On Mar 5, 2010, at 3:01 AM, theshipslist-request@rootsweb.com wrote: > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Old Ships info. (Jim Murphy) > 2. Re: L-o-n-g voyage (Marj Kohli) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 17:47:26 +0000 > From: Jim Murphy <jamescmurphy@eircom.net> > Subject: [TSL] Old Ships info. > To: Ships list <TheShipsList-L@rootsweb.com> > Message-ID: <4B8FF22E.3040000@eircom.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Hi, > > I wonder can anyone give me some information/photo or maybe > know of some web site where I may be able to locate something > as I have tried the Mirimar index without any luck. > > I am doing a bit of local history on mariners from Passage West, Co. > Cork, Ireland > and have the dischage document belonging to a local ships carpenter > relating to the > following ships:- > > "Eliza Keith" Official No. 13013, 540 tons; home port Cork. (year 1878) > > "Mary Jane" Official No.65971; Home port Liverpool (year 1878) > > "Electra" Official No. 56818; 543 tons; Home Port-London (year 1869) > > "Sarah M Smith" Official No. 59262; 776 tons; Home port- St. John's N.B. > (year 1878) > > "Bewick" Official No.67317; 995 tons; Home Port Newcastle; (year 1876) > > I am not quite sure of the following but it appears to be- > "Light Brigade" Official No. 45775; 1200 tons; Home Port- Cork (year 1877) > > Any bit of help on any of these ships would be appreciated. > > Regards, > > Jim Murphy > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 13:45:47 -0500 > From: Marj Kohli <marj@uwaterloo.ca> > Subject: Re: [TSL] L-o-n-g voyage > To: Kathy <lenerz@att.net>, TheShipsList@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <201003041845.o24Ijtfk021300@jubilation.uwaterloo.ca> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed > > Kathy > > Judging from the newspapers that year they had a very early winter > storm and there were many comments about it and wrecks reported. > There was also a report of a late hurricane going up the coast so > that might be the reason for the terrible gales which the ships were > reporting. The north Atlantic is never a pleasant sail in the late fall. > > Regards.. > > Marj > > Regards.. > > Marj > > At 09:46 PM 3/3/2010, Kathy wrote: >> Marj Kohli wrote: >>> One think I notice in the NY Times is that many of the vessels were >>> reporting very foggy weather -- so much so that some were several days >>> in the bay waiting for the fog to lift. I also see ships arriving a few >>> weeks before the Stanislaus reporting heavy gales. >>> >>> It is possible that the weather played a big part in the length of the >>> voyage. >> >> Thanks for looking into this. It's been a while since I gathered all the >> data I presented, so I had forgotten that I had also collected comments >> about the voyage. There certainly were a lot of reports about heavy gales. >> >> What I'm still wondering is whether that was typical or atypical for the >> season, why Antwerp ships took longer to cross the ocean than those >> departing from other ports, and why one ship that left on the same day >> as another from the same port could take 2 1/2 weeks longer in crossing. >> Presumably they encountered the same weather phenomena. >> >> Thanks for your ideas, >> Kathy >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> visit TheShipsList Website >> http://www.theshipslist.com/ >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> THESHIPSLIST-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------ > > To contact the THESHIPSLIST list administrator, send an email to > THESHIPSLIST-admin@rootsweb.com. > > To post a message to the THESHIPSLIST mailing list, send an email to THESHIPSLIST@rootsweb.com. > > __________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to THESHIPSLIST-request@rootsweb.com > with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body of the > email with no additional text. > > > End of THESHIPSLIST Digest, Vol 5, Issue 50 > *******************************************

I am posting this messagae again in hopes that someone can help me as there was no reply to my earlier one, maybe it is because there is no way I can find out these details. "Hi all, can anyone tell me where I can access a seaman's ticket register here in NSW Australia around the years 1850's and what information it would contain. In other words something that shows a crew member's agreement with the ships owner that he employed to sail on. I have my great grandfather Charles Smith born in Norway about 1833 and he settled here in Sydney New South Wale Australia. The following are possibly the ships he served on John Omerad 1855 Camilla 1859 and 1860 There are others but are less likely to be him." Thank you Robyn

New Alien Arrivals 1810-11 and 1826-69 In the early 1800's UK ports branded anyone arriving from outside of the British Empire as an Alien, and in order to keep track all ships were required to record any aliens on board as they entered the UK. http://www.ancestry.co.uk/arrivals?o_iid=42754&o_lid=42754 Annette

Have you tried the Mariners List which deals with crew and ships not emigration and immigration as this list does. mariners-request-l@rootsweb.com I hope I got that right. wilf Tarbet in SW ON Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robyn Munro" <robynm@mysoul.com.au> To: <THESHIPSLIST@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 8:01 PM Subject: [TSL] SEAMAN'S REGISTER >I am posting this messagae again in hopes that someone can help me as >there was no reply to my earlier one, maybe it is because there is no way >I can find out these details. > > "Hi all, can anyone tell me where I can access a seaman's ticket register > here in NSW Australia around the years 1850's and what information it > would contain. In other words something that shows a crew member's > agreement with the ships owner that he employed to sail on. I have my > great grandfather Charles Smith born in Norway about 1833 and he settled > here in Sydney New South Wale Australia. > > The following are possibly the ships he served on > John Omerad 1855 > Camilla 1859 and 1860 > > There are others but are less likely to be him." > > Thank you > Robyn > > ------------------------------- > visit TheShipsList Website > http://www.theshipslist.com/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > THESHIPSLIST-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2723 - Release Date: 03/05/10 02:34:00 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.733 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2723 - Release Date: 03/05/10 02:34:00

Hi Bob, Unfortunately, Canada did not begin archiving passenger lists for the port of Quebec before 1865. We do have partial information about ships to Quebec for 1854 and 1855 http://www.theshipslist.com/ships/Arrivals/ships1854.html http://www.theshipslist.com/ships/Arrivals/ships1855.html I looked in the 1851 Canada census ... no luck, however .... It looks like they were living in Brantford, Ontario by 1861 ... age next birthday. Name: Margaret Houlahan Gender: Female Age: 64 Birth Year: 1797 Birthplace: Ireland Marital Status: Widowed Home in 1861: Brantford, Brant, Canada West Religion: RC James 30 ; Mary 25, born Ireland ; Margaret 6 ; Mary 4 ; Johanna 2, born Upper Canada I looked in the 1870 US census and it shows the next child, Ellen, also born in Canada abt. 1862, then Hanora, Canada abt. 1864, then Lizzie, Canada abt. 1866, then Kate born in Michigan abt. 1868 with James also born Michigan in 1870, so I agree that they moved to Detroit between Lizzie and Kate. The Can-US border records do not begin before 1895, so there is no surviving record there either. btw. I looked at them in 1880 and some of the girls have renamed themselves a bit :-} ... what a big family, first 7 girls then 5 boys by 1880. Sue -- TheShipsList Website http://www.theshipslist.com/ At 05:19 AM 2010-03-05 -0800, Tera Robert wrote: >Hello today > >Might someone kindly help me? > >Looking for any travel information about James Houlihan . b.1829 and his >spouse Mary b. 1834 and Margaret Houlihan, b.1796, presumably James's mother. > >My arithmetic indicates that they likely traveled together in (or possibly >just before) 1855 from place unknown in Ireland to place unknown in Canada >. They were listed with nine children in Detroit in the US census for >1870. The family evidently moved from Canada to Michigan about 1867. > >I've checked GRO index for an 1855ish marriage of James and Mary. And >I've checked other census records with no clear further information. > >Thank you > >Bob Tera

Hello today   Might someone kindly help me?   Looking for any travel information about James Houlihan . b.1829 and his spouse Mary b. 1834 and Margaret Houlihan, b.1796, presumably James’s mother.   My arithmetic indicates that they likely traveled together in (or possibly just before) 1855 from place unknown in Ireland to place unknown in Canada .  They were listed with nine children in  Detroit in the US census for 1870.  The  family evidently moved from Canada to Michigan about 1867.   I’ve checked GRO index for an 1855ish marriage of James and Mary.  And I’ve checked other census records with no clear further information.     Thank you   Bob Tera

Hi, I wonder can anyone give me some information/photo or maybe know of some web site where I may be able to locate something as I have tried the Mirimar index without any luck. I am doing a bit of local history on mariners from Passage West, Co. Cork, Ireland and have the dischage document belonging to a local ships carpenter relating to the following ships:- "Eliza Keith" Official No. 13013, 540 tons; home port Cork. (year 1878) "Mary Jane" Official No.65971; Home port Liverpool (year 1878) "Electra" Official No. 56818; 543 tons; Home Port-London (year 1869) "Sarah M Smith" Official No. 59262; 776 tons; Home port- St. John's N.B. (year 1878) "Bewick" Official No.67317; 995 tons; Home Port Newcastle; (year 1876) I am not quite sure of the following but it appears to be- "Light Brigade" Official No. 45775; 1200 tons; Home Port- Cork (year 1877) Any bit of help on any of these ships would be appreciated. Regards, Jim Murphy

Kathy Judging from the newspapers that year they had a very early winter storm and there were many comments about it and wrecks reported. There was also a report of a late hurricane going up the coast so that might be the reason for the terrible gales which the ships were reporting. The north Atlantic is never a pleasant sail in the late fall. Regards.. Marj Regards.. Marj At 09:46 PM 3/3/2010, Kathy wrote: >Marj Kohli wrote: > > One think I notice in the NY Times is that many of the vessels were > > reporting very foggy weather -- so much so that some were several days > > in the bay waiting for the fog to lift. I also see ships arriving a few > > weeks before the Stanislaus reporting heavy gales. > > > > It is possible that the weather played a big part in the length of the > > voyage. > >Thanks for looking into this. It's been a while since I gathered all the >data I presented, so I had forgotten that I had also collected comments >about the voyage. There certainly were a lot of reports about heavy gales. > >What I'm still wondering is whether that was typical or atypical for the >season, why Antwerp ships took longer to cross the ocean than those >departing from other ports, and why one ship that left on the same day >as another from the same port could take 2 1/2 weeks longer in crossing. >Presumably they encountered the same weather phenomena. > >Thanks for your ideas, >Kathy > > >------------------------------- >visit TheShipsList Website >http://www.theshipslist.com/ >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >THESHIPSLIST-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

-----Original Message----- From: cwarschak@aol.com To: theshipslist@rootsweb.com Cc: graemeo@netspace.net.au Sent: Tue, Mar 2, 2010 12:34 pm Subject: Re: Ship Off Course / At Sea Birth Certificate One of my ancestors was born at sea in 1859. I have never heard of an At Sea Birth Certificate but would like to know more about whether it was common to issue such certificates and, if so, where can I search for this information. My ancestor was Johann Warak (Warack on the ships passenger list). The family traveled aboard the Anna Delius and it arrived in New Orleans in May 1859. Any assistance regarding where to search for At Sea Birth Certificates is greatly appreciated. -----Original Message----- From: theshipslist-request@rootsweb.com To: theshipslist@rootsweb.com Sent: Tue, Mar 2, 2010 2:01 am Subject: THESHIPSLIST Digest, Vol 5, Issue 47 Today's Topics: 1. Ship Off Course (Or Not?) (Graeme Owen) 2. Re: Passamaquoddy 1832 (Betty) 3. Re: Ship Off Course (Or Not?) (David Dixon) 4. Re: Passamaquoddy 1832 (Joe) 5. WILLIAM TELL-Havre-New York City-1851 (THOMAS DEMPSEY) --------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 ate: Mon, 1 Mar 2010 22:17:53 +1100 rom: "Graeme Owen" <graemeo@netspace.net.au> ubject: [TSL] Ship Off Course (Or Not?) o: <THESHIPSLIST@rootsweb.com> essage-ID: <006601cab930$d7289410$8579bc30$@net.au> ontent-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hello All, Here's a query for the experts who know about such things. A month or so back I found the ship that my ancestors came to Australia on ack in 1857. It was 'Invincible' of The Black Ball Line out of Liverpool. I established through other means that my 'great great grandmother' gave irth to a baby during the voyage. The "Born At Sea' Birth Certificate etailed the date of birth and the co-ordinates as being 9'8 S and 32'29 W. o I 'fired up' Google Earth to see exactly where it was and was staggered o find that the given co-ordinates were not far off the coast of Brazil. I hought they must have been wrong or I was not reading them correctly and eft it at that. I then was fortunate to find (at the National Library Of Australia) a diary ritten by a female passenger on the Invincible on that exact voyage. nfortunately the passenger who wrote the diary was travelling in 'Cabin lass' and not 'Steerage' so it was not really reflective of my ancestors ourney, but a fascinating and eye opening read just the same. However in he journal she made mention of an island group which they travelled close o . . . "we were within 20 miles of an island called Terando Noronba, off he coast of South America, the northern portion of which is exactly the hape of a church with a very high steeple" . . Back to Google Earth I went o find this island, and found (slightly different spelling) 'Fernando de oronha' just a small distance due north of where the birth apparently took lace, (and within 'spitting distance' of Brazil!) My (very long winded) query is . . "What In The Bloody Hell Were They Doing ff The Coast Of South America When They Were Sailing From England To ustralia??" I'm sure there's a logical explanation but it's got me beat! Anybody got any houghts? y the way there was a small mention in her diary about a birth on board in teerage. Cheers Graeme elbourne, Australia ------------------------------

Hello Graeme, The ship would have been well on course following and its great circle route. The great circle distance is the shortest distance between two points on the Earths surface assuming the Earth is a sphere, and from England to Australia this route runs in an arc close to the Brazilian coast across south of the Cape of Good Hope into the Southern Ocean to Australia. In early periods provisioning calls were made at South American ports.. Favourable weathers patterns and currents were also an advantage on this route. The First Fleet called at Rio de Janiero. Pushing a barrow, I remember learning this in primary school history in the 1950's. A good visual example of the great circle distance is the course followed by an aircraft fyling from New York to the UK. Regards Denis McCarthy Qld Australia

Marj Kohli wrote: > One think I notice in the NY Times is that many of the vessels were > reporting very foggy weather -- so much so that some were several days > in the bay waiting for the fog to lift. I also see ships arriving a few > weeks before the Stanislaus reporting heavy gales. > > It is possible that the weather played a big part in the length of the > voyage. Thanks for looking into this. It's been a while since I gathered all the data I presented, so I had forgotten that I had also collected comments about the voyage. There certainly were a lot of reports about heavy gales. What I'm still wondering is whether that was typical or atypical for the season, why Antwerp ships took longer to cross the ocean than those departing from other ports, and why one ship that left on the same day as another from the same port could take 2 1/2 weeks longer in crossing. Presumably they encountered the same weather phenomena. Thanks for your ideas, Kathy

----- Original Message ----- From: "Robyn Munro" <robynm@mysoul.com.au> To: <THESHIPSLIST@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 12:04 PM Subject: [TSL] Subject: Passamaquoddy 1832 > For Margm. found this > > The St. Croix River flows into Passamaquoddy Bay from the north, marking > the border between the United States and Canada. > > Thanks Robyn Never stop learning with this hobby. Its a beautiful word too ! Bye MargM Beautiful Central Coast of NSW Australia

Kathy One think I notice in the NY Times is that many of the vessels were reporting very foggy weather -- so much so that some were several days in the bay waiting for the fog to lift. I also see ships arriving a few weeks before the Stanislaus reporting heavy gales. The Bark Brilliant (arrived Dec 20) reported that on Nov 23 they "encountered a gale from the northward and westward which continued 4 days, and which from its violence and the intensity of the cold was the most tedious and trying of any that the master had before experienced for many years. Split sails, lost head-rail and part of bulwarks....Three men were so badly frost-bitten as to be rendered unable to do duty. Sailed in co. with bark Sarah Bridge, for this port." It is possible that the weather played a big part in the length of the voyage. Regards.. Marj At 12:21 PM 3/3/2010, Kathy wrote: >According to the NY Times "Marine Intelligence" column, the Bark >Stanislaus, on which my ancestors traveled, arrived in NY on 3 Jan 1852 >and took 72 days to cross the ocean from Antwerp. This seemed like a >long time to me, so I did some checking on the other ships that traveled >from the continent in that time frame. > >Based on info reported in the Marine Intelligence column, the average >voyage length to NYC for ships that departed from continental ports from >7 Oct 1851 to 19 Dec 1851 was 51 days. Of the 40 ships that departed in >that time frame, only 8 exceeded 60 days in voyage length. 6 of those 8 >were from Antwerp, 1 from Rotterdam, and 1 from Havre. > > N Mean Median >Havre 12 42.5 41.0 >Bremen 10 49.9 50.0 >Rotterdam 3 53.0 51.0 >Hamburg 5 56.0 54.0 >Antwerp 8 64.4 64.5 >Total 40 50.8 50.0 > >I also discovered that 3 ships had embarked from Antwerp on the same >day: the Bark Stanislaus, which toook 72 days to cross the ocean; the >Fanny (55 days); and the Bark Koophanelle (65 days). > >I have a lot of questions about all this, and hopefully some of the >knowledgeable people on this list can help answer one or more. > >(1.) Did ships departing from the continent pass the British Isles to >the south or the north? >(2.) Did it take longer to cross the ocean in late fall-early winter >than during other seasons? >(3.) What sort of weather is typical on the Atlantic in that season? Is >it worse than in other seasons? >(4.) Why would ships from Antwerp have taken longer to cross the ocean >than those from other ports, even ports that were further away, such as >Bremen and Hamburg? >(5.) How common was it that 3 passenger ships would depart from Antwerp >on the same day? >(6.) Does departure of 3 ships on the same day suggest that they were >all waiting for a break in the weather? >(6.) What factors are likely to account for the differing voyage lengths >for ships that all departed on the same day? (e.g., captain's skill, >ship size or design, etc.) > >Thanks for any help, >Kathy > >------------------------------- >visit TheShipsList Website >http://www.theshipslist.com/ >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >THESHIPSLIST-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

According to the NY Times "Marine Intelligence" column, the Bark Stanislaus, on which my ancestors traveled, arrived in NY on 3 Jan 1852 and took 72 days to cross the ocean from Antwerp. This seemed like a long time to me, so I did some checking on the other ships that traveled from the continent in that time frame. Based on info reported in the Marine Intelligence column, the average voyage length to NYC for ships that departed from continental ports from 7 Oct 1851 to 19 Dec 1851 was 51 days. Of the 40 ships that departed in that time frame, only 8 exceeded 60 days in voyage length. 6 of those 8 were from Antwerp, 1 from Rotterdam, and 1 from Havre. N Mean Median Havre 12 42.5 41.0 Bremen 10 49.9 50.0 Rotterdam 3 53.0 51.0 Hamburg 5 56.0 54.0 Antwerp 8 64.4 64.5 Total 40 50.8 50.0 I also discovered that 3 ships had embarked from Antwerp on the same day: the Bark Stanislaus, which toook 72 days to cross the ocean; the Fanny (55 days); and the Bark Koophanelle (65 days). I have a lot of questions about all this, and hopefully some of the knowledgeable people on this list can help answer one or more. (1.) Did ships departing from the continent pass the British Isles to the south or the north? (2.) Did it take longer to cross the ocean in late fall-early winter than during other seasons? (3.) What sort of weather is typical on the Atlantic in that season? Is it worse than in other seasons? (4.) Why would ships from Antwerp have taken longer to cross the ocean than those from other ports, even ports that were further away, such as Bremen and Hamburg? (5.) How common was it that 3 passenger ships would depart from Antwerp on the same day? (6.) Does departure of 3 ships on the same day suggest that they were all waiting for a break in the weather? (6.) What factors are likely to account for the differing voyage lengths for ships that all departed on the same day? (e.g., captain’s skill, ship size or design, etc.) Thanks for any help, Kathy

For Margm. found this The St. Croix River flows into Passamaquoddy Bay from the north, marking the border between the United States and Canada. Cheers

Our family left Ireland 1841 from Cobh ( they were from Dunmanway). The father John (age 52) and son Cornelius ( age 17) boarded ship on St. Patrick's Day but didn't sail until April 1st due to unfavourable sailing conditions. They arrived in St. John, N.B. on May 25th and from there walked to Pugwash, N.S. and forward the story goes. I can't find any records for this. I know St. John lost the records that include these years but where would I look for Ships Boarding records? There should be a record of the ship since we know the date of departure but I am having no luck there either. Everything I know ( which could be like other oral family histories) seems to be enclosed in a black hole somewhere as I am having no luck. HELP Eleanor

I am looking for details of HMS Albymarl(?). A John Churchill of that ship married in South Devon on 1705. Joy Brealey

Graeme, The route taken by sailing ships was designed to make the best of the winds & currents, the course for Australia was very roughly Sth West from say, Plymouth to near the coast of Brazil then roughly Sth East to clear the Cape of Good Hope, then roughly East in the "Roaring Forties" to the chosen Australian Port. The clipper Thermopylae held the record to Melbourne in 63 days, roughly on that route. Incidently I too had a relative that gave birth off the coast of Brazil. Regards, Dave On 1/03/2010 10:17 PM, Graeme Owen wrote: > Hello All, > > Here's a query for the experts who know about such things. > > A month or so back I found the ship that my ancestors came to Australia on > back in 1857. It was 'Invincible' of The Black Ball Line out of Liverpool. > > I established through other means that my 'great great grandmother' gave > birth to a baby during the voyage. The "Born At Sea' Birth Certificate > detailed the date of birth and the co-ordinates as being 9'8 S and 32'29 W. > So I 'fired up' Google Earth to see exactly where it was and was staggered > to find that the given co-ordinates were not far off the coast of Brazil. I > thought they must have been wrong or I was not reading them correctly and > left it at that. > > I then was fortunate to find (at the National Library Of Australia) a diary > written by a female passenger on the Invincible on that exact voyage. > Unfortunately the passenger who wrote the diary was travelling in 'Cabin > Class' and not 'Steerage' so it was not really reflective of my ancestors > journey, but a fascinating and eye opening read just the same. However in > the journal she made mention of an island group which they travelled close > to . . . "we were within 20 miles of an island called Terando Noronba, off > the coast of South America, the northern portion of which is exactly the > shape of a church with a very high steeple" . . Back to Google Earth I went > to find this island, and found (slightly different spelling) 'Fernando de > Noronha' just a small distance due north of where the birth apparently took > place, (and within 'spitting distance' of Brazil!) > > My (very long winded) query is . . "What In The Bloody Hell Were They Doing > Off The Coast Of South America When They Were Sailing From England To > Australia??" > > I'm sure there's a logical explanation but it's got me beat! Anybody got any > thoughts? > By the way there was a small mention in her diary about a birth on board in > Steerage. > > Cheers > > Graeme > Melbourne, Australia > > ------------------------------- > visit TheShipsList Website > http://www.theshipslist.com/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to THESHIPSLIST-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > >

Hello All, Here's a query for the experts who know about such things. A month or so back I found the ship that my ancestors came to Australia on back in 1857. It was 'Invincible' of The Black Ball Line out of Liverpool. I established through other means that my 'great great grandmother' gave birth to a baby during the voyage. The "Born At Sea' Birth Certificate detailed the date of birth and the co-ordinates as being 9'8 S and 32'29 W. So I 'fired up' Google Earth to see exactly where it was and was staggered to find that the given co-ordinates were not far off the coast of Brazil. I thought they must have been wrong or I was not reading them correctly and left it at that. I then was fortunate to find (at the National Library Of Australia) a diary written by a female passenger on the Invincible on that exact voyage. Unfortunately the passenger who wrote the diary was travelling in 'Cabin Class' and not 'Steerage' so it was not really reflective of my ancestors journey, but a fascinating and eye opening read just the same. However in the journal she made mention of an island group which they travelled close to . . . "we were within 20 miles of an island called Terando Noronba, off the coast of South America, the northern portion of which is exactly the shape of a church with a very high steeple" . . Back to Google Earth I went to find this island, and found (slightly different spelling) 'Fernando de Noronha' just a small distance due north of where the birth apparently took place, (and within 'spitting distance' of Brazil!) My (very long winded) query is . . "What In The Bloody Hell Were They Doing Off The Coast Of South America When They Were Sailing From England To Australia??" I'm sure there's a logical explanation but it's got me beat! Anybody got any thoughts? By the way there was a small mention in her diary about a birth on board in Steerage. Cheers Graeme Melbourne, Australia

I am looking for any details about the voyage and passenger list about Franz or Frank Rodler or Roedler What kind of ship was this and how was the crossing and any other details. Castle Garden.org Search Results FRANZ ROEDLER Occupation UNKNOWN Age 18 Sex M Literacy U Ship WILLIAM TELL Arrived 14 Jun 1851 Origin GERMANY Port HAVRE Last Residence Destination 7328 Plan Unknown Passage Unknown He may have come with other family members surname Beplear. Thank you-Tom Dempsey _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/