On 8/12/2018 2:48 PM, leoglue wrote: > Your articles are great.  I wish I discovered you earlier. Now I know why my exhibits don't print, they are PDF.  I will re-save in one of the formats you recommended. > Would second site put my data in a web based format? > Leo Glueckstein 920 698 1669Sent from my U.S.Cellular© Smartphone S9 Thanks, Leo. I'm not sure I understand your question about Second Site. Yes, it's purpose is to create a website from your TMG data. See my section on Second Site at https://tmg.reigelridge.com/SecondSite.htm for details. If your question is specifically about Exhibits, the answer is it depends on what kind of Exhibits you are talking about. Images are fine, so long as they are one of the file formats recognized by web browsers (jpg, gif, or png) . They may either be embedded in the page or linked. Text Exhibits can be included in your site, and the text can be copied into the page or linked. Other types of files (PDF, word processor, spreadsheet, audio, or video) can be linked but whether your reader will be able to display or play them depends on the capabilities installed on the reader's computer. Second Site does not convert them into a web-based format. Terry

At 8/12/2018 1:13 PM, Rowan Sylvester-Bradley wrote: >I have a couple of questions about the best way of using TMG: I suspect "best way" depends upon the needs of the user -- just wait for the next series debating "splitter" or "lumper" <G>. It may also depend upon whether one is only using SecondSite for reporting, or using, say, the book manager feature of TMG. >1. Does one include images as internal, or external? What are the pros >and cons of each? How does Second Site use these images? As I recall, SecondSite only accesses /external/ exhibits. The other reason to keep them external is that internals are always part of the regular TMG back-up and thereby result in LARGE back-up files, whereas it is optional for externals (which are probably better off being backed up as part of a computer-wide back-up system, not just TMG). >2. If you need to refer to a citation in several tags, e.g. for several >different people, how do you do this easily without duplicating data >entry? E.g for a census entry, it may give evidence for the birth of >several people, for their residence, for their occupation. You could >easily end up with 10 or 20 tags all referring to this one document. You > >don't want to have to enter the details of the document 20 times, and >certainly you don't want to enter its scan 20 times. The key word is "refer". The document is entered once as a source, and the citations all link to that source. The citation memo field should probably only mention the parts specific to that person/event (if that; it may be sufficient just to reference the source with a surety level to justify the event). >3. When citing an online source, what is the best way to do it? Does one > >include an image of the document, and/or a transcription? If the latter, > >where do you put the transcription? What is the source and the >repository in this case? Does the source need to mention the exact URL >of the web page, or just the web site, or just a generic "Web"? Is the >repository the web site you got this from (e.g. Ancestry or Findmypast), > >or the original source of the document (e.g. "Buckinghamshire Parish >Records 1575-1911", or "West Wycombe Marriage Register 1830"). > I'd probably have the detail URL somewhere -- but would prefer to have information on where /that/ information came from if it is cited; URLs change so often. Just checked -- I have a repository of "Family Tree Legends" <http://www.familytreelegends.com/> which now results in a redirect to <https://www.myheritage.com/> I haven't worked on cleaning up my data for some time, and have some poorly documented sources, I'm afraid (in particular, when I started I'd found a few on-line GEDCOMs that seemed to intersect my family and did a mass import -- all of which have just the GEDCOM name as a source/citation and the GEDCOMs didn't have much in the way of internal evidence). -- bieber.genealogy@earthlink.net Dennis Lee Bieber HTTP://home.earthlink.net/~bieber.genealogy/

At 8/12/2018 08:13, Rowan Sylvester-Bradley wrote >I have a couple of questions about the best way of using TMG: >1. Does one include images as internal, or external? What are the >pros and cons of each? How does Second Site use these images? I would suggest that all images should be attached as External Exhibits. And, make TMG Backups without External Exhibit, but do back up your External Exhibits separately, This reduces the size of your TMG Backup SQZ file. You will want External Exhibits for Second Site anyway. >2. If you need to refer to a citation in several tags, e.g. for >several different people, how do you do this easily without >duplicating data entry? E.g for a census entry, it may give evidence >for the birth of several people, for their residence, for their >occupation. You could easily end up with 10 or 20 tags all referring >to this one document. You don't want to have to enter the details of >the document 20 times, and certainly you don't want to enter its scan 20 times. When I enter a census record for a household, I enter the Head of Household as the Principal in the Tag and all others in the household as Witnesses. You can adjust the Sentences for the Principal and each Witness as desired and , if desired, Exclude the Senten ces for some or all. >3. When citing an online source, what is the best way to do it? Does >one include an image of the document, and/or a transcription? If the >latter, where do you put the transcription? What is the source and >the repository in this case? Does the source need to mention the >exact URL of the web page, or just the web site, or just a generic >"Web"? Is the repository the web site you got this from (e.g. >Ancestry or Findmypast), or the original source of the document >(e.g. "Buckinghamshire Parish Records 1575-1911", or "West Wycombe >Marriage Register 1830"). I never include images of documents. Most wind up being too large anyway if they are to be readable, I rarely include transcriptions although I may quote a short bit within the Tag Memo if the phraseology is interesting or otherwise worth including. For on-line Source Types, I would suggest that you Google "Tri-Valley TMG Users Group" and order (from lulu.com) their "Source Templates for The Master Genealogist". It has many more Source Types than are included within TMG including many on-line. Almost no Source Types forr on-line sources have Respository Source Elements. Instead they use Website Names and URL Source Elements. As forr the URL, it is always be to include the entire URL. However, in some cases, the URL is just too long. In these cases, I cut the URL back some. You have to use your own judgement while keeping in mind that you need to tell the reader as much as possible to point them to the source. Another place to find ionformation about on-line Source Types is to acquire a copy of Elizabeth Shown Mills' "Evidence Explained". It has a lot more information than the above book, but this is generic while the Tri-Valley book is aimed at TMG and shows how eacvh Source Type is created and used. Lee

> -----Original Message----- > From: Lee Hoffman [mailto:azchief@bellsouth.net] > Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2018 10:49 AM > To: The Master Genealogist Rootsweb Email List > Subject: [TMG] Re: Best Practice for Citations/Sources/Repositories > > At 8/12/2018 08:13, Rowan Sylvester-Bradley wrote > >I have a couple of questions about the best way of using TMG: > >1. Does one include images as internal, or external? What are the pros > >and cons of each? How does Second Site use these images? > <snip> > I never include images of documents. Most wind up being too large anyway if > they are to be readable, I rarely include transcriptions although I may quote a > short bit within the Tag Memo if the phraseology is interesting or otherwise > worth including. FYI, for Rowan's benefit or others reading this, and as already noted, there are various opinions on attaching Source documents as Exhibits. Lee notes above that he "never include ... wind up being too large anyway...". In contrast, I always do... attach Source exhibits, or do so many times, but obviously not for books or similar. They are not too large in my opinion if you resize them. For images found online, I attach a jpg copy, re-sized to around 220 - 300 dpi. I don't print the source images, but it is there anyways. In Second Site, I include a downsized copy in an alternate Exhibit folder, named the same and downsized to approx. 95 dpi and to a page size suitable that is related to the original image type. The downsized version reads very nicely in the SS website on a screen. Tom

On 8/12/2018 8:13 AM, Rowan Sylvester-Bradley wrote: > I have a couple of questions about the best way of using TMG: > 1. Does one include images as internal, or external? What are the pros and cons > of each? How does Second Site use these images? External is recommended and works for use in SS (Second Site). > 2. If you need to refer to a citation in several tags, e.g. for several different > people, how do you do this easily without duplicating data entry? E.g for a > census entry, it may give evidence for the birth of several people, for their > residence, for their occupation. You could easily end up with 10 or 20 tags all > referring to this one document. You don't want to have to enter the details of > the document 20 times, and certainly you don't want to enter its scan 20 times. A couple others already noted the Source doc is entered once, then the many birth, occupation, etc Event tags are created showing the info with citations to the source. Yes, with this method, the Source is cited many times using "repeat" keys others noted. I also include in each citation detail (as Terry noted) the specifics of what was found relating to that specific tag. So, e.g., for a Death tag, and for a death certificate, I may note, " showing date of death "Jan 8, 1920" and place, "E. Otterman & Wilson" and "Greensburg" and "Westmoreland County" ,,, because other death sources may or may not include place or dates, or differing detail, etc... so each "citation" to a source includes in the citation detail the unique info presented in that source document. > 3. When citing an online source, what is the best way to do it? Does one > include an image of the document, and/or a transcription? If the latter, where > do you put the transcription? What is the source and the repository in this > case? Does the source need to mention the exact URL of the web page, or just > the web site, or just a generic "Web"? Is the repository the web site you got this > from (e.g. Ancestry or Findmypast), or the original source of the document (e.g. > "Buckinghamshire Parish Records 1575-1911", or "West Wycombe Marriage > Register 1830"). As Terry noted, there are different approaches for use of Exhibits. I like to attach the image of the document with the Source as an Exhibit. I like this, because it is easy to find, go back to, review later on. I don't include the Source Exhibits in TMG printed reports. They show up nicely in Second Site. Consideration should be given to whether or not the images are copyrighted... so for instance, on an internet SS website, I don't include Source Exhibits. However, on a local SS website on my laptop for my own use, there is a "full" more complete version with all people and Source Exhibits included for my own use and reference. You asked about citing an online source. There are probably as many methods as there are users (or almost?). An example for a Full Footnote for a Census source in my database: "James M Reed household, 1880 U.S. Census, Allegheny County, Pennsylvania, population schedule, Allegheny, Enumeration District 007, p. 174A, dwelling 107, family 214, digital images, Ancestry.com (www.ancestry.com : 07 Oct 2012), from National Archives micropublication T9, roll 1086<, [CD]>." I generally refer to Elizabeth Shown Mills book, Evidence Explained for assistance, and in doing so, there is leeway in order of the material included and in the composition. In my case, I used no repository elements. The Full Footnote sentence: " [HOUSEHOLD] household, [TITLE], [COUNTY], [STATE]<, population schedule, [LOCATION]><, Enumeration District [ENUMERATION DISTRICT]>, p. [PAGE], dwelling [DWELLING], family [FAMILY], digital images, [ITAL:][PUBLISHER][:ITAL] ([PUBLISHER LOCATION] : [ACCESS DATE])<, from National Archives micropublication [FILM NUMBER]><, [CD]> ." Thus, in printed reports or on SS websites, the "CD" (citation detail) at the end looks to the citation in the event tag for text included there. Tom

For Source Types, Google "Tri-Valley TMG Users Group" and order (from lulu.com) their "Source Templates for The Master Genealogist". It has many more Source Types than are included within TMG including many on-line. Almost no Source Types for on-line sources have Repository Source Elements. Instead they use Website Names and URL Source Elements. As for the URL, it is always better to include the entire URL. However, in some cases, the URL is just too long. In these cases, consider cutting the URL back some. You have to use your own judgement while keeping in mind that you need to tell the reader as much as possible to point them to the source. The Tri-Valley TMG Users Group's Source Templates for The Master GenealogistT http://www.lulu.com/shop/tri-valley-tmg-users-group/source-templates-for-the -master-genealogisttm/paperback/product-22804992.html Livermore-Amador Genealogical Society, Livermore, California A guide for creating computerized genealogical source citation templates for The Master Genealogist(TM) software package. Each source type template includes the template structure for footnotes and bibliography, as well as citation examples of each. In addition, there are a number of extra tips, ideas and discussion points. These examples and pointers may serve as useful guides when creating source citations in other genealogy software applications. When you purchase the book you may obtain the complete templates by email to TVTMG.editors@L-AGS.org. TVTMG Cemetery Marker (online) 5.16 FULL FOOTNOTE: <[COMPILER], ><[ITAL:][REPOSITORY][:ITAL], >database and images (<[REPOSITORY ADDRESS] ><: accessed [CD3]>), <[CD1], ><[CD2], > <[CEMETERY], ><[CITY], ><[COUNTY], ><[STATE]><, photograph C [CD4]> <; [CM]>. Find a Grave, Inc., Find A Grave, database and images (http://www.findagrave.com/ : accessed 18 July 2011), Captain Denison Butler Baldwin (1832-1916) gravestone photograph, memorial no. 14354725, Maple Park Cemetery, Mercer County, West Virginia, photograph C Bridget Kelley-Dearing, 2006. SHORT FOOTNOTE: <[COMPILER], ><[ITAL:][REPOSITORY][:ITAL], ><[CD1], > <[SHORT LOCATION]><; [CM]>. Find a Grave, Inc., Find A Grave, Captain Denison Butler Baldwin (1832-1916) gravestone photograph, Mercer Co., W. Va.; grave is marked with a Confederate memorial cross. BIBLIOGRAPHY: <[COMPILER]. ><[ITAL:][REPOSITORY][:ITAL]. >Database and images. <[REPOSITORY ADDRESS]>< : [DATE]>. Find a Grave, Inc. Find A Grave. Database and images. http://www.findagrave.com/ : 2011. REMINDER: This template mimics EE QuickCheck Model 215, Online Images, p. 229, and online discussions in re: Find A Grave citations. - [CEMETERY] is the name of the cemetery. - [SHORT LOCATION] is the proper abbreviation of the cemetery's location; note that Mills does not include the cemetery's name in her template. Consider using only the city and state or county and state in this field. - [COMPILER] is the creator of the website. Note that this field obeys Surname, Given rule. - [DATE] is the year the information on this cemetery was posted or the year you accessed the material. - [STATE] is the state, spelled out. - [COUNTY] is omitted, if the city is well known. If it applies, the county should include "County", "Parish", etc.; e.g., Hamilton County or Orleans Parish. - [CITY] is the city. - [REPOSITORY] is the name of the website. - [REPOSITORY ADDRESS] is the main URL of the website. Patrick M. Lofft Genealogy Researcher and Lecturer -----Original Message----- From: Rowan Sylvester-Bradley [mailto:rowan@sylvesterbradley.org] Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2018 5:13 AM To: tmg@rootsweb.com Subject: [TMG] Best Practice for Citations/Sources/Repositories I have a couple of questions about the best way of using TMG: 1. Does one include images as internal, or external? What are the pros and cons of each? How does Second Site use these images? 2. If you need to refer to a citation in several tags, e.g. for several different people, how do you do this easily without duplicating data entry? E.g. for a census entry, it may give evidence for the birth of several people, for their residence, for their occupation. You could easily end up with 10 or 20 tags all referring to this one document. You don't want to have to enter the details of the document 20 times, and certainly you don't want to enter its scan 20 times. 3. When citing an online source, what is the best way to do it? Does one include an image of the document, and/or a transcription? If the latter, where do you put the transcription? What is the source and the repository in this case? Does the source need to mention the exact URL of the web page, or just the web site, or just a generic "Web"? Is the repository the web site you got this from (e.g. Ancestry or Findmypast), or the original source of the document (e.g. "Buckinghamshire Parish Records 1575-1911", or "West Wycombe Marriage Register 1830"). I hope someone can help me with best practice or recommendations in answer to these questions. Thanks - Rowan _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe and Archives https://mailinglists.rootsweb.com/listindexes/search/tmg Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 RootsWeb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Patrick- I thought I'd respond to your link to Lulu below. I was curious about it and since I'd used Lulu- long ago- I thought I'd give it a look. However, the site was not secure using your link. It was also not secure after opening the site by a search and then, not even when logging in (had my old log in info). Just thought I'd report back. Sydney Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email. ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ On Sunday, February 10, 2019 8:15 PM, Patrick M. Lofft <pmlofft@comcast.net> wrote: > For Source Types, Google "Tri-Valley TMG Users Group" and order (from > lulu.com) their "Source Templates for The Master Genealogist". It has many > more Source Types than are included within TMG including many on-line. > Almost no Source Types for on-line sources have Repository Source Elements. > Instead they use Website Names and URL Source Elements. As for the URL, it > is always better to include the entire URL. However, in some cases, the URL > is just too long. In these cases, consider cutting the URL back some. You > have to use your own judgement while keeping in mind that you need to tell > the reader as much as possible to point them to the source. > > The Tri-Valley TMG Users Group's Source Templates for The Master > GenealogistT > http://www.lulu.com/shop/tri-valley-tmg-users-group/source-templates-for-the > -master-genealogisttm/paperback/product-22804992.html > Livermore-Amador Genealogical Society, Livermore, California A guide for > creating computerized genealogical source citation templates for The Master > Genealogist(TM) software package. Each source type template includes the > template structure for footnotes and bibliography, as well as citation > examples of each. In addition, there are a number of extra tips, ideas and > discussion points. These examples and pointers may serve as useful guides > when creating source citations in other genealogy software applications. > When you purchase the book you may obtain the complete templates by email to > TVTMG.editors@L-AGS.org. > > TVTMG Cemetery Marker (online) 5.16 > FULL FOOTNOTE: > <[COMPILER], ><[ITAL:][REPOSITORY][:ITAL], >database and images > (<[REPOSITORY ADDRESS] ><: accessed [CD3]>), <[CD1], ><[CD2], > <[CEMETERY], > > > <[CITY], ><[COUNTY], ><[STATE]><, photograph C [CD4]> <; [CM]>. > > Find a Grave, Inc., Find A Grave, database and images > (http://www.findagrave.com/ : > accessed 18 July 2011), Captain Denison Butler Baldwin (1832-1916) > gravestone photograph, memorial no. 14354725, Maple Park Cemetery, Mercer > County, West Virginia, photograph C Bridget Kelley-Dearing, 2006. > SHORT FOOTNOTE: > <[COMPILER], ><[ITAL:][REPOSITORY][:ITAL], ><[CD1], > <[SHORT LOCATION]><; > [CM]>. > Find a Grave, Inc., Find A Grave, Captain Denison Butler Baldwin (1832-1916) > gravestone photograph, Mercer Co., W. Va.; grave is marked with a > Confederate memorial cross. > BIBLIOGRAPHY: > <[COMPILER]. ><[ITAL:][REPOSITORY][:ITAL]. >Database and images. > <[REPOSITORY ADDRESS]>< : [DATE]>. > Find a Grave, Inc. Find A Grave. Database and images. > http://www.findagrave.com/ : 2011. > REMINDER: > This template mimics EE QuickCheck Model 215, Online Images, p. 229, and > online discussions in re: Find A Grave citations. > > - [CEMETERY] is the name of the cemetery. > - [SHORT LOCATION] is the proper abbreviation of the cemetery's location; > note that Mills does not include the cemetery's name in her template. > Consider using only the city and state or county and state in this field. > > - [COMPILER] is the creator of the website. Note that this field obeys > Surname, Given rule. > > - [DATE] is the year the information on this cemetery was posted or the year > you accessed the material. > > - [STATE] is the state, spelled out. > - [COUNTY] is omitted, if the city is well known. If it applies, the county > should include "County", "Parish", etc.; e.g., Hamilton County or Orleans > Parish. > > - [CITY] is the city. > - [REPOSITORY] is the name of the website. > - [REPOSITORY ADDRESS] is the main URL of the website. > > Patrick M. Lofft > Genealogy Researcher and Lecturer > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rowan Sylvester-Bradley [mailto:rowan@sylvesterbradley.org] > Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2018 5:13 AM > To: tmg@rootsweb.com > Subject: [TMG] Best Practice for Citations/Sources/Repositories > > I have a couple of questions about the best way of using TMG: > > > 1. Does one include images as internal, or external? What are the pros and > cons of each? How does Second Site use these images? > > 2. If you need to refer to a citation in several tags, e.g. for several > different people, how do you do this easily without duplicating data entry? > E.g. for a census entry, it may give evidence for the birth of several > people, for their residence, for their occupation. You could easily end up > with 10 or 20 tags all referring to this one document. You don't want to > have to enter the details of the document 20 times, and certainly you don't > want to enter its scan 20 times. > > 3. When citing an online source, what is the best way to do it? Does one > include an image of the document, and/or a transcription? If the latter, > where do you put the transcription? What is the source and the repository in > this case? Does the source need to mention the exact URL of the web page, or > just the web site, or just a generic "Web"? Is the repository the web site > you got this from (e.g. Ancestry or Findmypast), or the original source of > the document (e.g. "Buckinghamshire Parish Records 1575-1911", or "West > Wycombe Marriage Register 1830"). > > I hope someone can help me with best practice or recommendations in answer > to these questions. > > Thanks - Rowan > > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe and Archives > https://mailinglists.rootsweb.com/listindexes/search/tmg > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: > https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > RootsWeb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb > community > > Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref > Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/tmg@rootsweb.com > Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 > Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog > RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community