Hello Philip Thank you for the suggestion. Helenor MEADOWS rings a bell with me, but not certain why. I have a thick pile of WRONG certificates but that one isn't in it. I've tried looking for her in the census, but can't find her. One of my biggest failings is have not started a file of Disproved possibilities. Something I have recently started, but should have don back in the mid 90's. I have a large number of girls that I have completely disproved and a lot that I haven't. They've just disappeared into thin air. As more data becomes available, hopefully they may reappear and I can prove that one is Gt Granny. Thank you again for your suggestion and your interest. Regards Michael On 23-Sep-12 9:41 AM, Philip Maddocks wrote: > possibly waste the price of a birth certificate on > > Dec 1873 > Meadows Helenor Elizabeth Yarmouth 4b 16 > > Philip Maddocks > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> > Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 4:05 PM > Subject: [SFK-UK] bastardy orders > > >> I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according >> to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to >> the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. >> >> According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, >> Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. >> >> I can't find her in the 1891 or 1881 census and I can't find her birth >> registration. There are a few possibilities but they have all been >> disproved. >> >> I've thought for a long time that she was perhaps the illegitimate >> daughter of a Scottish fisher girl and local fisherman. Or the >> illegitimate daughter of a local girl and a Scottish fisherman. >> >> If either is the case, then there may well be some form of legal >> document, somewhere. Such as a bastardy order. >> >> Does anybody know if there are any and if so are they in the public >> domain. >> >> My Gt. Granny was Helen Elizabeth WILSON. >> >> Many thanks >> >> Michael in Lancashire >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Paula, Could this be your man? parents: Robert Everson,&#8203; Mary name: Robert Everson gender: Male baptism/christening date: 28 Sep 1704 baptism/christening place: THORNDON,SUFFOLK,ENGLAND birth date: 28 Sep 1704 father's name: Robert Everson mother's name: Mary indexing project (batch) number: P01300-1 system origin: England-ODM source film number: Q942.64 T4 V26T Best, Ken Message: 9 Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2012 15:57:07 +1000 From: Paula Hadgraft <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [SFK-UK] My Brickwall - Robert Everson b. c1705 To: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]om> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi all, Thanks to Bob Stephenson, I now have the baptisms of Robert Everson's missing children, who were baptised at Creeting St. Mary as follows: 07 Apr 1728 Robert Everston, son of Robert 26 Apr 1730 Sarah Everston, son of Robert 25 Jun 1732 Mary Everston, dau pf Robert Bob, suggested checking Elmsett for Robert snr's baptism, however I do have a transcript of baptisms between 1700-1900 and there are no baptisms at all in Elmsett for any Everson's during this time, only the three burials of him, his daughter Elizabeth in 1727 and his 2nd wife Mary Barber in 1754. Do you guys think it is worth me trying to check earlier than 1700 in Elmsett for a baptism for Robert Everson, bearing in mind that he first married in 1726? I did notice while looking through the Suffolk Burial Index that there are several burials at Hitcham around 1700-1705 and burial at Bildeston. There are also a lot at Combs as well. I had a look back through my records and realised that the search that I had done at Combs was only for Robert's children Robert & Sarah, not for Robert himself. Does anyone have the parish registers for Combs and if so would you mind checking for a baptism for Robert Everson abt 1700? Any help that any of you can offer would be wonderful. Thanks and take care, Paula Hadgraft Melbourne, Australia On 24 September 2012 19:07, Paula Hadgraft <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi all, > > I have been trying to track down my 7th great grandfather for about 20 > years now with no luck, so I am wondering if anyone can help or offer > any suggestions to help me find him. > > I am looking for: > > ROBERT EVERSON b. abt 1700-1705. Could also be spelt as Eversden, > Everston, Evison etc. > > He married SARAH GOUDE/GOODE in Bramford on 11 Oct 1726, stating he > was from Barham, however there is no baptism for him there. He has one > daughter who is buried in Elmsett in 1727 (Source: SBI) and then I > have a gap until 1733, where he then baptises 5 children in Somersham. > > The baptisms for the 2 children that I can't find during this time are: > > ROBERT EVERSON b. abt 1728 (he married Ann Tricker at Stowmarket in 1749) > SARAH EVERSON b. abt 1731 (shemarried Jeremiah Garwood at Aldham in 1757) > > Robert was buried in Elmsett on 20 Apr 1748. His 1st wife Sarah was > buried in Somersham in 1742. His 2nd wife Mary Barber was buried in > Elmsett in 1754, Source: Suffolk Burial Index > > I've so far checked the following parishes for a baptism for Robert > Everson and his 2 children: Aldham, Barham, Barking, Battisford, > Belstead, Bentley, Bramford, Brantham, Burstall, Capel St. Mary, > Chattisham, Chelmondiston, Claydon, Combs, Copdock, Creeting St. Mary, > Earl Stonham, East Bergholt, Elmsett, Erwarton, Great Blakenham, Great > Wenham, Harkstead, Hintlesham, Holbrook, Ipswich St. Clement, Ipswich > St. Margaret, Ipswich St. Matthew, Ipswich St. Peter. Ipswich St. > Stephen, Kersey, Little Blakenham, Little Wenham, Needham Market, > Offton, Shotley, Somersham, Sproughton, Stutton, Whatfield, Wherstead, > Washbrook and came up with nothing. > > If anyone on the list has any PR's from around this area that isn't on > the list of searched parishes would you please help by checking them > for me, even if it is to just cross more places off of my list. > > Thank you and hugs, > > Paula

Hi Linda, Will check 'Early Country Motoring, cars and motorcycles in Suffolk 1896-1940' tomorrow for you, it has information on various motor companies in Ipswich. Pat ... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Linda" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 7:16 PM Subject: [SFK-UK] Ipswich Carriage business 1901-1911 > Hi Everyone > > In the 1901 Census, Civil Parish of St. Clement, Ecclesiastical Parish of > St. Barthlomew.living in 59 Tomline Rd., my Grandfather Charles Henry > Vesey's brother Fred is seen working as a Coachbuilder's Clerk in the > Carriage Motor Building Trade. By 1911 he was joined by my grandfather I > presume in that same business, hired also as clerk. It seems they left > their jobs in the printing business to work at this carriage > (automotive?) > business. Was there any one business in Ipswich that might be that early > company? I'd love to know a name and a little history. > > Thanks for any help you can give > > Linda > > B.C. > > Canada

Greetings List. I desperately need some help on my brick wall. I need to find the parents of Roger Cole b. 1695 in Chattisham, and also the parents of Susanna Lewis b. abt May 1695 in Chattisham, and died there March 6, 1762. Most likely Roger as well. They were married Sept. 28, 1714 at Grt. Wenham, Suffolk. Any help appreciated! Regards, David in NW Florida with Suffolk roots!

Hi Linda There does not appear to be a lot of coachbuilders in and around Ipswich in that period If I remember rightly there were railway carriage manufacturers there? Which seems to be backed up by In :- A Suffolk Bibliography on Ancestry Under Coachbuilding (p107) 5703 Bennet and Sons, merchant coach-and harness-makers and exporters. Special export Catalogue for 1886 [Ipswich], (1885) 5704 Botwood, W.T. and S.E. Ipswich carriage works. Carriage designs. [Ipswich] (1894) Again from Ancestry 1911 England Census about William Thomas Botwood Name: William Thomas Botwood Age in 1911: 40 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1871 Relation to Head: Head Gender: Male Birth Place: Ipswich, Suffolk, England Civil parish: Ipswich County/Island: Suffolk Country: England Street Address: 163 Woodbridge Road, Ipswich Occupation: Motor Engineer and Motor Body Builder and Coach Builder Registration district: Ipswich Registration District Number: 213 Sub-registration district: Ipswich Western ED, institution, or vessel: 13 Household schedule number: 55 Piece: 10838 Household Members: Name Age William Thomas Botwood 40 Mary Botwood 31 Mary Doris Botwood 8 Gladys Evelyn Maud Botwood 8 William Thomas Jordon Botwood 3 Bernard Gomer Botwood 1 Gertrude Sea 34 Florence Kate Plesance 30 RG14; Piece: 10838; Schedule Number: 55; . I am not saying the above is the employer but perhaps worth exploring Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) On 24/09/2012 19:16, Linda wrote: > Hi Everyone > > In the 1901 Census, Civil Parish of St. Clement, Ecclesiastical Parish of > St. Barthlomew.living in 59 Tomline Rd., my Grandfather Charles Henry > Vesey's brother Fred is seen working as a Coachbuilder's Clerk in the > Carriage Motor Building Trade. By 1911 he was joined by my grandfather I > presume in that same business, hired also as clerk. It seems they left > their jobs in the printing business to work at this carriage (automotive?) > business. Was there any one business in Ipswich that might be that early > company? I'd love to know a name and a little history. > > Thanks for any help you can give > > Linda > > B.C. > > Canada

Hi all, I have been trying to track down my 7th great grandfather for about 20 years now with no luck, so I am wondering if anyone can help or offer any suggestions to help me find him. I am looking for: ROBERT EVERSON b. abt 1700-1705. Could also be spelt as Eversden, Everston, Evison etc. He married SARAH GOUDE/GOODE in Bramford on 11 Oct 1726, stating he was from Barham, however there is no baptism for him there. He has one daughter who is buried in Elmsett in 1727 (Source: SBI) and then I have a gap until 1733, where he then baptises 5 children in Somersham. The baptisms for the 2 children that I can't find during this time are: ROBERT EVERSON b. abt 1728 (he married Ann Tricker at Stowmarket in 1749) SARAH EVERSON b. abt 1731 (shemarried Jeremiah Garwood at Aldham in 1757) Robert was buried in Elmsett on 20 Apr 1748. His 1st wife Sarah was buried in Somersham in 1742. His 2nd wife Mary Barber was buried in Elmsett in 1754, Source: Suffolk Burial Index I've so far checked the following parishes for a baptism for Robert Everson and his 2 children: Aldham, Barham, Barking, Battisford, Belstead, Bentley, Bramford, Brantham, Burstall, Capel St. Mary, Chattisham, Chelmondiston, Claydon, Combs, Copdock, Creeting St. Mary, Earl Stonham, East Bergholt, Elmsett, Erwarton, Great Blakenham, Great Wenham, Harkstead, Hintlesham, Holbrook, Ipswich St. Clement, Ipswich St. Margaret, Ipswich St. Matthew, Ipswich St. Peter. Ipswich St. Stephen, Kersey, Little Blakenham, Little Wenham, Needham Market, Offton, Shotley, Somersham, Sproughton, Stutton, Whatfield, Wherstead, Washbrook and came up with nothing. If anyone on the list has any PR's from around this area that isn't on the list of searched parishes would you please help by checking them for me, even if it is to just cross more places off of my list. Thank you and hugs, Paula

Hi Everyone In the 1901 Census, Civil Parish of St. Clement, Ecclesiastical Parish of St. Barthlomew.living in 59 Tomline Rd., my Grandfather Charles Henry Vesey's brother Fred is seen working as a Coachbuilder's Clerk in the Carriage Motor Building Trade. By 1911 he was joined by my grandfather I presume in that same business, hired also as clerk. It seems they left their jobs in the printing business to work at this carriage (automotive?) business. Was there any one business in Ipswich that might be that early company? I'd love to know a name and a little history. Thanks for any help you can give Linda B.C. Canada

Hi Edie Over the years I have tried various permutations and have eventually disproved them. The thing that bugs me now is that I never kept a list of all the disproved, except where I have certificates. It's only recently that I have started listing the wrong ones. Back in the last century, I had all the films for the Yarmouth area at my local LDS. Prior to that I lived only 20 minutes or so away from Ipswich RO and spent a lot of time there looking for her. Michael in wet and windy Lancashire On 23-Sep-12 2:30 AM, Edie wrote: > Could she have been the illegitmate daughter of Johns wife Helen and he has > adopted her, or she was just given his name. Did you check for a spinster > birth for Helen by her maiden name. I guess you would have. She may have > been baptised in 1872 with only Helens name. > > On Familysearch the old one and most likely the new one, you can do a Place > search in the Family History Library Catalogue. If you type the Parish in > the place of interest and the County the birth took place then see what > the Latter Day saints have filmed for that area. Sometimes they have filmed > the Bastardy records for he area. You can then hire the film in your nearest > Latter day Saints family history library. About $7 dollars to hire and you > can keep it there for three months so can check other records for your > family out as well. > Edie > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2012 1:05 AM > Subject: [SFK-UK] bastardy orders > > >> I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according >> to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to >> the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. >> >> According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, >> Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. >> >> I can't find her in the 1891 or 1881 census and I can't find her birth >> registration. There are a few possibilities but they have all been >> disproved. >> >> I've thought for a long time that she was perhaps the illegitimate >> daughter of a Scottish fisher girl and local fisherman. Or the >> illegitimate daughter of a local girl and a Scottish fisherman. >> >> If either is the case, then there may well be some form of legal >> document, somewhere. Such as a bastardy order. >> >> Does anybody know if there are any and if so are they in the public >> domain. >> >> My Gt. Granny was Helen Elizabeth WILSON. >> >> Many thanks >> >> Michael in Lancashire >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Mike That has been my feeling for a number of years now. She was quite possibly the daughter of a Local girl by a Herring Fisherman. Or a Scottish fisher girl by a local fisherman. If I could just a little bit of a lead that doesn't hit the wall in the 1901 census. But I can't find it. I have disproved so many possibilities. Regards Michael On 22-Sep-12 5:39 PM, Mike Fry wrote: > On 2012/09/22 17:05, Michael wrote: > >> I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according >> to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to >> the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. >> >> According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, >> Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. > > Sounds as though she was illegitimate in which case, she was probably registered > under her mother's name. No Helen Elizabeth's that I can see for that period. > Plenty of Ellen Elizabeth's though :-) >

My thanks to everybody who replied both on and off list to my request about Bastardy orders. I have had a lot of replies and lots to take on board and check out, but will reply to you all. Thank you to all of you Regards Michael

I have seen the same on a family tree Roy. I knew the tree well. it turned out the father given on this tree was a complete invention as the mans whose tree it belonged to, was illegitimate and I knew the mother was the other of this fellow I was enquiring about. They turned out to be brothers who knew nothing of one another at that point. On the death bed of the one I was enquiring for. Edie ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2012 3:24 AM Subject: Re: [SFK-UK] bastardy orders > From: Mike Fry <[email protected]> > >> On 2012/09/22 17:05, Michael wrote: >> >> > I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who >> according to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and >> according to the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. >> > >> > According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, >> > Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased >> fisherman. >> >> Sounds as though she was illegitimate in which case, she was >> probably registered >> under her mother's name. No Helen Elizabeth's that I can see for >> that period. >> Plenty of Ellen Elizabeth's though :-)> > > I wouldn't always put too much credence on a named father on a marriage > certificate. > > In my experience people who were born illegitimate often "invented" a > father on a marriage > certificate to avoid embarrassment if they didn't wish to tell their > intended or the vicar! > > I have seen a number of certificates where I knew for a fact that the > father of one of the > parties was an invention. > > -- > Roy Stockdill > Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer > Famous family trees blog: http://blog.findmypast.co.uk/tag/roy-stockdill/ > > "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, > and that is not being talked about." > OSCAR WILDE > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

From: [email protected] > From: Mike Fry <[email protected]> > > > On 2012/09/22 17:05, Michael wrote: > > > > > I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who > > according to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 > > and according to the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. > > > > > > According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, > > > Kilburn, Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased > > fisherman. > > > > Sounds as though she was illegitimate in which case, she was > > probably registered under her mother's name. No Helen Elizabeth's that I can see for > > that period. > > Plenty of Ellen Elizabeth's though :-)> > > I wouldn't always put too much credence on a named father on a > marriage certificate. > > In my experience people who were born illegitimate often "invented" > a father on a marriage certificate to avoid embarrassment if they didn't wish to tell their > intended or the vicar! > > I have seen a number of certificates where I knew for a fact that > the father of one of the parties was an invention.> I presume the gt-grandmother of Michael, the OP, was Hellen [sic] Elizabeth Wilson who married Thomas Barlow Lonsdale at Kilburn Holy Trinity on 19 Feb 1899 (Ancestry's London Parish Registers)? In the 1901 census she is indeed shown as being born at Yarmouth, Suffolk, Thomas B Lonsdale was born 1868 at Brighton and they had a son of one, born 1900 at Willesden. Like Mike in South Africa, I think Hellen (or whatever her name was) was born illegitimate and, as I said, she probably invented a father on her marriage certificate. FreeBMD has no Helen Elizabeth Wilson born at Yarmouth in 1872 or thereabouts, which of course is not to say conclusively that her father wasn't John Wilson, fisherman! -- Roy Stockdill Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Famous family trees blog: http://blog.findmypast.co.uk/tag/roy-stockdill/ "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

I wonder who Johns wifes name was before marraige. Seems I have Helen as his wife which was wrong. My third great grnny had a illegitimate son in 1800 and she married my third great great granddfather John Lane in 1802. Her name was Amelia Twells. Her son was baptised John Twells Lane, afterh the marrriage of Amelia and John. Edie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Philip Maddocks" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2012 6:41 PM Subject: Re: [SFK-UK] bastardy orders > possibly waste the price of a birth certificate on > > Dec 1873 > Meadows Helenor Elizabeth Yarmouth 4b 16 > > Philip Maddocks > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Michael" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> > Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 4:05 PM > Subject: [SFK-UK] bastardy orders > > >> I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according >> to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to >> the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. >> >> According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, >> Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. >> >> I can't find her in the 1891 or 1881 census and I can't find her birth >> registration. There are a few possibilities but they have all been >> disproved. >> >> I've thought for a long time that she was perhaps the illegitimate >> daughter of a Scottish fisher girl and local fisherman. Or the >> illegitimate daughter of a local girl and a Scottish fisherman. >> >> If either is the case, then there may well be some form of legal >> document, somewhere. Such as a bastardy order. >> >> Does anybody know if there are any and if so are they in the public >> domain. >> >> My Gt. Granny was Helen Elizabeth WILSON. >> >> Many thanks >> >> Michael in Lancashire >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

From: Mike Fry <[email protected]> > On 2012/09/22 17:05, Michael wrote: > > > I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who > according to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and > according to the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. > > > > According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, > > Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased > fisherman. > > Sounds as though she was illegitimate in which case, she was > probably registered > under her mother's name. No Helen Elizabeth's that I can see for > that period. > Plenty of Ellen Elizabeth's though :-)> I wouldn't always put too much credence on a named father on a marriage certificate. In my experience people who were born illegitimate often "invented" a father on a marriage certificate to avoid embarrassment if they didn't wish to tell their intended or the vicar! I have seen a number of certificates where I knew for a fact that the father of one of the parties was an invention. -- Roy Stockdill Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Famous family trees blog: http://blog.findmypast.co.uk/tag/roy-stockdill/ "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

On 2012/09/22 17:05, Michael wrote: > I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according > to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to > the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. > > According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, > Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. Sounds as though she was illegitimate in which case, she was probably registered under her mother's name. No Helen Elizabeth's that I can see for that period. Plenty of Ellen Elizabeth's though :-) -- Regards, Mike Fry Johannesburg

Could she have been the illegitmate daughter of Johns wife Helen and he has adopted her, or she was just given his name. Did you check for a spinster birth for Helen by her maiden name. I guess you would have. She may have been baptised in 1872 with only Helens name. On Familysearch the old one and most likely the new one, you can do a Place search in the Family History Library Catalogue. If you type the Parish in the place of interest and the County the birth took place then see what the Latter Day saints have filmed for that area. Sometimes they have filmed the Bastardy records for he area. You can then hire the film in your nearest Latter day Saints family history library. About $7 dollars to hire and you can keep it there for three months so can check other records for your family out as well. Edie ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2012 1:05 AM Subject: [SFK-UK] bastardy orders > I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according > to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to > the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. > > According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, > Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. > > I can't find her in the 1891 or 1881 census and I can't find her birth > registration. There are a few possibilities but they have all been > disproved. > > I've thought for a long time that she was perhaps the illegitimate > daughter of a Scottish fisher girl and local fisherman. Or the > illegitimate daughter of a local girl and a Scottish fisherman. > > If either is the case, then there may well be some form of legal > document, somewhere. Such as a bastardy order. > > Does anybody know if there are any and if so are they in the public > domain. > > My Gt. Granny was Helen Elizabeth WILSON. > > Many thanks > > Michael in Lancashire > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

possibly waste the price of a birth certificate on Dec 1873 Meadows Helenor Elizabeth Yarmouth 4b 16 Philip Maddocks ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 4:05 PM Subject: [SFK-UK] bastardy orders > I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according > to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to > the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. > > According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, > Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. > > I can't find her in the 1891 or 1881 census and I can't find her birth > registration. There are a few possibilities but they have all been > disproved. > > I've thought for a long time that she was perhaps the illegitimate > daughter of a Scottish fisher girl and local fisherman. Or the > illegitimate daughter of a local girl and a Scottish fisherman. > > If either is the case, then there may well be some form of legal > document, somewhere. Such as a bastardy order. > > Does anybody know if there are any and if so are they in the public > domain. > > My Gt. Granny was Helen Elizabeth WILSON. > > Many thanks > > Michael in Lancashire > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

On 2012/09/22 17:05, Michael wrote: > I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according > to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to > the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. > > According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, > Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. Sounds as though she was illegitimate in which case, she was probably registered under her mother's name. No Helen Elizabeth's that I can see for that period. Plenty of Ellen Elizabeth's though :-) -- Regards, Mike Fry Johannesburg

We all have them Michael, you are not alone My great grandfather "helped" my great grandmother produce my grandfather in 1874 He then does a very good impersonation of Dr Who in his Tardis and disappears completely off the face of the earth Never seen again, no marriage, death, burial nothing His father dies and leaves a will, nothing mentioned on his son, his brother continues on for a long career as a doctor and there is some evidence of correspondence between he and my grandfather In a letter to my father, my grandfather says "I told you of the manner of my fathers death" But does not say what how where So we all have them and one day we may crack the case Don't give up just yet :-) Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) On 22/09/2012 17:01, Michael wrote: > Hi Nivard > > Yes, I know what you are saying. It was all very convenient in them > days, wasn't it. > > They do say we all have a skeleton in the family somewhere. Mine's been > jangling away for near on 20 years and I can't lay it to rest. > > One day maybe. > > Michael

Hi Nivard Yes, I know what you are saying. It was all very convenient in them days, wasn't it. They do say we all have a skeleton in the family somewhere. Mine's been jangling away for near on 20 years and I can't lay it to rest. One day maybe. Michael On 22-Sep-12 4:31 PM, Nivard Ovington wrote: > Hi Michael > > Unfortunately at that time the onus was on the mother to more or less > take the reputed father to court and to prove he was the father, very > few did > > If there was an action it should be in the petty sessions I believe, I > would try the County records office > > Sadly there was no proof required when giving information for a marriage > certificate so the father could be a made up one to save embarrassment > > A deceased father was convenient as he could not attend the marriage > > Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > > On 22/09/2012 16:05, Michael wrote: >> I'm having great trouble trying to pin down my Gt Granny who according >> to the 1901 census was born Yarmouth, Suffolk in 1872 and according to >> the 1911 census Yarmouth, Norfolk in 1873. >> >> According to her marriage certificate of February 1899, Kilburn, >> Middlesex. She was the daughter of John WILSON a deceased fisherman. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >