Derick, I've a question. Are you saying you don't accept volunteers to host a county in your state unless they live in the county they wish to host? Your letter is somewhat confusing - are you telling Mr. Nichols that his best avenue of service is to volunteer where he lives instead of elsewhere? I know that there are many volunteers that don't live in the county or even the state they host in, yet their sites are excellent while some sites hosted by home persons aren't. What qualifications do you require in order to accept new coordinators? Tim At 11:09 PM 9/20/02 -0400, you wrote: >List administrators are encouraged to share this post with their lists. > >To: Mr. Derek Nichols >Re: Issues of Integrity > >Your offer to represent Martin county, (NCGenWeb Project ) North Carolina >is indeed appreciated. However, at the present time we are discovering many >new folks who have chosen to volunteer as hosts for North Carolina GenWeb >Project pages and this county s one of them. Many volunteers have >expressed a desire to become more involved in Internet genealogy. Even more >importantly, most have made a committment to learn and perfect HTML skills. >This has been one of the more gratifying moments for me as a USGW >volunteer. We are fortunate to have been able to attract many new folks who >happen to reside in the counties which they have chosen to represent. Not >only will they be able to give the pages a home-town feel, they are already >intimately involved with the geological and genealogical aspects of their >areas. I hope that you will share with me the excitement of seeing a >Project develop and mature as we have.

At 11:19 PM 9/22/02, you wrote: >Derick, > >I've a question. Are you saying you don't accept volunteers to host >a county in your state unless they live in the county they wish to host? Tim, Above all people in the world, I thought you knew me better. If you have any questions after reading my ALL not, please write back. This is my ALL post: For a good many years, our North Carolina GenWeb Project has sought excellence in every way possible. The number of hours spent in page maintenance, research, transcriptions and answering queries has been beyond measure for most of us. We have come to expect only the best in ourselves and our fellow CCs. In most cases we are gratified to share their excellence. Any opportunity to respond to a query is our reward. We help each other whenever we can. An obscure newspaper article sometimes winds up being celebrated in a far-off NC town, thanks to the assistance of members of "our family." Often, we would check each other's pages to see how we can improve our own. We share links, logos and philosophies. Our desire to provide the very best is reflected in our web pages. Our close-knit association with the USGenWeb Project gives us the opportunity to perform as successful volunteers among a circle of like-minded civic associations. Our organizational creation was the work of many good folks. Nobody will dispute the talent, leadership and desire expended by dedicated folks to form this cohesive movement. In the last decade, we have made exponential strides in electronic genealogy. Unfortunately, there has been a dissident movement within our cyber-organization. It is difficult to determine their motives or discover their goals. Most posts in that abrasive bandwidth have been devoted to accusations, legalisms, untruths and in general, bad speech and behavior. Cyber communities need to assume a civil attitude! While the Internet may provide a certain anonymous insulation between polarities, attitudes need to look beyond self-promotion. North Carolina currently has 100 counties. Each one has a story to tell. I have viewed every one of the NC pages in my capacity as State Coordinator. As I understand it, one of my duties is to help each coordinator, in any way I am able. I should have no objective, other than to help see this Project become the very best that it can be. That is what my goals have been from the start. I don't expect this Project to stumble or fall. Some have reacted in a manner that opposes our goals. I can never understand how folks can establish themselves within a family and then suddenly, rise up and try to inject their inflammatory venom of anarchy and dissension. Does their form of organization hold a better promise? What is their agenda? Have they really posed any alternative to the present structure? Well, indeed, they have. Twice, in as many years, they have sought to remove the National Coordinator, the By-Laws, the AB and any vestige of a system or order, in order to achieve their desired goal of anarchy. They advocate a hostile relationship between servers, regardless of the DOT COM. Have we totally lost control? Why do many of us spend our time fending off attacks? Isn't this supposedly genealogy and isn't it suppose to be a fun avocation? Do I need to spend my *volunteer* time mediating arguments and fending off supposed legal actions against me? I thought this was supposed to be enjoyable!!! I certainly get no monetary satisfaction--only a deficit in personal time from this aggravation. My stand on any particular issue, regardless of any personal post, list or chat group is as follows: I love the USGenWeb Project and will do everything I can to promote it in the most positive manner. In front of this organization and all members thereof, I am extremely sorry if I have portrayed the USGW or NCGW in a negative light. My foremost wish is to see each volunteer unit chaired by the most eminently qualified person possible. Ideally, that individual would be a resident of the area in question or one intimately familiar with the area and its history. That person would ideally have first-hand knowledge of family chronologies, local lore and sources of resources. These folks might possess tales unknown to those not possessing local knowledge. The bottom line is that we should strive for excellence, regardless of where it resides. My foremost goal, as North Carolina GenWeb Project State Coordinator, is to see that this Project excel as no other entity in our affiliation. Without the shrill voices of discontent; those who choose to complain but who have no alternatives, I say: "Where do you stand? Are you with us…or against us?" "Where's the beef?" "What do you choose to contribute?" Neither myself, nor anyone in this Project derives an income from the NCGenWeb Project. To those who disparage us, attack us, blame us, accuse us, curse us. To them I say, "What the heck do you REALLY want????" Derick S. Hartshorn NCGenWeb State Coordinator Visit the NC home page at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~ncgenweb/ This is a post received from one of the NCGW volunteers: >While it sounds good to say that we are all adults and all are mature enough >to perform the jobs we signed on to do, only someone who has never browsed a >wide range of GenWeb pages would believe that it is adequate to simply >allow someone to adopt a county with the belief that they will be maintained >to even minimal standards. GenWeb is a volunteer organization but that >does not mean that it is sufficient to hope for the best. It is a slap in >the face of all those who work diligently to provide free genealogy (our >stated goal) and bad publicity for the project as a whole, to allow people >to adopt pages and then walk away without ever making any attempt to provide >even current links to off page sites, much less provide even one iota of >data related to the county. It is possible I may have a few broken links on >my own sites but I have also transcribed hundreds of pages this year and >work on my pages daily. I am aware of one particularly sad site that has >had only one change in years, the name of the new CC (and also a co-CC). > > >Other than attaching their name to the page, they have done nothing and >furthermore put a big sign on their page that they have no information about >the county so please do not write to them. Except for the first page, all >other e-mail links are even to the former CC. I don't think they have ever >looked at their pages and certainly have not touched them and apparently >have no intention of doing so. Guess what, there is no provision for taking >this county away from them and assign it to someone who might have an >interest in genealogy rather than having their name on a county page for the >sole purpose of screaming to all who will listen about how bad GenWeb is. >Unfortunately there are those who for unknown reasons want to put their name >on a GenWeb page when the last thing they are interested in is working to >provide free genealogy. It sometimes appears that they become CCs for the >sole purpose of being allowed to behave like children and pitch temper >tantrums. I saw one message on this list that made the statement that they >do not transcribe records because it was not required that they do so in >order to be a CC. Question - How do we provide free genealogy without >posting data? Not one person on the list even questioned why this person >might want to be a CC. > > >As a member of a number of volunteer organizations, I know that although >voluntary, the volunteers must conform to certain standards to be a part of >the group and must measure up to the stated goals of the organization. I >belong to NO organization other than GenWeb where anarchy is allowed to >reign unchecked. I think that GenWeb has matured to the point that those who >wish to be associated with the project should be held to certain standards. >If people do not wish to subscribe to certain minimal standards, they should >go elsewhere. Furthermore, there must be some vehicle to enforce >standards. Instead of complaining about those with too much authority, I >maintain that there is too little authority to maintain a viable >organization. Without standards, GenWeb will indeed become a memory of a >great dream that could not survive. Unfortunately, throughout history, >without standards, any association will descend into anarchy. That is why >as a nation we proudly proclaim that we are a nation of laws. To those that >complain about the fact that GenWeb was intended to be run from the ground >up, I would submit that in a democracy it is always from the ground up. We >do it with out votes. However, once the vote is in, we are all bound by >laws, rules and regulations. > > >I hold NO office in GenWeb, never have, and would not accept one under any >circumstances. It is all too apparent that holding a position in GenWeb >simply places one in the position of becoming the focus for those who need >to have someone to scream at - over and over and over again. Any attempt >at bringing order out of chaos simply fuels the fire. If anyone thinks >that allowing this kind of distraction is productive, then perhaps it is >time to give up the dream. > > >As an alternative, I say there should be rules and they should be enforced >and those in leadership must see that the rules are enforced. The rules >need not be overly burdensome but they should be adequate to maintain an >organization that works toward a common goal. > > >Mine is just one opinion and I realize it may not be a majority. I do have >an option. I can always go away and do my own thing and provide my material >in another forum. I have long hosted my own site on my own servers with my >own domain before joining GenWeb. However, I sincerely hope that GenWeb will >develope standards that others will be proud to identify with, thus >strengthening the organization. I am just glad I joined BEFORE I was aware >of chaos that is allowed to reign unchecked. If my introduction to GenWeb >was the All-L, I would have run away without ever considering joining. > > >Just one opinion from the masses, i.e. the CCs who keep quiet and do their >thing - provide free genealogy. > >Your letter is somewhat confusing - are you telling Mr. Nichols that his >best avenue of service is to volunteer where he lives instead of elsewhere? > >I know that there are many volunteers that don't live in the county or even >the state they host in, yet their sites are excellent while some sites >hosted by home persons aren't. > >What qualifications do you require in order to accept new coordinators? > >Tim Tim, Shit or get off the pot! --Derick >At 11:09 PM 9/20/02 -0400, you wrote: > >List administrators are encouraged to share this post with their lists. > > > >To: Mr. Derek Nichols > >Re: Issues of Integrity > > > >Your offer to represent Martin county, (NCGenWeb Project ) North Carolina > >is indeed appreciated. However, at the present time we are discovering many > >new folks who have chosen to volunteer as hosts for North Carolina GenWeb > >Project pages and this county s one of them. Many volunteers have > >expressed a desire to become more involved in Internet genealogy. Even more > >importantly, most have made a committment to learn and perfect HTML skills. > >This has been one of the more gratifying moments for me as a USGW > >volunteer. We are fortunate to have been able to attract many new folks who > >happen to reside in the counties which they have chosen to represent. Not > >only will they be able to give the pages a home-town feel, they are already > >intimately involved with the geological and genealogical aspects of their > >areas. I hope that you will share with me the excitement of seeing a > >Project develop and mature as we have.