Hello, Forgot to post this. May be needed later. Will excerpt of Richard Persons 11-2-1817 names sons James, John,Joseph,Richard,George, Johnathan, daughters Mary, Tabitha, Milly. Wife Betsy. Executor Thomas Wright. Wit. Lawrence Holcomb, William Britian. Proved by Holcomb. Recorded Nov. court 1820. Note* Surry Co. 1815 Tax list: Richard Persons, Sr. with 224 acres, Richard Jr. 50 acres. The 1816 tax list shows land to be on Hunting Creek. Surry County Marriage bond 2-1-1817 Richard Persons to Elizabeth SPENCE. The 1820 Surry census shows Elizabeth Pearson over 45+ with one white male 10 to 16 and one white female 0 to 10. Whoever this Elizabeth Spence was, she was born prior to 1775 to be at least 45 years old in 1820. Carolyn

Carolyn....ya did good girl....the data from Surry Co., NC regarding Thomas Spence was excellent. (Delighted to see a William Sparks in there too...another one of my ancestors!) Folks....doesn't Carolyn make you proud!!! Jim James F. Carver 610 Gay Street, Box 214 Portsmouth, Ohio 45662-0214 e-mail: heritage@zoomnet.net

Cousins, Jim, thanks for the praise. I only got through a thir of the Surry Co books in the High Point NC library research room. I'll look at the others ASAP. As I said Surry has an excellent Genealogical Society and volunteers who have published the records. I wanted to pass along a URL of a website that has most of Alleghany Co. NC citizens in it. This file contains over 55,000 persons, but be warned, some of it is not correct. I have tried to contact him 5 times and no answer. If you have an interest in western NC try the Blevins file at: http://www.oblevins.com/ Sheila, you may find some folks in this file! I have tried and tried to locate my copy of a census record that Jean sent me. Jean will you please repost the 1830 Grayson Co. VA census listing all the Spence households ? Those of you who are stuck on a William Spence, did you notice that William Spence who married Hannah Morris disappeared from the Surry NC tax lists in 1795-96 ???? Some theories are coming to mind on this Thomas in Surry County. Under NC law, and it is still in place today, a widow is only allowed a third of the property. The children are allowed the lion's share of two thirds. This settlement proves there were children involved. The dates confirm there may have been friction in settling the estate because it took so long. It looks as if Lucy may have been a 2nd wife. It has always been assumed that Lucy Spence McGrady, born about 1790, was a sister to Burwell Spence. Following this theory, she may have been a half-sister, a daughter of Lucy. Peter Spence also could have been a brother to Lucy. Both Peter and Lucy the daughter were known to be in Ashe County NC at some point in time. I''m speculating here..... working on digging under the brick wall.......... Carolyn

This is from a New River Valley site whose URL was posted a while back on the Southwest Virginia list. The URL for the main page is: http://www.ls.net/~newriver/nrv.htm Alana Tithes Blacks 0-16 Blacks 16+ Horses Spencer, John 1 2 Spence, Joseph 2 2 2 Spence, John 1 1 Spence, Bowell 1 Spence, John 1 1 (If the numbers don't line up in your mail viewer, the first number is Tithes and the second one is horses for everyone except Joseph. He's the only one with "Blacks 16+" *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* Alana & Marc Considine <beeswing@inconnect.com> http://www.inconnect.com/~beeswing

Hi, I went to my library and found a few things in Surry Co. NC books. Nothing earth shattering. Luckily Surry County NC has been active in getting their information in book form. I wish Ashe & Alleghany had..... Deed book F 3-1-1787 Elijah Kirkman to Aaron Moore 250 acres on waters of Beaver Creek adjoining Gilbert Keen, Thomas Spence, and Josiah Keen. Wit. David Spence & Thomas Spence. 11-26-1787 William T. Lewis, heir at law of Micajah Lewis, deceased to Laughlin McAlyea 200 acres Deep Creek adjoining David Martin. Wit. Thomas Spence and Thomas Johnson 7-22-1785 John Cain to William McAlyea 200 acres head of Cobb Creek. Wit. Richard Jacks, John Persons and David Spence. 8-30-1793 Laughlin McAlyea to David Taylor on waters of Deep Creek adj. Nathan Haines, formerly David Martins. Wit. David Spence and Hugh McAlyea. 9-26-1789 Gilbert Keen to Abraham Downey 200 acres Beaver Dam Creek adj. Josiah Keen and Zeno Baldwin. 8-1-1793 William Sparks Jr. to Hugh McAlyea 100 acres Rich Nob one of the Brushy Mountains granted Sparks 8-9-1787 adj. his survey. Wit. David Spence and Jeremiah Sparks. 5-18-1789 NC Grant David Spence 200 acres Fall Creek between Fox Knob and Brushy Mountain including Nathaniel Morrison's old improvement and adj. William T. Lewis. 1793 Deed from John Cain to William McAlyea proved by David Spence. Deed from William T. Lewis to Laughlin McAlyea proved by Thomas Spence. Deed registered 2-14-1805 Deed from Thomas Spence to Daniel Dejarnette was proved by the oath of David Cook and ordered registered. ************************************ Here let me comment that it appears that Thomas and David Spence moved with the movers and shakers of the county at the time. William T. Lewis was involved in the big Surry County court case in regards to the Ridge Tory incident. Zenos Baldwin and Gilbert Keen, I have discussed before, and let's not forget that we have a Keen family with an older lady with the surname of Spence living in Tazewell Co VA . What is confusing is the presence of the McAlyeas in relation to these Spences. I do not think this David Spence mentioned in ALL these deeds is the same person.... We know that there was a David Spence of the Paquotank line who lived in Wilkes County NC, and this IS the area of Surry County that became Wilkes County. I also think that we may be dealing with 2 Thomas Spences' also, both in the county at the same time. Surry Tax Lists 1790 Captain Benge's District Thomas Spence 400 acres 1 poll John Spence 100 acres 1 poll David Spence 200 acres 1 poll 1791 Thomas Spence 300 acres 1 poll David Spence 0 acres 1 poll John Spence 0 acres 1 poll 1792 Thomas 320 acres 1 poll John 150 acres 1 poll David 110 acres 1 poll William 0 acres 1 poll 1793 Thomas 370 acres 1 poll David 110 acres 1 poll William 0 acres 1 poll John 150 acres 1 poll 1794 Thomas 370 acres 1 poll William 0 acres 1 poll John 0 acres 1 poll 1795 Hudspeth's District John Spence 0 acres 1 poll Wilborn's District Thomas Spence 400 acres 1 poll William Spence 100 acres 1 poll 1796 Wilborn's District Thomas Spencer 400 acres 1 poll John Spencer 250 acres 1 poll 2 slaves 1797 Wilborn's Dist. John Spencer 250 acres 1 poll 3 slaves Thomas Spence 400 acres 1 poll * notice that from here on out that John was listed as a SpenceR and Thomas was a Spence. 1798 Wilborn's Dist. John Spencer 250 acres 1 poll 3 slaves Thomas Spence 418 acres 0 polls * this indicates that Thomas turned 65 yrs. and was exempt from tax. Born ca. 1733 ???? 1799 Wilborn's Dist. John Spencer 250 acres 1 poll 3 slaves Thomas Spence 378 acres 0 polls 1800 Wilborn's Dist. John Spencer 250 acres 2 polls 3 slaves Thomas Spence 354 acres 0 polls ************* These tax lists are in alpha order so they do not indicate who lived beside whom. But Wilborn's District was a rather small district. ************* Court minutes 1782 Thomas Spence ordered to serve as juror 1786 Thomas Spence ordered to serve as juror 5-19-1787 Thomas Spence on the Grand Jury 2-14-1787 Thomas Spence ordered overseer of the road from near his house to Gideon Woodruff's house. * (The Woodruff's moved from Surry to Ashe County NC.) Other neighbors near Thomas were Parsons, Hudspeth, Petty and McElmore. 5-19-1787 appointed juror . 8-16-1787 appointed juror. 5-16-1789 appointed juror to court at Richmond. * ( This isn't Richmond VA. It was a small town in Surry County NC.) John Spence was appointed a juror on 2-13-1801 At court on 5-12-1801 John was absent and fined n.i.s.i. 1791 Thomas Spence sues a neighbor Rueben Shores. no reason given in book. **************** 1781 Deposition, Thomas Spence taken before Wm. Terrell Lewis; it being Last Will and Testament. * ( I really need to turn the courthouse inside out on this one ! ) 5-14-1801 Administration on the estate of Thomas Spence deceased is granted to LUCY SPENCE widow, of said decedant, who entered into bond with William Richards security in the sum of 200 , for her faithful performance performance as administrix and qualified according to law. On motion ordered that William Cook esquire, Daniel Cockram, Moses Woodrough and David Cook be appointed to lott off for one years support to the widow agreeable to act of assembly. 11-10-1801 Agreeable to an order of court directed, we met agreeable to appointment at the house of Lucy Spence widow of Thomas Spence deceased, after being duly sworn apportioned and appoint to the said Lucy Spencer widow of the said Thomas the whole crop, a red horned cow, and calf, and speckled heifer, five two year old hoggs, and one year old, and one choice of sheep, two sides of sole leather, and two small hides or sides for upper leather, and two bushels of salt, with all wool and flax now in the house, to which agreement we have set our hands and seals this 10th day of September 1801. 5-11-1803 An amount of a settlement of the estate of Thomas Spence deceased with Lucy Spence widow of said deceased was returned signed by three commissioners and ordered to be recorded. William Cook , Esquire to see. The comr appointed to settle with the widow Spence and lott off to the widow her third of the land and other property made their report wherein they say the administrix is endebted the sum of 57:12:9 and say they proceeded to lott off to the widow the third of the land which they find to be (total) 350 acres. Ordered to be recorded. William Cook, Esquire, to see. 2/pd to J.W. An amount of a settlement of the estate of William Cook deceased made with Samuel Cook executor was returned and ordered to be recorded. * ( Same day ! ) 2-16-1803 A deed from Thomas Spence to Francis Jenkins was proved to court by oath of William Downey. 8-12-1811 Ordered by the court that PETER SPENCE, orphan boy aged 11 years the 1st day of September next, be bound unto John Spencer until he arrives at the age of 21 years the said Spencer agrees to learn the said Peter the art & mystery of a farmer and agrees to learn him to read, write and cypher as fare as the rule of three inclusive. He also agrees to give him two good suits of home made clothes and a horse worth ten pounds at his freedom. * ( This is probably the Peter Spence later found in Ashe County NC.) Peter is 11 so he was born about 1800 ???? Later, Carolyn

No, but check with the Spencetop@aol.com, she may know where your roots are.

Hi Folks.... For those of you who "surf" the net...check out the new Search Engine....: (go to) dogpile.com James F. Carver 610 Gay Street, Box 214 Portsmouth, Ohio 45662-0214 e-mail: heritage@zoomnet.net

This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_918432587_boundary Content-ID: <0_918432587@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII --part0_918432587_boundary Content-ID: <0_918432587@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline From: MAGICKRN@aol.com Return-path: <MAGICKRN@aol.com> To: bibeal@email.msn.com Subject: jno Date: Sun, 7 Feb 1999 18:38:26 EST Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Can you tell me what name Jno. stands for? --part0_918432587_boundary--

If anyone has the Alleghany, NC and Grayson, Carroll County, VA census-years 1790 to 1890, please download them and email to me.

I have found my Anderson line of Franklin Eugene Anderson who married Gussie Ellen Spence. His father was John Arthur Anderson, son of Enoch Anderson, son of Swinfield Anderson and Elizabeth Delp. If anyone runs across Swinfield in their Alleghany/Grayson research, please email me.

This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --part0_918419065_boundary Content-ID: <0_918419065@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII My friend Dina sent this to me..thought you might like it. --part0_918419065_boundary Content-ID: <0_918419065@inet_out.mail.coastalnet.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: <dina@coastalnet.com> Received: from rly-yd04.mx.aol.com (rly-yd04.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.4]) by air-yd04.mx.aol.com (v56.24) with SMTP; Sun, 07 Feb 1999 14:04:41 -0500 Received: from raven.coastalnet.com (raven.coastalnet.com [204.183.40.26]) by rly-yd04.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id OAA23929; Sun, 7 Feb 1999 14:04:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from l024569 (pm-jax9-71.coastalnet.com [205.245.116.71]) by raven.coastalnet.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id OAA26530; Sun, 7 Feb 1999 14:04:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <002701be52cc$a3871ea0$2574f5cd@l024569.nadepcp.navy.mil> From: "Dave & Dina Crandall" <dina@coastalnet.com> To: "Ronnie Silver" <r3s7t6nb@coastalnet.com> Subject: We're Old Date: Sun, 7 Feb 1999 14:04:01 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Sad humor about being older now Here is the latest college freshman stats....... Just in case you weren't feeling too old today, this will certainly bring things into focus Each year the staff at Beloit College in Wisconsin puts together a list to try to give the faculty a sense of the mindset of that year's incoming freshmen. Here's this year's list: 1. The people who are starting college this fall across the nation were born in 1980. 2. They have no meaningful recollection of the Reagan Era and did not know he had ever been shot. 3. They were prepubescent when the Persian Gulf War was waged. 4. Black Monday 1987 is as significant to them as the Great Depression. 5. There has been only one Pope. They can only really remember one president. 6. They were 11 when the Soviet Union broke apart and do not remember the Cold War. 7. They have never feared a nuclear war. "The Day After" is a pill to them, not a movie. 8. They are too young to remember the space shuttle blowing up, and Tiana= nm Square means nothing to them. 9. Their lifetime has always included AIDS. 10. They never had a Polio shot, and likely do not know what it is. 11. Bottle caps have not only always been screw off, but have always been plastic. They have no idea what a pull-top can looks like. 12. Atari pre-dates them, as do vinyl albums. 13. The expression "you sound like a broken record" means nothing to them= . 14. They have never owned a record player. 15. They have likely never played Pac Man and have never heard of pong. 16. Star Wars looks very fake to them, and the special effects are pathetic. 17. There have always been red M&Ms, and blue ones are not new. What do you mean there used to be beige ones? 18. They may have heard of an 8-track, but chances are they probably never have actually seen or heard one. 19. The Compact Disc was introduced when they were 1 year old. 20. As far as they know, stamps have always cost about 32 cents. 21. They have always had an answering machine. 22. Most have never seen a TV set with only 13 channels, nor have they seen a black-and-white TV. 23. They have always had cable. 24. There have always been VCRs, but they have no idea what BETA is. 25. They cannot fathom not having a remote control. 26. They were born the year that Walkmen were introduced by Sony. 27. Roller-skating has always meant inline for them. 28. The Tonight Show has always been with Jay Leno. 29. They have no idea when or why Jordache jeans were cool. 30. Popcorn has always been cooked in a microwave. 31. They have never seen Larry Bird play, and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is a football player. 32. They never took a swim and thought about Jaws. 33. The Vietnam War is as ancient history to them as WWI, WWII, or even the Civil War. 34. They have no idea that Americans were ever held hostage in Iran. 35. They can't imagine what hard contact lenses are. 36. They don't know who Mork was or where he was from. 37. They never heard the terms: "Where's the beef?", "I'd walk a mile for a Camel," or "de plane, de plane!" 38. They do not care who shot J.R. and have no idea who J.R. is. 39. The Titanic was found? I thought we always knew where it was. 40. Michael Jackson has always been white. --part0_918419065_boundary--

FROM GEORGIA LAND LOTTERY OF 1827: JAMES SPENCE, CAPT. LYNCH CO., BURKE CO., #59 DT.24, SEC.2. JEREMIAH SPENCE, CAPT. MCGARS DIST., EMANUEL CO., #94, DT. 22, SEC 2. JOHN SPENCE, CAPT. ROLLINS DIST. GWINETT CO., #177, DT. 6, SEC 1 JOSEPH SPENCE, CAPT LYNCH CO., BURKE CO., #123, DT. 9, SEC 1 LEASTON SPENCE, 57TH DIST. EMANUEL CO., #67, DT. 6, SEC 5 WILLIAM SPENCE, 113TH DIST. HANCOCK CO., #136, DT. 9, SEC 5 STATE CENSUS OF N.C. 17 MARCH 1786, PASQUOTANK CO., -- ISAAC SPENCE, A WHITE MALE BETWEEN THE AGES OF 21 AND 60 YEARS. JOHN SPENCE, AGE 36, SERVANT TO JOHN CUTHBERT OF DRAIKES. ARRIVED IN GEORGIA 10 JAN. 1735-36. INEEL SPENCE, DOBBS CO., N.C. 1780. ISAAC SPENCE, DUPLIN CO., N.C. AUGUST 19, 1867. VOTER REGISTRATION IN TRINITY COUNTY, TEXAS, PRECINCT #2. I. R. SPENCE, FROM GEORGIA. FROM GA. LAND LOTTERY OF 1807. ISAAC SPENCE LIVING IN BURKE COUNTY--HILLIARD'S MILITIA DISTRICT -- LOT #115, DISTRICT 6, CO., GA. ISAAC SPENCE, GEORGIA LAND LOTTERIES OF 1820/21. LOT #119, SEC 8, IRWIN CO., LOT 126, SEC 15, IRWIN CO. AARON SPENCE'S ORPHANS, LOT #327, SEC 118 HENRY CO., BLUFORD SPENCE, #80, SEC 6, HOUSTON CO., BLUFORD SPENCE, #108, SEC 13, MONROE CO., LEASTON SPENCE #80, SEC 7, HOUSTON CO. BLUFORD SPENCE C.S.A, CO E 31 GEORGIA INF., PRIVATE. BLUFORD SPENCE, C.S.A. CO I, 22 TEXAS INF., PRIVATE NORTH CAROLINA TAXPAYERS PASQUOTANK COUNTY 1754. SPENCE -- ELIZ., ANN, DAVID, JEREMIAH, ROBERT,TRUMAN. NEW HANOVER CO., 1767 __ SPENCE--JOHN, TIMOTHY PASQUOTANK CO., 1769. SPENCE, DAVID, GREAVES, JAMES,JEREMIAH, JOB,JOSEPH SR., JOSEPH JR., LEMUEL, RANCHER, THOMAS, CRAVEN CO., WILLIAM SPENCE PASQUOTANK. 1779, ISAAC SPENCE. DOBBS CO., 1780---INEEL AND CHARLES SPENCE SURRY CO., N.C. MARRIAGES 1779-1868. LEWIS SPENCE AND FRANCES BRIM, 11 JUNE 1833. WILLIAM SPENCE AND HANNAH MORRIS, 24 DEC. 1792 SOLDIERS OF WAR OF 1812 IN N.C., FOURTH COMPANY, DETACHED FROM THE PASQUOTANK REGIMENT. WILLIAM SPENCE, CAPT., ROBERT AND DANIEL SPENCE, PRIVATES. FITST REGIMENT, CURRITUCK COUNTY, WILLIAM AND ARTHUR SPENCE, PRIVATES. DAVID AND ANN SPENCE IMMIGRATED FROM VIRGINIA TO MARYLAND IN 1667. JOHN SPENCE 1666. ANOTHER DAVID SPENCE IMMIGRATED IN 1665. ISAAC SPENCE, PASQUOTANK CO., N.C. DIST #6 (CENSUS OF 1784-1787) ISAAC SPENCE, DUPLIN CO., N.C. (1800 CENSUS) ISAAC SPENCE, THOMAS CO., GA. (1830 CENSUS) INSEL SPENCE, SCREVEN CO. GA., 35TH DIST (1830 CENSUS) ISAAC SPENCE, THOMAS CO., GA. JONES DIST (1840 CENSUS) ISAAC SPENCE, THOMAS CO., GA., 81ST DIST (1850 CENSUS) ISAAC R. SPENCE, THOMAS CO., GA., 81ST DIST (1850 CENSUC) ISAAC SPENCE, THOMAS CO., GA., THOMASVILLE (1860 CENSUS) OCHLOCKNEE CEMETERY, OCHLOCKNEE, GA., I. S. SPENCE B. 9-6-1858 D. 12-15-1933 MARY A. SPENCE, B. 6-20-1863 D. 4-6-1933 I. S. SPENCE DIED 15 DEC. 1933 INTESTATE. R. W. MCMILLAN, ADMINISTRATOR, K. B. SPENCE, G. L. SPENCE, BROTHERS. PROPERTY: ONE TWO STORY HOUSE AND LOT ON SPENCE STREET IN THE TOWN OF OCHLOCKNEE, GA., I BRICK STOREHOUSE ON RAILROAD ST. IN THE TOWN OF OCHLOCKNEE, GA., HOUSEHOLD AND KITCHEN FURNITURE. I AUTOMOBILE. 31 MAY 1935 -- ALL DEBTS PAID AND BALANCE OF ESTATE TO LAWFUL HEIRS. THOMAS CO. GA., RECORDS -- MARY SPENCE 250 ACRE LANDGRANT, LOT 66, NOW GRADY COUNTY, 30 NOV. 1824. A RESIDENT OF BURKE CO., GA. THOMAS COUNTY, NOW BROOKS CO., OLIVE AND ANNE SPENCE, 490 ACRES, LOT 513, RESIDENTS OF BURKE CO., GA. 13 JUNE 1829. GRANTOR: ISAAC SPENCE , GRANTEE JAMES STRANGE - BY POWER OF ATTORNEY - BOOK C PAGE 250 DATED 3 SEPT. 1840. 490 ACRES, LOT 119 DIST 8. (NOW COLQUITT COUNTY). GRANTOR,: INSEL SPENCE -- GRANTEE: GEO. H. RICKS - BOOK M, PAGE 216, DATED 1 NOV. 1872. 490 ACRES LOT 158, DIST. 13, THOMAS CO., GA., LIES NEAR TOWN OF MERRILLVILLE, WHICH IS EAST OF OCHLOCKNEE RIVER. GRANTOR: ISAAC SPENCE--GRANTEE: A. T. MCINTYRE, BY DEED, BOOK Q,PAGE 313, DATED 8 FEB. 1878. 250 ACRES , LOT 148 DIST 17. LOCATED IN SPENCE DISTRICT., (NOW IN GRADY CO) GRANTOR: HANNAH SPENCE - GRANTEE: A. T. MCINTYRE, BY DEEDBOOK Q, PAGE 314, DATED 20 JULY 1878. 250 ACRES, LOT 148 DIST. 17. (NOW GRADY CO.) GRADY COUNTY GA., WAS ORGANIZED 1 JAN. 1906. COUNTY SEAT IS AT CAIRO, GA., 31728. FROM ABRIDGED COMPENDIUM OF AMERICAN GEN., BY VIRKUS, VOL 2, 1926, PAGE 409. EMMIGRANT ANCESTORS. ROBERT MURDOCK B. 1667. FROM SCOTLAND TO ROXBURY, MASS., BEFORE 1667, MARRIED HANNAH STEDMAN. FROM VOLUME 1, PAGE 745. THOMAS SPENCE, DESCENDANT OF DUKE OF ARGYLE, FROM SCOTLAND, SETTLED IN N. J., MARRIED SARAH DAUGHTER OF DAVID HARRIMAN FROM WALES. WAS A RANGER ON THE FRONTIER IN 1778 TO 1783 IN CAPTAIN RITCHIE'S REGIMENT. DAVID SPENCE, BORN IN N.J. SERVED IN THE AMERICAN RECOLUTIONARY WAR. MARRIED MARY, DAUGHTER OF LUDOVIC MCELYEA IN YORK CO. PA.

Gang, I've been waylaid by tax season but I'm still trying to keep up with you ! Anyway, like Jim said we DO need original documents ! I think that we in Burwell's line have picked the Carroll County records clean. Between Mary Anne, Essie, John, myself and a couple others, we should have everything that I'm aware of . We can only hope when a new courthouse is built, that during the move they find some boxes in the attic or basement ! I will get over to Dobson just as soon as I can to grab the Surry Co NC stuff. I have a Burcham cousin and we get together and take research trips. We live in the foothills and every time we climb the mountain, it rains ! So we don't even attempt to go during the winter. Dobson is in the foothills too though, so we really have no good excuse for not going ! Next trip we are meeting 2 more cousins, one from Galax VA and one from Elkin NC, and I'll supervise the trip by assigning surnames and I'll take SPENCE ! Between the 4 of us MAYBE we can find something. Mary Anne, can you ask Essie if she had ever gone to Dobson ? If Surry turns up empty, we still have Ashe Co. to explore in West Jefferson NC. If there is anything on Spences, that is my best guess as to where it is, since I've been to Alleghany and didn't see anything. Then there's Wilkes and Yadkin, and finally Rowan. Salisbury is supposed to have a good selection, but it's the OLD OLD stuff ! I'm corresponding with a Spence lady in Rocky Mount NC. She has a stray Spence that she doesn't think came out of the Pasquotank line. Those of you with the GA line, please check out the Insel Spence who was in NC. Wasn't there some GA Spence's living close to him after he moved to GA ??? Keep the discussion going, thanks to all I owe a thank you ! Carolyn

HERE ARE SOME TIDBITS I PICKED UP DOING RESEARCH. MAYBE SOME ONE CAN USE THEM. FROM GEORGIA TAX DIGEST: INSELL SPENCE, WILKES CO., GA. 1791, ALSO BURKE CO. GA., 1798. MOSES SPENCE, BURKE CO., GA., 1798 HEADRIGHT GRANTS 1790 THRU 1795 TO MOSES SPENCE COMMISSIONS FROM GOVERNOR OF GA., 1790. BURKE CO., GA MILITIA. JOHN SPENCE, MOSES SPENCE, THARP SPENCE, & THOMAS SPENCE. BURKE CO., GA., LAND LOTTERY OF 1807 --- INSELL SPENCE - 2, JOHN SPENCE - 1, MOSES SPENCE - 2. NORTH CAROLINA MARRIAGE BONDS : WILLIAM SPENCE MARRIED HANNAH MORRIS, 24 DEC. 1792. RECORD #09201219. BONDSMAN DAVID SPENCE. ISAAC SPENCE MARRIED ELISABETH BOWDEN, 27 APRIL 1769. RECORD #03501079. BONDSMA : LEVIN WATKINS. SAMUEL SPENCE MARRIED JULIAN GRAY, 19 AUG. 1786. RECORD #07501079. BONDSMAN JOHN SAWYER. FROM GEORGIA PIONEERS, BOOK 1968, PAGE 124: THOMAS COUNTY GEORGIA MARRIAGES.: ISAAC SPENCE AND HANNAH TAYLOR -- 4 APRIL 1839. BLUFORD SPENCE AND MANDY MCKINNON -- 2 FEB. 1858 JOSHUA SPENCE AND AMY LEVINS -- 10 DEC. 1835. WINFRED SPENCE AND ELLEN HOUSE -- 4 MAY 1843. FROM GEORGIA PIONEERS, BOOK 1968, PAGE 226. FROM PASSENGERS TO AMERICA- TEPPER-PORT OF LONDON, 18 TO 25 DECEMBER 1773. HENRY SPENCE, AGE 25, TALLOW CHANDLER, FROM LONDON, SHIP "CAROLINE", TO VIRGINIA, AN INDENTURED SERVANT. PAGE 193. WILLIAM SPENCE OF CAMBRIDGE, AGE 20 YEARS, 5 MOS., 19MARCH 1699, INDENTURED SERVANT TO WM. BENN, MASTER OF THE "ELIZABETH ANN", BOUND FO MONTSERRATTE IN THE WEST INDIES AND TO AMERICA. WILLIAM IS FROM LIVERPOOL. PAGE 282. PORT OF LONDON, 21 TO 28 MARCH 1774. WILLIAM SPENCE, AGE 23, A BAKER, FROM SCOTLAND. SHIP "DIANA". TO MARYLAND. IS INDENTURED. PAGE 303. PORT OF LONDON, 7 TO 14TH JUNE 1774. ROBERT SPENCE, AGE 23, A STAYMAKER, FROM LONDON. SHIP "PRINCESS CAROLINE". TO JAMICA. IS GOING ON A BUSINESS TRIP. PAGE 338. PORT OF LONDON, 28TH NOV. THRU 3 DEC. 1774. PHILLIP SPENCE, AGE 14. FROM KENT. SHIP "GENEROUS FRIEND". TO ANTIGUA, GOING AS A MERCHANTS CLERK. PAGE 371. PORT OF LONDON, 27TH MARCH TO 3RD APRIL 1775. JAMES SPENCE, AGE 41. A SHIP WRIGNT. FROM KENT. SHIP "BLAND". TO VIRGINIA. INDENTURED FOR 4 YEARS. WILLIAM N. SPENCE, SOLICITOR-GENERAL FOR THE ALBANY CIRCUIT COURT, WAS BORN IN STEWART CO. 25 FEB. 1851. SON OF WILLIAM AND SUSAN HILLIARD SPENCE. THE SPENCE FAMILY IN AMERICA DESCENDS FROM ENGLISH EMIGRANTS OF EARLY COLONIAL DAYS. THERE WERE TWO BROTHERS, JOSEPH, WHO CAME TO VIRGINIA AND WILLIAM WHO SETTLED IN N. C. THE GREAT GRANDFATHER OF WILLIAM N. SPENCE WAS A THORPE SPENCE, VORN IN VA., WHO MIGRATED TO BURKE CO., GA., WHERE HE MARRIED AN ORPHAN GIRL, CHARITY SMITH, WHO HAD BEEN RAISED IN THE HOME OF WILLIAM HINDS. THORPE DIED IN MIDDLE AGE LEAVING 5 SONS: BLUFORD, GREEN, LITLETON, EASTERN AND JOSEPH. CHARITY MARRIED A MR. MILLER AND HAD TWO SONS: GEORGE AND LEVI MILLER, WHO LIVED IN ALABAMA. BLUFORD SPENCE WAS THE GRANDFATHER OF WILLIAM N. SPENCE. HE MARRIED POLLY FANN AND SHE DIED LEAVING ONE CHILD A DAUGHTER SUSAN WHO MARRIED JAMES ADAMS. BLUFORD BLUFORD MARRIED AGAIN TO ELIZABETH FIRZGERAL, AND DIED ABOUT 1836, LEAVING HIS WIDOW AND 7 CHILDREN: JOSEPH T., GREEN, SARAH BLUFORD ANN, MARY, MARTHA AND WILLIAM. THE FATHER OF WILLIAM N., OUR SUBJECT. WILLIAM N. WAS BORN IN BURKE CO., GA., BUT WAS EDUCATED AND RAISED IN STEWART CO., WHERE HE WAS MARRIED IN 1845 TO SUSAN HILLIARD. HE ENLISTED IN THE C.S.A. AND SERVED MAILY IN TENN. AFTER THE WAR HE MOVED TO HOUSTON CO., WHERE HE DIED IN 1885 AT AGE 63. BY SUSAN HE HAD NINE CHILDREN. WILLIAM N. (SUBJECT), MARY C., IRENE, CARSWELL, SUSAN, ANDREW J., JAMES HILLIARD, CELIA, ELLEN AND BLUFORD SPENCE. WILLIAM M. SPENCE, FARMER OF WALTON CO., GA., WAS BORN IN MORGAN CO., SON OF HIRAM AND ANGELINE CHANRY SPENCE. hIRAM WAS A SON OF GEORGE AND MARY KNIGHT SPENCE, WAS BORN IN MARYLAND AND CAME TO GEORGIA IN OXCARTS IN 1798 TO SETTLE IN MORGAN COUNTY. ANGELINE WAS DAUGHTER OF THOMAS AND LUCY CHENCY, BORN IN MARYLAND, CAME TO GEORGIA IN 1798. WILLIAM N. SPENCE MARRIED IN 1868 TO DELPHIA MCPHERSON, DAUGHTER OF ELIJAH AND SARAH MCPHERSON, WHO CAME FROM TENN. TO GA. THEY HAD 9 CHILDREN: LEON, ELLA, IDA, CORA,WILLIAM, NEWTON, ALBERT,MARY AND IVEY SPENCE. MCALVIN H. SPENCE, HARRIS CO., FARMER WAS BORN IN ROCKINGHAM CO., N. C. IN 1810. SON OF NATHAN AND ADELINE REEVES SPENCE. NATHAN WAS SON OF NATHAN AND ELIZABETH QUINDLEY SPENCE, BORN IN MARYLAND. ADELINE WAS A DAUGHTER OF REV. MALACHIA AND RHODA HOWELL REEVES. NATHAN SR., WAS A REVOLUTIONARY WAR VET WHO MIGRATED TO GA., AND DIED GWINNETT CO., HE WAS IN THE WAS OF 1812 ALSO. MCALVIN MARRIED IN 1830 TO ELIZABETH BORN IN N.C., IN 1812. THEY HAD 4 CHILDREN TO SURVIVE. JAMES, ADELINE, ELIZABETH AND FRANCES. ELIZABETH DIED AND HE MARRIED MARTHA MILLIGAN AND HAD 3 CHILDREN. WILLIAM, GEORGE, AND SAIILE SPENCE. HE WAS MARRIED A 3RD TIME IN 1892 TO MRS. ELIZABETH ELLIS. INEEL SPENCE, TAXPAYER IN DOBBS COUNTY N.C. IN 1780. GEORGIA LAND LOTTERY OF 1827, REGISTER #30. WILKINSON CO., GA., INCEL SPENCE, CAPT. HALL'S DIST#49, DIST 3, SEC 4., COWETA CO. GA.. ISAAC SPENCE ENLISTED FROM BURKE CO. GA., IN 1814 TO SERVE IN WAR OF 1812. INCEL, INSELL, SPENCE -- IN REVOLUTIONARY WAR. FROM N.C., SERVED IN BRADLEY'S COMPANY. ENLISTED 20 JULY 1778 FOR 9 MOS. MUSTERED OUT OCT. 1778. NOT ON PENSION ROLL.

Barbara, My grandmother Gussie Ellen Spence really had some roots. Dalton mother and Spence father. She is a descendant of the Dalton gang ancestry line and also some Cherokee Indian in the mix with all the Scot-Irish blood..Even found a Swedish grandmother in the Dalton line which I have traced to 980 AD! The Dalton line I have done alot of research on. I wish I could go back further with Spence. Sheila Anderson-Lewis

Interesting theory, Barbara. As I told you before, my great grandmother was Dora California Dalton, who married Ennis Lee Spence..The Dalton's were living side by side with the Spence's in Carroll County. Maybe some Spences or a Spence moved to the Coffeyville area along with James Lewis Dalton..he was born in Logan County Ky. His father, whose name I don't yet have, came from Carroll County, VA, and whose ancestors came from Ireland and originally France. (The original name was D'Alton).

Hi Folks, I wish to thank those of you who have contacted me direct with your support of my airing of my nasty opinion regarding conducting "out of State" research. At least now I know I'm not alone. For this reason along we need to search out "family" who live in areas such as Southhampton; Carroll; Tazewell; Augusta; Counties of VA, and in Surry Co., NC and the other sites of early SPENCEs and encourage them to hit the Courthouses to gather the misc. documents relating to the lines we are researching. Items like Property Deed Records, some Marriage Records, & Court Order records are most of the time easy to find...books have "indexes" all you need to know is the time frames. Over the many years of conducting research I've discovered fantastic data hidden within simple Deed Records ...items that would truly surprise you. These documents, once obtained, should be sent to a central location (person) so that those in need of such records for a certain Spence Line can tap that source for what is available. Those of you sitting on any documents...share them!! Think about it folks!! Jim James F. Carver 610 Gay Street, Box 214 Portsmouth, Ohio 45662-0214 e-mail: heritage@zoomnet.net

Gang, I agree with Jim. Everytime I send the customary fee for a document, I get a letter back from the clerk's office, " We couldn't find the ???, but for a fee of $ ?/.// per hour one of our recommended researchers would be glad to help you." Then I find out that sometimes the "recommended researcher" is a sister-in-law of the clerk ! Phooey ! What a run around ! Carolyn

Hi Folks, Noticed the comments made regarding the High Prices for obtaining documents from the Virginia State Archives. What you're seeing here is not all that unusual...it's a growing trend. (Comments here..my personal opinion) Virginia is also following the footsteps of Kentucky. KY houses most of their records in one location...Frankfort, KY Archives....they to have been discouraging "out of State" researchers with overpricing, long delay in responses, strick restrictions ....folks what they're trying to do is STOP the search for records. Because of Public Access & Freedom of Information Laws...they really can't deny anyone the data they process...but they sure can make it difficult to obtain. They also find doing "business" by snail-mail takes actual efforts of staff members....with operating budgets being as they are ...they feel they must discourage such research . If you visit such a location researching on a self-serve basis, you'll experience no problems, the staff is helpful, photocoping cost is reasonable....this is all they want. Look closely at the Archive staff personal, the board of directors...and you might find a cast of "pros"...who also on the side will research for you, find your documents for you, for a high fee.....put the puzzle together and you'll also see why such decisions are made to discourage "out of State" researching....greed. I have over the years obtained directly from County Courthouses many documents such as Wills, Deeds, Marriage Lic., etc. I've done this in Ohio, KY, VA, NC, TN, PA, NY, CT and other places I can't recall .....Virginia "counties" have been the most difficult with over 60% REFUSING outright to proved documents, they won't suppy copies of Deed Indexes, etc. I've been told directly that they don't cater to "genealogist", they refuse to take time for such nonsense. Two days after Russell Co., VA sent me such a rejection letter of assistance I showed up at their office with their letter....informed them I traveled 700 miles for one document...advised them to be grateful I wasn't hostile when I arrived at their door, their letter really pissed me off! Folks, these State Libraries / Archives, and even the seperate Counties...receive FEDERAL MONIES to assist them in preserving the old documents...our Nation's Heritage...many are overstepping OUR RIGHTS to have access to the heritage of our Nation.....it's not right! This is my personal opinion but thought it needed to be stated. ....... Jim James F. Carver 610 Gay Street, Box 214 Portsmouth, Ohio 45662-0214 e-mail: heritage@zoomnet.net

Hi Folks.... Just wish to publicly address the statements made by Carolyn during her midnight moment of madness about the Southhampton Spence Line. Carolyn....dear you're NOT mad nor have you stepped on any toes with your public thoughts on the obvious....there IS and HAS always been a loose connection....we all have seen this...you just said it out loud. I'm not hindered by decades of research effort thinking the Spence-Bluford Line MUST come from WILLIAM SPENCE of Southhampton Co.VA ...while it may be nice, the thought of having this "one more generation" back to count is progress....but I too DO NOT see any "HINT" of evidence that a connection exist. The only item that gives hope is in William Spence's Will of 1758....we all know he had a dau. - Elizabeth (m. John McElmore) and did not mention her in his Will. ..........so Carolyn states the obvious...WHY.. was our Thomas Spence NOT mentioned in this will ....where was he???...in 1758 Thomas Spence was fighting the French & Indian War in Augusta Co., VA. ....that's where he was.... thus ...was Thomas Spence omitted from the Will of 1758 of William Spence because he was ....far away in Augusta Co.,VA. ?? Was Thomas dead??? --killed in the war?? .....if Thomas was dead, while not required but often the "widow" of the deceased son would be mentioned within the Will... this didn't happen. Folks...Carolyn made good points....until we can get more positive evidence or clues this William Spence of Southhampton must remain only a POSSIBILITY of being the father of Thomas Spence. We still have the mystery man Thomas Spence there in Surry Co., NC in the late 1700s ....which could very well be our Thomas from Augusta Co.VA , slipping over State Lines to resettle after the French & Indian War was over. Focus is needed on THOMAS SPENCE but I think we'll find him easier if we quit looking so hard for his early roots....and look sideways at his wife....MARY GREEN...which we no nothing about.....to marry her...he had to be where she was....I'd say folks...look more at Mary Green and I think we'll see more of Thomas ...... remember....pioneers who migrate together normally marry each other....that may sound sick but tis life where selection is limited. Carolyn....thanks for bringing this out in the open ...now lets throw darts at it!!! Jim (still like those French Broads!) James F. Carver 610 Gay Street, Box 214 Portsmouth, Ohio 45662-0214 e-mail: heritage@zoomnet.net