For the record: http://files.usgwarchives.org/ca/alameda/cemeteries/mtvview-v1.txt Mountain View Cemetery Cemetery, Oakland, Alameda County, CA Submitted by David Johnson 21 May 2004 Updated 8 Aug 2006 (partial list) This file is part of the California Tombstone Project http://www.usgwtombstones.org/california/californ.html Cemtetery record for Richard H. ( -1881 and wife Elizabeth ( -1882) Van Arman, father and mother of H.M. Van Arman.

There's a possibility this Henry is connected to the Jacob (1773) line somehow. Mostly on the basis of the "ledmines" mentioned in his letter. Jacob's son Richard (H or M or maybe A) Van Arnam was located in Galena, IL, from, near as I can tell, about 1845 to perhaps as late as around 1870. Galena was originally all about mining lead. This Henry claims to be 53 in 1871 and "spent all the best part of my life in the mines" which more or less fits Galena Richard's apparent timing. Problem is this Henry's age would make him born about 1818. That makes him too old to be one of Richard's children. On the other hand, we actually have what appears to be a reliable list of Jacob's children and there's no Henry on it. (Not to mention Henry isn't a name that belongs in the line, anyway.) There are a number of other U.S. "strays" that might connect with the Richard of Galena line but I haven't been able to find proof either way for 10 years now. --pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Schwenn" <schwel@comcast.net> To: <vannorman@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, November 08, 2010 8:31 AM Subject: [VANNORMAN] Henry Van Arnam, 1818- 1871+, in Arizona Territory 1871 > Papers of Ulysses S. Grant: June 1, 1871-January 31, 1872, p 93 By > Ulysses > Simpson Grant, John Y. Simon, Ulysses S. Grant Association > Google Books. [Google Search string: "Territory of Arizona, secretary Van > Arman"] > A plaintive letter to authorities during the US Grant administration from > Henry Van Arman 11 Oct 1871 from Sacaton, Arizona Territory, describes how > he and his nephew, after arriving in the spring of 1870 from the > "ledmines" > by wagon train across the Missouri River, constructed irrigation ditches > to > prepare their newly purchased land on the Salt River for farming, spending > nearly all what remained of the $2800 they took west with them. While they > were away, Indians came and destroyed it all. He had complained to the > Indian agent without redress and is pleading for it now. It appears to be > part of an investigation of abuses by and/or threats toward the Indian > agent. > > "On Oct. 11, Henry Van Arman, Sacaton, Arizona Territory, wrote to USG > "haveing left our home in the ledmines two-years ago last my for the west > my > self and Nephew with the Sad to be the best waggon and team that had > crossed > the Mo River that Season and $2800 twenty eight hundred Dollars in Cash we > brought upon Salt River in this territory about 18 month Since whare we > located farms and constructed a canal or ditch about 3 miles in length for > the purposs of irrogateing our farms which cost us evry thing we had Save > our groing Crop and improvenants which if we could have Saved would made > us > quite independant but while absent for a few days leaveing my house in > care > of a neighbor to attend to the Merricopa and Pemi or Pemoi Indians Made a > raid upon my place and Destroid evry thing we had a full Statementment of > which we have forwarded to the indian department with our affidavits and > other testimony now my good President Since doing this we are told > unless > we employ a lobby lawyer we will not get any thing in 3 or 4 years and > then > it will take all we claim to pay him --I am now working for the Indian > agent > at Gila reservation whare I mit in person Mr. Vincent Colier and Stated > our > Situation to him and he told me he would do all he could for me. Since the > I > have been told by one in authority that he, colier receives thousand of > letters that he never reads them and will probably neve think of me again > now my Drs I am 53 years of age have spent all the best part of my life in > the mines you must know about what I am at this time of life and how well > I > am capasitated to work by the month for my living which this misfortune > compels me to do which is terable on me allthough this agen is a verry > good > Man to work for --now I will close by Saying in gods name help me if you > can, and please let me know at your earleyst convenience Direct to Gila > reservation A. T. in care of J. H. Stout of whom you can ask any question > relative to me you please and he will answer" ALS, ibid., RG 75, Letters > Received, Arizona Superintendency." > > Linda Schwenn > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Papers of Ulysses S. Grant: June 1, 1871-January 31, 1872, p 93 By Ulysses Simpson Grant, John Y. Simon, Ulysses S. Grant Association Google Books. [Google Search string: "Territory of Arizona, secretary Van Arman"] A plaintive letter to authorities during the US Grant administration from Henry Van Arman 11 Oct 1871 from Sacaton, Arizona Territory, describes how he and his nephew, after arriving in the spring of 1870 from the "ledmines" by wagon train across the Missouri River, constructed irrigation ditches to prepare their newly purchased land on the Salt River for farming, spending nearly all what remained of the $2800 they took west with them. While they were away, Indians came and destroyed it all. He had complained to the Indian agent without redress and is pleading for it now. It appears to be part of an investigation of abuses by and/or threats toward the Indian agent. "On Oct. 11, Henry Van Arman, Sacaton, Arizona Territory, wrote to USG "haveing left our home in the ledmines two-years ago last my for the west my self and Nephew with the Sad to be the best waggon and team that had crossed the Mo River that Season and $2800 twenty eight hundred Dollars in Cash we brought upon Salt River in this territory about 18 month Since whare we located farms and constructed a canal or ditch about 3 miles in length for the purposs of irrogateing our farms which cost us evry thing we had Save our groing Crop and improvenants which if we could have Saved would made us quite independant but while absent for a few days leaveing my house in care of a neighbor to attend to the Merricopa and Pemi or Pemoi Indians Made a raid upon my place and Destroid evry thing we had a full Statementment of which we have forwarded to the indian department with our affidavits and other testimony now my good President Since doing this we are told unless we employ a lobby lawyer we will not get any thing in 3 or 4 years and then it will take all we claim to pay him --I am now working for the Indian agent at Gila reservation whare I mit in person Mr. Vincent Colier and Stated our Situation to him and he told me he would do all he could for me. Since the I have been told by one in authority that he, colier receives thousand of letters that he never reads them and will probably neve think of me again now my Drs I am 53 years of age have spent all the best part of my life in the mines you must know about what I am at this time of life and how well I am capasitated to work by the month for my living which this misfortune compels me to do which is terable on me allthough this agen is a verry good Man to work for --now I will close by Saying in gods name help me if you can, and please let me know at your earleyst convenience Direct to Gila reservation A. T. in care of J. H. Stout of whom you can ask any question relative to me you please and he will answer" ALS, ibid., RG 75, Letters Received, Arizona Superintendency." Linda Schwenn

http://dmna.state.ny.us/historic/reghist/civil/infantry/134thInf/134thInfMain.htm Boynton, Thom. *Thom Boynton Collection*. There are many items of the 134th on loan at the Schoharie NY musuem. Some of the items include a 134th Gar Kepi, SNY Cartridge box, Over 100 Civil war and Gar Medals of the same 134th Soldier by the name of Christian Van Arnum. 134th Infantry Regiment Civil War Mustered in: September 22, 1862 Mustered out: June 10, 1865

I got this link in a newsletter today. It is a search engine geared to genealogical searches. I wondered if others might find it helpful. http://www.genealogyintime.com/GenealogyResources/Tools/advanced_genealogy_search_engine.html

Love it!!! Thanks for sharing Linda. Susan -----Original Message----- From: Linda Schwenn [mailto:schwel@comcast.net] Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2010 11:58 AM To: vannorman@rootsweb.com Subject: [VANNORMAN] Genealogy search engine I got this link in a newsletter today. It is a search engine geared to genealogical searches. I wondered if others might find it helpful. http://www.genealogyintime.com/GenealogyResources/Tools/advanced_genealogy_s earch_engine.html ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Don't everybody go nuts trying to research this on the 'net. There are other records that, if they don't actually conflict with this record of Hiram's marriage, at least don't seem to fit with it very well. For once, I can actually consult primary records (if they exist) since I live about 25 miles from Marengo but it'll take me two or three weeks at least to do it. (Stephe: I meant to mention there's nothing directly pertaining to the Van Arnams at the McHenry County Historical Society.) --pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Wood" <stephe.w300@gmail.com> To: "VANNORMAN" <VANNORMAN@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2010 9:17 AM Subject: [VANNORMAN] Double Van Arnam (etc.) family connection > Hi! > > While I was going through records on the net this past week, I > stumbled upon the following index to this marriage record. [at: > beta.familysearch.org] > > Hiram M. Van Arman; born Cleveland Ohio; son of Richard H. & Elizabeth > Van Arman; to Melissa Daman; daughter of Amos & Elizabeth Daman > married 29 May 1862 in Shullsburg, La Fayette, Lafayette County, > Wisconsin. > > Not only was this (first) marriage of Hiram's unknown to myself, as a > 1907 writeup in "History of the State of California and biographical > record of Oakland and environs" for the Hon. Hiram Miller Van Arman > (1839 - 1904) only mentions his widow Isabella Haines, whom he had wed > by 1870, but it shed some light on another puzzle that had been around > for a number of years. > > Melissa A. Daman (c1839/40 Illinois - prob. 1881 Illinois) has > turned out to likely be a first cousin of Hiram, the daughter of Amos > Daman / Damon and Elizabeth "Eliza" Van Arnam (c1800 NY - prob. 1888 > Illinois). She was residing as M. Van Arman with her mother in the > 1870 census return of Marengo, McHenry County, Illinois, but likely > remarried to a Mr. Humphrey sometime prior to the 1880 census when she > was [probably] listed with her mother as "Maud" Humphrey. > > Pete and I believe that Elizabeth is the daughter of Jacob Van > Arnam & Catharina Hemstraet, as was Richard H. Van Arman (c1803/6 NY - > 1881 CA), the father of Hiram. [FYI - This Jacob is the common > ancestor for both Pete and I, but we descend from different wives.] > > There are several Daman family outlines on Rootsweb's Worldconnect > project, but my research appears to differ slightly from what is > posted for the children. [I can't connect the 2 eldest sons at the > moment, so I won't post their information] > > Based on the 1830,1840 and later census returns for Amos & Elizabeth > Daman, the family appears to consist of the following children: > > son b. 1821/25 > son b. 1821/25 > Eliza b. 1825/30 m. Elisha Lamphear Jr. 1843 > Ill. > Harriet Arvilla b. 1828/29 Ohio m. Amos B. Coon 1846 Ill. > Ann C. b. c1831 Ohio m. John Clark 1856 > Ill. > George Washington b. c1835 MI m.1) Caroline M. Blake 1856 Wis. > m.2) Matilda S. > Marsh 1890 Neb. > Melissa A. [Maud?] b. 1839/40 Ill. m.1) Miller Van Arman 1862 Wis. > m.2) > Humphrey 187? > > > Here are the two early census returns for Amos & Elizabeth, with > corresponding given names as I perceive them to be: > > 1830 census Leroy township, Geauga County, Ohio - Possible entry > Amos Deming > 2 males 5-9 ? & ? > 1 male 30-39 Amos > 2 females under 5 Eliza & "Hattie" > 1 female 15-19 ? > 1 female 30-39 Eliza > > ! 1840 census McHenry County, Illinois > Amos Daman > 1 male 5-9; George W > 2 males 15-19; ? & ? > 1 male 30-39 Amos > 1 female under 5; Melissa A. > 1 female 5-9; Ann C. > 2 females 10-14; Eliza & "Hattie" > 1 female 30-39. Eliza > > The hunt for additional information goes on..... > > Stephen > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

1840 Henry P. Van Ornam Lansingburgh, Rensselaer, NY M: 1 under 5, 1 5–9, 1 30–39 F: 1 under 5, 1 20–29 Home in 1850 Troy Ward 7, Rensselaer, New York Family Number: 4018 Henry Vanarnam 38 NY Occupation: porter Amanda Vanarnam 36 MA Martin Vanarnam 17 NY Martha Vanarnam 14NY Henry Vanarnam 10 NY William Vanarnam 9 NY Elizabeth Stevenson 27 NY Oliver Stevenson 5 NY 1858 -Apr 11 -Henry P. Van Arnam - b.Troy age at death 49; parents: Isaac & Lydia Van Arnam Burials Oakwood Cemetery, Troy, NY This places Isaac and Lydia in Troy about the 1810 census time. 1860 can't find Amanda and fam. in census indexed on Ancestry.com. 1865 Troy, NY http://www.connorsgenealogy.com/Troy1865/10thWard-S.htm Name, age, position, birthplace (NY county), number children, times married, married-single-widowed, occupation, ward, not sure what others are, probably dwelling, fam # Vanarnam Amanda 50 head Greene 4 1 w 10-N 101 143 Vanarnam James N 25 child Rens s None, Army 10-N 101 143 Vanarnam William A 20 child Rens s Fireman, TBRR 10-N 101 143 I think James N b 1840 and Henry age 10 in 1850 must be the same child. The transcriber could have thought the initial after James was an N when it was an H for Henry. Martin is enumerated in Ward 7 with his two children and wife Catherine. Poor Martha has gone into genealogical oblivion unless we have some luck knowing who she married. FYI Also in the 10th ward but maybe on the south side of town?? Haven't figured out yet who they belong to. Vanarnum Hannah 50 head Ireland 1 1 w paper mill AL 10-S 195 323 Vanarnum Margret A. 7 child Rens s 10-S 195 323In 1860 they are living with the Martin Conolly family in Troy; he is perhaps her brother. Linda Schwenn

As I recall, he was discharged out West. I didn't try to or couldn't follow him but I have the vague impression he didn't last a long time. See if you can locate Betty Rainey. The Dixon VA's are her line. She lives or lived out near Portland. There should be posts from her on this board. --pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Schwenn" <schwel@comcast.net> To: <vannorman@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2010 2:02 PM Subject: Re: [VANNORMAN] John Van Arnam, b 1826 Lockport, NY Thanks, Pete. Do you know where John went after the war? Linda On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 10:17 AM, Pete Gonigam <gonigam@hotmail.com> wrote: > John Van Arnam, musician in the Illinois Infantry in the Mexican War, was > the son of John (1799 I think) Van Arnam of Dixon, son of Jacob (1773) VA > and Catherina Haemstraet (various spellings) originally of Brunswick > Center, > NY. > > Researcher Betty Rainey has a letter John sent from Mexico to his mother > Chloe in Dixon. > > --pete > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Linda Schwenn" <schwel@comcast.net> > To: <vannorman@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 4:59 PM > Subject: [VANNORMAN] John Van Arnam, b 1826 Lockport, NY > > > In 1847 John Van Arnam enlisted in the Mexican War. He was 21 and born in > Lockport, NY. Enlistment place: Dixon [no state given. The list includes > various states/places] Occupation: stage driver. 16th Infantry Regiment. > Discharged Aug 7, 1848, expiration of service, at Newport, KY. A musician. > > Source: Ancestry.com "U.S. Army, Register of Enlistments, 1798-1914 Record > for John Vanaenam" (In the original it looks more like Van Arnam) > > Is this an early son of John 1801-1859 and Chloe Van Arnam? And does it > tie > into the PA Van Normans? > 1840 census: Dixon, Lee, IL M:1 under 5, 1 5–9, 2 15–19, 7 20–29, 4 > 30–39, 1 free colored male 36 – 54 > 1850: Dixon, Lee, IL wife Chloe is there b 1807 NY with several children. > > Linda Schwenn > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

check it out: http://www.connorsgenealogy.com/troy/1865Census.html

Thanks, Pete. Do you know where John went after the war? Linda On Sat, Nov 6, 2010 at 10:17 AM, Pete Gonigam <gonigam@hotmail.com> wrote: > John Van Arnam, musician in the Illinois Infantry in the Mexican War, was > the son of John (1799 I think) Van Arnam of Dixon, son of Jacob (1773) VA > and Catherina Haemstraet (various spellings) originally of Brunswick > Center, > NY. > > Researcher Betty Rainey has a letter John sent from Mexico to his mother > Chloe in Dixon. > > --pete > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Linda Schwenn" <schwel@comcast.net> > To: <vannorman@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 4:59 PM > Subject: [VANNORMAN] John Van Arnam, b 1826 Lockport, NY > > > In 1847 John Van Arnam enlisted in the Mexican War. He was 21 and born in > Lockport, NY. Enlistment place: Dixon [no state given. The list includes > various states/places] Occupation: stage driver. 16th Infantry Regiment. > Discharged Aug 7, 1848, expiration of service, at Newport, KY. A musician. > > Source: Ancestry.com "U.S. Army, Register of Enlistments, 1798-1914 Record > for John Vanaenam" (In the original it looks more like Van Arnam) > > Is this an early son of John 1801-1859 and Chloe Van Arnam? And does it > tie > into the PA Van Normans? > 1840 census: Dixon, Lee, IL M:1 under 5, 1 5–9, 2 15–19, 7 20–29, 4 > 30–39, 1 free colored male 36 – 54 > 1850: Dixon, Lee, IL wife Chloe is there b 1807 NY with several children. > > Linda Schwenn > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi! While I was going through records on the net this past week, I stumbled upon the following index to this marriage record. [at: beta.familysearch.org] Hiram M. Van Arman; born Cleveland Ohio; son of Richard H. & Elizabeth Van Arman; to Melissa Daman; daughter of Amos & Elizabeth Daman married 29 May 1862 in Shullsburg, La Fayette, Lafayette County, Wisconsin. Not only was this (first) marriage of Hiram's unknown to myself, as a 1907 writeup in "History of the State of California and biographical record of Oakland and environs" for the Hon. Hiram Miller Van Arman (1839 - 1904) only mentions his widow Isabella Haines, whom he had wed by 1870, but it shed some light on another puzzle that had been around for a number of years. Melissa A. Daman (c1839/40 Illinois - prob. 1881 Illinois) has turned out to likely be a first cousin of Hiram, the daughter of Amos Daman / Damon and Elizabeth "Eliza" Van Arnam (c1800 NY - prob. 1888 Illinois). She was residing as M. Van Arman with her mother in the 1870 census return of Marengo, McHenry County, Illinois, but likely remarried to a Mr. Humphrey sometime prior to the 1880 census when she was [probably] listed with her mother as "Maud" Humphrey. Pete and I believe that Elizabeth is the daughter of Jacob Van Arnam & Catharina Hemstraet, as was Richard H. Van Arman (c1803/6 NY - 1881 CA), the father of Hiram. [FYI - This Jacob is the common ancestor for both Pete and I, but we descend from different wives.] There are several Daman family outlines on Rootsweb's Worldconnect project, but my research appears to differ slightly from what is posted for the children. [I can't connect the 2 eldest sons at the moment, so I won't post their information] Based on the 1830,1840 and later census returns for Amos & Elizabeth Daman, the family appears to consist of the following children: son b. 1821/25 son b. 1821/25 Eliza b. 1825/30 m. Elisha Lamphear Jr. 1843 Ill. Harriet Arvilla b. 1828/29 Ohio m. Amos B. Coon 1846 Ill. Ann C. b. c1831 Ohio m. John Clark 1856 Ill. George Washington b. c1835 MI m.1) Caroline M. Blake 1856 Wis. m.2) Matilda S. Marsh 1890 Neb. Melissa A. [Maud?] b. 1839/40 Ill. m.1) Miller Van Arman 1862 Wis. m.2) Humphrey 187? Here are the two early census returns for Amos & Elizabeth, with corresponding given names as I perceive them to be: 1830 census Leroy township, Geauga County, Ohio - Possible entry Amos Deming 2 males 5-9 ? & ? 1 male 30-39 Amos 2 females under 5 Eliza & "Hattie" 1 female 15-19 ? 1 female 30-39 Eliza ! 1840 census McHenry County, Illinois Amos Daman 1 male 5-9; George W 2 males 15-19; ? & ? 1 male 30-39 Amos 1 female under 5; Melissa A. 1 female 5-9; Ann C. 2 females 10-14; Eliza & "Hattie" 1 female 30-39. Eliza The hunt for additional information goes on..... Stephen

John Van Arnam, musician in the Illinois Infantry in the Mexican War, was the son of John (1799 I think) Van Arnam of Dixon, son of Jacob (1773) VA and Catherina Haemstraet (various spellings) originally of Brunswick Center, NY. Researcher Betty Rainey has a letter John sent from Mexico to his mother Chloe in Dixon. --pete ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda Schwenn" <schwel@comcast.net> To: <vannorman@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2010 4:59 PM Subject: [VANNORMAN] John Van Arnam, b 1826 Lockport, NY In 1847 John Van Arnam enlisted in the Mexican War. He was 21 and born in Lockport, NY. Enlistment place: Dixon [no state given. The list includes various states/places] Occupation: stage driver. 16th Infantry Regiment. Discharged Aug 7, 1848, expiration of service, at Newport, KY. A musician. Source: Ancestry.com "U.S. Army, Register of Enlistments, 1798-1914 Record for John Vanaenam" (In the original it looks more like Van Arnam) Is this an early son of John 1801-1859 and Chloe Van Arnam? And does it tie into the PA Van Normans? 1840 census: Dixon, Lee, IL M:1 under 5, 1 5–9, 2 15–19, 7 20–29, 4 30–39, 1 free colored male 36 – 54 1850: Dixon, Lee, IL wife Chloe is there b 1807 NY with several children. Linda Schwenn ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi! Thanks for posting this death record for Henry P. Van Arnam - It's very helpful. I suspect that this is the Henry Vanarnam who married Amanda __?__ and was residing in Ward 7 of Troy in 1850. His age is a bit off (c1812) but the 1840 census for Henry P. Van Ornam of Lansingburgh, Rensselaer County, NY whom I believe to be the same person, shows an age of 1801 - 1810 which fits the c1809 age perfectly. I haven't located the family in 1860 yet, but Amanda was probably a widow in th 1870 and 1880 census returns.... Now if we could only determine where Isaac was residing (or who with) in the census returns prior to 1840.... Stephen <snip> An intriguing snippet that I have that I haven't been able to make heads or tails out of so far is the death record for a Henry P VanArnam. Here's my copy/paste: 1858 -Apr 11 -Henry P. Van Arnam -Troy 49 Isaac & Lydia Van Arnam DOD, name, birthplace, age at death, parents Oakwood Cemetery, Troy, NY It occurs to me now that this Isaac could be the same as the Isaac from Painted Post. This is purely speculative, mind you. I have no further information on this Henry P. Maybe someone else on the list has more.

Hi! That would be a great help Linda - with luck it will confirm everything for us! Thanks, Stephen On 11/3/10, Linda Noggle <lindanoggle@verizon.net> wrote: > Stephen, > > This is great - I actually had 2 Williams listed on my database. > I think the next time I go to the Archives, I will look up Ransom Van > Norman's civil war pension - > he served from Wisconsin and his mother (Elmira filed for his pension in > 1871) > This might give the information if she was divorced. > > Linda Noggle

Edith, I don't have any Lydia 1815 in my database. However, in looking at the 1850 census for Adam and Lydia, it appears that this might have been a second marriage for Adam. The oldest children are too old for them to be Lydia's. Adam appears in the 1840 census in Painted Post, Steuben, NY. His name is terribly written by the enumerator and transcribed Aamlivus Abbott by Ancestry.com (image 17). Also enumerated in Painted Post is William S. Vanorman w a female 10-14 in the family (image 15) who is a candidate as son of Isaac Vanorman who has a female age 15-19 and one 20-29 also living in Painted Post 1840. So my GUESS is that Lydia is the dau of Isaac based on age and opportunity; perhaps she named a son after her a favorite sibling, William, as many women did then. She's the Liddie living with John Abbott in Thurston, Steuben, NY, when she's 55. It's interesting that the enumerator wrote that her birthplace was Deutschland. And she's still with John in 1880. All I know about Isaac for sure is that he was born between 1781-1790. An intriguing snippet that I have that I haven't been able to make heads or tails out of so far is the death record for a Henry P VanArnam. Here's my copy/paste: 1858 -Apr 11 -Henry P. Van Arnam -Troy 49 Isaac & Lydia Van Arnam DOD, name, birthplace, age at death, parents Oakwood Cemetery, Troy, NY It occurs to me now that this Isaac could be the same as the Isaac from Painted Post. This is purely speculative, mind you. I have no further information on this Henry P. Maybe someone else on the list has more. I'd like to know the source for Lydia Jane's birth date and place. Good luck with your searching, Linda

Another Pratt sent me this e-mail Now that I have time, I've been into Ancestry.Com using my membership and found a family tree with Adam F Abbott & Lydia Jane Van Norman, plus their 10 kids. Also had a note referring to a letter between some Abbotts about Anna on her own after husband deserts her - here is some of the info, but there is so much, I'll print it out and mail it Adam F Abbott b 6/8/1809, d 1852 Lydia Jane Van Norman, b 6/15/1815 in Saratoga, NY, d 8/17/1896 in Bath, NY Children: John W Abbott b 11/18/1832 Anna Abbott b, 7/31/1834 Emily Amelia Abbott b, 3/18/1836 Charles L Abbott b, 3/9/1838 Eliza Abbott b, 4/20/1840 Amanda Abbott b, 3/5/1842 Julia A Abbott b, 6/29/1844 William Henry Abbott b, 2/28/1846 George Abbott b, 4/7/1848 Mary L Abbott b, 10/11/1850 > Date: Fri, 5 Nov 2010 17:45:38 -0400 > From: schwel@comcast.net > To: vannorman@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [VANNORMAN] John Van Arnam, b 1826 Lockport, NY > > Edith, > > I don't have any Lydia 1815 in my database. However, in looking at the 1850 > census for Adam and Lydia, it appears that this might have been a second > marriage for Adam. The oldest children are too old for them to be Lydia's. > Adam appears in the 1840 census in Painted Post, Steuben, NY. His name is > terribly written by the enumerator and transcribed Aamlivus Abbott by > Ancestry.com (image 17). Also enumerated in Painted Post is William S. > Vanorman w a female 10-14 in the family (image 15) who is a candidate as > son of Isaac Vanorman who has a female age 15-19 and one 20-29 also living > in Painted Post 1840. So my GUESS is that Lydia is the dau of Isaac based on > age and opportunity; perhaps she named a son after her a favorite sibling, > William, as many women did then. She's the Liddie living with John Abbott in > Thurston, Steuben, NY, when she's 55. It's interesting that the enumerator > wrote that her birthplace was Deutschland. And she's still with John in > 1880. All I know about Isaac for sure is that he was born between 1781-1790. > > > An intriguing snippet that I have that I haven't been able to make heads or > tails out of so far is the death record for a Henry P VanArnam. Here's my > copy/paste: > 1858 -Apr 11 -Henry P. Van Arnam -Troy 49 Isaac & Lydia Van Arnam > DOD, name, birthplace, age at death, parents > Oakwood Cemetery, Troy, NY > > It occurs to me now that this Isaac could be the same as the Isaac from > Painted Post. This is purely speculative, mind you. I have no further > information on this Henry P. Maybe someone else on the list has more. > > I'd like to know the source for Lydia Jane's birth date and place. > > Good luck with your searching, > Linda > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Stephen, I also want to thank you for this list. I also use it a lot. Linda Noggle On Nov 4, 2010, at 9:19 AM, Stephen Wood wrote: > Hi everyone! > > Just a quick note to mention that the latest version of our > "Early Van Norman census returns 1790 - 1840" is now available as an > excel file download at Sherri's Van Norman Family Association website > - http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~vnfa/census.html > > We've added a couple of more newly located entries, fixed up a > couple of errors [Joseph Van Norman / Elizabeth Wybern 1800 entry is > one example] and added a couple of Van Norman (etc.) daughter's family > entries, so a bit of everything....... > > And I already have more to add to it! > > Many thanks to all who added their input to this version - we > will eventually get 99% of them sorted out sooner or later. > > Stephen > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Do you have the text or link to John's will and to Chloe's 1839 petition? I have 7 children not including John and I'd like to see if my list matches. Linda It's interesting that Chloe's son Williard went to California, also occupation stage driver. On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 9:49 AM, Stephen Wood <stephe.w300@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi! > > The following information may apply to the same John Van Arnam / > Van Arman. I had guessed that this pertained to John, son of John Van > Arnum & Tamar Dewey, because of his occupation and Michigan location > at that date, but I could be in error. > > The following was taken from: http://www.eaton.migenweb.net/pageone.htm > > History of Eaton County, Michigan > > (snip) > The grand jury came in with indictments and were discharged. The next > day, November 14, 1851, was the last of the county court. It ended in > open rebellion against the judge. When the judge ordered Mr. Shaw to > pay a fine of five dollars Mr. Shaw is said to have retorted, “Fine > and be d---d.” For this the judge ordered him imprisoned for five > days, and the sheriff was ordered to arrest him. John Van Arman, Henry > A. Shaw, Martin S. Bracket, C. C. Chatfield, and quite a number of > other attorneys stood up in battle array, some with their coats off > and shirt sleeves rolled up (instead of having their black gowns on), > and gave the judge and sheriff to understand that not one of their > number could be taken out of that bar. The sheriff stood hesitating at > the entrance, when some of them in friendly tones assured him that he > had better not try to come in there. He probably saw at a glance that > the caution was given him for his good. They were many of them men > whom it would be difficult to handle. M. S. Bracket bore the > reputation of being physically the most powerful man in the county. > Spectators say that as he bared his arms muscles and tendons rose up > like whip-cords. Mr. Shaw was tall, quick and powerful--he had nearly > broken the next of an antagonist by kicking him under the chin while > standing before him. John Van Arman had been a soldier in the Mexican > war and looked as if he would rather fight than eat. No arrest was > made. A jury of twelve men sat looking on. Some of them afterwards > censured the sheriff for not calling on them for help. > > This is not likely a son of John (1801 - 1859) & Chloe Van Arnam. > >From John's will and Chloe's 1839 petition, we know that there were 7 > children in the family - although the father of the eldest son James > may not be John Van Arnam - and they didn't have a son John...... > > The John of "John & Chloe" is likely one of the New York Van > Arnam's, and quite possibly the other John of "John & Tamar" descends > from this line too.... > > Stephen > > P.S. You have good timing - I just found that quote about John in the > Mexican War a couple of days ago! > > On 11/4/10, Linda Schwenn <schwel@comcast.net> wrote: > > In 1847 John Van Arnam enlisted in the Mexican War. He was 21 and born > in > > Lockport, NY. Enlistment place: Dixon [no state given. The list includes > > various states/places] Occupation: stage driver. 16th Infantry > Regiment. > > Discharged Aug 7, 1848, expiration of service, at Newport, KY. A > musician. > > > > Source: Ancestry.com "U.S. Army, Register of Enlistments, 1798-1914 > Record > > for John Vanaenam" (In the original it looks more like Van Arnam) > > > > Is this an early son of John 1801-1859 and Chloe Van Arnam? And does it > tie > > into the PA Van Normans? > > 1840 census: Dixon, Lee, IL M:1 under 5, 1 5–9, 2 15–19, 7 20–29, 4 > > 30–39, 1 free colored male 36 – 54 > > 1850: Dixon, Lee, IL wife Chloe is there b 1807 NY with several > children. > > > > Linda Schwenn > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

This is not pertinent to your reports, but are the women ever listed in any of the reports? I have been looking for Lydia Jane Van Norman, born June 15, 1815 in Saratoga County, NY - later moved to Steuben County, NY & died Aug. 17, in Bath, Steuben County, NY. who married Adam Abbott & they had a daughter Anna who was said to be "Mohawk and Dutch descent" Anna Married Nelson Pratt in NY & they moved to Wisconsin. Can't seem to find anything on that connection. > Date: Fri, 5 Nov 2010 12:40:42 -0400 > From: schwel@comcast.net > To: vannorman@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [VANNORMAN] John Van Arnam, b 1826 Lockport, NY > > Do you have the text or link to John's will and to Chloe's 1839 petition? I > have 7 children not including John and I'd like to see if my list matches. > Linda > > It's interesting that Chloe's son Williard went to California, also > occupation stage driver. > > On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 9:49 AM, Stephen Wood <stephe.w300@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hi! > > > > The following information may apply to the same John Van Arnam / > > Van Arman. I had guessed that this pertained to John, son of John Van > > Arnum & Tamar Dewey, because of his occupation and Michigan location > > at that date, but I could be in error. > > > > The following was taken from: http://www.eaton.migenweb.net/pageone.htm > > > > History of Eaton County, Michigan > > > > (snip) > > The grand jury came in with indictments and were discharged. The next > > day, November 14, 1851, was the last of the county court. It ended in > > open rebellion against the judge. When the judge ordered Mr. Shaw to > > pay a fine of five dollars Mr. Shaw is said to have retorted, “Fine > > and be d---d.” For this the judge ordered him imprisoned for five > > days, and the sheriff was ordered to arrest him. John Van Arman, Henry > > A. Shaw, Martin S. Bracket, C. C. Chatfield, and quite a number of > > other attorneys stood up in battle array, some with their coats off > > and shirt sleeves rolled up (instead of having their black gowns on), > > and gave the judge and sheriff to understand that not one of their > > number could be taken out of that bar. The sheriff stood hesitating at > > the entrance, when some of them in friendly tones assured him that he > > had better not try to come in there. He probably saw at a glance that > > the caution was given him for his good. They were many of them men > > whom it would be difficult to handle. M. S. Bracket bore the > > reputation of being physically the most powerful man in the county. > > Spectators say that as he bared his arms muscles and tendons rose up > > like whip-cords. Mr. Shaw was tall, quick and powerful--he had nearly > > broken the next of an antagonist by kicking him under the chin while > > standing before him. John Van Arman had been a soldier in the Mexican > > war and looked as if he would rather fight than eat. No arrest was > > made. A jury of twelve men sat looking on. Some of them afterwards > > censured the sheriff for not calling on them for help. > > > > This is not likely a son of John (1801 - 1859) & Chloe Van Arnam. > > >From John's will and Chloe's 1839 petition, we know that there were 7 > > children in the family - although the father of the eldest son James > > may not be John Van Arnam - and they didn't have a son John...... > > > > The John of "John & Chloe" is likely one of the New York Van > > Arnam's, and quite possibly the other John of "John & Tamar" descends > > from this line too.... > > > > Stephen > > > > P.S. You have good timing - I just found that quote about John in the > > Mexican War a couple of days ago! > > > > On 11/4/10, Linda Schwenn <schwel@comcast.net> wrote: > > > In 1847 John Van Arnam enlisted in the Mexican War. He was 21 and born > > in > > > Lockport, NY. Enlistment place: Dixon [no state given. The list includes > > > various states/places] Occupation: stage driver. 16th Infantry > > Regiment. > > > Discharged Aug 7, 1848, expiration of service, at Newport, KY. A > > musician. > > > > > > Source: Ancestry.com "U.S. Army, Register of Enlistments, 1798-1914 > > Record > > > for John Vanaenam" (In the original it looks more like Van Arnam) > > > > > > Is this an early son of John 1801-1859 and Chloe Van Arnam? And does it > > tie > > > into the PA Van Normans? > > > 1840 census: Dixon, Lee, IL M:1 under 5, 1 5–9, 2 15–19, 7 20–29, 4 > > > 30–39, 1 free colored male 36 – 54 > > > 1850: Dixon, Lee, IL wife Chloe is there b 1807 NY with several > > children. > > > > > > Linda Schwenn > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to VANNORMAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message