Their barrells were full of apples- The southerners didn't even have a barrell. Carlene Leatherwood wrote: > I am from Texas and consider myself a southerner. i enjoy all the postings > on the " Late Unpleasantness". it just occurred to me while reading this > last posting, Wonder what happened up North after the war was over? Or for > that matter did the Northern states suffer as much as the South did. i know > they lost loved ones but did they suffer deprivation in other forms. guess i > should try to reread history books but thought someone on the list might > know. > > ============================== > Search over 1 Billion names at Ancestry.com! > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/rwlist1.asp

Hi, sorry, what I said about Mr. Rocky Martin being a stagecoach driver and freighter, as was one of the Uncles of Homer Stevens, who also ox carted freight to Fort Graham and Fort Griffin via Chalk Mountain, where he and family lived in Panther Cave. Ever been there? all came from H. Grady Perry's book GRAND OLE ERATH, . He was raised in the rural area around Dublin and ran the Three Way (Johnsville) Store and was a State Representative in Austin, where he gatherred info from State Records. He was a Hurley grandchild. I mentioned several different Martin families for someone who asked- I have no reason to know if they were related and do not think they all were- . I forget- for 300 years now we have always been told that anyone who spelled our name Wyly were kin. Then a small family showed up in S.C. with same Irish and Quaker background which an Australian Wyly descendant plans to try to prove on his trip to Europe this summer that Grandad was right and the 3 Wyly immigrants were cousins if not brothers. We know 2 were brothers. I was rather small when they were active and much I knew about them came from my dad at Johnsville and Uncle and Grandad at Selden. Once again if I was a little confused on this one, but I thought I said that I was listing several Martin Families and did not say nor have reason to believe they were connected. I just thought the inquirer might find a missing link they were hunting. Take care, Charles A. Wyly On Sun, 17 Jun 2001 22:10:45 -0600 john martin <jdmartin@zianet.com> writes: > My uncle Blackie Martin really Lewis Lee Martin, was married to Mont > Thomas's daughter. Uncle Blackie was deputy sheriff under Mont > Thomas > and later sheriff in his own right. > > You have yet to get right anything you say about this family. > Perhaps everything else you write is wrong also! > John Martin > > > > > > > Hi, > Do you have the Selden, Erath County Picketts? Also, I goofed this > morning. I said that Blackie Martin and Carl Turnbow were kin, There > was > also a Mont Thomas. They were all Erath County law officers and > cattle > Traders. Mr. Thomas ran it when I was in High School and my Stone > cousins used to skip school and buy a calf to resell or take home to > a > nurse cow, sometimes with 2 to 4 calves on each cow. Pretty good > part > time job which taught responsibility. > > I am not sure which two of the 3 above were kin- all 3 may have > been. > > Take care, > Charles A. Wyly > > > ============================== > Search over 1 Billion names at Ancestry.com! > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/rwlist1.asp >

I have talked to Judy about this before.... Franklin County Virginia Marriage records - say 1780s, 1790s show an Isaac Rentfro as one of the ministers.... I at first thought several of the families in Franklin Co vA in 1790s were same families who appear on 1840 Van Buren Co AR census, now I find many of the VA families actually ended up in Kentucky....my daughter just got back from Renfro Valley Kentucky. I know the Moses Potter/Francis Kirby in VA went to KY, and it seems so did the Estes, and Kirbys, etc. So my Potters I am still looking for after collecting a lot of info on these Potter/Kirby/Estes. But....I still think my theory about these people traveling together is a good one.... In Franklin Co VA 1791 Elizabeth Young married Anthony Owens with John Young Sur. In the 1840 census of Van Buren Co AR - appears Elizabeth Owens (she must have been a widow) and also John O. Young. So....could it be the same people? There are other names in 1790s VA and 1840 AR which are the same - Young, Potter, Owens, Lemon, Edmunds, etc. So I still think while some went from VA to Kentucky, some might have taken a left and ended up in Arkansas. By the way - Franlin co VA marriage... Turpen Rentfro to Sarah Troupe in 1792, Jesse Rentfro to Lucy bates in 1787. Mary

Hi, I got a historical Humor bit recently claiming that Sam Houston's dad was a Scottish Bowman who could outshoot many Indians. Have you heard this or was it a Joke setup about the French threaten9ing to cut off their Bowfingers if the won a battle? Take care, charles A. Wyly On Sun, 17 Jun 2001 23:14:37 EDT LRudd71847@aol.com writes: > I thought some of you might enjoy reading about Sam Houston and his > relationship with the Cherokees. I've enjoyed reading your recent > postings. > I'm sure not many people are aware of Sam's relationship with John > Jolly. > This article is on the Sam Houston State University web site. > Linda in Texas > > Use of the words "native American" is more than a late-20th Century > effort at > political correctness. That description of the people we have also > called > "Indians" and "American Indians" was used in 1828 by no less than a > Cherokee > chief. > Although they have only recently become popular, the words "native > Americans" > were used by Chief Oo-loo-te-ka to describe the culture that > flourished here > when America was "discovered" and settled by white immigrants. > > Chief Oo-loo-te-ka was also Sam Houston's adoptive father, the man > most > responsible for Houston's personal traits that we so admire--his > bravery, his > oratorical skills, and his leadership. These he likely acquired or > at least > honed in Cherokee communities and at the feet of the wise Cherokee > leader. > > When the agreement was signed in 1828 to move the Georgia Cherokees > to the > west, Oo-loo-te-ka urged that they join him and those who had > already moved > and to become what he hoped would be an independent tribal nation. > He wrote: > > "Instead of being remnants & scattered we should become the United > Tribes of > America...(and) preserve the sinking race of native Americans from > extinction." > > Houston's relationship with Oo-loo-te-ka had begun almost two > decades > earlier, in an age in which native Americans were treated as > sub-humans. > > "To kill an Indian was a public-spirited act;" wrote Marquis James > in his > 1929 biography "The Raven," "to swindle one, the exercise of common > sense." > > With an independence which would later prompt him to be described as > a > "statesman," (although some have speculated that as a boy it was > laziness), > the 16-year-old Houston ran away to live with a band of 300 > Cherokees. His > own father had died when he was 13. He was adopted by Chief > Oo-loo-te-ka and > given the Cherokee name "Co-lo-neh"--The Raven. > > Different authors have used different spellings for Houston's mentor > and his > nickname. James wrote them as they have been spelled here. Marshall > De Bruhl, > in "Sword of San Jacinto," spelled the names "Ooleteka" and > "Kalanu." Chief > Oo-loo-te-ka was also known as John Jolly. > > Later Houston described this period of his life, referring to > himself in the > third person as native Americans often did: > > "Houston has seen nearly all in life there is to live for and yet he > has been > heard to say that when he looks back over the waste...there's > nothing half so > sweet to remember as this sojourn he made among the untutored > children of the > forest." > > After Houston's heroic conduct at the Battle of Horseshoe Bend, he > was named > an Indian sub-agent in Tennessee. He accompanied a delegation of > Cherokees to > Washington in 1818. > > Houston was elected U. S. congressman and governor of Tennessee, but > his > failed first marriage, in 1829, sent him again to the Cherokee > Nation, where > he was made a Cherokee citizen. > > He became influential among the Cherokee, Osage, and Creek. He > lobbied the > War Department for fairer dealings with those Houston called "the > Red People" > and simply "Indians." He operated a trading post, married a Cherokee > wife, > and drank heavily, earning another nickname--Oo-tse-tee > Ar-dee-tah-skee, or > "Big Drunk." > > It was a trip to Washington with a Cherokee delegation that turned > Houston's > life around. An Ohio congressman accused him of dishonesty. Houston > beat him > with his cane and was tried for contempt before the House of > Representatives. > Although reprimanded, Houston was recognized for his magnificent > oratory and > he considered the event his personal resurrection. > > Shortly thereafter he came to Texas, where he continued to remain a > friend to > native Americans when they could claim few others among white men. > His > ability to convince the Texas tribes to remain neutral in the Texas > war for > independence from Mexico was crucial to the Texas army's eventual > success at > San Jacinto. > > Throughout his political career as twice president of the Republic > of Texas, > as U. S. Senator, and as governor, he took the side of native > Americans when > other Texas and national leaders would have banished them westward, > or worse, > had them exterminated. > > "...I will punish any man who does injustice to the Indians," he > wrote in > 1843. "I have known them from my boyhood. They are a brave, honest, > upright > people." > > > ============================== > Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the > #1 > Source for Family History Online. Go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB >

In a message dated 6/18/01 2:44:29 PM !!!First Boot!!!, hlm@qtm.net writes: << I love the stories about the pioneer women - anyone got one? >> I will drag out some research and send a letter written by Anne Royall about early Alabama and the wilderness road. Got to go get the cat from the vet now. Will send this afternoon. Get out the hankies. betty.

>Indian Agent Gen. Joseph Martin had 2 Anglo and 3 or more Cherokee wives >at one time or another. Polygamy was allowed but not common in the >Cherokee Nation. Some Anglo women would overlook the husband's Indian >wife as it guaranteed her and her family's safety from Indian attack and >they were not in the same community at the same time. I could not let this one pass me by....maybe the wives kept quite cause women had so little to say about what their husbands did. If a man wanted to beat his wife, in many places that was his right. If he wanted a mistress, that was his right. Often the "law" on things such as this was the woman's own male relatives. I have heard stories about one family, the wife was beaten by her husband who did a lot of drinking and gambling....the woman's male relatives got a hold of the husband and worked him over, put him in a wagon (guess he was unable to walk) and threw him out at the county line and said he was a dead man if they ever saw him in their county again. They must have thought it was better than going to court for a divorce..... That is probably why it was so important who your mother's family was.....kind of like in Scotland. When you were in trouble, you could depend on your whole family - both sides - helping you out. Orphan children were often raised by grandparents or aunts and uncles from the mother's side. Maybe why so often the mother's maiden name, or even the grandmothers were used as middle names for sons - or even first names. I have found strange first or middle names as a clue to female line. I am still working on one named either Garman or Jarman born 1820s in Tennessee. Looking at the area the family was living then, I find both a Jarman and a Garman family....and even a Germany one. Old census records on this man, it is something different ever time so that is why I am not sure what it really was. Anyway, women often kept their mouths shut (yes it is possible) regarding what their husbands did. How many women do you think were real happy about packing up and moving off to the wilderness? Having babies while moving from place to place, being left at home so much while the husbands ran around saving the world? Not much is said about the women, and yet they were the ones who made the homes, kept the children, often educated the children....their lives were centered around not exploration but perserving the future generation. I have found in my research that the family which had an educated mother, did much better each generation. So much of how the family progressed depended on if the mother lived, and if she had some education. If she could read and write, the next generation seemed to leap ahead. If she died when the children were young, it was much harder on them. I love the stories about the pioneer women - anyone got one? My favorite I think is the one about Sevier's second wife....Bonny Kate. I know Charles can tell that one. Mary

I am from Texas and consider myself a southerner. i enjoy all the postings on the " Late Unpleasantness". it just occurred to me while reading this last posting, Wonder what happened up North after the war was over? Or for that matter did the Northern states suffer as much as the South did. i know they lost loved ones but did they suffer deprivation in other forms. guess i should try to reread history books but thought someone on the list might know.

My ancestors had to sell the family farms and furniture and move into town to find work in the mills and stores. The Reconstruction Period is often breezed over by those folks from the north because that period of time was harder on the whole south than the war was. At least before the war our people had their land. Afterwards they could not afford to pay the taxes and could not keep the land. The Reconstruction Period makes my blood boil more than thinking about the war. At least during the war we had a fighting chance. I had about a dozen great-grandfathers & great uncles fighting for their land in the South. Sandy Granmommy Jeremiah 29:11 Quixtar Independent Business Owner Future Resident of the Old Genealogists Home, best kept secret in America.

In a message dated 6/18/01 3:17:00 AM !!!First Boot!!!, LRudd71847@aol.com writes: << After Houston's heroic conduct at the Battle of Horseshoe Bend, he was named an Indian sub-agent in Tennessee >> Learn something new every day. I did not know that he was at Horseshoe Bend. It is now a National Park. Visited there a couple of times. Beautiful place. Betty.

>........ correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the Natchez trace , used by Indians leaving New Orleans for the Memphis area .< Actually, the Trace runs from Nashville to Natchez. Memphis doesn't enter into it.It was a major thoroughfare in the Old Southwest used by traders and the military, as well native Americans... today the Trace is a scenic route through some really beautiful country. You can get on it in any number of places. P.Walk _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com

Thought this might be of some interest to the list.It is a transcript of a tape made by my grandfather Toby Lonzo Holsted (I did the interview). His father Robert Holsted was about age 15 at the end of the Civil War. They lived in Searcy County AR. Lemuel, father of Robert was killed in Feb 1865. This is Robert's account of life immediately after the war. If no interest just hit delete. What did they do they after he (Lemuel) was killed? How did they make a crop? They had a little field back up the holler and they went up there and planted corn. Now these boys did that-they's three of em. My dad and two brothers, but I don't remember which one's what, and they up there and was hoein corn and they come back down, they talked it over and decided they's goin to starve to death. They come back down through by an old man by the name of Adams. Dad always called him Uncle Joe, Joe Adams, and he hollered at the boys and asked em why they was quittin. Said well they knowed it wasn't no use to work, they knowed that corn, they couldn't wait till that was growed, they decided they'd just go on, and the old man hollered at em and told them to go down there and get a sheep he had, an old black sheep, and kill it, butcher it, and eat it. And that's what they done, went back to the field, and went to hoein their corn. Something about eating buds off the trees, or somethin? He said he eat sassafras buds down-lot of people don't know what a sassafras is-but it's a little sprout that grows there in Arkansas, you know, and they eat this slippery elm bark, peel the rough part off, and eat the slippery elm bark and eat buds off bushes. That's what they lived on. And he said the first good meal he got after they liked to starved to death, his mother took him to one of the neighbors once and they had bear meat for dinner, and she was afraid he'd eat enough to kill him. Wouldn't let him eat all of it he wanted. I've heard him tell it so many times-it was the best meal he thought he ever eat, was that bear meat. Because he hadn't had any meat in such a long time? That's right. And them days they didn't have no salt to put in their food, even when they had meat, didn't had no salt. And they'd go in these old smoke houses where they had salted meat years ago and dig up that dirt and put it in the water and boil the water off and strain it through somethin and use that for salt. No salt 'cause of the War, was that what it was? They just run out of salt. Nobody didn't have no salt. Because of the War. Yeah, and I don't know why they run out of salt, but they did. There's no natural salt down in that area where??? No, not that I know of.

I thought some of you might enjoy reading about Sam Houston and his relationship with the Cherokees. I've enjoyed reading your recent postings. I'm sure not many people are aware of Sam's relationship with John Jolly. This article is on the Sam Houston State University web site. Linda in Texas Use of the words "native American" is more than a late-20th Century effort at political correctness. That description of the people we have also called "Indians" and "American Indians" was used in 1828 by no less than a Cherokee chief. Although they have only recently become popular, the words "native Americans" were used by Chief Oo-loo-te-ka to describe the culture that flourished here when America was "discovered" and settled by white immigrants. Chief Oo-loo-te-ka was also Sam Houston's adoptive father, the man most responsible for Houston's personal traits that we so admire--his bravery, his oratorical skills, and his leadership. These he likely acquired or at least honed in Cherokee communities and at the feet of the wise Cherokee leader. When the agreement was signed in 1828 to move the Georgia Cherokees to the west, Oo-loo-te-ka urged that they join him and those who had already moved and to become what he hoped would be an independent tribal nation. He wrote: "Instead of being remnants & scattered we should become the United Tribes of America...(and) preserve the sinking race of native Americans from extinction." Houston's relationship with Oo-loo-te-ka had begun almost two decades earlier, in an age in which native Americans were treated as sub-humans. "To kill an Indian was a public-spirited act;" wrote Marquis James in his 1929 biography "The Raven," "to swindle one, the exercise of common sense." With an independence which would later prompt him to be described as a "statesman," (although some have speculated that as a boy it was laziness), the 16-year-old Houston ran away to live with a band of 300 Cherokees. His own father had died when he was 13. He was adopted by Chief Oo-loo-te-ka and given the Cherokee name "Co-lo-neh"--The Raven. Different authors have used different spellings for Houston's mentor and his nickname. James wrote them as they have been spelled here. Marshall De Bruhl, in "Sword of San Jacinto," spelled the names "Ooleteka" and "Kalanu." Chief Oo-loo-te-ka was also known as John Jolly. Later Houston described this period of his life, referring to himself in the third person as native Americans often did: "Houston has seen nearly all in life there is to live for and yet he has been heard to say that when he looks back over the waste...there's nothing half so sweet to remember as this sojourn he made among the untutored children of the forest." After Houston's heroic conduct at the Battle of Horseshoe Bend, he was named an Indian sub-agent in Tennessee. He accompanied a delegation of Cherokees to Washington in 1818. Houston was elected U. S. congressman and governor of Tennessee, but his failed first marriage, in 1829, sent him again to the Cherokee Nation, where he was made a Cherokee citizen. He became influential among the Cherokee, Osage, and Creek. He lobbied the War Department for fairer dealings with those Houston called "the Red People" and simply "Indians." He operated a trading post, married a Cherokee wife, and drank heavily, earning another nickname--Oo-tse-tee Ar-dee-tah-skee, or "Big Drunk." It was a trip to Washington with a Cherokee delegation that turned Houston's life around. An Ohio congressman accused him of dishonesty. Houston beat him with his cane and was tried for contempt before the House of Representatives. Although reprimanded, Houston was recognized for his magnificent oratory and he considered the event his personal resurrection. Shortly thereafter he came to Texas, where he continued to remain a friend to native Americans when they could claim few others among white men. His ability to convince the Texas tribes to remain neutral in the Texas war for independence from Mexico was crucial to the Texas army's eventual success at San Jacinto. Throughout his political career as twice president of the Republic of Texas, as U. S. Senator, and as governor, he took the side of native Americans when other Texas and national leaders would have banished them westward, or worse, had them exterminated. "...I will punish any man who does injustice to the Indians," he wrote in 1843. "I have known them from my boyhood. They are a brave, honest, upright people."

My uncle Blackie Martin really Lewis Lee Martin, was married to Mont Thomas's daughter. Uncle Blackie was deputy sheriff under Mont Thomas and later sheriff in his own right. You have yet to get right anything you say about this family. Perhaps everything else you write is wrong also! John Martin Hi, Do you have the Selden, Erath County Picketts? Also, I goofed this morning. I said that Blackie Martin and Carl Turnbow were kin, There was also a Mont Thomas. They were all Erath County law officers and cattle Traders. Mr. Thomas ran it when I was in High School and my Stone cousins used to skip school and buy a calf to resell or take home to a nurse cow, sometimes with 2 to 4 calves on each cow. Pretty good part time job which taught responsibility. I am not sure which two of the 3 above were kin- all 3 may have been. Take care, Charles A. Wyly

No, I grew up in south Arkansas. My Middlebrooks grandfather came there about 1890. Charles M.

Charles Middlebrooks, did you grow up in Anson, TX?? I know there are Middlebrooks in that area. Dortha Greenlee

Hi, The War Eagle Mill may be the only undershot mill now west of the Mississippi, but there was one in early 1900's in New Braunfels , Texas which powered the Comall Cotton mills and the dam is still visible from I-35 and the mill is still open useing other power now. Comal Cotton was once a choice product. We ate in the 3rd story restaurant there the day before the fair opened on both sides of the River- No one would discuss the rivalry between those North of the River by the Mill and high 1 way Iron bridge And the grounds a short distance down the road on the other side of the River. This wouldn't have anything to do with the Trail of Tears and those who were already there , would it? Just a wilcd Guess. My mom was born in Hope and had kin in Batesville, Nashville, Pine Mountain and other places in Arkansas. Take care, Charles A. Wyly On Sun, 17 Jun 2001 15:04:27 -0500 "Jeanie Bismark" <bismark@arkansas.net> writes: > The War Eagle grist mill is located east of Rogers, AR in Benton Co. > on Arkansas Road 12. It is a working undershot water mill, said to > be > the only one west of the Mississippi. Of course it is a replacement, > the last one was destroyed during the Civil War. > > The mill is the site of a spring juried craft fair which has spawned > additional fairs throughout most of Benton County and attracts > thousands of visitors. Another craft fair is held in October. > > There is also a War Eagle Cavern. > > Jeanie > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "skm" <flintlock@kcnet.com> > To: <Southern-Trails-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2001 11:24 PM > Subject: Re: [SouthernTrails] Re: Southern-Trails-D Digest > > > > Could you tell me where the grist mill is located? I have looked > for many > > years for it. > > No one had a knowledge of it until you mentioned it. > > > > ============================== > Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the > #1 > Source for Family History Online. Go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB >

Thank you. N D Rees From: LRudd71847@aol.com Reply-To: Southern-Trails-L@rootsweb.com Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 23:14:37 EDT To: Southern-Trails-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [SouthernTrails] Sam Houston the Cherokee Citizen Resent-From: Southern-Trails-L@rootsweb.com Resent-Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 21:14:43 -0600 I thought some of you might enjoy reading about Sam Houston and his relationship with the Cherokees. I've enjoyed reading your recent postings. I'm sure not many people are aware of Sam's relationship with John Jolly. This article is on the Sam Houston State University web site. Linda in Texas Use of the words "native American" is more than a late-20th Century effort at political correctness. That description of the people we have also called "Indians" and "American Indians" was used in 1828 by no less than a Cherokee chief. Although they have only recently become popular, the words "native Americans" were used by Chief Oo-loo-te-ka to describe the culture that flourished here when America was "discovered" and settled by white immigrants. Chief Oo-loo-te-ka was also Sam Houston's adoptive father, the man most responsible for Houston's personal traits that we so admire--his bravery, his oratorical skills, and his leadership. These he likely acquired or at least honed in Cherokee communities and at the feet of the wise Cherokee leader. When the agreement was signed in 1828 to move the Georgia Cherokees to the west, Oo-loo-te-ka urged that they join him and those who had already moved and to become what he hoped would be an independent tribal nation. He wrote: "Instead of being remnants & scattered we should become the United Tribes of America...(and) preserve the sinking race of native Americans from extinction." Houston's relationship with Oo-loo-te-ka had begun almost two decades earlier, in an age in which native Americans were treated as sub-humans. "To kill an Indian was a public-spirited act;" wrote Marquis James in his 1929 biography "The Raven," "to swindle one, the exercise of common sense." With an independence which would later prompt him to be described as a "statesman," (although some have speculated that as a boy it was laziness), the 16-year-old Houston ran away to live with a band of 300 Cherokees. His own father had died when he was 13. He was adopted by Chief Oo-loo-te-ka and given the Cherokee name "Co-lo-neh"--The Raven. Different authors have used different spellings for Houston's mentor and his nickname. James wrote them as they have been spelled here. Marshall De Bruhl, in "Sword of San Jacinto," spelled the names "Ooleteka" and "Kalanu." Chief Oo-loo-te-ka was also known as John Jolly. Later Houston described this period of his life, referring to himself in the third person as native Americans often did: "Houston has seen nearly all in life there is to live for and yet he has been heard to say that when he looks back over the waste...there's nothing half so sweet to remember as this sojourn he made among the untutored children of the forest." After Houston's heroic conduct at the Battle of Horseshoe Bend, he was named an Indian sub-agent in Tennessee. He accompanied a delegation of Cherokees to Washington in 1818. Houston was elected U. S. congressman and governor of Tennessee, but his failed first marriage, in 1829, sent him again to the Cherokee Nation, where he was made a Cherokee citizen. He became influential among the Cherokee, Osage, and Creek. He lobbied the War Department for fairer dealings with those Houston called "the Red People" and simply "Indians." He operated a trading post, married a Cherokee wife, and drank heavily, earning another nickname--Oo-tse-tee Ar-dee-tah-skee, or "Big Drunk." It was a trip to Washington with a Cherokee delegation that turned Houston's life around. An Ohio congressman accused him of dishonesty. Houston beat him with his cane and was tried for contempt before the House of Representatives. Although reprimanded, Houston was recognized for his magnificent oratory and he considered the event his personal resurrection. Shortly thereafter he came to Texas, where he continued to remain a friend to native Americans when they could claim few others among white men. His ability to convince the Texas tribes to remain neutral in the Texas war for independence from Mexico was crucial to the Texas army's eventual success at San Jacinto. Throughout his political career as twice president of the Republic of Texas, as U. S. Senator, and as governor, he took the side of native Americans when other Texas and national leaders would have banished them westward, or worse, had them exterminated. "...I will punish any man who does injustice to the Indians," he wrote in 1843. "I have known them from my boyhood. They are a brave, honest, upright people." ============================== Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the #1 Source for Family History Online. Go to: http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB

could this Renfro be any connection w/ Renfro Valley,Kentucky? Where gospel& country,bluegrass music has been held for more than 40yrs?My wife used to sing there as a little girl w/ her mother and father,who were known as "The Singing Taylors" an ole time gospel song trio--

Hi, did you get my reply? my computer shows "Forwarded" Charles A. Wyly On Tue, 22 May 2001 22:45:02 -0500 "armenta" <armenta@brightok.net> writes: > Charles, which Ramage family are you talking of. How are you related > to them, and where are they located. My brother is married to a > Ramage. It is an unusual name. > > Armenta....... > > Charles, Thank you for the information about the Wire Road. I find > it useful. > > Armenta............ > > > ============================== > Ancestry.com Genealogical Databases > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/rwlist2.asp > Search over 2500 databases with one easy query! >

As you may know, Cooke has also written a book with the same name. It is very interesting, I think. He helps put our experiences in the perspective of a Britisher. Charles Middlebrooks