Too many "probables", Brian. Here are some facts and comments: 1. "It is probable that several years elapsed between the date of the first occupation of the Cape by Van Riebeek, on the part of Holland, and the time when land surveying was taken up as a profession, or became necessary: for so long as the views of the Dutch Government were confined to a settlement in Table Valley for the purpose of supplying ships with fresh provisions, it is probable that the division or allotment of ground was altogether subservient to that object..." 1a. Records show that at the first occupation of the Cape by the Dutch, the Van Riebeeck administration had access to skilled surveyors. Mariners themselves were skilled surveyors, possessing the mathematical knowledge and instruments to complete such tasks. At first, Company buildings and gardens, as well as roads, needed to be laid out in an orderly fashion, necessitating surveying. As free burghers took up agricultural pursuits, notably close to the military presence at Cape Town, and only on the Cape Peninsula, plots of land were claimed; these were surveyed and title deeds were issued. By 1658, 275 morgen of land had been granted to free burghers. Charts of the area were regularly made and amended, and sent to Amsterdam. You can see all this for yourselves: http://www.mocavo.com/Precis-of-the-Archives-of-the-Cape-of-Good-Hope- Letters-Despatched-From-the-Cape-Volume-13/481461/31 Charts: pages 19, 20, 21; images 31, 32, 33/498, etc. Title Deeds: page 19; image 31/498 and 326/498 onwards (1657-62) Land surveyor: page 21; image 33/498 In a letter of 11 April 1658, van Riebeeck sets out his staffing requirements, including 1 Surveyor and 1 Cartographer. See: page 30; image 42/498 2. "...But when individual interests sprung up and accumulated with increasing population, the fertile land about Stellenbosch, the Paarl, and Groenekloof became tenanted, and about the year 1744, the loan places or annual tenures at the will of the Government had extended to the north of Piquetberg..." 2a. The loan farm system whereby a land holder paid an annual rent to the Company, was also partly a quitrent system, and the land holder would be entitled to freehold deeds for the land after 20 years of payments. (Ref:) Franz Joosten, a German from Lippstad, who had arrived at the Cape in 1693 as a soldier in the employ of the Company, became a Dutch citizen and was granted the standard 60 morgen farm at the furthest boundary of the settlement at Drakenstein (Groen Kloof) in 1700. You can see by the outline of his surveyed farm, that it had a panhandle shape. with a long, narrow handle stretching from a spring (up the mountain) to the homestead. Franz (Frans) Joosten (Jooste) was murdered by his wife and his two slaves in late 1713 or early 1714, and his farm Bartholomeusklip was surveyed on 28 August 1714, to allow his Estate to be passed on to his two young sons. According to Barend J. Toerien, who researched and documented these events (Die wegraak van Frans Joosten), the farm was found to be 50.352 morgen in extent. However, the survey deed indicates that the area was 59 morgen, 352 roods, so possibly a typo by the former. It is interesting to see how close to the 60 morgen grant the farm was originally measured, which indicates that it was, indeed, surveyed when granted in 1700. You can see this farm diagram at: http://csg.dla.gov.za/esio/searchproperty.jsp Select Province: Western Cape + Farm Name = Barthlomeus Klip; Select `Search´ On Search result, click `Search´ at the end of the top line. 3."The loan tenure was introduced by the Dutch Government at a very early date. It consisted simply of an annual lease, renewable annually, on payment of rent fixed by the Government. No legal title was issued,.." 3a. See letter from Johan (Jan) van Riebeeck to the Amsterdam Chamber et al, dated 20 Feb 1858, annexure No. 23: Title Deeds. Also see 2a. above. http://www.mocavo.com/Precis-of-the-Archives-of-the-Cape-of-Good-Hope- Letters-Despatched-From-the-Cape-Volume-13/481461/31 4. "...nor survey made:... 4a. See Title Deeds: Pages 314 to 343; images 326 to 355 Many survey drawings are shown, from claim1 / title deed. Where survey drawings are not shown, it is generally because the boundaries of the properties are described in relation to fixed, surveyed objects, such as roads, inside the town limits of Cape Town. 5. "...the position being defined by a central point, which was generally a local feature, as a spring of water or conspicuous rock, and often a beacon was planted where no local feature existed. From this central point, generally known as the 'ordinantie', the right of the lessee extended no further than a walk of half an hour direct out from the selected centre, which was considered to be, and adopted as the radius of a circle containing 3000 morgen." 5a. It would be more convincing if we knew the time frame for this system (certainly not before the mid-1700s), and how many people used it and in which areas (certainly not in the fully settled areas). The arithmetic fits for 3000 morgen, certainly not 4500 morgen. For a circular farm, which is the best shape for fitting in the maximum area (not that I´ve seen any large farms of regular shape), a simple half-hour walk in any direction to establish the radius, would require a person to cover a distance of 1.78 miles, averaging a brisk 3.56 mph. Although we have now established that this is possible, I, for one, would like to know of any primary sources for this proposition, not just repetitions of repetitions. Urban myth comes to mind. 6. "By a proclamation dated 16th October, 1812, the Government expressed the intention to grant land on perpetual quitrent; . and on 23rd July, 1813, an advertisement appeared conveying the intention of the Governor to grant land only on a reservation of quitrent, and that no grant should be made, unless upon a survey and diagram regularly 'executed and prepared by the surveyor appointed by Government' " 6a. I believe that this system was rejected by the majority of farmers, and disregarded until a more acceptable system eventually replaced it. Excuse me for not quoting a reference. Best wishes, John Powell

Sorry. The farm of Franz Joosten should be correctly spelt Bartholomeus Klip. Apologies, John John Powell

Thanks John You've gone to a lot of trouble - much appreciated. I'll spend some time on this tomorrow. I guess there's no short answer as to why, if my chap had used the system of measurement available at the time, 3000 Morg should have stretched to 13363 morg 11 years later when it was properly surveyed and granted as a Perpetual Quitrent farm. What makes this even more confusing is that he was not even a Burgher of the Colony when he acquired the land in 1827. He only applied for "Burghership" in 1830. I'll have another go at this when next I visit the archives to see if I can lay my hands on his Loan Farm grant of 1827. I just love these family mysteries. Brian Benningfield Phones: 27(0)832759857 or 27(0)219758695    Fax: 27(0)866848582 Skype: brianben44   E-Mail: brian.ben44@gmail.com Researching: The BEN(N)INGFIELD; EYBERS; van TUBBERGH; DANIEL; VAN ASWEGEN; LATSKY and related families. -----Original Message----- From: south-africa-eastern-cape-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:south-africa-eastern-cape-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of ctrhine via Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2015 1:53 PM To: The Revd Fr Brian Tee via Subject: Re: [ZA-EC] Measuring a morgen Too many "probables", Brian. Here are some facts and comments: 1. "It is probable that several years elapsed between the date of the first occupation of the Cape by Van Riebeek, on the part of Holland, and the time when land surveying was taken up as a profession, or became necessary: for so long as the views of the Dutch Government were confined to a settlement in Table Valley for the purpose of supplying ships with fresh provisions, it is probable that the division or allotment of ground was altogether subservient to that object..." 1a. Records show that at the first occupation of the Cape by the Dutch, the Van Riebeeck administration had access to skilled surveyors. Mariners themselves were skilled surveyors, possessing the mathematical knowledge and instruments to complete such tasks. At first, Company buildings and gardens, as well as roads, needed to be laid out in an orderly fashion, necessitating surveying. As free burghers took up agricultural pursuits, notably close to the military presence at Cape Town, and only on the Cape Peninsula, plots of land were claimed; these were surveyed and title deeds were issued. By 1658, 275 morgen of land had been granted to free burghers. Charts of the area were regularly made and amended, and sent to Amsterdam. You can see all this for yourselves: http://www.mocavo.com/Precis-of-the-Archives-of-the-Cape-of-Good-Hope- Letters-Despatched-From-the-Cape-Volume-13/481461/31 Charts: pages 19, 20, 21; images 31, 32, 33/498, etc. Title Deeds: page 19; image 31/498 and 326/498 onwards (1657-62) Land surveyor: page 21; image 33/498 In a letter of 11 April 1658, van Riebeeck sets out his staffing requirements, including 1 Surveyor and 1 Cartographer. See: page 30; image 42/498 2. "...But when individual interests sprung up and accumulated with increasing population, the fertile land about Stellenbosch, the Paarl, and Groenekloof became tenanted, and about the year 1744, the loan places or annual tenures at the will of the Government had extended to the north of Piquetberg..." 2a. The loan farm system whereby a land holder paid an annual rent to the Company, was also partly a quitrent system, and the land holder would be entitled to freehold deeds for the land after 20 years of payments. (Ref:) Franz Joosten, a German from Lippstad, who had arrived at the Cape in 1693 as a soldier in the employ of the Company, became a Dutch citizen and was granted the standard 60 morgen farm at the furthest boundary of the settlement at Drakenstein (Groen Kloof) in 1700. You can see by the outline of his surveyed farm, that it had a panhandle shape. with a long, narrow handle stretching from a spring (up the mountain) to the homestead. Franz (Frans) Joosten (Jooste) was murdered by his wife and his two slaves in late 1713 or early 1714, and his farm Bartholomeusklip was surveyed on 28 August 1714, to allow his Estate to be passed on to his two young sons. According to Barend J. Toerien, who researched and documented these events (Die wegraak van Frans Joosten), the farm was found to be 50.352 morgen in extent. However, the survey deed indicates that the area was 59 morgen, 352 roods, so possibly a typo by the former. It is interesting to see how close to the 60 morgen grant the farm was originally measured, which indicates that it was, indeed, surveyed when granted in 1700. You can see this farm diagram at: http://csg.dla.gov.za/esio/searchproperty.jsp Select Province: Western Cape + Farm Name = Barthlomeus Klip; Select `Search´ On Search result, click `Search´ at the end of the top line. 3."The loan tenure was introduced by the Dutch Government at a very early date. It consisted simply of an annual lease, renewable annually, on payment of rent fixed by the Government. No legal title was issued,.." 3a. See letter from Johan (Jan) van Riebeeck to the Amsterdam Chamber et al, dated 20 Feb 1858, annexure No. 23: Title Deeds. Also see 2a. above. http://www.mocavo.com/Precis-of-the-Archives-of-the-Cape-of-Good-Hope- Letters-Despatched-From-the-Cape-Volume-13/481461/31 4. "...nor survey made:... 4a. See Title Deeds: Pages 314 to 343; images 326 to 355 Many survey drawings are shown, from claim1 / title deed. Where survey drawings are not shown, it is generally because the boundaries of the properties are described in relation to fixed, surveyed objects, such as roads, inside the town limits of Cape Town. 5. "...the position being defined by a central point, which was generally a local feature, as a spring of water or conspicuous rock, and often a beacon was planted where no local feature existed. From this central point, generally known as the 'ordinantie', the right of the lessee extended no further than a walk of half an hour direct out from the selected centre, which was considered to be, and adopted as the radius of a circle containing 3000 morgen." 5a. It would be more convincing if we knew the time frame for this system (certainly not before the mid-1700s), and how many people used it and in which areas (certainly not in the fully settled areas). The arithmetic fits for 3000 morgen, certainly not 4500 morgen. For a circular farm, which is the best shape for fitting in the maximum area (not that I´ve seen any large farms of regular shape), a simple half-hour walk in any direction to establish the radius, would require a person to cover a distance of 1.78 miles, averaging a brisk 3.56 mph. Although we have now established that this is possible, I, for one, would like to know of any primary sources for this proposition, not just repetitions of repetitions. Urban myth comes to mind. 6. "By a proclamation dated 16th October, 1812, the Government expressed the intention to grant land on perpetual quitrent; . and on 23rd July, 1813, an advertisement appeared conveying the intention of the Governor to grant land only on a reservation of quitrent, and that no grant should be made, unless upon a survey and diagram regularly 'executed and prepared by the surveyor appointed by Government' " 6a. I believe that this system was rejected by the majority of farmers, and disregarded until a more acceptable system eventually replaced it. Excuse me for not quoting a reference. Best wishes, John Powell ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ----- No virus found in this message. 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Dear John, I would just like to point out that everything I quoted in my email was taken verbatim from a publication of the Department of Lands. Regards, Brian+. -----Original Message----- From: south-africa-eastern-cape-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:south-africa-eastern-cape-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of ctrhine via Sent: 21 January 2015 19:53 To: The Revd Fr Brian Tee via Subject: Re: [ZA-EC] Measuring a morgen Too many "probables", Brian. Here are some facts and comments: 1. "It is probable that several years elapsed between the date of the first occupation of the Cape by Van Riebeek, on the part of Holland, and the time when land surveying was taken up as a profession, or became necessary: for so long as the views of the Dutch Government were confined to a settlement in Table Valley for the purpose of supplying ships with fresh provisions, it is probable that the division or allotment of ground was altogether subservient to that object..." 1a. Records show that at the first occupation of the Cape by the Dutch, the Van Riebeeck administration had access to skilled surveyors. Mariners themselves were skilled surveyors, possessing the mathematical knowledge and instruments to complete such tasks. At first, Company buildings and gardens, as well as roads, needed to be laid out in an orderly fashion, necessitating surveying. As free burghers took up agricultural pursuits, notably close to the military presence at Cape Town, and only on the Cape Peninsula, plots of land were claimed; these were surveyed and title deeds were issued. By 1658, 275 morgen of land had been granted to free burghers. Charts of the area were regularly made and amended, and sent to Amsterdam. You can see all this for yourselves: http://www.mocavo.com/Precis-of-the-Archives-of-the-Cape-of-Good-Hope- Letters-Despatched-From-the-Cape-Volume-13/481461/31 Charts: pages 19, 20, 21; images 31, 32, 33/498, etc. Title Deeds: page 19; image 31/498 and 326/498 onwards (1657-62) Land surveyor: page 21; image 33/498 In a letter of 11 April 1658, van Riebeeck sets out his staffing requirements, including 1 Surveyor and 1 Cartographer. See: page 30; image 42/498 2. "...But when individual interests sprung up and accumulated with increasing population, the fertile land about Stellenbosch, the Paarl, and Groenekloof became tenanted, and about the year 1744, the loan places or annual tenures at the will of the Government had extended to the north of Piquetberg..." 2a. The loan farm system whereby a land holder paid an annual rent to the Company, was also partly a quitrent system, and the land holder would be entitled to freehold deeds for the land after 20 years of payments. (Ref:) Franz Joosten, a German from Lippstad, who had arrived at the Cape in 1693 as a soldier in the employ of the Company, became a Dutch citizen and was granted the standard 60 morgen farm at the furthest boundary of the settlement at Drakenstein (Groen Kloof) in 1700. You can see by the outline of his surveyed farm, that it had a panhandle shape. with a long, narrow handle stretching from a spring (up the mountain) to the homestead. Franz (Frans) Joosten (Jooste) was murdered by his wife and his two slaves in late 1713 or early 1714, and his farm Bartholomeusklip was surveyed on 28 August 1714, to allow his Estate to be passed on to his two young sons. According to Barend J. Toerien, who researched and documented these events (Die wegraak van Frans Joosten), the farm was found to be 50.352 morgen in extent. However, the survey deed indicates that the area was 59 morgen, 352 roods, so possibly a typo by the former. It is interesting to see how close to the 60 morgen grant the farm was originally measured, which indicates that it was, indeed, surveyed when granted in 1700. You can see this farm diagram at: http://csg.dla.gov.za/esio/searchproperty.jsp Select Province: Western Cape + Farm Name = Barthlomeus Klip; Select `Search´ On Search result, click `Search´ at the end of the top line. 3."The loan tenure was introduced by the Dutch Government at a very early date. It consisted simply of an annual lease, renewable annually, on payment of rent fixed by the Government. No legal title was issued,.." 3a. See letter from Johan (Jan) van Riebeeck to the Amsterdam Chamber et al, dated 20 Feb 1858, annexure No. 23: Title Deeds. Also see 2a. above. http://www.mocavo.com/Precis-of-the-Archives-of-the-Cape-of-Good-Hope- Letters-Despatched-From-the-Cape-Volume-13/481461/31 4. "...nor survey made:... 4a. See Title Deeds: Pages 314 to 343; images 326 to 355 Many survey drawings are shown, from claim1 / title deed. Where survey drawings are not shown, it is generally because the boundaries of the properties are described in relation to fixed, surveyed objects, such as roads, inside the town limits of Cape Town. 5. "...the position being defined by a central point, which was generally a local feature, as a spring of water or conspicuous rock, and often a beacon was planted where no local feature existed. From this central point, generally known as the 'ordinantie', the right of the lessee extended no further than a walk of half an hour direct out from the selected centre, which was considered to be, and adopted as the radius of a circle containing 3000 morgen." 5a. It would be more convincing if we knew the time frame for this system (certainly not before the mid-1700s), and how many people used it and in which areas (certainly not in the fully settled areas). The arithmetic fits for 3000 morgen, certainly not 4500 morgen. For a circular farm, which is the best shape for fitting in the maximum area (not that I´ve seen any large farms of regular shape), a simple half-hour walk in any direction to establish the radius, would require a person to cover a distance of 1.78 miles, averaging a brisk 3.56 mph. Although we have now established that this is possible, I, for one, would like to know of any primary sources for this proposition, not just repetitions of repetitions. Urban myth comes to mind. 6. "By a proclamation dated 16th October, 1812, the Government expressed the intention to grant land on perpetual quitrent; . and on 23rd July, 1813, an advertisement appeared conveying the intention of the Governor to grant land only on a reservation of quitrent, and that no grant should be made, unless upon a survey and diagram regularly 'executed and prepared by the surveyor appointed by Government' " 6a. I believe that this system was rejected by the majority of farmers, and disregarded until a more acceptable system eventually replaced it. Excuse me for not quoting a reference. Best wishes, John Powell ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message