Dear Sheri you said, "As you may know I volunteered to help an elderly gentleman attempt to determine who Big John's father was. This gentleman kindly provided me with all his information by snail mail, and all of it is old information. I know new discoveries and corrections occurred because I" I can understand your desire to return to your own research. The Mayes family is awfully confusing even if one is descended from this family. However, I have about completed a family group sheets at least of bith dates (circa dates from the census <grin>) and marriages. I have do not have any death information as of yet (escept for poor John Joice (Joyce). Did your material from the gentleman you are trying to help have ANY information about when or where Nancy and Big John's children died. Pheby Hodge, of course, died before 1850 and Edward Hodge is listed on the census with his second wife Orlena. I can figure out about when Phebe died, but not when she was born. However, when I have this family group completed I shall hope to have a slot to fit Phebe into. Gail

Dear fellow researchers, In case you are wondering I am still working on "Big" John and Nancy Mayes Mayes's family. It occured to me that there was something odd about the final settlement of Big John's estate. See settlement documents transcribed by Larry Hodge at Selena's website: http://uneedspeed.net/~sdulac/ESTMayesJohn1852.htm and http://uneedspeed.net/~sdulac/ESTMayesJohn1850.htm or at GenForum http://genforum.genealogy.com/mayes/ msg #1143 msg #1137 etc. (Something has been niggling at my mind every since we were discussing the odd wording on the Edward Mayes heirs document. (BTW to all who are interested in Edward my filmstrip IS in at the FHC in St. Joe, BUT it came in the day after the last time I was able to get to St. Joe. :( hopefully I will be able to get a photocopy of this land record sometime soo.) It struck me that John Joyce was most likely dead by the time Big John's estate was settled. Note the "by receipt of Nancy Joice" etc. John should have been a cosignatory.. The Trigg County census shows a Nancy Joyce as head of household. James Joyce is still living in 1850 and listed with HIS Nancy so I thought the other Nancy Joyce was most likely the Nancy I was seeking. Somewhere along the way I did check the index for all other Joyces. <grin> and found the information I was looking for. Although there are no online images the ancestry index apparently includes the mortality index. John Joyce aged 30 born North Carolina died in January cause of death "fits". More later..although I do not know if anyone, but Sheri is interested in this stuff. Eleanor I hope you don't mind a nosy question. How do you descend from the Mayeses?? Perhaps I can be of some help in your research. <grin> apologies to the rest of you if you are not interested in Nancy and Big John, but I thought somebody might be curious about my queries into Joice (Joyce) marriages. Gail

Gail, I am interested in what you find on Edward Mayes's estate records...that Larry Hodges transcribed part of to the Mayes Genforum, if you see anything on that...please post....Thanks, Shar ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gail Roorda" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 2:42 PM Subject: [TNGRAING-L] Jon Joyce/Nancy Mayes > Dear fellow researchers, > > In case you are wondering I am still working on "Big" John and Nancy Mayes > Mayes's family. It occured to me that there was something odd about the > final settlement of Big John's estate. > > See settlement documents transcribed by Larry Hodge at Selena's website: > > http://uneedspeed.net/~sdulac/ESTMayesJohn1852.htm > > and > > http://uneedspeed.net/~sdulac/ESTMayesJohn1850.htm > > or at GenForum > > http://genforum.genealogy.com/mayes/ > > msg #1143 > > msg #1137 > > etc. > > (Something has been niggling at my mind every since we were discussing the > odd wording on the Edward Mayes heirs document. (BTW to all who are > interested in Edward my filmstrip IS in at the FHC in St. Joe, BUT it came > in the day after the last time I was able to get to St. Joe. > :( hopefully I will be able to get a photocopy of this land record sometime > soo.) > > It struck me that John Joyce was most likely dead by the time Big John's > estate was settled. Note the "by receipt of Nancy Joice" etc. John should > have been a cosignatory.. The Trigg County census shows a Nancy Joyce as > head of household. James Joyce is still living in 1850 and listed with HIS > Nancy so I thought the other Nancy Joyce was most likely the Nancy I was > seeking. Somewhere along the way I did check the index for all other > Joyces. <grin> and found the information I was looking for. Although there > are no online images the ancestry index apparently includes the mortality > index. > > John Joyce aged 30 born North Carolina died in January cause of death > "fits". > > More later..although I do not know if anyone, but Sheri is interested in > this stuff. > > Eleanor I hope you don't mind a nosy question. How do you descend from the > Mayeses?? Perhaps I can be of some help in your research. > > <grin> apologies to the rest of you if you are not interested in Nancy and > Big John, but I thought somebody might be curious about my queries into > Joice (Joyce) marriages. > > > > Gail > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] > >

Gail: I do have some information at home. I will look it up and will post it to this list. I do not have all I would like on John and Nancy's children but I do have dates and maybe a few other details on John and Jane May Mayes children. This is the line (Frederick) that my gentleman descends from. He also has a cousin who possibly descends from another of that same family. Sheri Gail Roorda <[email protected]> wrote:Dear Sheri you said, "As you may know I volunteered to help an elderly gentleman attempt to determine who Big John's father was. This gentleman kindly provided me with all his information by snail mail, and all of it is old information. I know new discoveries and corrections occurred because I" I can understand your desire to return to your own research. The Mayes family is awfully confusing even if one is descended from this family. However, I have about completed a family group sheets at least of bith dates (circa dates from the census ) and marriages. I have do not have any death information as of yet (escept for poor John Joice (Joyce). Did your material from the gentleman you are trying to help have ANY information about when or where Nancy and Big John's children died. Pheby Hodge, of course, died before 1850 and Edward Hodge is listed on the census with his second wife Orlena. I can figure out about when Phebe died, but not when she was born. However, when I have this family group completed I shall hope to have a slot to fit Phebe into. Gail ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more

Gail: Thank you for posting the Big John and etc update. Yes, I am still very interested in the Big John saga. If others are not, please feel free to contact me privately. I have been reading up on collateral families to see if perhaps there would be a clue there. I have neglected to try to locate John in the 1800 census records. I probably should do that next. Regarding Eleanor, she is (lucky, lucky girl) in and around Peru (the country) at this time. She is also going to Machu Picu. Her lines are not specifically Mayes, but Solomons. She and I had corresponded on this prior to her trip. I have sent her a couple of emails on her Solomon and Bibbins lines that she won't get until she returns, a little more than a week from now. If memory serves me right, Franky Solomon married Elijah Bibbins. It would be that line of Solomons she seeks. Later, Sheri Gail Roorda <[email protected]> wrote:Dear fellow researchers, In case you are wondering I am still working on "Big" John and Nancy Mayes Mayes's family. It occured to me that there was something odd about the final settlement of Big John's estate. See settlement documents transcribed by Larry Hodge at Selena's website: http://uneedspeed.net/~sdulac/ESTMayesJohn1852.htm and http://uneedspeed.net/~sdulac/ESTMayesJohn1850.htm or at GenForum http://genforum.genealogy.com/mayes/ msg #1143 msg #1137 etc. (Something has been niggling at my mind every since we were discussing the odd wording on the Edward Mayes heirs document. (BTW to all who are interested in Edward my filmstrip IS in at the FHC in St. Joe, BUT it came in the day after the last time I was able to get to St. Joe. :( hopefully I will be able to get a photocopy of this land record sometime soo.) It struck me that John Joyce was most likely dead by the time Big John's estate was settled. Note the "by receipt of Nancy Joice" etc. John should have been a cosignatory.. The Trigg County census shows a Nancy Joyce as head of household. James Joyce is still living in 1850 and listed with HIS Nancy so I thought the other Nancy Joyce was most likely the Nancy I was seeking. Somewhere along the way I did check the index for all other Joyces. and found the information I was looking for. Although there are no online images the ancestry index apparently includes the mortality index. John Joyce aged 30 born North Carolina died in January cause of death "fits". More later..although I do not know if anyone, but Sheri is interested in this stuff. Eleanor I hope you don't mind a nosy question. How do you descend from the Mayeses?? Perhaps I can be of some help in your research. apologies to the rest of you if you are not interested in Nancy and Big John, but I thought somebody might be curious about my queries into Joice (Joyce) marriages. Gail ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more

Dear all, <Really red faced> The last msg should have read I had the information for the marriage of Nancy Mayes to JOHN Joice (Joyce) Gail

Gail, I guess you already have what you need then? the only Marriages I find in that time frame are for JOICE, Thomas to COLSON, Elizabeth 1-2-1829 JOICE, Wortham to DANIEL, Dinah 12-22-1829 just in case anyone needs them.....this only means those are the only two"Originals" remaining in the Court House...not that there weren't more Joyce Marriages ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gail Roorda" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2003 8:32 AM Subject: Re: [TNGRAING-L] Joyce marriage > Dear Sarah and Shar, > > Shar, the time frame was looking for was 1820-1830 looking for (and I should > have posted this information to the list <smile>). > > Sarah, thank you. This is the marriage information I am looking for. I > knew as soon as I hit the send button I should have said Joyce or Joice. (I > did have the information for Nancy Mayes to James Joice.) > > Gail > > > > There is a James Joice to Nancy Morse, July 19, 1826, Dudley Belton, BM > > Also, John Joice to Nancy Mayes, Dec 27, 1836 > > Thomas Joice BM > > These are from "Marriages of Grainger County, Tennessee 1796-1837", > Whitley. > >

Dear Sarah and Shar, Shar, the time frame was looking for was 1820-1830 looking for (and I should have posted this information to the list <smile>). Sarah, thank you. This is the marriage information I am looking for. I knew as soon as I hit the send button I should have said Joyce or Joice. (I did have the information for Nancy Mayes to James Joice.) Gail > There is a James Joice to Nancy Morse, July 19, 1826, Dudley Belton, BM > Also, John Joice to Nancy Mayes, Dec 27, 1836 > Thomas Joice BM > These are from "Marriages of Grainger County, Tennessee 1796-1837", Whitley. > > -

There is a James Joice to Nancy Morse, July 19, 1826, Dudley Belton, BM Also, John Joice to Nancy Mayes, Dec 27, 1836 Thomas Joice BM These are from "Marriages of Grainger County, Tennessee 1796-1837", Whitley ----- Original Message ----- From: "R&T_Cooke" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, April 07, 2003 4:28 PM Subject: Re: [TNGRAING-L] Joyce marriage > I show a > James Joyce (20)-Retha Morgan for Feb.15,1921 (bond date) not issued > John Joyce - Nancy J.Morgan for Dec.21,1863 (bond date) Samuel Collinson,JP > John Joyce - Nancy J.Morgan for Dec.20,1863 (bond date) bond only > there was a > John H.Joyce - Mary Jarnigan for Dec.21,1871 (bond date) H.C.Helton,JP > > Tina Lephew Cooke > Union Co.TN > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gail Roorda" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, April 07, 2003 3:23 PM > Subject: [TNGRAING-L] Joyce marriage > > > > Dear fellow Grainger County researchers, > > > > Could someone please please help me with a lookup. I am searching for a > > marriage between James Joyce and Nancy ? in Grainger County. > > > > Gail > > > > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] > > > > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] > >

I show a James Joyce (20)-Retha Morgan for Feb.15,1921 (bond date) not issued John Joyce - Nancy J.Morgan for Dec.21,1863 (bond date) Samuel Collinson,JP John Joyce - Nancy J.Morgan for Dec.20,1863 (bond date) bond only there was a John H.Joyce - Mary Jarnigan for Dec.21,1871 (bond date) H.C.Helton,JP Tina Lephew Cooke Union Co.TN ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gail Roorda" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, April 07, 2003 3:23 PM Subject: [TNGRAING-L] Joyce marriage > Dear fellow Grainger County researchers, > > Could someone please please help me with a lookup. I am searching for a > marriage between James Joyce and Nancy ? in Grainger County. > > Gail > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] >

what time frame ???? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gail Roorda" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, April 07, 2003 2:23 PM Subject: [TNGRAING-L] Joyce marriage > Dear fellow Grainger County researchers, > > Could someone please please help me with a lookup. I am searching for a > marriage between James Joyce and Nancy ? in Grainger County. > > Gail > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] > >

Dear list members, Please excuse me if this letter appeared on the list. I don't find it in my Grainger list folder. I have no idea where it went <grin> for I never got it back > Dear Sheri, > > You said: > > "It appears that Nancy, Sherrod's daughter, was born in VA in All siblings > born prior to Nancy were born in VA, and the siblings born after Nancy were > born in TN." > > Not necesarily. Some researchers list my third great grandmother Jane Mayes > Ivy's birthplace as Virginia. The 1850 census says she was born Virginia. > The 1860 census has the irritating feature of only listing the birthplace of > the HOH which I am sure most of you already know. <grin> I actually once > sent Selena DuLac a long and (and perhaps boring <grin>) exposition on the > fact that later census information (both for her and her surviving children > on the 1870 Grianger County census and for the children on the 1880 Hamblen > county census) list Tennessee as Jane's birthplace. > > However, in once again plowing through the 1900 census about a year ago I > noticed that Manson Ivy's census entry listed his mother's birthplace as > Virginia. William Manson Ivy lived long enough to have a Tennessee death > certificate. I probably should order a copy of this document OTOH I > seriously doubt that the information given by some "informant" about the > birthplace of the deceased's mother 125 years after she was born could be > regarded as definitive. <smile> > > William Manson Ivy's entry in the Weifaring index BTW says that Benjamin Ivy > was born in Virginia and Jenny Mayes was born in Tennessee. (Benjamin Ivy > was born in North Carolina so I could say that perhaps the entry was in > error. However, after some experiences in which I thought the Weifaring > index might be wrong and hoping to find better information on the actual > death certificate and then discovering the actual certificate did list the > same information as Weifaring's I wouldn't make a bet on this. <smile>) > > The earliest information listing Sherrod Mayes in East Tennessee dates from > about 1795 so I don't think one can say for a certainty where Jenny Ivy was > born. > > The older children including Nancy are believed to have been born in Henry > County, Virginia since that was where Sherrod and Elizabeth were living at > the time. Priscilla "Ciller" and Jonathon's birthplaces are usually listed > as Tennessee (Sherrod is definitely known to have been in East Tennessee at > the time when Priscilla would have been born.) > > Anyway my own records presently indicate that I am not sure where Jane Mayes > Ivy is born. > > Gail > > > > > > > > > > Information I have states that John and Nancy married in 1805. This would > have made Nancy about 17 years old and John 31 years old. John seems to > have been married before since his son William looks to have been born in > the 1801 area. There may have been other children, but I don't know yet. > > > > It would appear that Sherrod's family came to TN from VA after 1788 but > before 1792 and most likely a young daughter would stay with the family, not > remain in VA. Does anyone know where the marriage between John and Nancy > may have occured? Also would anyone know where any of the children born by > John and Nancy would have been born? I know most ended up in Grainger Co., > TN to marry and die. > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sheri P. Kelly [email protected] ' Genealogy is Perpetual' > > > > VA, NC, TN, & KY: COFFEY-COLLINS-GREEN-HICKS-JONES-JORDAN-PERRY-RUSSELL. > > > > SC & AL: McCOOL-MILLS-McCOOL-SEGREST-THRASHER-WOOD > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more > > > > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] > > >

Dear fellow Grainger County researchers, Could someone please please help me with a lookup. I am searching for a marriage between James Joyce and Nancy ? in Grainger County. Gail

Thanks, Gail - I do appreciate the response! Eleanor -----Original Message----- From: Gail Roorda [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 7:40 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [TNGRAING-L] Mayes of Virginia Henry County, Eleanor. Gail ----- Original Message ----- From: ELEANOR McCAIN <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 10:19 Subject: [TNGRAING-L] Mayes of Virginia > Does anyone have a Virginia county name where Sherrod Mayes and others > of the family name are found before moving to TN? > > Would appreciate any help along this line. Perhaps I have missed it, > not thinking it might apply to me! > > Thanks > > Eleanor > > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected]

Greeting List from Warm SW Oklahoma!!! I am looking for a probate record that might be of Thomas Davis with wife Sarah, as listed on the 1860 census, or can someone shed some light on what happened to this Thomas and Sarah. It appears that the family was skipped on the 1870 census. 1860 census, Grainger County TN, Thomas Davis, 40, farm labor, TN Sarah, 42 Mary, 18 Nancy E., 17 James, 16 William C., 15, Anderson, 11 Joseph, 8 Calvin, 6 Marion, 3 Thomas J, 6/12 This same family is listed on the 1850 census: 1850 Grainger County, TN, 6th district, pg 45 Thomas Davis, 26, farmer, born in TN Sally, 26 Elizabeth, 6 James, 5 Mary, 4 Wm., 3 Anderson, 1 Any assistance is greatly appreciated.....remember our troops..... Bill in SW Oklahoma

Hello out there, I was wondering if anyone would have any idea who this family was. 1930 Grainger Thomas H.Lefhew 73 (which we know as Leffew) Susan 74 Robert Clevinger 43-son in law Cora E. 36 -daughter Hugh J.18-grandson Anna L. 16-granddaughter This Lefhew wasn't in the 1920 census or at least I never saw it. I wonder if someone may know this family. Tina Lephew Cooke Union Co.TN

Dear Sheri, "Does anyone know where the marriage between John and Nancy may have occured? Also would anyone know where any of the children born by John and Nancy would have been born? I know most ended up in Grainger Co., TN to marry and die." John and Nancy were NOT married in Virginia. The bond for John and Nancy's marriage is dated 11 January 1805 in Grainger County, Tennessee. It is a "no return" so the exact date they were married can not be known, but usually marriages took place the same day the bond was dated or within the next few days (sometimes a longer period of time elapsed). However, other records confirm this marriage did take place. It is likely that all of John and Nancy's children and all of John and Jane's children were born in Grainger County since that was where "Big" John lived at the time. My records usually indicate these presumed places of birth. One always realizes that an individual child could because of circumstances unknown to the researcher be born someplace else, but with the abscence of birth certificates etc. one does the best one can. Some of the lists I am on are full of "serious" genealogists who are very, very picky They place no reliance on census information except that it indicates the "location" of the parents at the time the census was taken etc., etc. Now I am a SERIOUS genealogist, but I realize that with the paucity of records on some of our East Tennessee families one can only do the best one can New England researchers have town vital records dating back to the earliest days, etc etc. Those of us who have ancestors who belonged to dissenting congregations and were often unable to read or write cannot always be that precise! I try to be extremely sure of my "links"(I would rather be permanently stalled on a great great grandparent than identify someone as an ancestor on scanty eveidence), and narrow birth dates, birth places, marriages and deaths down as closely as I can and sometimes all I can come up with is a "circa" date or an assumed place of birth. Elizabeth Shown Mills once remarked on my TMG list (won't go into why she was participating on the list), "searching a southern genealogy is NOT that easy.!" Excuse the tirade all! <grin>. Sheri, I ASSUME all of Big John's children were born in Grainger County, Tennessee. Gail > > Thanks, >

Gail, I do appreciate your information. I had felt that the Nancy and John children were born in TN but was hoping someone on this list would have information to confirm my speculations. I was basicly trying to determine if perhaps John had married prior to arriving in TN. You are correct in it is hard to tell when actual birth dates, even years are. There was the birth of the State of Franklin, then TN, the changing of several boundary lines, the known fact that many enumerators got their information from other family members or neighbors rather than the actual person, so many variables. I know that many names both Christian and surname were written as pronounced, and that became written in stone as time passed. As you may know I volunteered to help an elderly gentleman attempt to determine who Big John's father was. This gentleman kindly provided me with all his information by snail mail, and all of it is old information. I know new discoveries and corrections occurred because I have tripped and stumbled my way through much of his work. I took his work and began stripping it apart, questioning the list when I found inconsistencies which raised red flags. Much of his information came from Selena but I see where she has corrected a major amount of data since his original queries in 2001. I want to wrap up the basic research task and get back to my own work. I appreciate all who have volunteered and answered my many questions. I am not new to research, merely to the Mayes lines. I am sure I will be asking a few more before I ship all my results and printouts to him. Sheri Gail Roorda <[email protected]> wrote: Dear Sheri, "Does anyone know where the marriage between John and Nancy may have occurred? Also would anyone know where any of the children born by John and Nancy would have been born? I know most ended up in Grainger Co., TN to marry and die." John and Nancy were NOT married in Virginia. The bond for John and Nancy's marriage is dated 11 January 1805 in Grainger County, Tennessee. It is a "no return" so the exact date they were married can not be known, but usually marriages took place the same day the bond was dated or within the next few days (sometimes a longer period of time elapsed). However, other records confirm this marriage did take place. It is likely that all of John and Nancy's children and all of John and Jane's children were born in Grainger County since that was where "Big" John lived at the time. My records usually indicate these presumed places of birth. One always realizes that an individual child could because of circumstances unknown to the researcher be born someplace else, but with the absence of birth certificates etc. one does the best one can. Some of the lists I am on are full of "serious" genealogists who are very, very picky They place no reliance on census information except that it indicates the "location" of the parents at the time the census was taken etc., etc. Now I am a SERIOUS genealogist, but I realize that with the paucity of records on some of our East Tennessee families one can only do the best one can New England researchers have town vital records dating back to the earliest days, etc etc. Those of us who have ancestors who belonged to dissenting congregations and were often unable to read or write cannot always be that precise! I try to be extremely sure of my "links"(I would rather be permanently stalled on a great great grandparent than identify someone as an ancestor on scanty evidence), and narrow birth dates, birth places, marriages and deaths down as closely as I can and sometimes all I can come up with is a "circa" date or an assumed place of birth. Elizabeth Shown Mills once remarked on my TMG list (won't go into why she was participating on the list), "searching a southern genealogy is NOT that easy.!" Excuse the tirade all! . Sheri, I ASSUME all of Big John's children were born in Grainger County, Tennessee. Gail > > Thanks, > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more

Hi Gail and Sheri & all, yes, you are right to be serious, there are way to many published "Genealogies" in Libraries and especially on the Web. that could confuse a fox hound with a good scent <Smile> on one of my other lists, someone has this motto as a tag line and its a VERY GOOD one too, it goes something like this: " Genealogy without Documentation is Mythology" Shar

Henry County, Eleanor. Gail ----- Original Message ----- From: ELEANOR McCAIN <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 10:19 Subject: [TNGRAING-L] Mayes of Virginia > Does anyone have a Virginia county name where Sherrod Mayes and others > of the family name are found before moving to TN? > > Would appreciate any help along this line. Perhaps I have missed it, > not thinking it might apply to me! > > Thanks > > Eleanor > > > > ==== TNGRAING Mailing List ==== > To UNSUBSCRIBE please send your message to [email protected] >