Please change e-mail address from: rhnaylor@erols.com to: <rhnaylor@msn.com>

Dave, Is Seedorf the same village as Seehof.??? Reply!

Dear Barbara: The Walperswiler surname originates from the village of Seedorf in canton BE (Bern) from before 1800. You may register your name and e-mail address as "interested people" along with viewing who else is researching the line at: http://iseli.simplenet.com/ch-names/ which is part of SwissGen http://swiss.genealogy.net Information about SwissGen's Swiss Surname Directory (SSD) is found at either of these addresses: http://swiss.genealogy.net/surnam-m.htm http://www.eye.ch/swissgen/surnam-m.htm Webpages describing the "sources" of Swiss Surname Directory can be found on either of these web addresses (keep trying until one of them works): http://swiss.genealogy.net/sursou-e.htm http://www.eye.ch/swissgen/sursou-e.htm To find out if church parish registers (original handwritten script records) for the village of Seedorf have been microfilmed, start at: http://swiss.genealogy.net/ldsloc-m.htm http://www.eye.ch/swissgen/ldsloc-m.htm and click on the canton. For you, it is BE. Then search the list for the village name and click away. (Seedorf is there, just keep on paging down) If the village is found on the list, then contact your local Family History Center, part of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, to order the microfilm(s): http://www.familysearch.org/fhlc/Help/Family%20History%20Centers/what_is_a_f amily_history_center.htm (hint - between http and center.htm all has to be on one line in your internet browser) best wishes, Dave Schmutz -----Original Message----- From: blew48 [mailto:blew48@gateway.net] Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2000 10:38 AM To: bernhelp@genealogy.net Subject: Benedict Walperswiller My name is Barbara Williams. I am looking for my great-grandfater. I have found on a census that he came from Switzerland. My Benedict was born in May 1827 as far as I know. On the LDS familysearch.org internet connection I have found a Benedict Walperswiller also spelled Walperswyller. The Benedict I found on the internet was born in 1760's a little to wide a spread for them to have been son and father. This is all the concert information I have on my great-grandfather. I have had a hard time finding any other person with his last name. Any help you could give me would be greatly appreciated.

"Outriggger" will be hard to find for the next week or so. Personal reasons. I will still be monitoring the list as often as possible, but necessarily will have to restrict replies. Appreciate your understanding. Pete Mattli Ft. Myers, FL

My vote for most valuable info posted to the list in CY1999, goes to Steve's posting (see below), and Claire's comments on it (see posting, 01/12/2000 from cjlisa@sprynet.com, same subject. Sorry, too long to re-post, but well worth the reading.) I can only emphasize Claire's point, that it is imperative to let the archives know you are coming in advance. The archives don't like surprise drop-ins who spend the day. Pete Mattli Ft. Myers, FL > ---------- Subj: [SWITZ] Re: SWITZERLAND-D Digest V00 #10 Date: 01/10/2000 9:31:56 PM Eastern Standard Time From: dash@nucleus.com (Steve Delton Henrich) To: SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Well, speaking from my blunders; you should compile a summary of what you do know and have two copies incase the airline loses a peice of your luggage. Find out the address's of the archives that would concern you for country and municipality if possible. This really depends on how much time you have in Europe. You should also prioritise just what is most inportant for you, and what is most realistic to acheive. I cannot speak for Switzerland, as I only visited Germany and the U.K.. But you should really do as much as you possibly can before you go. No matter how much time you have, it's never enough; and you want to maximize your experience!

KOETZLE is similar to KUTZLI and if they are merely variant spellings of the same name, there were many Kutzli's from Barzheim, Schaffhausen. My great-great-great-great-great grandmother was a Christina KUTZLI (1752-1822) married to Hans Conrad WINZELER (1744-1805). Just a thought, j. ott

What modes of transportation would have been available for a Swiss citizen to use in order to get from Rheineck, Switzerland to Bremen, Germany in 1858? My g-g-grandfather left Rheineck on July 24, 1858 and left Bremen, Germany on August 14, 1858. I am just trying to determine how he might have gotten from Rheineck to Bremen? >From a map of Switzerland in 1859, it appears that there was already a railroad system in the northern part of Switzerland at that time. Would this have been a viable option for an average citizen? Thanks for any information or ideas. Patty in Colorado

Dear Tom Biery; Sorry but I have so little to go on. I do not know the village, so that is quite a problem. Yes, I was in Switzerland in 1985. Was with the Farm & Ranch Tour.Covered more than 2/3 ds. of Switzerland and of course could not stop where I wanted to with the group. My daughter has a planned trip in July so I was trying to gather as much info as possible for her. I have found that their is Eggemans in Basel. But could not establish any relation to me. Eggeman is my paternal side of my family. Have you been to Switzerland? I was in awe the whole time. Other vacations are not as beautiful. Would appreciate and help what so ever. I am Sincerely, Betty Beery

Dear Shirley: How far back???? Hmmmmm.......depends on the location. But in general........(from Jared H. Suess' "Handy Guide to Swiss Genealogical Records," ~$10, published in 1978 by http://www.everton.com/ - 800-443-6325). approximate years covered type of record ========== =============== 1000's - Citizenship records ~1275 - Notarial records ~1290 - Court records 1290 - 1800 Declarations of Land Possessed 1300's - 1920 Donations for Masses for the Dead 1300's - 1700's Emigration Records 1400's - 1800's City Genealogical Records 1400's - 1800's Tithing Books 1400's - University Records 1400's - Military Records ~1525 - Protestant Parish Registers ~1580 - Catholic Parish Registers (In Catholic cantons couples often went to favorite shrines, e.g., Mariastein SO and Einsiedeln SZ to be married) 1500's - 1900's Guild Records 1549 - 1850 Records of Protestant Refugees 1600 - 1962 Swiss Surname Book (Familiennamenbuch der Schweiz) - a = 1600-1800, b = 1800-1900, c = 1900-1962 1700 - 1900 Family Registers 1700's - Records of Foreigners 1764 - Census Records - started 1764, 1798, 1811-1850 (every 15 years), 1850 (every 10 years) since 1876 - Civil Registration, but earlier in other cantons ~1810 - Family Certificates that's all I have for now...... best wishes, Dave Schmutz SwissGen volunteer (we need more volunteers - do you have access to Familiennamenbuch der Schweiz [Swiss Surnames] or Mario von Moos' Bibliography of Swiss Genealogies?) -----Original Message----- From: Eearl2@aol.com [mailto:Eearl2@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2000 1:15 PM To: dschmutz@es.com Subject: Re: [SWITZ] Church records - how far back?? Hi I just signed up for this email group and it has been fascinating. I have one question - how far back is it possible to go in finding Swiss ancestors ? I have been able to trace as far back as the early 1600's but the one resource I found stated that the pastor of the church only started keeping records about that time. Does anyone know when the Catholic Church started keeping records ?? By the way for what its worth in case someone else has already done the same search I am looking for this is as far back as I have been able to go so far Hans Graf of Baretswil Zurich - 1661 Jacob Guth Soffingen Aargu 1659 Georg Weber bn 1590 Albis Zurich ?? Micheal Horst 1732 I found info stating that there were references of Horsts in 1591 Gugiesberg and Whalein area of Schwarzenburg I haven't been able to find anything beyond the the original family who came over in 1732. Just seen to appear out of nowhere. But Micheal has been a family name for the past 200 years so I am guessing that there should be references to that family somewhere. Christian Gehman (Gauman) from the town of Shwendli near Obethal approx 1645. I have just started searching that era so have not nearly exhausted all the possible resources I have available at this point BUT was just curious when records started actually being kept and if it was worth my time contacting the various resources mentioned in Switzerland if it was going stop the same period of time I would have. Also what about prison-arrests records from the 1500-1600's ? Are they easily available ? I am guessing that those would probably be more helpful than just getting birth records. Shirley

To Biery Thank you for answering. I only know that my gggrandma had a goat cart and goat that took the cheese they made and eggs and went through a tunnel to a village and sold them. I assume it was not a RailRoad tunnel. I do know it was south of Bern. I was told they lived 7 hours from Bern. In the 1860's I do not know what 7 hours is! Betty Beery

Dear Jonathan, > ---------- > Von: Jonathan Farnsworth[SMTP:jonathan@nsdigital.com] > Gesendet: Dienstag, 11. Januar 2000 00:27 > An: SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com > Betreff: [SWITZ] Reguest of records from Benken, Saint Gallen > > In November 1999, I submitted a request for genealogical records. I > recieved a response from Benken, saying that a change in law had occurred > and I needed to contact the Canton for permission. Do anyone know the > specifics of the law for obtaining vital records in the Canton of Saint > Gallen. > This is nothing peculiar for canton St.Gallen - this is caused by the new Federal Civil Registration Ordinance. Those reading German are invited to read an article by the SGFF President on the subject : http://www.eye.ch/swissgen/ver/chbull61.htm#ochsner The full text is available as pdf file on http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/c211_112_1.html (German) http://www.admin.ch/ch/f/rs/c211_112_1.html (French) http://www.admin.ch/ch/i/rs/c211_112_1.html (Italian) Let me give you a brief summary in English ;-) Nobody will get any information on living people : you are supposed to contact these people themselfes (there are a few exceptions - not really worth mentioning). To get information on deceased people you have to get a permission from the cantonal Civil Registry Office - the address for canton St.Gallen is Amt für Bürgerrecht u. Zivilstand Spisergasse 41 9000 St. Gallen Fax +41 71 229 35 61 Anyone planning to contact them by e-mail : send me a short note (I don't believe they would appreciate their e-mail address being published on the list). Now - to get this permission, you have to prove that you are a direct descendant ! So forget about your uncles :-((. Prove means - have a chain of documents from your birth certificate to your parents' marriage certificate to .... the person you want information about. If you get the permission - there is a fee (sfr 50 for St.Gallen - this might be different in other cantons). With this permission you are now allowed to approach the local Civil Registration Office and ask for a Familienschein - see http://swiss.genealogy.net/intro-e.htm for which the fee will usually be in the sfr 25 ... 50 range (depending on the number of entries, i.e. mainly the number of children). Don't shoot me - I haven't made the law - I'm only reporting ! This is the bad news - now, the good news is that this is only valid for data you request from a Civil Registration Office. These offices were set up in 1876 and collected some data retrospectively then - usually all people still alive and living in Switzerland - which brings you back to early 19th century in most cases (only few communities have similar records dating further back). Before this time it's church records - and these church records have been filmed to a fair extent (some cantons where few have been filmed - others, like St.Gallen, completely) and usually cover the time until 1875. Despite other rumours : you do not need any permission to view those films (when existing) !! Just go to the nearest Family History Centre, order the film (they only charge a nominal fee for this) - and try to read them : now, this might be a problem : written in German or French (depending on the area), older ones often in Latin, in an old script - often bad handwriting :-((. So what are the choices ? 19th century, prior to 1876 : if the Civil Registry Office has some data (and you are a direct descendant), this will be the more expensive way to get some data - but may still be a lot faster. If you consider this - a hint : you have to have the permission to actually get data - you don't need a permission to enquire whether a certain person can be identified in their register ! So contact Civil Registration Office first, indicate that you know about the legal requirements - and ask them to just check for the existence of your ancestor in their register : otherwise you possibly will have paid for the permission - but still don't get any data, if they don't find any data. If you go for church records : if you know the canton you are looking for - start at http://swiss.genealogy.net/ldsloc-m.htm which will lead you directly to a listing of all parishes for which something has been filmed (try St.Gallen : Benken is listed). If you don't find the village name you are looking for, there are two possible explanations - either nothing has been filmed, or the village did not form an independent parish. Unfortunately the search engine won't find village names which may be mentioned in a parish they belong to. So - if the list of villages for a canton is rather long (like St.Gallen) - try to locate the village you are looking for on a map, and check which other villages are in the neighborhood - and then check for these other villages. But how do you get on with the language and/or old script ? I consider it challenging to learn it - but time consuming : if you are determined to learn, you'll find a few hints on http://swiss.genealogy.net/asinfo-e.htm (go to translation services and related help) The alternative is help from a professional or semi-professional : whilst a few people are willing to spend their time to get you started (by giving advice on this list - or contributing to web projects like http://swiss.genealogy.net or http://german.genealogy.net/gene/reg/CH/), we just don't have the time to do research for you. After all - these people do this in their spare time and have another profession to earn their living - or they would be professional genealogists ;-) ! I hope some of you find this information useful, and wish you good luck with your further research - Wolf ---------------------- Wolf W. Seelentag, PhD, e-mail : wolf@swissmail.com Reherstr. 19, CH - 9016 St. Gallen, Switzerland Tel (home) : +41-71-2885121 Fax : +49-89-2443-91987 Tel (work) : +41-71-4942233

Dear Lorie: The Schmutz family name held citizenship (comes from) in 5 different villages in canton BE, 1 in BL, 10 in FR, in Switzerland before 1800. I would use SwissGen's Swiss Surname Directory to get the info on the villages for both the Schick and Schmutz surnames: http://iseli.simplenet.com/ch-names/ However, please read about SSD first at: http://swiss.genealogy.net/surnam-m.htm so you are familiar with what data may be found. The Schick family comes from 3 villages in canton BE from before 1800. I bet you $100 that some of those Schick villages are within walking distance (no cars back then) to the Schmutz villages in canton BE. So, use http://www.geocities.com/swissschmutz/chpostal.html to see which villages are near each other, by using the postal codes. Then use http://www.mapquest.com or other mapping websites to zoom in and physically see where they are. As far as your other names, submit a request to the SSD volunteers to find the info through the SSD query webpage above. best wishes, Dave Schmutz -----Original Message----- From: storbeck [mailto:storbeck@gateway.net] Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2000 11:02 AM To: dschmutz@es.com Subject: Re: [SWITZ] RE: Gutikhausen (or Gutighausen) Hello Dave, I just saw your message on the Switzerland mailing list. Your comments were informative, and I was wishing I knew where in Switzerland my Koetzle(i) and Halzi families were from so I could find more info about them. What really caught my attention, however, was your last name. Schmutz! I have a gg grandmother with that name, but I thought it was a German name. Maybe I've been looking in the wrong country! Can you possibly direct me to where I can find info about the Schmutz family? All I have is - Katherine Schick (b. about 1862) was daughter of Johannes SCHICK and Barbara SCHMUTZ. The Schick family came to the U.S. and settled in Bergen or Passaic County, New Jersey. Any ideas? Thanks for your time, Lorie

Dear Joe: The church parish records for Gütighausen are found under the records for: Switzerland, Zürich, Thalheim an der Thur - Church records in the LDS FHL On-line Catalog. Start with http://swiss.genealogy.net/ldsloc-m.htm and then click on Zürich, then search the list for either Dorlikon or Thalheim an der Thur, which will take you to: http://www.familysearch.org/fhlc/supermainframeset.asp?display=localitydetai ls&subject=162360 Evntually, after several links you get to the film numbers and description: "Parish register of Dorlikon and Gütighausen, Ct. Zürich, Switzerland. Includes baptisms, marriages, deaths, communicants, and church census. Dorlikon was renamed Thalheim an der Thur in 1878. best wishes, Dave Schmutz -----Original Message----- From: Joseph E. Wolfe [mailto:joeedwolfe@juno.com] Sent: Saturday, October 02, 1999 1:02 PM To: SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [SWITZ] RE: Gutikhausen (or Gutighausen) I am trying to find the church records of Gutighausen and the Haubacher family there. In Swiss Gazeeter the Bezirkamt is Andelfingen and the Geminde is Thalheim. There are no microfilmed records for Gutighausen per se. Before I forget this is in Zurich Canton. It was a very small place with only 32 houses and 163 reformed citizens. There is a small portion of Gutighausen in Andelfingen early church records and then they disappear. The person I am checking on is Ana HAGENBUCH (BORN APPROX. 1659 in Gutighausen ) amd narried 20 Jan 1680 to Jacob Bachmann (born 4 Mar 1652 in Altikon, Vogt's son and he died in Altikon on 4 Jul 1687. I am sure that she remarried as she would have been very young and cannot find her anymore in Altikon records. In the Zurich census records Gutighausen and Thalheim are listed in 1637 and 1640 too early to connect with Ana as above. Any help will be appreciated. Thanking you in advance Joe Wolfe

What Steve said regarding research is very true. I went to Switzerland this past fall and did as much prep work as possible -- lots of resources on the web. Pinpointed towns to visit and mapped them out -- get a map from Swiss Tourism (on the web) and Swiss Consulate (also on the web) can be of help for any questions you may have -- they will send or fax info on researching your ancestors. I had a "loose" (this allowed me to spend more time if needed in certain areas) itinerary before I left. However, I didn't pack any of my info in a suitcase -- I was the only person who could lose it... I used a lightweight report folder with clear sheet holders -- and only copies of my info went in them and a backpack along with pen and paper and camera and carried it on the plane. You don't want to worry about handling or damaging original "stuff". I organized it in the order of places and family members that I was researching. I'm first generation American of Swiss parents and Swiss and German grandparents, etc. So there were quite a few places that I planned to visit. Also, where your family is born is not necessarily where they "originated." Family origin is based on where the family name originated. So you can be researching in many places for 1 person: the town the family originated, the birth town and they can also be listed if they moved to a different town and there is also the State Archives. And you also need to work around time schedules of lunch (everything closes). You should also look into a Swiss Pass if you plan to travel quite a bit. Once purchased it is good on trains, postal buses, and boats, cable cars, most transporation -- except excursions. If it doesn't pay for all there are discounts using the pass. Also most people speak English, and if they don't they usually have someone in the archives that they can call upon to translate. The French area is more difficult. If you can advise them that you are coming that is good too. I made 2 connections via the internet that allowed me to set appointment dates. Most is not on the web. But people are really receptive and helpful. Have a good time Claire And Steve is right -- there can never be enough time -- you also want to experience the sights and sounds and beauty of Switzerland and know somewhat what your ancestors experienced. It's a wonderful experience. > Well, speaking from my blunders; you should compile a summary of what you do > know and have two copies incase the airline loses a peice of your luggage. > Find out the address's of the archives that would concern you for country > and municipality if possible. This really depends on how much time you have > in Europe. You should also prioritise just what is most inportant for you, > and what is most realistic to acheive. I cannot speak for Switzerland, as I > only visited Germany and the U.K.. But you should really do as much as you > possibly can before you go. No matter how much time you have, it's never > enough; and you want to maximize your experience! > -----Original Message----- > From: SWITZERLAND-D-request@rootsweb.com > <SWITZERLAND-D-request@rootsweb.com> > To: SWITZERLAND-D@rootsweb.com <SWITZERLAND-D@rootsweb.com> > Date: Friday, January 07, 2000 9:05 PM > Subject: SWITZERLAND-D Digest V00 #10 > > > > > ==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== > Support RootsWeb! Help provide FREE genealogical resources on the > Internet: http://www.rootsweb.com/rootsweb/how-to-subscribe.html >

Hello, Does anyone know where I can find information on tunnels in the 1875 were located. Especially in the Canton of Berne and in the vicinity of Blumenstein to Thun area. This would be a great help to me to fine my gggrandfather and ggrandfather. Ulrich Eggeman and son Robert Eggeman. Robert b. 1864. immigrated to USA 1884. Roberts mother was Anna whitmore Eggeman. Thank you for any advise on the tunnels. Betty

Greeting I am trying to find out if any one has any info on Wild's in Toggenburg in the late 1400s or early 1500s I am trying to find out info on Alt Johann Wild (also called old Johann of Toggenburg) I have his son Niclaus Wild B. 1510 he married Anna Zwingli B. 1514 . I do not have any info on Niclaus, siblings or his mother, I would appriacte any help at all, I have ask this? before Dose anybody have info on the Origins of the Ser Name Wild? I have been lead to believe that at one time five or six familys up and moved into the Alps and drooped their Ser names and took up the name of Wild, Can any one help me with this? Also dose anyone have know how one might go about finding out if their are distance Relatives living in a certain Canton or City I.E. Canton St. Gallen/St Gallen Or Bern's I have been able to Actsess the phone book of all Wild's living in Switz, and have been able to narrow the list to a canton of my choosing are their such Family groups that search out if they had any Ancestors that might have migrated out of Switz? I know that I have a lot on my plate right now but i hope that some one might take a nibble at some of the items at hand Thankyou Glen Wild Texas USA

In a message dated 1/10/00 9:35:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, SWITZERLAND-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: << Hello all! Time to take the leap. I am researching John George Heck, deceased 1 May=20 1933 in Stroudsberg, Pennsylvania, born to Jacob Heck and Ann Elizabeth=20 Schaub of Basle on 25 Feb 1857, who traveled with his brother Christopher= to=20 America sometime on or before 25 April 1885. The Basel Stadt & Kanton=20 Liestal Zivilstandsamt have found no records, suggesting birth out of the= =20 city in a village & referring to the heimatort? The family is said to hav= e=20 come up from Graub=FCnden before that. Will appreciate any & all informat= ion=20 or leads including addresses & telephones of living relatives. Richard Charles (Devon McLellan Heck Jr) >> Take a further leap of faith, try Jacob Heckendorn and Ann Elisabeth Schaub. I have both surnames in the Basel-Stadt and Basel-Land cantons. But I have no Hecks names, may have been streamlined in America. What the Heck its worth a shot.

I now know for sure that my ancestors (great-great grandfather and great-great-great-grandfather) held citizenship in Straubenzell. I have a couple questions about that: 1. It is my understanding that Straubenzell no longer exists but that the area which used to be Straubenzell is now the western part of the city of St. Gallen - am I correct about that? 2. What was Straubenzell - a city? a canton? 3. For my g-g-g-grandfather to have held citizenship in Straubenzell, wouldn't some ancestor have had to have lived in that area originally to have initially established that citizenship? I know that my g-g-grandfather was born in Rorschach (1836) and have been fortunate enough to find his baptismal record, a report card for his attendance at a school in Rorschach, and a record of him depositing his Heimatschein in Rheineck for a few years prior to emigrating to the US. I am now trying to determine where my g-g-g-grandfather was born (1801). I do understand that where he holds citizenship may be totally unrelated to where he lived. However, several of the documents I have say "von Bruggen" on them. I have been told that Bruggen could have been used interchangeably with Straubenzell, thus this is just an indication of his citizenship in Straubenzell. Could it also be an indication that he moved to Rorschach from Bruggen, and therefore Bruggen church records might be a good place to look for his baptismal records? Thanks in advance for any information, suggestions! Patty in Colorado, USA

Would anyone know what training might have been required for a medical doctor practicing in Saint Gallen, Switzerland beginning in about the 1820s through 1870? Would he have gone to a university for training - if so, what universities existed then? Or would it have been an apprenticeship-type training? My great-great grandfather emigrated from Switzerland in 1858 at the age of 22 and was a druggist and/or physician here in the US. His brother was a physician and I have found a record of him attending the University of Zurich in 1854 before he emigrated, but there wasn't one for my great-great grandfather. The brother's record mentions he may have studied in Vienna prior to attending the University of Zurich. My g-g-g-grandfather was a medical doctor practicing in Rorschach from the 1820s through 1870 or so. I am curious as to what medical training these three men might have had. Any information, thoughts or suggestions would be welcome! Thank you! Patty in Colorado, USA

Well, speaking from my blunders; you should compile a summary of what you do know and have two copies incase the airline loses a peice of your luggage. Find out the address's of the archives that would concern you for country and municipality if possible. This really depends on how much time you have in Europe. You should also prioritise just what is most inportant for you, and what is most realistic to acheive. I cannot speak for Switzerland, as I only visited Germany and the U.K.. But you should really do as much as you possibly can before you go. No matter how much time you have, it's never enough; and you want to maximize your experience! -----Original Message----- From: SWITZERLAND-D-request@rootsweb.com <SWITZERLAND-D-request@rootsweb.com> To: SWITZERLAND-D@rootsweb.com <SWITZERLAND-D@rootsweb.com> Date: Friday, January 07, 2000 9:05 PM Subject: SWITZERLAND-D Digest V00 #10