Wonder if anyone can tell me what is meant by the phrase "black dutch?" My grandmother Ara Mae Surginer always said that her dad "Fate" (W.L. or Wesley Lafeyete Surginer)said their family was "Black Dutch" and "a drop in the bucket" cherokee. By the way, Surginers in that family spell their last name variously: Surginer or Surgener. The spellings of "Lafeyete" also vary on both sides of the family. I have many other names in this particular line, by the way, if anyone is researching. Mostly from Texas, from KY via TN. I am stuck between 1860 and the 1830 Surginers and can't find a clear path, like many of you. I Continue to read contributions to the list with interest. Kay Shock [email protected] _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

That drop in the bucket Cherokee is probably why you've heard the term "Black Dutch". It was a phrase used by people who had Indian blood in them, but were afraid to admit it for fear of being sent west. It's the same with the term Black Irish as well. It was a way of stepping around the fact that you had Indian in you at a time when that information would have taken you away from your loved ones who were not of Indian descent. I'm not an expert on this. I just happened to do a lookup on it. Many web sites were vague on the meaning and even indicate that it's a vague term. If anyone else can shed a little more light on the subject, or correct me. Please do. I have never researched "Black Dutch", but have seen the question posed before. I just couldn't remember the responses. Tina Hall SURGENER list manager -----Original Message----- From: Kay Shock [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, March 30, 2001 12:10 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [SURGENER-L] surgener question Wonder if anyone can tell me what is meant by the phrase "black dutch?" My grandmother Ara Mae Surginer always said that her dad "Fate" (W.L. or Wesley Lafeyete Surginer)said their family was "Black Dutch" and "a drop in the bucket" cherokee. By the way, Surginers in that family spell their last name variously: Surginer or Surgener. The spellings of "Lafeyete" also vary on both sides of the family. I have many other names in this particular line, by the way, if anyone is researching. Mostly from Texas, from KY via TN. I am stuck between 1860 and the 1830 Surginers and can't find a clear path, like many of you. I Continue to read contributions to the list with interest. Kay Shock [email protected]