I am new to this list and doing some research for a friend. Is anyone researching WALDER? I am getting in a muddle with them and need a little guidance, please! I have a Frederick J WALDER who married Harriet SOTHERDEN in 1884. Frederick, who was down as John on the certificate, said he was 29 on the marriage certificate which gives a birth year of 1855. He also said his father was William (deceased). A William WALDER married an Elizabeth WALDER which confuses things even more! They did not have a child Frederick, but they did have a John b 1851 Rogate. The only Frederick I can find was one born in Rogate in 1857. I sent for his birth certificate but his parents are given as Alfred & Maria which has completely thrown me! It looks as if Maria's maiden name was Hear or something like it. Have not investigated that yet. In 1901 Frederick is actually down as John Walder with wife Harriet in Tonbridge, Kent. I KNOW that this is the correct husband with the correct children. His age is 45 which gives a birth year of 1856. Born in Rogate. In 1891 Harriet is with the children and no sign of husband Frederick (or John). Again I know I have the correct family there. But where is Frederick or John? I have also looked for an alternative spouse for Harriet thinking I had the wrong marriage certificate, but I cannot find one. Can anyone help out here please? That would be great. Suzie (from Orkney)

Hi Suzie The only marriage I can find with a harriett Sotherden around the time frame is St George Hanover Square London in 1884 to a John Walden. NOT Walder...... No births for a John or Frederick Waldon/Walden found. NOTE an r is often mistranscribed as an n and vica versa. Is this the correct marriage? Freebmd has three Frederick J Walder's - none for the time frame anywhere Just Frederick Walder, there is one "registered" Midhurst on the border of Hampshire and Sussex 2b,page 341 red March Q. Midhurst in only 5.1 miles from Rogate. bearing in mind that nothing in truly complete this is the best so far. You could order the Birth certificate with the stipulation that the father is William. He could well have been registered late. I have to go through this logically from start to finish, so may be a bit bothersome. To get it right in my head. 1861 census No Frederick Walder at all. three Johns. One is with an Uncle Richard, Father John and Mother Mary with siblings. John and Richard Farmers born Horsham which is 23 miles from Rogate (although Rogate might be a red herring) Down the street Soloman Wlader and Family. The other parents Peter and Fanny born 1854, the last born 1860 too late according to the marriage (presuming the marriage is correct). 1871 census, nothing that stands out apart from Alfred and Maria... BUT on the upside on the 1881 census has a John, living St George Hanover as a Servant, which is likely the John Walder that married Harriett St George Hanover 1884. UNMARRIED......which ties in with the 1884 marriage Age is correct - born 1855. Born Petworth which is only 10.6 miles from Rogate. AND in 1891 the same John Walder in St George Hanover as a servant,(groom) this time married........born rogate Ssx at 4 Grantham Place, St Geo Han, servant right age So this John Walder is the one that married Harriett Sotherden in St George Hanover 1884 I have had this time and again in Sussex.........giving different places as their place of birth, when in fact all the places they name are within cooee of each other as we say in Oz. I suggest your next step is to get the Parish registers for all these places and make a database of Walder's from Rogate, Petworth. At one I am sure you will find the parents William and whomever. Ok the fly in this ointment is....there is a Harriett Welder 1891 CENSUS, St George Hanover, 44 born Chichester Sussex.....single......however, many females in service gave their status as single to prevent being "let go". Because you have found harriett with kids in 1891 I can only suggest that the research I have done, either suggests there is another option OR to discount the ones I found, which may help in the scheme of things. You do not give Harrietts age or place of birth, the children's names so I can go no further. I just followed through from the Freebmd, to the IGI to the censuses. You of course must have more information to come to the conclusions you have. The ages and places and marriage all fits for mine. BUT without more in depth info I cannot go further. One other thought to put the cat amongst the pigeons. Frederick J's father may have fone by his second christian name also. Oh yes I have found this too. I suugest you do like most of us do and wade through the Parish registers for the most likely places. Rogate especially seeing as both you and I have found TWO John Walder's from Rogate with possible wives Harriett. Probably cousins. So this is the obvious next course. Time consuming but worth it. Also do petworth. A few birth certificates might not go astray to ensure ytou are not barking up the wrong tree, literally. I hope I have not confused you. You obviously came from harrietts direction as I came from John/Fredericks with limitations of what you told us. But there are some variables. It's given you something to ponder, and something to discount or add into the equation. there are two Johns, 1891 census......... Cheers Pam from Adelaide Australia >I am new to this list and doing some research for a friend. > > Is anyone researching WALDER? I am getting in a muddle with them and need > a > little guidance, please! > > I have a Frederick J WALDER who married Harriet SOTHERDEN in 1884. > Frederick, who was down as John on the certificate, said he was 29 on the > marriage certificate which gives a birth year of 1855. He also said his > father was William (deceased). > > A William WALDER married an Elizabeth WALDER which confuses things even > more! > They did not have a child Frederick, but they did have a John b 1851 > Rogate. > > The only Frederick I can find was one born in Rogate in 1857. I sent for > his > birth certificate but his parents are given as Alfred & Maria which has > completely thrown me! It looks as if Maria's maiden name was Hear or > something like it. Have not investigated that yet. > > In 1901 Frederick is actually down as John Walder with wife Harriet in > Tonbridge, Kent. I KNOW that this is the correct husband with the correct > children. His age is 45 which gives a birth year of 1856. Born in Rogate. > > In 1891 Harriet is with the children and no sign of husband Frederick (or > John). Again I know I have the correct family there. But where is > Frederick > or John? > > I have also looked for an alternative spouse for Harriet thinking I had > the > wrong marriage certificate, but I cannot find one. > > Can anyone help out here please? That would be great. > > Suzie (from Orkney) > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SUSSEX-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.5/990 - Release Date: 4/09/2007 > 10:36 PM > >

Pam. Just home from working all day so need time to get my head round the information you sent and what you have suggested. It's all a bit complicated. I have also found a John WALDER bap Rogate 4 May 1856 with parents John & Mary Ann. Date-wise this one fits well apart from the father's name! The Frederick WALDER bap 5 Apr 1857 to Alfred & Maria married someone else, so he's not mine. Will ponder this further and get back to you. Many many thanks. Suzie (from Orkney) ----- Original Message ----- From: "pamhillier" <pamhillier@iprimus.com.au> To: <SUSSEX-PLUS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 9:42 AM Subject: Re: [SXP] Frederick WALDER Hi Suzie The only marriage I can find with a harriett Sotherden around the time frame is St George Hanover Square London in 1884 to a John Walden. NOT Walder...... No births for a John or Frederick Waldon/Walden found. NOTE an r is often mistranscribed as an n and vica versa. Is this the correct marriage? Freebmd has three Frederick J Walder's - none for the time frame anywhere Just Frederick Walder, there is one "registered" Midhurst on the border of Hampshire and Sussex 2b,page 341 red March Q. Midhurst in only 5.1 miles from Rogate. bearing in mind that nothing in truly complete this is the best so far. You could order the Birth certificate with the stipulation that the father is William. He could well have been registered late. I have to go through this logically from start to finish, so may be a bit bothersome. To get it right in my head. 1861 census No Frederick Walder at all. three Johns. One is with an Uncle Richard, Father John and Mother Mary with siblings. John and Richard Farmers born Horsham which is 23 miles from Rogate (although Rogate might be a red herring) Down the street Soloman Wlader and Family. The other parents Peter and Fanny born 1854, the last born 1860 too late according to the marriage (presuming the marriage is correct). 1871 census, nothing that stands out apart from Alfred and Maria... BUT on the upside on the 1881 census has a John, living St George Hanover as a Servant, which is likely the John Walder that married Harriett St George Hanover 1884. UNMARRIED......which ties in with the 1884 marriage Age is correct - born 1855. Born Petworth which is only 10.6 miles from Rogate. AND in 1891 the same John Walder in St George Hanover as a servant,(groom) this time married........born rogate Ssx at 4 Grantham Place, St Geo Han, servant right age So this John Walder is the one that married Harriett Sotherden in St George Hanover 1884 I have had this time and again in Sussex.........giving different places as their place of birth, when in fact all the places they name are within cooee of each other as we say in Oz. I suggest your next step is to get the Parish registers for all these places and make a database of Walder's from Rogate, Petworth. At one I am sure you will find the parents William and whomever. Ok the fly in this ointment is....there is a Harriett Welder 1891 CENSUS, St George Hanover, 44 born Chichester Sussex.....single......however, many females in service gave their status as single to prevent being "let go". Because you have found harriett with kids in 1891 I can only suggest that the research I have done, either suggests there is another option OR to discount the ones I found, which may help in the scheme of things. You do not give Harrietts age or place of birth, the children's names so I can go no further. I just followed through from the Freebmd, to the IGI to the censuses. You of course must have more information to come to the conclusions you have. The ages and places and marriage all fits for mine. BUT without more in depth info I cannot go further. One other thought to put the cat amongst the pigeons. Frederick J's father may have fone by his second christian name also. Oh yes I have found this too. I suugest you do like most of us do and wade through the Parish registers for the most likely places. Rogate especially seeing as both you and I have found TWO John Walder's from Rogate with possible wives Harriett. Probably cousins. So this is the obvious next course. Time consuming but worth it. Also do petworth. A few birth certificates might not go astray to ensure ytou are not barking up the wrong tree, literally. I hope I have not confused you. You obviously came from harrietts direction as I came from John/Fredericks with limitations of what you told us. But there are some variables. It's given you something to ponder, and something to discount or add into the equation. there are two Johns, 1891 census......... Cheers Pam from Adelaide Australia >I am new to this list and doing some research for a friend. > > Is anyone researching WALDER? I am getting in a muddle with them and need > a > little guidance, please! > > I have a Frederick J WALDER who married Harriet SOTHERDEN in 1884. > Frederick, who was down as John on the certificate, said he was 29 on the > marriage certificate which gives a birth year of 1855. He also said his > father was William (deceased). > > A William WALDER married an Elizabeth WALDER which confuses things even > more! > They did not have a child Frederick, but they did have a John b 1851 > Rogate. > > The only Frederick I can find was one born in Rogate in 1857. I sent for > his > birth certificate but his parents are given as Alfred & Maria which has > completely thrown me! It looks as if Maria's maiden name was Hear or > something like it. Have not investigated that yet. > > In 1901 Frederick is actually down as John Walder with wife Harriet in > Tonbridge, Kent. I KNOW that this is the correct husband with the correct > children. His age is 45 which gives a birth year of 1856. Born in Rogate. > > In 1891 Harriet is with the children and no sign of husband Frederick (or > John). Again I know I have the correct family there. But where is > Frederick > or John? > > I have also looked for an alternative spouse for Harriet thinking I had > the > wrong marriage certificate, but I cannot find one. > > Can anyone help out here please? That would be great. > > Suzie (from Orkney) > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SUSSEX-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.5/990 - Release Date: 4/09/2007 > 10:36 PM > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SUSSEX-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message