What we call the Lutheran Church was generally known as the Evangelische Kirche. The Reformiert Church was Calvinist (based on Calvin's teachings). The differences were not great. Both were protestant and accepted each other's ordinances. In Germany and in the U.S. (among German speaking immigrants)and maybe in Switzerland, if a village had only a Lutheran Church, the local reformed protestants attended the Lutheran Church and received baptism, etc. from the Lutheran minister. The baptismal or marriage record often listed the fact that the person was reformed. If there was only a Reformed church then the local Luterans attended there. In the U.S. (at least) some churches were officially both religions combined. A large city, like Philadelphia, had separate Lutheran and Reformed churches. We traced my wife's ancestors to Reamstown, Pennsylvania where they attended a combined Lutheran/Reformed church in the late 1700's. Then we traced them to Gondelsheim, Baden-Wuerttemburg, Germany where they attended, for three generations, the only church in the small town which was a Lutheran (Evangelische) Church. Still they were always characterized as "reformiert". That, and other clues, led us to look for their origins in Switzerland. We have now found that the line went back to Muenchenbuchsee and Baetterkinden in Bern Canton. Near to Gondelsheim, the city of Weingarten had a reformed church. At that time, Weingarten may have only had a reformed church. Hugonauts where French Calvinists and therefore were considered reformed. Another group, the Waldensians (Waldenses in German and Vaudois in French), were descended from a group that broke from the Catholic Church a few hundred years earlier than the Lutherans and Calvinists. At one point they fled France into the alpine valleys of northwestern Italy. They fled there in 1685 at the same time the Hugonauts were fleeing France. A large group came to Switzerland and to Germany. Where there were concentrations, Waldensians had their own churches. Where they were scattered, I believe they also attended the local protestant church whether Lutheran or Calvinist. I have been told the difference between Lutheran and Calvinist but the theological details have fled from my mind. The practical details, as described above, are still there. Paul Rands near Portland, Oregon >From: "Jane T." <[email protected]> >Reply-To: "Jane T." <[email protected]> >To: [email protected] >Subject: [SWITZ] Reformiert church >Date: Sat, 3 Aug 2002 14:35:41 -0700 > >Was the Reformiert church in Switzerland equivalent to the US' Lutheran >church? If not, is there a Protestant sect which it most resembles? > >Jane in AZ > > >==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== >Swiss Resource Site >http://swiss.genealogy.net _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

Here are my two cents worth on the subject: Growing up in the Swissgerman speaking region of Switzerland, the two main churches were always and still are the Reformierte and the Katholische Kirche. (we use the terms "reformiert" and protestantisch" interchangeably.) In some regions the protestants were in the majority, in others the catholics. Still are. The Swissgerman speaking area was almost exclusively influenced and led by Ulrich Zwingli, the Swiss reformator. His base was in Zürich. At Zwingli's death, the Bremgarten /AG theologian Heinrich Bullinger took over the fight for reformation and [my history book says] that at his death he left a "unified and strengthened Reformierte Kirche", having accomplished a peaceful understanding between the western Swiss reformators Calvin and Farel (1549 "Consensus Tigurinus"). (I assume that means that they agreed to coexist peaceably). But he was unable to achieve the same understanding with the Lutherans. The Calvinists prospered in the French speaking regions of Switzerland, Geneva being headquarters. In the shadows of the United Nations' Building in Geneva is a beautiful park with statues of all the reformators. (I wouldn't be surprised if they were sculpted by the famous Rhodin? How about it, Jacques?) Very interesting. They were brave men. Hanneli ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Rands <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, August 03, 2002 4:38 PM Subject: Re: [SWITZ] Reformiert church > What we call the Lutheran Church was generally known as the Evangelische > Kirche. The Reformiert Church was Calvinist (based on Calvin's teachings). > The differences were not great. Both were protestant and accepted each >

Here is a link for the history of protestantism and the reformation in Switzerland. A lot of information on Zwingli. Written by J. A. Wylie 1808-1890 -- this is Volume 1 Book 8 portion that covers Switzerland only. The entire collection is online here. http://www.whatsaiththescripture.com/Voice/History.Protestant.v1.b8.html Claire ----- Original Message ----- From: "guy grenny" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, August 03, 2002 9:58 PM Subject: [SWITZ] Reformierte Kirche (protestant church) Here are my two cents worth on the subject: Growing up in the Swissgerman speaking region of Switzerland, the two main churches were always and still are the Reformierte and the Katholische Kirche. (we use the terms "reformiert" and protestantisch" interchangeably.) In some regions the protestants were in the majority, in others the catholics. Still are. The Swissgerman speaking area was almost exclusively influenced and led by Ulrich Zwingli, the Swiss reformator. His base was in Zürich. At Zwingli's death, the Bremgarten /AG theologian Heinrich Bullinger took over the fight for reformation and [my history book says] that at his death he left a "unified and strengthened Reformierte Kirche", having accomplished a peaceful understanding between the western Swiss reformators Calvin and Farel (1549 "Consensus Tigurinus"). (I assume that means that they agreed to coexist peaceably). But he was unable to achieve the same understanding with the Lutherans. The Calvinists prospered in the French speaking regions of Switzerland, Geneva being headquarters. In the shadows of the United Nations' Building in Geneva is a beautiful park with statues of all the reformators. (I wouldn't be surprised if they were sculpted by the famous Rhodin? How about it, Jacques?) Very interesting. They were brave men. Hanneli ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul Rands <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, August 03, 2002 4:38 PM Subject: Re: [SWITZ] Reformiert church > What we call the Lutheran Church was generally known as the Evangelische > Kirche. The Reformiert Church was Calvinist (based on Calvin's teachings). > The differences were not great. Both were protestant and accepted each > ==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== Going on vacation? Gone longer than 4 days? Go to http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/CHE/SWITZERLAND.html to unsubscribe

I do agree with everything that Paul has written, except that the Reformed Church was formed by Ulrich Zwingli in Switzerland. As a Swiss-German County in North Carolina, we had many joint Lutheran and Reformed churches. However, Zwingli and Luther could not agree on communion. The Reformed Church in America welcomes all to communion and takes the bread and wine "in memory of the body and blood of Christ". The Lutherans differ on their view of communion. There was a great friendship between the two churches, and they intermarried and stood as godparents to each other's children. To call a Reformed a "Calvinist" would be fighting words . It is true that the English and Scots-Irish clerks of court would record some Union churches, as "Lutheran and Presbyterian" leading many researchers to a false conclusion, and Reformed churches will sometimes appear in books as Presbyterian. It is true that the Presbyterian and Refomred Church use the same form of worship and the same hymn book. Anne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Rands" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, August 03, 2002 7:38 PM Subject: Re: [SWITZ] Reformiert church > What we call the Lutheran Church was generally known as the Evangelische > Kirche. The Reformiert Church was Calvinist (based on Calvin's teachings). > The differences were not great. Both were protestant and accepted each > other's ordinances. In Germany and in the U.S. (among German speaking > immigrants)and maybe in Switzerland, if a village had only a Lutheran > Church, the local reformed protestants attended the Lutheran Church and > received baptism, etc. from the Lutheran minister. The baptismal or > marriage record often listed the fact that the person was reformed. If > there was only a Reformed church then the local Luterans attended there. In > the U.S. (at least) some churches were officially both religions combined. > A large city, like Philadelphia, had separate Lutheran and Reformed > churches. > > We traced my wife's ancestors to Reamstown, Pennsylvania where they attended > a combined Lutheran/Reformed church in the late 1700's. Then we traced them > to Gondelsheim, Baden-Wuerttemburg, Germany where they attended, for three > generations, the only church in the small town which was a Lutheran > (Evangelische) Church. Still they were always characterized as > "reformiert". That, and other clues, led us to look for their origins in > Switzerland. We have now found that the line went back to Muenchenbuchsee > and Baetterkinden in Bern Canton. Near to Gondelsheim, the city of > Weingarten had a reformed church. At that time, Weingarten may have only > had a reformed church. > > Hugonauts where French Calvinists and therefore were considered reformed. > Another group, the Waldensians (Waldenses in German and Vaudois in French), > were descended from a group that broke from the Catholic Church a few > hundred years earlier than the Lutherans and Calvinists. At one point they > fled France into the alpine valleys of northwestern Italy. They fled there > in 1685 at the same time the Hugonauts were fleeing France. A large group > came to Switzerland and to Germany. Where there were concentrations, > Waldensians had their own churches. Where they were scattered, I believe > they also attended the local protestant church whether Lutheran or > Calvinist. > > I have been told the difference between Lutheran and Calvinist but the > theological details have fled from my mind. The practical details, as > described above, are still there. > > Paul Rands > near Portland, Oregon > > >From: "Jane T." <[email protected]> > >Reply-To: "Jane T." <[email protected]> > >To: [email protected] > >Subject: [SWITZ] Reformiert church > >Date: Sat, 3 Aug 2002 14:35:41 -0700 > > > >Was the Reformiert church in Switzerland equivalent to the US' Lutheran > >church? If not, is there a Protestant sect which it most resembles? > > > >Jane in AZ > > > > > >==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== > >Swiss Resource Site > >http://swiss.genealogy.net > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: > http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx > > > ==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== > Resource Site > http://www.rootsweb.com/~chewgw > >