I think I sent my reply to the wrong person, so am seeking for the Tom who has Kaufmann files in Switzerland. I have been looking for my Kaufmanns in Bern Canton. Thanks, Jann jowin@ix.netcom.com wrote: > Tom--I will be glad to open your files for you. You can e-mail me at > jowin@ix.netcom.com. > > Jo > > > Thanks all who responded to my .mdb query. Unfortunally I so > not have > Microsoft Access or the $279.00 to buy the prog. Would anybody, > who has > Access, be willing to open these files and see if they can be > converted to a > text or Excel file(I can read this). Unfortunatly my friend in Switz. > is on > vacation in Italy (nice huh?) and won't be back until late Feb. so I > have no > way to contact him. The files are abt. 100kb each, only two of > them and > contain family data from the 1700's. I scanned them thru Norton's > Anti Virus > 2000 (updated sigs.) and they are clean. One has my 4th > g-gradfather, > Sylvester MAHRER of which I have been searching a loooooong > time for so > needless to say I'm very anxious to see these files. Thanks all > for any > help. > Tom Schmidt > PS: These files also contain a load of KAUFMANN family data > from Mo"hlin and > will share any info. > > > ==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== > Resource Site > http://www.rootsweb.com/~chewgw > > > ==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== > Going on vacation? Gone longer than 4 days? > mail to Switzerland-L-request@rootsweb.com > subject line: unsubscribe > nothing in message

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Ruederswil is about is about 7 miles as the crow flies NE Of Grosshoechstetten. Rick Saunders

Hello, It turns out my Krähenbühl/Krehbiel ancestor, Peter II, who we thought was born in Zaziwyl, Grosshochstetten, Bern, Switzerland, was born March 1, 1657 in Ruederswil, Switzerland instead. They were Anabaptist and left Switzerland in 1671 for Weierhof, Pfalz, Germany Does anyone know if these places are close to each other, or in the same area ? Thank you, Marty Graybill ============================================================ "For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ." 1 Cor. 3:11 ============================================================ < http://www.anabaptists.org/history/#ba >

My g-grandfather/grandmother, Pierre Henry Bessire, b-Nov 28, 1834 and Elise Grosjean, b-Dec 1, 1840, in Pery, Canton of Bern, departed Pery on April 19, 1869 according to city records in Pery. However, I have not found them on a passenger list, I have looked a number of times thru all the East Coast ports passenger lists from April 1969 thru Dec 1969. This is the French speaking part of Switzerland. Since other family members in 1873 came over from a port out of France, I would guess they also had left from a France port. Is there any passenger lists of ships departing from France for that period?? Also anyone interested in the surnames BESSIRE, GROSJEAN, & CRIBLEZ, I have baptism, marriage and death records from 1696 to 1875 on those families. They lived in Pery, Canton of Bern. Roy Bessire

Dear Bruce: The data from SSD was misunderstood by you. Please review http://www.eye.ch/swissgen/famnam-m.htm to understand what all of it means. The only connection with 1940, was the year Familiennamenbuch was published. The 'a' after the village indicates citizenship from before 1800. In other words, the Touchon family have been citizens of La Sagne for a long, long, long time. Probably back to the 15-1600's. Touchon Familiennamenbuch 1940: Complete NE Neuchâtel a La Sagne a best wishes, Dave Schmutz -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Cardner [mailto:BruceCardner@worldnet.att.net] Sent: Monday, January 24, 2000 6:15 PM To: SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [SWITZ] Wm. E. TOUCHON, Marie Louise GRAU, to USA 1893 [large snip] The SSD information I received indicated there was still a TOUCHON connection in La Sagne in 1940. I received GRAU information from the SSD also, but I have not gotten it translated yet. Someone looked at a copy of the family bible page that I have, and they said it looked like a combination of French, German, and a little Italian mixed in. [large snip] Sydney Cardner (the Sydney is a female name) Florida, USA

Many thanks for all that advised that we had a priest in the family. Paul M. ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul E. Mullett <mullettpe@email.msn.com> To: <SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, January 24, 2000 8:40 PM Subject: [SWITZ] Re: SWITZERLAND-D Digest V99 #441 > I just received a copy of church extract. After the name of one son was the > work in brackets (Sacerdos). I have been unable to find the word in any > dictionary. Anyone have an idea. > Paul Mullett, Louisville, KY > mullettpe@msn.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <SWITZERLAND-D-request@rootsweb.com> > To: <SWITZERLAND-D@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 1999 11:12 PM > Subject: SWITZERLAND-D Digest V99 #441 > > ______________________________

Attiswil is found nearby the villages of: 4532 SO Feldbrunnen 4532 SO St. Niklaus SO 4533 SO Attisholz 4533 SO Riedholz 4534 SO Flumenthal 4535 SO Hubersdorf 4535 SO Kammersrohr 4536 BE Attiswil 4537 BE Wiedlisbach 4538 BE Oberbipp 4539 BE Farnern 4539 BE Rumisberg on the SO, BE cantonal border. data from: http://www.geocities.com/swissschmutz/chpostal-count.html Using http://www.mapquest.com/ - click on 'online maps' I can enter Attiswil and the village is found To get the largest map - click on customize near the bottom and use 999 x 999. It lies about 16 miles northeast of Bern. To the right of the red star, SO is to the left, BE is to the right, hence it is in BE. There is no village (that I can find) named: Oberbigg But there is: 9413 AI Oberegg 8843 SZ Oberiberg nor is there one named: Wiryen Look at http://www.geocities.com/swissschmutz/chpostal-count.html to see if any others seem to come close. best wishes, Dave Schmutz -----Original Message----- From: NNorris803@aol.com [mailto:NNorris803@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2000 12:36 PM To: Subject: Attiswil? Hello, In finding my family's roots, I find Hans Ulrich Weber born Attiswil, Switzerland. Could you help me locate where that is? I am sorry, I have checked all of the maps I can. Sincerely, Nancy Norris Also looking for a researcher in Oberbigg, Wiryen?

Hi Mike - Thanks for responding. The explanation that you offered is certainly quite possible and I considered that for a long, long time - before throwing the questiuon to the list. However, and as I mentioned, this particular passenger list appears to be both legible and thorough. Both 'suspect' people are listed as males. The names aren't close - George for Frances; Johann for Anna Marie. (I mean I could easily understand Francis for France and/or Johann for Johanna. In both cases, the person in question is listed second - immediately after the head of household and immediately before the children. With the exception of the EBERHARD example that I mentioned in my original message, there are no other similar adult couples with families on the entire ship. That is, no other two male, no female couples. So - the mistake would have been made 2-3 times on one page and then never again, either before or after. Nonetheless, I realize that you may be right and I appreciate your input. Thanks. Jim Mike Hobart wrote: > > Jim - one possibility which you did not mention was errors in the passenger > list! I've run across a number of errors in the arrival lists, often at New > Orleans, but that may be just a coincidence. I have seen a number of > instances when the children are listed with the correct name and age but > with the sex wrong and a couple of instances of the wrong sex listed for the > head of the family also. There are also a fair number of errors in the > names, though usually not as dramatic as the examples you have. > > So my own guess would be an error in the data entered on the list, rather > than the person in question actually traveling disguised as the opposite > sex. > > Regards, Mike Hobart

Hi I just wanted to thank those who have put a lot of work onto this website. What I appreciated most was finding links to the families that I was working on. Great to be able to refer now to PRINTED pages rather than handwritten scribble !! I would definitely recommend it to anyone searching for their Swiss roots. You would be suprised what you might find. That plus some research I did this afternoon takes me back a couple more generations . So now for the Weber's am back to the early 1500's - the Horst's side - to the mid 1500's. Fortunately now I know where Barbara Horst came from ( or at least the general area ) plus her family a few more generations back. so I am making a bit more progress !! Shirley tracing Jakob Graf Jan 28 1615 Christian Stauffer bn 1580 Eggiwil Bern Joseph Horst bn 1691 Micheal Schenk bn 1639 Hinten Eggiwil ( one of his decendents married Joseph above) at least now I know where the Micheal orginated from !! Christian Gauman 1600's

Hi ! I've got many ancestors in the La Sagne area. In complement to Sam La Sagne is quite close to the point where cantons Bern, Vaud and Neuchatel touch each other. So your quest shall be less easy than hoped. I never heard of Touchon but some names you mention are quite familiar to me. RICHARS = RICHARD PERRET is a surname I have many times in my family, with a lot of connections... about the language in your bible I would suggest it shall be a kind of french-based dialect still spoken in that area. Sincerely Guillaume - Mulhouse/Cherbourg - France ----- Message d'origine ----- De : Bruce Cardner À : SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Envoyé : mardi 25 janvier 2000 02:14 Objet : [SWITZ] Wm. E. TOUCHON, Marie Louise GRAU, to USA 1893 I have been lurking on the list a while, and it seems to be a patient list when someone is experiencing language difficulties. I have not written for any records yet in Switzerland. I am in the process of gathering what distant US uncles and aunts have stored away. I just received the birth certificate for Bertha Eugenie TOUCHON, b. June, 1892 in Neuchatel. Is La Sagne in Neuchatel? That appears to be her birth place. Her father was William Edouard TOUCHON, b. 1870, son of Jules Ernest TOUCHON and Jeniet ?? Eugenie RICHARS??. Please be patient, as the language is a barrier as well as the poor quality of the copy. Her mother was Marie Louise GRAU, b. 1871, fille de (daughter of?) Alexis (GRAU) and Elise von KANEL. On the 1900 census of Goshen, Connecticut, USA, this family is found with a family of Henri PERRET next to them. This family is also from Switzerland, but they came over in 1888. I suspect there may be a family connection there somewhere. Other surnames connected with the family are DESOULE (sp?) who married a sister of Marie Louise GRAU; HAMM, whom we suspect married a sister of William or Marie who was named Bertha. CORIELL is also a family connection, but that may have occurred here in the USA. CARDNERS also were a connection, but that was definitely in the US. The SSD information I received indicated there was still a TOUCHON connection in La Sagne in 1940. I received GRAU information from the SSD also, but I have not gotten it translated yet. Someone looked at a copy of the family bible page that I have, and they said it looked like a combination of French, German, and a little Italian mixed in. I am posting this surname information in the event there are others researching the same names. Odds are small on a country list, but it does happen sometimes. Best to all on the list, and a thanks to the volunteers in Switzerland who seem to be so helpful on this list. Sydney Cardner (the Sydney is a female name) Florida, USA ==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== Going on vacation? Gone longer than 4 days? mail to Switzerland-L-request@rootsweb.com subject line: unsubscribe nothing in message

----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Schneider <lorenz3@magi.com> To: <SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2000 10:44 AM Subject: [SWITZ] Women Traveling as Men?? > Hello Listers - > > While the inference above seems improbable, to me as well as to most of > you, I've had to entertain it as a possibility regarding the emigration > from Kanton Sank Gallen of some of my direct ancestors. You will see > the particulars below. My question to the list is - has anyone else run > into this practice? > > Two parties of the ZELLER family left Le Havre on 26 May 1845 aboard the > Swanton, which docked in New Orleans on 21 July 1845. > > One party including my great great grandmother - Maria Anna Francesca > ZELLER. That party is listed as incluyding - (with ages) - Joseph (38), > Georg (blank), Francis (16), Maria (15), Josephina (14), Relkina (= > Regina - 12), Francisca (4) and Franz Xavier (3/4). The youngest - > Franz Xavier was actually 7 months of age when the party left Le Havre. > > The other party - led by the uncle of my Joseph ZELLER - consisted - > according to the passenger list - of the following: Francis (60), > Johann (50), Sebastian (12), Barbara (9) and Elizabeth (8). > > In both cases, the people listed comprise an entire family with the > single exception that a second adult male appears on the list instead of > the spouse. Joseph's wife was Frances SELINER (age 40); Francis' wife > was named Anna Maria MAIER (age 50). > > Regarding the first party - the family led by Joseph - their exists the > possibility that the Georg listed was the father of Josepf. Johann > George ZELLER was aged 70 in 1845 and died back in Schaenis in 1848. It > is possible, I suppose, that the father/grandfather escorted the family > to New Orleans and then, at some point, returning to Switzerland. This, > of course, does not explain the absence of the wife/mother - > particularly remarkable given the age of the youngest child. > > Regarding the other party - the family led by Francis - I have searched > the Schaenis church records at length and have not been able to find > another Johann ZELLER within the indicated age bracket. > > Both familes were united and living in St. Clair County, Illinois by the > time of the 1850 federal census. The first family - that of Joseph and > Frances - had a child Caroline, born in St. Clair County on 2 December > 1846 - which would mean that the family was reunited by early March > 1846. > > One other item of note. On the same page of the Swanton's passenger > list, there is a party comprised of Pierre EBERHARD (31), George (32), > Johan (4) and Marc (1). The Eberhard's were a interretalted family from > the same hamlet of Winklen - with the larger community of Schaenis, > Sankt Gallen, Switzerland from which originated the ZELLER family. > > As for the list itself, the writing is quite legible and the other > information on the two ZELLER families is complete and accurate with the > exception of the spelling of the one child's name. > > I have combed, via the ISTG site at Rootsweb, all other ships arriving > in the US between July 1845 and March 1846. I realize that this listing > is incomplete and that I still have work to do when and as I find other > lists. > > That notwithstanding, I'm led to entertain what seems to me to be the > strong possibility that Georg and Johann were, indeed, Frances and Anna > Maria - travelling under the guise of being male. I realize that, for a > variety of reasons, people travelled under assumed names - but I have > never come across reference to people travelling as members of the > opposite sex. > > Thank you for bearing with me. My question, again, is - is there anyone > out there who has come across similar occurrences? Does my deduction > appear implausible? Any input would be greatly appreciated. > > Jim Schneider > Jim - one possibility which you did not mention was errors in the passenger list! I've run across a number of errors in the arrival lists, often at New Orleans, but that may be just a coincidence. I have seen a number of instances when the children are listed with the correct name and age but with the sex wrong and a couple of instances of the wrong sex listed for the head of the family also. There are also a fair number of errors in the names, though usually not as dramatic as the examples you have. So my own guess would be an error in the data entered on the list, rather than the person in question actually traveling disguised as the opposite sex. Regards, Mike Hobart

Hello Listers - While the inference above seems improbable, to me as well as to most of you, I've had to entertain it as a possibility regarding the emigration from Kanton Sank Gallen of some of my direct ancestors. You will see the particulars below. My question to the list is - has anyone else run into this practice? Two parties of the ZELLER family left Le Havre on 26 May 1845 aboard the Swanton, which docked in New Orleans on 21 July 1845. One party including my great great grandmother - Maria Anna Francesca ZELLER. That party is listed as incluyding - (with ages) - Joseph (38), Georg (blank), Francis (16), Maria (15), Josephina (14), Relkina (= Regina - 12), Francisca (4) and Franz Xavier (3/4). The youngest - Franz Xavier was actually 7 months of age when the party left Le Havre. The other party - led by the uncle of my Joseph ZELLER - consisted - according to the passenger list - of the following: Francis (60), Johann (50), Sebastian (12), Barbara (9) and Elizabeth (8). In both cases, the people listed comprise an entire family with the single exception that a second adult male appears on the list instead of the spouse. Joseph's wife was Frances SELINER (age 40); Francis' wife was named Anna Maria MAIER (age 50). Regarding the first party - the family led by Joseph - their exists the possibility that the Georg listed was the father of Josepf. Johann George ZELLER was aged 70 in 1845 and died back in Schaenis in 1848. It is possible, I suppose, that the father/grandfather escorted the family to New Orleans and then, at some point, returning to Switzerland. This, of course, does not explain the absence of the wife/mother - particularly remarkable given the age of the youngest child. Regarding the other party - the family led by Francis - I have searched the Schaenis church records at length and have not been able to find another Johann ZELLER within the indicated age bracket. Both familes were united and living in St. Clair County, Illinois by the time of the 1850 federal census. The first family - that of Joseph and Frances - had a child Caroline, born in St. Clair County on 2 December 1846 - which would mean that the family was reunited by early March 1846. One other item of note. On the same page of the Swanton's passenger list, there is a party comprised of Pierre EBERHARD (31), George (32), Johan (4) and Marc (1). The Eberhard's were a interretalted family from the same hamlet of Winklen - with the larger community of Schaenis, Sankt Gallen, Switzerland from which originated the ZELLER family. As for the list itself, the writing is quite legible and the other information on the two ZELLER families is complete and accurate with the exception of the spelling of the one child's name. I have combed, via the ISTG site at Rootsweb, all other ships arriving in the US between July 1845 and March 1846. I realize that this listing is incomplete and that I still have work to do when and as I find other lists. That notwithstanding, I'm led to entertain what seems to me to be the strong possibility that Georg and Johann were, indeed, Frances and Anna Maria - travelling under the guise of being male. I realize that, for a variety of reasons, people travelled under assumed names - but I have never come across reference to people travelling as members of the opposite sex. Thank you for bearing with me. My question, again, is - is there anyone out there who has come across similar occurrences? Does my deduction appear implausible? Any input would be greatly appreciated. Jim Schneider

In a message dated 1/25/00 12:43:26 PM, SWITZERLAND-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: >: NNorris803@aol.com Nancy< Our name is Beeler. Do you have any dates of later Beelers in the US? We have not been able to trace back beyond the US but do know that Beeler with this spelling is a Swiss name. I tried to email you direct and was told "this is not a known name" Billie iharpi@aol.com

Seelentag Wolfhart Dr. KSSG_RO wrote: > > The translation into German would be "Schweizer Garde" - which is the German > name of the Pope's "bodyguards" in the Vatican : mainly representative > nowadays, but well known soldiers in earlier centuries. Check > http://www.datacomm.ch/awicky/gsp/index.html > (sorry - in German only). I would consider this the most likely explanation, > though I cannot exclude for sure that some other Swiss regiment (and there > were lots of them) could also be meant. > > Best regards - Wolf > Wolf, Do you know whether muster rolls exist for service in the Papal Guard in earlier times? Best regards, Trigg Lupher > > ---------- > > Von: Julie Sass[SMTP:sassy1@mindspring.com] > > Gesendet: Montag, 24. Januar 2000 13:11 > > An: SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com > > Betreff: [SWITZ] Legio Helvetica > > > > This question came up on the B-W List...Anyone on the Swiss List have any > > further information or comments on the Legio Helvetica? > > > > Thanks for any input. > > > > Julie > > > > In a message dated 01/23/2000 7:32:38 AM Pacific Standard Time, > > g.rotter@t-online.de writes: > > > > << 1748, across a "former soldier" of the "Legio Helvetica". > > Has anybody any idea what kind of soldiery this "Legio" was? >> > > > > Legio helvetica is Latin for "Swiss Regiment." That in itself doesn't > > tell > > you which Swiss regiment or for whom they were fighting at the time. The > > Swiss contracted regiments to many European governments--for example, > > there was a Swiss regiment stationed in Canada for the British as late as > > the > > War of 1812. You will need to find more identifying data. Virginia > > > > ==== SWITZERLAND Mailing List ==== > Going on vacation? Gone longer than 4 days? > mail to Switzerland-L-request@rootsweb.com > subject line: unsubscribe > nothing in message > Do not add anything else but the one word.... unsubscribe

----- Original Message ----- From: Amelia O. Debusman <amelia@iglou.com> To: <SWITZERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2000 7:38 AM Subject: [SWITZ] Guides > Is there a book that outlines how to search in Switzerland? The LDS site > does not mention a research guide for Switzerland like it has for many > places. I have found those helpful in the past. I have also used different > ones for other locales. > > Thanks, > Amelia There is an LDS research guide for Switzerland. I've got it and found it exceedingly useful when I was starting my research on Swiss lines. I still refer to it from time to time. Not sure why it's not mentioned at the web site but it's still in the racks on the international floor at the LDS Family History Library. Regards, Mike Hobart

I am researching Michael Bealer/Beeler and don't know the original spelling prob. of Canton Bern. Do they pronounce Buhler the same way? Nancy Norris

I have the following names in our family history as places of birth. Could someone help me as to where Attiswil Switzerland is and also I have Oberburg Wiryen? Thanks for any help. Would like to find a researcher for Canton Bern and above places. Nancy Norris