Sorry Mary the film was a dissapointment. It listed Prince William residents who had married out of county in 1870, Most were Loudoun Co residents. I found no Turners. Virginia Ila, I.m sorry but I did not find Middleton. Film did not include Loudoun County Statistics as listed on title.. Delt more with Prince William County. 1870 was a later time frame than I had anticipated.. Virginia

I am searching for Kenneth W. Manson and Melissa V. Manson of Leesburg, Loudoun Co., VA. Their mother was Charlotte Whitford who d. Dec. 20, 1990 in St. Louis Park, Minn. Remaining family would like to locate Kenneth & Melissa. Thank you for your help. Carolyn Whitford For I am the Lord, your God, who takes hold of your right hand and says to you; Do not fear, I will help you. (Isaiah 41:13)

Hi everyone, I was wondering if some one could do a lookup on the 1930 census Loudoun County Virginia for Leonard Lee Putman and wife Careline, also Charles Fry and wife Jane, also Thomas Putman and wife Susan. Thanks everyone for all your help. Marilyn

Are anyone familiar with William Mathers and Margaret Brooks line? Married 5/21/1846 possibly, and perhaps Quakers? Also Wesley Brooks who died 1881? Says Mary Brooks is parent and B.F. Mathers is nephew. Is this Brooks family the on related to the brooks that married Alice Stevens/Stephens? Thanks.

My guess on line below" vc Gaesol; not on Y T vicinity of Gaesol [placename?]; not on Yardley Taylor [map] aye, Bob McArtor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marty Hiatt" <martyhiatt@starpower.net> To: <VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, May 31, 2002 7:23 AM Subject: Re: [VALOUDOU-L] Tavenner Abbreviations > > My guesses: > > > lv MD & Pelve lv Hamit on 7 (Whats Pelve and 7) - lived Maryland and P'vle > (Purcellville, lived Hamilton on Route 7 > > Morndon - > > sto vc Unison (Whats sto) - depends on the surname, but I think this is > store vicinity of Unison. > > > d/t 1825 - something dated 1825 > > > vc Gaesol; not on Y T > > > lv Bradk rd vc Fx line "Major" - lived Bradock Road vicinity Fairfax line, > "Major" was probably an honorary title. > > grantee 1787 on Elklick - received grant in 1787, land was on Elklick Run > > > Thectin - could this be Ketoctin or Catoctin? > > > > Yes these notes are really in there: > > she kleptomaniac (who told) > > killed by cannibals (who brought the word back) > > These last two bring up my assumption of Mr. Tavenner's work--that it was > based on oral history as well as court docs. I'm sure he talked to remaining > family members because there are other statements like the two above that I > doubt he found in any traditional court record. Those two statements could > have been made in a chancery suit, but then I've never seen any indication > that he combed those files. > > > > Gerald James > > Dallas, TX > > > > ______________________________ > > > > ==== VALOUDOU Mailing List ==== > Join the Rootsweb Genealogical Data Cooperative. > Rootsweb members & sponsors are who make this list possible. > http://www.rootsweb.com > >

Gerald, You've really got some good ones! > lv Bradk rd vc Fx line "Major" < OK, I'll take a stab at this one: "Lived on Braddock Road in the vicinity of the Loudoun-Fairfax County line. This person was also known as the "Major." (Or perhaps estate was called "Major.") Braddock RD is VA Route #620. The intersection of Fairfax & Loudoun Counties at Rt. 620 is UTM 18 283410E 4306984N [HERNDON quad] You can plug those co-ordinates into Topozone.com to see the actual location. It's on the road between Conklin and Schneider's Crossroads. John Freed fleance@nyc.rr.com

So much for my kindergarten abbreviations. I forgot to consider Roman Numerals. I will try to redeem myself with the following: (these came from the end of Denny Shirer's list) Pwm - Prince William Sycolia (town? where?) - Sycolin, sometimes spelled Segolin or Siglin because that is how it is pronounced. It is the area sometimes called "The Kingdom" south of Leesburg. Modern maps show Sycolin Road, on the east edge of Leesburg, leading to the Arthur Godfrey airport. Wheatld (possibly Wheatland but can't find in Md., Va. or W.Va.) Wheatland is south of Lovettsville, but north of Route 9. Look at a map where Rts. 9 and 287 cross, then go about 1/2 inch north. Marty Hiatt, CGRS

My guesses: > lv MD & Pelve lv Hamit on 7 (Whats Pelve and 7) - lived Maryland and P'vle (Purcellville, lived Hamilton on Route 7 > Morndon - > sto vc Unison (Whats sto) - depends on the surname, but I think this is store vicinity of Unison. > d/t 1825 - something dated 1825 > vc Gaesol; not on Y T > lv Bradk rd vc Fx line "Major" - lived Bradock Road vicinity Fairfax line, "Major" was probably an honorary title. > grantee 1787 on Elklick - received grant in 1787, land was on Elklick Run > Thectin - could this be Ketoctin or Catoctin? > > Yes these notes are really in there: > she kleptomaniac (who told) > killed by cannibals (who brought the word back) These last two bring up my assumption of Mr. Tavenner's work--that it was based on oral history as well as court docs. I'm sure he talked to remaining family members because there are other statements like the two above that I doubt he found in any traditional court record. Those two statements could have been made in a chancery suit, but then I've never seen any indication that he combed those files. > > Gerald James > Dallas, TX > > ______________________________

Pwm = Prince William County Thanks for the others!

LaVonne: Kudos to you and the staff of Thomas Balch. You have come through again. I was amused at how far off I was on "fun deiac Leesb" - Funeral Director in Leesburg. Thanks for taking time to do this for all of us. Gerald James Dallas, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: "Balch Library" <BalchLib@leesburgva.org> To: "Gerald James" <gjames@cowtown.net> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 2:52 PM Subject: RE: [VALOUDOU-L] Transcription Help Please! Since I didn't know on exactly which "James" pages these abbreviations were found, I'm just going to guess - based on my time here at Thomas Balch Library as a staff member: "1775 Tithe ShelPsh" (also CamPsh) - these indicate this person was found in the early tithables of this county which basically was divided into two parishes - Shelbourne (West) and Cameron (East). They had to pay pounds of tobacco to support the Anglican Parish vestry. "Blumt" - Bluemont area of Loudoun County "Clpr" - Culpeper County "LCo" - Loudoun County "no clil" - I believe this is "no children" "lv Hamet" - living in Hamilton (Hamlt) "lv Lovtvl vc" - living in the vicinity of Lovettsville "Fx" - Fairfax County "Arlg" - Arlington County "Ash" - Ashburn - eastern section of Loudoun County "Fq" - Fauquier County "fc 1973" - we interpret this as "fl" - found living still in 1973 "$10M 1850" - worth $10,000 in the 1850 census I'm going to guess at these next two. I got out the "James" pages and found one entry that said "lived Waterford [Shawen ho]" - I think this means they lived in a house or home called Shawen or occupied by some people named Shawen? "fun deiac Leesb" - Funeral Director in Leesburg Adding some other common ones: "bur Ebnzer" - buried Ebenezer Cemetery "cf" - might be the same person as which ever number follows "cf" "Valley" - means Shenandoah Valley "PSpr" - Paeonian Springs Hope this is of some help to you. LaVonne Markham, Thomas Balch Library staff -----Original Message----- From: Gerald James [mailto:gjames@cowtown.net] Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2002 10:55 AM To: VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [VALOUDOU-L] Transcription Help Please! Glenda: I have tried to translate all 15 of the James pages that Blair Tavener did and have had some limited success. The best clues come from the meticulous format that he used and the repetition of various abbreviations. Almost without exception the format was: First Name Small number above name (date of birth and death) Son or Daughter to Married (m) or Unmarried (unm) Date of marriage Spouse (date of birth and death) Son or Daughter to Notes Where he lived Occupation Where he went The Notes portion was the most difficult part of course. In some instances I enlarged the word to fill the entire screen to determine the exact spelling. Blair was very consistent and used the same identical abbreviations throughout so if you figure one out you had many problems solved. I had the most difficulty with the towns. He wrote: 1775 tithe ShelPsh Blumt Clpr, LCo no clil lv Hamet *(Shawen ho) lv Lovtvl vc *Fx *Arlg *Ash, Fq *fc 1973 *fun deiac Leesb *$10M 1850 *items I still don't know what they mean. Send me your page and I'll do what I can for you. Gerald James Dallas, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glenda Argo" <argo2@mindspring.com> To: <VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2002 8:42 PM Subject: [VALOUDOU-L] Transcription Help Please! > Hello, > I am hoping that someone on the list is familiar with THE CHARLES BLAIR > TAVENER COLLECTION. I received a page, containing a surname I am > researching, from a volunteer from Thomas Balch Library. A sample to help > with transcription was sent with that page, but the sample did not include > the abbreviations that would help me. > > I wonder if someone on the list has had some experience transcribing > this Tavener Collection? If so, would you be willing to look at a scanned > copy of my page to see if you can tell me what it says? > > I would certainly appreciate the help.....thank you. > > Glenda > > > ==== VALOUDOU Mailing List ==== > Join the Loudoun Co., VA Genealogical Society! > For information contact: > Loudoun Genealogy Club > P.O. Box 254 > Leesburg, VA 20178 > Annual Dues are only $10 > > ______________________________

Thanks to all for their input. Sometimes it appears that life is an endless succession of blanks to be filled in. Well, no one has started throwing rocks at me yet so I will venture forth with a few more unknown abbreviations. lv MD & Pelve lv Hamit on 7 (Whats Pelve and 7) Morndon sto vc Unison (Whats sto) d/t 1825 vc Gaesol; not on Y T lv Bradk rd vc Fx line "Major" grantee 1787 on Elklick Thectin Yes these notes are really in there: she kleptomaniac (who told) killed by cannibals (who brought the word back) Gerald James Dallas, TX

Denny: Your abbreviations have proved invaluable. I had many notes that Tavenner made (most were in pencil) that said ie: fe1974, fc1973. Some were in the Notes portion and some were in the (born-died) portion that looked like (fc 1973). It now appears after looking at your abbreviations that it is not fe, or fc, but fl - found living. Thanks for the help. Gerald James Dallas, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: "Denny Shirer" <drdx@neo.rr.com> To: <VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 10:37 AM Subject: [VALOUDOU-L] Re: Solving Puzzles > When I sent for info from the Tavenner Collection it came with a sheet explaining > some of the common abbreviations. I didn't see all of them mentioned in this > thread so will include what they are. > > Fq = Fauquier Co. > Fx = Fairfax Co. > Lv = Lovettsville > Wtfd = Waterford > cf = same as (doesn't make sense but will bow to their wisdom) > dau = daughter > fl = found living > inv = inventory > w = will > > Others that I have found. Some are very obvious so don't shoot the messenger > > Ala = Alabama > Alex = Alexandria > CSA = Confederate States Army > Calif = California > Capt - Captain > Chlvl = Charlottesville > Ck = Creek (as in Goose Ck) > DC = District of COlumbia > Hillsb = Hillsboro Md. > Ky = Kentucky > Lc = Loudoun county > Leesb = Leesburg > Lit Rv = Little River > Lt = Lieutenant > Mass = Massachusetts > Md = Maryland > Mdbg = Middleburg > Midlbg = Middleburg > Miss. = Mississippi > Mt Gild = Mount Gilead > NC = North Carolina > Pa = Pennsylvania > Pcvl = Purcellville > Penn = Pennsylvania > Psh = Parish > Rev = Reverand > Rg = Ridge (as in Blue Rg) > S = South ( as in S Va. Exception is in following or preceding a name where it > indicates an initial) > ShelPsh = Shelby Parish > USN = United States Navy > Upvl = Upperville > Va = Virginia > Wa = Washington > adj = adjacent > ch = church > cls = close to > cprl = Corporal > dischg = discharge > foot or ft = foot hills (as in foot Blue Rg) > lv = lived or lived in (Don't confuse with Lv) > m = married > p.m. = Post Master > thbl = tithable > to = moved to > unm = unmarried > vc = very close (as in "lv vc Arcola") > wit = witness > wva = West Virginia > yr = years (as in lv Alex 50 yr) > > There are many many more. I took these from the pages I have for my surnames. > > Often references are made to numbers as in "son to 110" or "m 130" which shows the > relation to the person listed in the line marked with the reference number. > > When a reference is made to a name and initial, it is in reference to someone with > the last name as the section it is found in. For instance in the section on Adams > is found "dau to Humphrey S" Here the S does not mean "south" but Humphrey S. > Adams. > > Some name abbreviations are very obvious as in the following but still worth > noting: > Benj = Benjamin > Chas = Charles > Geo = George > Jas = James > > There are many abbreviations that still mystify me. Maybe we can all send our > unknown abbreviations and we can compile a comprehensive list of abbreviations > from the responses. > > Here are some of my unknowns > > Pwm > Sycolia (town? where?) > Wheatld (possibly Wheatland but can't find in Md., Va. or W.Va.) > > The mystery previously mentioned about "$10M 1850" is solved. The reference is to > the value of the property listed in the 1850 census and it is in thousands not > millions. In my Tavenner pages is listed the following: > > ADAMS > 61. Francis TA (1816 ) son to 82: m 1850 Martha L Rosseau ) dau to > ... $5M 1850 on LitRv MH > > Found in the 1850 census is: > > 25 965 965 Adams Francis 34 M . Farmer 5,000 Virginia . . . . . > 26 965 965 Oden Mary 79 F . . . Jersey . . . . . > 27 965 965 Adams Martha 26 F . . . Virginia . . . . . > > Obviously it is the same person as the dates of birth for him and his wife match. > The real estate value is 5,000 which Tavenner probably wrote as $5M. The Roman > numeral for 1000 is "M" and this is probably what he used. > > Hope this helps! > > Denny Shirer - drdx@neo.rr.com - North Canton, OH > Shirer Family Genealogy - http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mysong > Muskingum County, OHGenWeb - http://www.rootsweb.com/~ohmuskin/ > > > > ==== VALOUDOU Mailing List ==== > Join the Rootsweb Genealogical Data Cooperative. > Rootsweb members & sponsors are who make this list possible. > http://www.rootsweb.com > >

John: Your observations have caused me to look at $10M 1850 from a different angle. I looked at the Tavenner notes on all 328 James and discovered that some had a similar remark and other had a remark $6000 1850 so it appears that I have fallen victim to Blair's shorthand again. Thanks for the help. Gerald James Dallas, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Freed" <fleance@nyc.rr.com> To: <VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 9:23 AM Subject: [VALOUDOU-L] Chas Blr Tavnr abbr > >$10M 1850 > > My experience is that Tavenner recorded some of the county's larger > landholders' property value, as listed in the US Census. I have seen > listings from 1850 and 1860; don't know if there are other years as well. > Read "M" as the roman numeral for 1000, not million. I interpret "$10M1850" > as: "The value of Real Estate Owned from the 1850 Census shows $10,000." > > > > John Freed > fleance@nyc.rr.com > > > ==== VALOUDOU Mailing List ==== > Join the Rootsweb Genealogical Data Cooperative. > Rootsweb members & sponsors are who make this list possible. > http://www.rootsweb.com > >

Susan: The lady Tavenner was referring to was Elizabeth James who was the daughter of Clarence B. James (1884-1967) so it appears that it is out of the time frame for Ashburn as you suggest. Thanks. Gerald James Dallas, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: <SUZYBC@aol.com> To: <VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 5:47 AM Subject: Re: [VALOUDOU-L] Solving Puzzles > Gerald and Marty > > I agree with most of Marty's transcriptions however depending on the time > frame the Ash abbreviation may stand for Ashby district in Fauquier County. > In the mid 1800's Ashburn was still known as Farmwell. . The Leesb. is > obviously Leesburg could the "fun refer to funeral? > > Susan > > > ==== VALOUDOU Mailing List ==== > Join the Rootsweb Genealogical Data Cooperative. > Rootsweb members & sponsors are who make this list possible. > http://www.rootsweb.com > >

Yes, I, too, have appreciated the abbrevs. I found that the folks at the Balch Library are extremely helpful if you are searching there. Mr. Tavenner is a hero for all of the work he did, but some of are lucky he didn't know shorthand. ~(:o>) Aye, Bob McArtor ----- Original Message ----- From: "Susan Bellinger" <bellinger@visionet.org> To: <VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, May 30, 2002 11:50 AM Subject: [VALOUDOU-L] Hillsboro > Hi, > Regarding the Tavenner collection discussion, I've really appreciated the helpful hints and info. Just a note that there is also a Hillsboro in northern Loudoun Co., I believe. > Susan B. > > > ==== VALOUDOU Mailing List ==== > Join the Rootsweb Genealogical Data Cooperative. > Rootsweb members & sponsors are who make this list possible. > http://www.rootsweb.com > >

Hi, Regarding the Tavenner collection discussion, I've really appreciated the helpful hints and info. Just a note that there is also a Hillsboro in northern Loudoun Co., I believe. Susan B.

When I sent for info from the Tavenner Collection it came with a sheet explaining some of the common abbreviations. I didn't see all of them mentioned in this thread so will include what they are. Fq = Fauquier Co. Fx = Fairfax Co. Lv = Lovettsville Wtfd = Waterford cf = same as (doesn't make sense but will bow to their wisdom) dau = daughter fl = found living inv = inventory w = will Others that I have found. Some are very obvious so don't shoot the messenger Ala = Alabama Alex = Alexandria CSA = Confederate States Army Calif = California Capt - Captain Chlvl = Charlottesville Ck = Creek (as in Goose Ck) DC = District of COlumbia Hillsb = Hillsboro Md. Ky = Kentucky Lc = Loudoun county Leesb = Leesburg Lit Rv = Little River Lt = Lieutenant Mass = Massachusetts Md = Maryland Mdbg = Middleburg Midlbg = Middleburg Miss. = Mississippi Mt Gild = Mount Gilead NC = North Carolina Pa = Pennsylvania Pcvl = Purcellville Penn = Pennsylvania Psh = Parish Rev = Reverand Rg = Ridge (as in Blue Rg) S = South ( as in S Va. Exception is in following or preceding a name where it indicates an initial) ShelPsh = Shelby Parish USN = United States Navy Upvl = Upperville Va = Virginia Wa = Washington adj = adjacent ch = church cls = close to cprl = Corporal dischg = discharge foot or ft = foot hills (as in foot Blue Rg) lv = lived or lived in (Don't confuse with Lv) m = married p.m. = Post Master thbl = tithable to = moved to unm = unmarried vc = very close (as in "lv vc Arcola") wit = witness wva = West Virginia yr = years (as in lv Alex 50 yr) There are many many more. I took these from the pages I have for my surnames. Often references are made to numbers as in "son to 110" or "m 130" which shows the relation to the person listed in the line marked with the reference number. When a reference is made to a name and initial, it is in reference to someone with the last name as the section it is found in. For instance in the section on Adams is found "dau to Humphrey S" Here the S does not mean "south" but Humphrey S. Adams. Some name abbreviations are very obvious as in the following but still worth noting: Benj = Benjamin Chas = Charles Geo = George Jas = James There are many abbreviations that still mystify me. Maybe we can all send our unknown abbreviations and we can compile a comprehensive list of abbreviations from the responses. Here are some of my unknowns Pwm Sycolia (town? where?) Wheatld (possibly Wheatland but can't find in Md., Va. or W.Va.) The mystery previously mentioned about "$10M 1850" is solved. The reference is to the value of the property listed in the 1850 census and it is in thousands not millions. In my Tavenner pages is listed the following: ADAMS 61. Francis TA (1816 ) son to 82: m 1850 Martha L Rosseau (1824 ) dau to ... $5M 1850 on LitRv MH Found in the 1850 census is: 25 965 965 Adams Francis 34 M . Farmer 5,000 Virginia . . . . . 26 965 965 Oden Mary 79 F . . . Jersey . . . . . 27 965 965 Adams Martha 26 F . . . Virginia . . . . . Obviously it is the same person as the dates of birth for him and his wife match. The real estate value is 5,000 which Tavenner probably wrote as $5M. The Roman numeral for 1000 is "M" and this is probably what he used. Hope this helps! Denny Shirer - drdx@neo.rr.com - North Canton, OH Shirer Family Genealogy - http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~mysong Muskingum County, OHGenWeb - http://www.rootsweb.com/~ohmuskin/

Clare: CHARLES BLAIR TAVENNER COLLECTION FAMILY RECORDS Introduction by Charles Blair Tavenner This catalog of individuals who lived in Loudoun County, Virginia is intended to facilitate genealogical and historic investigations. It is the product of over 40 years of intermittent research, yet it is by no means complete. More than 75,000 individuals are listed. The guiding principle has been to list all known white adults who lived in the county at some time before 1900. There are many exceptions, however, to this Standard. It would exclude persons born after 1900, also those born before 1900 who died before becoming 21 years old, yet many in each category are included, either for convenience or because of uncertainty as to dates of birth or death. Too, a smaller number of individuals who never lived in Loudoun are listed, chiefly because of their association with Loudoun people or, occasionally, ownership of Loudoun land. Gerald James Notes on Tavenner from many sources: Mr. Tavenner was a Loudoun County historian and genealogist. He spent years in the Loudoun County Courthouse and while he was researching, he started to see the same names frequently mentioned. He then started to compile an organized composite of family relationships. The collection consists of notebooks where he has written information about most Loudoun families. The data was taken from deeds, wills, and marriages as well as word of mouth. I looked at this collection at the University of VA and they are truly a work of art. The notebook pages are very small, about 3" x 6" as I recall. It is interesting to see that his notes were written in several different colors of ink with some pencil notations which accounts for them being hard to copy. He had very small handwriting and used many abbreviations, which are often hard to interpret. Some of the pages are faint because the originals were on onion skin paper. Also, nearly all of the "T" family data is missing, including all the Tavenner material. His wife left his original notebooks to the University of Virginia in Charlottesville, VA (not to the Library of VA in Richmond.) However, the Thomas Balch Library, Leesburg, VA has a copy of them but it is very light and at times hard to read. I do know that if you write to the Library and request a SURNAME search of Tavenner's papers, they will send you what they have. They are in alphabetical order and have only a page or two for each surname. It gives dates and relationships as they relate to that family name, and found in the court documents of Loudoun County Courthouse records. The library has copied pages for people but only if it is a name with two or three pages. The more common Loudoun surnames such as Nichols or James can run to twenty pages and they cannot copy those for patrons. I understand that volunteers do this copy work and a small donation to the Library might be in order. Gerald James Dallas, TX ----- Original Message ----- From: <Tiafind@aol.com> To: <VALOUDOU-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 29, 2002 8:34 PM Subject: [VALOUDOU-L] Re: VALOUDOU-D Digest V02 #141 > Would someone tell me what The Charles Blair Tavener Collection is and what > kinds of information it contains. Family names? Does it include the name > surname Clare?. thanks Clare > > > ==== VALOUDOU Mailing List ==== > Have you posted your Loudoun Co. surnames lately? > New members are joining our mailing list every day. > Be sure to periodically remind us of your Loudoun research interests. > >

In a message dated 5/26/2002 11:24:37 PM Central Daylight Time, Virga1234@aol.com writes: > You are welcome. I'll post any Turner info I find I Find. I should receive > > the film next week. > Virginia Hi Virginia, Hope you'll post the Turner information to the whole list. I am also researching Turners in Loudoun Co., VA in the 1700s and early 1800s. Thanks, Pam

>$10M 1850 My experience is that Tavenner recorded some of the county's larger landholders' property value, as listed in the US Census. I have seen listings from 1850 and 1860; don't know if there are other years as well. Read "M" as the roman numeral for 1000, not million. I interpret "$10M1850" as: "The value of Real Estate Owned from the 1850 Census shows $10,000." John Freed fleance@nyc.rr.com