Hi Ken, Thank you for your reply. I did see the birth notice at Plomsgate. Where is that in relation to Marlesford? Is the Marlesford register available on line?. I live in Australia so it is not possible for me to get there. I acn't see a James Messenger b1852 in my line of Messengers. Regards Liz ----- Original Message ----- From: "k.finch" <k.finch@ntlworld.com> To: <suffolk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 5:46 AM Subject: Re: [SFK-UK] William Messenger son of Charles > But there is also a William in June 1858 in Plomesgate. > > I think a check on the Marlesford register could be interesting. > > The Messengers tie my son in law's family to mine but its a james born > 1852 > thats the link when he married Amelia Ling in Tunstall on 20th March 1875 > > Ken > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Nivard Ovington" <ovington1@sky.com> > To: <suffolk@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, June 26, 2010 9:00 AM > Subject: Re: [SFK-UK] William Messenger son of Charles > > >> Hi Liz >> >> Although the 1858 entry is an extraction it is still a transcript >> >> Check the original baptism to see if the mother is recorded as Mary or >> Eliza >> although the mistake could be by the Vicar and either way will not tell >> you >> the mothers name (unless he was illegitimate) >> >> Ultimately the way forward would be to obtain the birth cert for William >> which will give his mothers maiden name which is most likely Eliza CABLE >> >> Given the dates of the baptisms, the later birth is most likely to be >> yours >> >> Births Sep 1858 >> Messenger William Plomesgate 4a 563 >> >> Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) >> >> >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SUFFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi again Liz A copy of the source document can be ordered direct from the LDS for not a lot Or the records office, however although I would advocate getting a copy at some point, it will not tell you the mothers maiden name (unless the child was illegitimate which does not appear to be the case) Baptisms do not record the mothers maiden name The birth cert is your best way forward Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Hi Nivard, > Thank you for your reply.How can I check the transcript? I have a basic > Ancestry subscription but is does not allow me to view Baptisms.Is there > any > other way before I send for the certificate. > Regards > Liz in Australia

Lots of English emigrants to NZ would be interested in news from home. It was probably reported in Australian , Canadian and South African papers as well. Anne South Australia Rebecca Chapman wrote: > Hi, > > > > I wonder if someone might know why a case concerning my relative (who > attempted to poison her child in 1874) was reported on in a New Zealand > Newspaper!!!! > > > > I would be very interested to know why this was (please note that she was > sentenced to 10 years in prison in Norfolk). > > > > Many thanks > > > > Rebecca >

Hi Listers Thanks to Honor and David for their help regarding my hunt for MORLEY entries (Baptism of the unbaptised). I'm still chasing them, but now have another quey in the same context. Does anyone have access to Hinderclay parish registers for 1865, who could verify a marriage of Elizabeth EDWARDS during the summer of that year, and if so provide the name of the bridegroom, etc. Many thanks Brian _________________________________________________________________ http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/195013117/direct/01/ We want to hear all your funny, exciting and crazy Hotmail stories. Tell us now

Hi, I wonder if someone might know why a case concerning my relative (who attempted to poison her child in 1874) was reported on in a New Zealand Newspaper!!!! I would be very interested to know why this was (please note that she was sentenced to 10 years in prison in Norfolk). Many thanks Rebecca

But there is also a William in June 1858 in Plomesgate. I think a check on the Marlesford register could be interesting. The Messengers tie my son in law's family to mine but its a james born 1852 thats the link when he married Amelia Ling in Tunstall on 20th March 1875 Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nivard Ovington" <ovington1@sky.com> To: <suffolk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, June 26, 2010 9:00 AM Subject: Re: [SFK-UK] William Messenger son of Charles > Hi Liz > > Although the 1858 entry is an extraction it is still a transcript > > Check the original baptism to see if the mother is recorded as Mary or > Eliza > although the mistake could be by the Vicar and either way will not tell > you > the mothers name (unless he was illegitimate) > > Ultimately the way forward would be to obtain the birth cert for William > which will give his mothers maiden name which is most likely Eliza CABLE > > Given the dates of the baptisms, the later birth is most likely to be > yours > > Births Sep 1858 > Messenger William Plomesgate 4a 563 > > Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > > > >

Hi Everyone, I have always found the people on this list very helpfull in the past and I am hoping that you can help me once again. I have Charles Messenger born 1832 Marlesford Suffolk who had a son William born about 1858. I have found Charles on the census with his family 1861,81,91,01. And his wife is always listed as Eliza. I have found a marriage for Charles and Eliza Cable 1853 in Marlesford. Family search has William Messenger Christened 26th September 1858 father Charles and mother Mary surname unknown.I have not been able to find a marriage for Charles and Mary nor have I been able to find them on the census. Both famlies seem to have had children by the names of William, Alice and Walter My great grandfather is William Messenger and on his marriage cert for 1883 he is age 25 and his father is Charles.I would really like to know who his mother is. Hope someone can help me Regards Liz

I found a marriage of Mirabell Hill of Claydon Suffolk in the marriage register for West Ham Essex in 1655. You can see it on http://seax.essexcc.gov.uk/Images.Net/Default.aspx?ID=961253 <http://seax.essexcc.gov.uk/Images.Net/Default.aspx?ID=961253&intThisRecords OffSet=&intOffSet> &intThisRecordsOffSet=&intOffSet= which might be of help to someone. Wishing you every success in your researches Giles Colchester, Researching COLCHESTER family, any spelling, any time, any place And PACKARD in Suffolk

just a hypothesis, but in the U.S., early newspaper editors were desperate for anything to keep their paper alive, and the more sensational stuff got people to buy the paper. also, news from "back home" was important, so there was (before we got whitewashed by our government) news from England, some from Europe, and scattered information from all over the newly forming states and even from Indian Territory. whatever was news that might grab peoples attention was put in, some of it simply gossip, some of it was who was seen about town and who was leaving for other places either as a visit or perminantly. crimes from the area and any really scandalous news from elsewhere, plus how the crops and stock (farm animals) were doing, what disease was hitting who or what at the time, and the weather. that and many other pieces of information, useful or not, fill paper space and make the news of the day, often crossing large masses of water or land for no reason other than curiosity. so it could simply be that the poisoning of a child was so shocking that the editor felt the need to report it. I could be wrong, family scattered far and wide and perhaps there was family there, but the preponderance is on the editor's need to keep his audiance interested in buying his paper. Cornelia Oregon, U.S.A. BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; } On Sat 06/26/10 1:48 PM , "Rebecca Chapman" rebecca@eopeo.com sent: Hi, I wonder if someone might know why a case concerning my relative (who attempted to poison her child in 1874) was reported on in a New Zealand Newspaper!!!! I would be very interested to know why this was (please note that she was sentenced to 10 years in prison in Norfolk). Many thanks Rebecca ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SUFFOLK-request@rootsweb.com [1] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Links: ------ [1] mailto:SUFFOLK-request@rootsweb.com

Hi Liz Although the 1858 entry is an extraction it is still a transcript Check the original baptism to see if the mother is recorded as Mary or Eliza although the mistake could be by the Vicar and either way will not tell you the mothers name (unless he was illegitimate) Ultimately the way forward would be to obtain the birth cert for William which will give his mothers maiden name which is most likely Eliza CABLE Given the dates of the baptisms, the later birth is most likely to be yours Births Sep 1858 Messenger William Plomesgate 4a 563 Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > Hi Everyone, > > I have always found the people on this list very helpfull in the past and > I am hoping that you can help me once again. > > I have Charles Messenger born 1832 Marlesford Suffolk who had a son > William born about 1858. I have found Charles on the census with his > family 1861,81,91,01. And his wife is always listed as Eliza. I have found > a marriage for Charles and Eliza Cable 1853 in Marlesford. > > Family search has William Messenger Christened 26th September 1858 father > Charles and mother Mary surname unknown.I have not been able to find a > marriage for Charles and Mary nor have I been able to find them on the > census. > > Both famlies seem to have had children by the names of William, Alice and > Walter > > My great grandfather is William Messenger and on his marriage cert for > 1883 he is age 25 and his father is Charles.I would really like to know > who his mother is. > > Hope someone can help me > Regards > > Liz

Thanks Brian, I will try that addy. Marg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Lummis" <lummis@btinternet.com> To: <suffolk@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, June 26, 2010 2:09 AM Subject: Re: [SFK-UK] Lynette Rabbitt > Marg & Neil Andrews <margay@tadaust.org.au> wrote: >> Hi all, >> A fellow genie is looking for Lynette and I have seen her answering >> requests on one of my mailing lists. >> Is it this one? >> If anyone knows her email addy, I would appreciate a reply. > > Hi Marg > > A search of the Rootsweb Mailing List Archives gives lrabbitt@big.net.au > as > Lynette's email address. > > Brian > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SUFFOLK-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi all, A fellow genie is looking for Lynette and I have seen her answering requests on one of my mailing lists. Is it this one? If anyone knows her email addy, I would appreciate a reply. The fellow looking for her is another helpful genie who lost info when his computer 'lost it" !! So I would like to help him reconnect with Lynette. Marg Andrews in Oz

Marg & Neil Andrews <margay@tadaust.org.au> wrote: > Hi all, > A fellow genie is looking for Lynette and I have seen her answering > requests on one of my mailing lists. > Is it this one? > If anyone knows her email addy, I would appreciate a reply. Hi Marg A search of the Rootsweb Mailing List Archives gives lrabbitt@big.net.au as Lynette's email address. Brian

David Vesey <veseybrown@sympatico.ca> wrote: > Found a reference in a circa 1338 document to Chedebury Suffolk. > Any one have a view on today's name ( ? Chedburgh?) Chedburgh it is! Have a look at The Place Names of Suffolk at http://www.archive.org/stream/placenamesofsuff00skearich/placenamesofsuff00skearich_djvu.txt and search for Chedebury and you will find this amongst the various spellings for Chedburgh. Brian

Hi Chedburgh springs to my mind too and its only about 7 miles from Bury St Edmunds. I have lived in both places Ann Found a reference in a circa 1338 document to Chedebury Suffolk. Any one have a view on today's name ( ? Chedburgh?) David Vesey Toronto

Somehow soundsmore likely to be Chedburgh rather than Chediston. The former is close to Horringer which used to be known as Horningsheath. Pat ... ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Vesey" <veseybrown@sympatico.ca> > Found a reference in a circa 1338 document to Chedebury Suffolk. > Any one have a view on today's name ( ? Chedburgh?) > > David Vesey > Toronto

Thanks for this information Roger, this is my family of Self's. About all the information I have on them is the 1841 and 1851 census info that I got from Rooney and what you have just sent. thanks so much for it. Any more information appreciated. Thanks. Bye for now. Leona Jensen

Found a reference in a circa 1338 document to Chedebury Suffolk. Any one have a view on today's name ( ? Chedburgh?) David Vesey Toronto

Hi Roger thanks for your reply dont know whether any of these are related to me but have noted them for further research. Have you ever come across this Self site www.dself.dls.pipex.com and click on genealogy it might be of interest to you. kind regards Janice

Hello Brian Mary Ann Elizabeth MORLEY was buried at Thrandeston on 17 June 1875, aged 5 months. She's in the Suffolk Burial Index, along with Mary Ann Louisa (1873) and Frederick Charles (1880). Sadly, no such "luck" with the 13th child. You describe Mary Ann Louisa (b. Hinderclay - 1865 Q4 Stow district) as the eldest. The IGI indicates that she was baptized as late as 1868 at Thrandeston, on the same day as her brothers Joseph Grimwood (b. 1867 Q1) and James Henry (b. 1868 Q2), who were both born there (in Hartismere district). I thought there might have been an older child between the 1863 marriage in Depwade district and the birth of Mary Ann Louisa in 1865. One possibility in Depwade that looked quite promising was Bertha Betsy, b. 1864 Q3, whose death was probably registered at the age of 2 as Betsy B. MORLEY in 1866 Q2. But there is a rather serious problem with the 1863 MORLEY-MOORE wedding: it didn't happen! Guessing that Diss would be a likely parish, since Elizabeth lived there in 1911, I checked the images of Norfolk parish registers at FamilySearch (http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#c=fs%3A1416598&s=waypointsOnly&w=0&p=waypoint). Image 81 (of 144 in m. 1845-1871; page 187) shows that Elizabeth MOORE married William PIKE on 7 Sept. and James MORLEY married Phoebe or Phebe SWOOTMAN on 18 Sept. 1863. So where were James and Elizabeth wed, and are you sure she was a MOORE and not a GRIMWOOD? If she had really been married 40 years before 1911, that would be 1870-71. The closest match I found was in the Sudbury district in 1874 Q4: James MORLEY and Elizabeth SPARKS. I suppose at least one of them could have had children from a previous marriage, but Sudbury is not particularly close to Thrandeston. David Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2010 19:52:57 +0100 From: Brian Evans <brinvansea@hotmail.co.uk> Subject: [SFK-UK] MOORE & MORLEY - Burials of the unbaptised To: Suffolk List <suffolk@rootsweb.com> Hello listers, Elizabeth MORLEY (nee MOORE, possibly b. 1840, Pakenham) was living in Diss in 1911, but, although widowed, she [helpfully] completed the marriage details on the census form, viz: married 40 years, 13 children, 7 still living, 6 died. She married James MORLEY (b. 1838, Hinderclay) in 1863, in Depwade RD, Norfolk, but the census entries indicate that they lived most of their married life in Thrandeston. I've been trying to 'collect' these thirteen children carefully recorded on the census. The seven still living (Joseph Grimwood (b.1867), James Henry (b.1868), George William (b. 1872), Eliza Matilda & Arthur Edward (twins, b.1876), Mary Elizabeth (b.1878) and Annie Louisa (b. 1882)) are all fairly clear. Apart from these seven, I know definitely of Frederick Charles, who died at a few weeks in 1880, and I've found the death of their eldest daughter, Mary Ann Louisa, (b.1865, d.1873). That leaves four more to find, and I've found three probable pairs of entries on FreeBMD for Eliza (b & d. Mar qtr 1869), Arthur (b. & d. Sep qtr 1873) and Mary Ann Elizabeth (b. & d. June qtr 1875), but the last one eludes me. Of these three 'possibles', I've found the baptism of Mary Ann Elizabeth in Thrandeston on 6.6.1875, and although the burials beyond January 1875 are on the next fiche (no.10) that I don't have, I suspect she will be found there. However, I was unable to find either baptism or burial entries for Eliza or Arthur. My query, therefore, is this: if these children died before they could be baptised, would it be the practice for them to be buried in the churchyard (albeit possibly in a separate part) and NOT entered in the parish register? Any help to confirm my assumptions, and/or find that elusive thirteenth child would also be gratefully appreciated. Thanks, Brian ... in sunny Letchworth, the First Garden City