number of WAR families where a similar set of circumstances arose... I have a gentleman who was hanged in 1805 for 'uttering' forged Bank of England Notes. Four years later, his widow was found guilty of being 'in possession' of forged Bank Notes (and some base silver coins), and was transported to Australia. At the time she was found guilty she and her late husband had baptised 6 children between 1796 and 1805 - and there is no mention in the transportation records that she was accompanied by any infant children. I've so far been unable to make any likely identification of any of them in the Censuses or the NBI. The question that I'm hoping the Collective Wisdom of the List may be able to answer is: "What was likely to've happened to those children?" There were no Social Services in 1809 to take them into "care" - and (as far as I can see) no others of the same surname in the area where the trials and baptisms were held. Help, please! Gus

Emily is from Kidderminster Worc., Eliza is from Manchester Cheshire --- ldo ldo <ct65as@yahoo.com> wrote: > 259 Icknield Pt Rd Birmingham. > Eliza Richardson, Head, Widow, 62, Upholstress, > Lancaster, I can't read the town. > Emily, D, Unmar, 21, Manageress, Worcester, I can't > read the town. > Lucy, D, Unmar, Machinist, Warwick, Birmingham. > Amelia, D, Unmar, 15, Machinist, Warwick, Birmingham. > This is what I make it out to be, Lynne. > > > "I’ve looked at lots of census information before but > the handwriting on this > one has got me beat. > The reference is Class: RG10; Piece: 3096; Folio: > 37; Page: 12; GSU roll: > 839569. I am interested in the Richardson Family at > 259 Icknield Street Birmingham" > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > Genealogy - connecting family trees http://genfam.com/FAMILY/index2.html Join the Genfam Newsletter and get the lastest links, databases, events and more delivered to you every month. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us. http://surveylink.yahoo.com/gmrs/yahoo_panel_invite.asp?a=7

From: David Pearce [mailto:david@pearcehome.co.uk] Sent: 27 September 2007 00:17 To: 'WARWICK@rootsweb.com' Subject: FW: Help reading 1871 census entry I’ve looked at lots of census information before but the handwriting on this one has got me beat. I would be grateful if someone could help. The reference is Class: RG10; Piece: 3096; Folio: 37; Page: 12; GSU roll: 839569. I am interested in the Richardson Family at 259 Icknield Street Birmingham Thanks David No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.13.31/1031 - Release Date: 26/09/2007 12:12 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.13.31/1031 - Release Date: 26/09/2007 12:12 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.476 / Virus Database: 269.13.32/1033 - Release Date: 27/09/2007 11:06

Hi everyone Thanks to all who emailed me with help and websites to try and find my ancestor - allegedly hanged for sheep stealing. I will definitely update this group if I find him! Thank you Nina ----------------------------------------- Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam

I believe the towns Lynne left unread are: Manchester (written M'chester) and Kidderminster. I agree with everything else she wrote. Sean --- ldo ldo <ct65as@yahoo.com> wrote: > 259 Icknield Pt Rd Birmingham. > Eliza Richardson, Head, Widow, 62, Upholstress, > Lancaster, I can't read the town. > Emily, D, Unmar, 21, Manageress, Worcester, I can't > read the town. > Lucy, D, Unmar, Machinist, Warwick, Birmingham. > Amelia, D, Unmar, 15, Machinist, Warwick, Birmingham. > This is what I make it out to be, Lynne. -------------------------------> > > "I’ve looked at lots of census information before but > the handwriting on this > one has got me beat. > The reference is Class: RG10; Piece: 3096; Folio: > 37; Page: 12; GSU roll: > 839569. I am interested in the Richardson Family at > 259 Icknield Street Birmingham" > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ____________________________________________________________________________________ Catch up on fall's hot new shows on Yahoo! TV. Watch previews, get listings, and more! http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/3658

259 Icknield Pt Rd Birmingham. Eliza Richardson, Head, Widow, 62, Upholstress, Lancaster, I can't read the town. Emily, D, Unmar, 21, Manageress, Worcester, I can't read the town. Lucy, D, Unmar, Machinist, Warwick, Birmingham. Amelia, D, Unmar, 15, Machinist, Warwick, Birmingham. This is what I make it out to be, Lynne. "I’ve looked at lots of census information before but the handwriting on this one has got me beat. The reference is Class: RG10; Piece: 3096; Folio: 37; Page: 12; GSU roll: 839569. I am interested in the Richardson Family at 259 Icknield Street Birmingham"

One of the local pits is featured on the website http://hometown.aol.co.uk/pitexplosion/index.htm At that time the pits were privately owned. Any records may or may not have survived. Dugdales, Ludfords, Newdegates were amongst local pit owners. Googling or A2A may come up with some sources for remaining records. Jacqui ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob Doe To: WARWICK@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2007 4:14 PM Subject: [WAR] Mine records - Atherstone In 1916 my grandfather was shown as a "Coal Hewer" in Atherstone on his daughter's birth certificate. Are there any records available from coal mines in this area and where might they be found please? Bob ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.32/1032 - Release Date: 26/09/2007 20:20

In 1916 my grandfather was shown as a "Coal Hewer" in Atherstone on his daughter's birth certificate. Are there any records available from coal mines in this area and where might they be found please? Bob

At Chelmsford Assizes, last week,a prisoner who pleaded guilty to a charge of breaking into a church to steal, delivered to Mr Baron Martin a brief written address, which commenced with this appeal:-" My Lord,- I have been over eighteen weeks a prisoner waiting for my trail. If it impresses your kind judgement in my favour I shall be ever thankful,and I will bring you as fine a bird for a present as ever was brought from India next voyage". The reading of this excited, of course much merriment.It was evidently meant in all simplicity, and the Judge laughed as heartily as any one. The learned Judge sentenced him only to three months imprisonment, observing," But, mind you most not bring me that bird " A saluary lesson to a cabmen was taught by Mr. Partridge, on Monday, at the Southwary Police Court. A driver who had refused a fare while upon the stand at the London Bridge Terminus, and had also used insulting language,was fined 2 pounds 4 shillings, with the alternative of twenty-eight days imprisonment

Paul: VERY many thanks for that url - it has solved a 10-year Mystery for me! Although I'd known OF "TYSO the Forger" for many years, all I knew was that he'd been hanged at some time before 1809 when his widow was sentenced at Bristol to transportation for possession of forged notes and currency... Now solved - a pity, though, that the database spells her late husband's name as TYSON :-) Gus ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Prescott" <paul@toranean.demon.co.uk> To: <n.terry@ntlworld.com>; <warwick@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 12:39 PM Subject: Re: [WAR] advice please Nina: This site http://www.richard.clark32.btinternet.co.uk/contents.html has a complete list of everyone hanged in the UK.

Nina: This site http://www.richard.clark32.btinternet.co.uk/contents.html has a complete list of everyone hanged in the UK. If you do find your ancestor, the best way to find out more details is through local newspapers. You *may* also be lucky and find court reports, but records have not all survived. Those for the Old Bailey are on-line at http://www.oldbaileyonline.org/. Let us know how you get on. Best wishes Paul Prescott ----- Original Message ----- From: <n.terry@ntlworld.com> To: <warwick@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2007 10:09 PM Subject: [WAR] advice please >I have just read an old copy of the Mail with an article on finding an >ancestor who was deported for stealing a sheep. Apparently if the item >stolen was 1 shilling or less, deportation was given instead of hanging! > My problem is that,according to an old family story, my gt gt > grandfather(the number of greats vary!)was hanged for stealing a sheep to > feed his family. No one ever mentioned which side of the family he was > from so I would like to check the Warwick/Staffs lines. > Can anyone tell me, please, where I would find details of hangings,please? > It would be presumably prior to 1837 as I have not turned up any one who > died in this manner after that date. My Warwickshire family came from > around Atherstone. > I realise it may all be fiction but feel compelled to try to find out so I > would be really grateful for some advice on this. > Thank you > Nina Terry > Warwicks names: Lycett,Bradford, Smith > > ----------------------------------------- > Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email > Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Ken They are available on fiche from http://www.bmsgh.org/bookshop/warw/wa_t.html and they are a copy of a published printed book, they cover 1558 to 1924. Mike Fisher Wythall,WOR One-Place Genealogical Study http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~wythallindex/index.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Franks (OPC)" <df10@cam.ac.uk> To: "Ken Poole" <kpoole01@rochester.rr.com> Cc: <warwick@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 2:48 PM Subject: Re: [WAR] Parish Records of Tanworth Hello Ken, As far as I know, Tanworth in Arden registers are not available on-line. I don't think there are any transcripts, other than the IGI (but it is an extracted record), and that stops for baptisms in 1875 and for marriages in 1787. A list of Warwickshire register transcripts and BMD extracts on Pickards Pink pages is at http://www.hunimex.com/warwick/bmd/bmd_indx.html and you can also look at the Warwickshire Online Parish Clerk's (OPC) pages http://www.hunimex.com/warwick/opc/opc.html for links to other transcripts (more specifically at http://www.hunimex.com/warwick/opc/igi.html for a list a transcripts missing from the IGI and some alternative sources (for Warwickshire). The registers, and microfilms, are at Warwick Record Office. Go to the Record Office's online catalogue (url on the Warwickshire OPC web pages) to see which registers they have. Best wishes, David Ken Poole wrote: > Hello listers, > Two questions please: > Are Tanworth in Arden parish records available on > line or does one have to go there? > Does anyone know a good researcher who specializes > in this area? > Cheers > Ken > > Poole's Creative Concepts > Kenton Poole > 34 Dungan Street > Canandaigua, NY 14424 > 585 905 0160 office > 585 703 2067 cell > 585 486 1248 fax > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- David Franks, Cambridge, England Researching Castle and Tallis, Warwickshire and Oxfordshire, and Thomas Castle, convict transported to Van Diemen’s Land Warwickshire Online Parish Clerks http://www.hunimex.com/warwick/opc/opc.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to WARWICK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

MaizeJust a quick note of reminder that the NNWFHS Family History Day is this coming Saturday, 29th September in St Mary's church in centre of Atherstone. Heaps of free parking in the town (yes, free!); second-hand bookshops to browse; library open; lots of knowledgeable family historians to talk to; lots of spots to take refreshments of your choice - and all within walking distance of each other. See information on www.nnwfhs.org.uk I hope listers able to visit will make themselves known! I will be one of the "serving wenches"...!! Jacqui

Hello Ken, There is a book at the SOG I saw some years ago and they could probably tell you who originally published it, it may be available somewhere if you're lucky. I also have a set of (7) fiche of some of the register transcripts, published by Burman, Cooper & Co Ltd., The Law Courts, Birmingham in 1930. BMSGH may be able to help with copies. If you want a look-up let me know (as long as it's not all SMITH entries from 1558 - 1924 <vbg>) Best wishes, David Ashmore. Warwickshire Online Parish Clerk scheme http://www.hunimex.com/warwick/opc/opc.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Poole" <kpoole01@rochester.rr.com> To: <warwick@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 2:13 PM Subject: [WAR] Parish Records of Tanworth SNIP > Hello listers, > Two questions please: > Are Tanworth in Arden parish records available on > line or does one have to go there?