In a message dated 11/26/2005 12:01:28 P.M. Central Standard Time, HELTSLEY@aol.com writes: The exchanges on Germanic immigrants leaving from Le Havre, but isn't it true different ports were popular at different periods of history, depending largely on the needs of the big shipping vessels. They shipped our ancestors to America and picked up cotton etc. from America back to Europe. I'm sure you know that, but I didn't see it in what I read so far. Mine, probably Haussli, came from that area where France, Germany and Switzerland meet, but went out of Rotterdam in 1738-39, via England, and to Philadelphia. Good hunting! Ernie Heltsley Hello Ernie and list, Yes, from what I know, many passenger ships carried cargo to Europe on their return voyages; others strictly carried passengers and luggage back to Europe. My Swiss family came over on a sailing ship in 1853 before the "big rush" of immigrants (and before the big passenger liners were built) and they came over in ballast. (meaning, absolutely no cargo, just luggage and passengers.) Some ships went back the same way. Lots of people made the return trip to Europe: anyone sick, of course, had to return home (eye disease and TB was most prominent). Any mentally impaired passengers were sent back. Any one known for criminal activity (I don't know how the port authorities would know this though...maybe another lister does). And many wealthy Americans traveled back and forth also. Then of course, the liners didn't want to disturb the bunk and eating quarters for steerage passengers each time on a return trip, so did not usually put supplies in that area when returning to Europe. (It would have just been too expensive to repair or replace for each trip.) Then again, many of the larger passenger ships had 8 "floors" so had plenty of room for cargo. Of course, Bremmen (really the port was Bremenhaven) was much more popular than the farther north Hamburg (the port was actually Cuxhaven) until a Jewish man by the name of Albert Bellin, headed HAPAG, organized Hamburg, built new buildings to house emigrants, cleaned out and made new channels, bought a fleet of ocean liners, lowered the steerage price, made a safer harbor, and marketed his policies. Then Hamburg became the larger port (and history shows that more people emigrated from there). Bellin said he became rich on the steerage passengers, because even though he charged little, he could get so many on each ship. The first ocean passenger vessel - built in Germany - was the Rugia, and as a young girl, my grandmother left from Hamburg and arrived to Ellis on that vessel. (1892). All of the first passenger ships continued to keep their sails (if you have photos of your family's ship you can see that) because many times the rudders/engines would fall into the sea and they had to finish their trip via sails! On the same trip as my grandma's (same dates, different ship) there was a storm at sea. One ship (not the one my grandma was on) had to throw all their cargo over the side. They were carrying salt to America. Well, that didn't help, the ship broke, and another ship picked up the passengers and brought them to safety. If you know your ship's name and date of arrival, check the NY newspaper. They listed daily arrivals and interesting articles. I really don't know about the actual port of Le Havre...other than many ships from Hamburg stopped at Havre on their way to America (this was still considered a direct sail, not indirect.) Maybe another lister knows about Le Havre. Hope this has been of interest to some of you, Regards from Texas, USA Nellie, a 68-yr-old root digger