Dear Rebecca, it's actually not a simplistic question at all! Especially considering the year 1796, which was around a time period of great upheavals here in Europe. First, let me say that my expertise is in the area/time period of the Netherlands from the French era (1795-1813) to the present day, but I have several German ancestors from several different time periods, so I know a bit about Germany as well. You say that you man indentifies himself as both from Germany and Holland, and born in 1796. Now, I don't know exactly what he said and how he said it in the records - and I would really need that exact information to be of more help. Did he identify himself from Germany in one record and from Holland in another? Did he say Holland or the Netherlands? These details make a huge difference. Let's start with the Netherlands. Holland is actually a part of the Netherlands, and encompasses North-Holland and South-Holland, two sea-side provinces. It's also the part of the Netherlands where many people from all over Europe boarded ships to go to the US, including the Pilgrims on the Mayflower. In 1796 the entire Netherlands was occupied and ruled by the French, who'd invaded in 1795. Another thing to keep in mind is that the Netherlands has always been very attractive to German immigrants - almost all Dutch people have some German ancestors because there were many times in history when Germans came to the Netherlands. Germany, in that time period, was a bit like a patch-work of little kingdoms, and duke-doms and other "independent states" so to speak, but they were all united in what is called in German Heiliges Römisches Reich, or the Holy Roman Empire So one possibility is that your manwas born in Germany and lived in the Netherlands (or Holland specifically) before going to the US. Another possibility is that he was born in the Netherlands but that his parents (or one of them) came from Germany. If I had a last name, I would have a better idea of that, because there's surprisingly little overlap between German and Dutch last names. Also, between 1600 and 1900 there were a lot of German seasonal workers, mostly from the German province Westfalen, who worked in the Netherlands for part of the year and then returned to Germany, only to repeat this pattern the next year. They were mostly small time farmers who couldn't make enough in Germany to support their family, so in the harvest season they came to the Netherlands and did all kinds of work here. However, this migration was slowly drying up at the end of the 18th century because the economical situation in the Netherlands at that time was not so good. It's therefore unlikely that your man, since he was born in 1796, was one of these migration workers, but it's entirely possible his father/parents were. Another thing to keep in mind is that in the 17th and 18th century, a quarter to half of the people working for the Dutch VOC (which were sailors, soldiers, and other workmen) came from outside the Netherlands, and part of them came from Germany. It's entirely possible that your man's father worked for the VOC in the Netherlands but was German by birth. With both this scenario and the one about the migration workers, it could be that your man had a German father and a Dutch mother (or vice versa, but that's less likely). Such a dual family might have been why he considered himself from both Germany and Holland. Also, he could've been born in the Netherland but be considered a German citizen, because in those days the father's nationailty determined the nationailty of the child, not the birth place as is now the case. And then there's the border area between the Netherlands and Germany. In the time period your man was born, the Napoleantic wars were being fought to gain control of Germany, while the Netherlands were already under French rule. He might've been born in this border area, where boundaries would have changed several times during the 1789-1815 period. He might've been born in one country, and then grown up in the other country, without ever moving! But like I said, these are just some of the scenarios I can see from what little information you gave. Not a simple question at all, many options to consider. Important questions to aks yourself, and details to help narrow down the possibilities are: Did he mention both Germany and Holland in the same document, or did he change his answer between documents? Did he say Holland or the Netherlands? Do you know where he was born? Do you know anything about his parents? What is his last name? Do you know when and where he left for the US? I hope this helps! You can always contact me to discuss this more. It's an interesing question. Joyce Mulder > > Message: 2 > Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2012 19:59:21 -0500 > From: Rebecca Koford <rwk.genealogy@gmail.com> > Subject: [TGF] Overseas Help > To: transitional-genealogists-forum@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: > <CAFN-1M5Q371XZqaXmw-4gS2myv_maN4_4mDqkiuMi0cZ4ps0Ag@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Dear TGF, > > I never work overseas, but I am working with research on a man who lived in > Baltimore that identified himself as both from Germany and Holland. I > imagine it sounds simplistic to many of you, and I know that the countries > border each other, but can anyone recommend a book or website that > describes how a person could be from both when born in 1796. I know about > the temporary French take-over in about 1811, but I want to make a short > explanation to the client. > > Thanks, > > Rebecca Whitman Koford >