I am looking for information on George Paton and his family. George was a Lieutenant in the Cape Mounted Rifles and married Magdalene Johanna Cornelia Prys, probably prior to 1820. They had 5 children all born in Cape Town; Alexander Prys, (B. Sept 8, 1820); Martha Elizabeth, (B. Oct 20, 1823, D. at Sea Point S.A. Jan 31, 1828); Dorothea, (B. Apr. 27, 1825); George Ponty, (B. Oct 24 1826, D. Feb 15, 1827 at 16 Strand St.) James, (B. Sept. 3 1828) Magdalene died Oct 27, 1828 in Cape Town and George moved back to Scotland. I am going to be in Cape Town at the end of October and would like to verify the above and obtain further information if possible. How would I go about checking the marriage, births and deaths - through civil registration or parish records? Are any of the early records indexed and/or transcribed? What cemeteries would have been in use in the 1820's? Any information that would assist me as I have limited time would be appreciated. Jim Westell Sharon, Ontario, Canada

Hi Sharon I think that sometimes people using fingers and pencils are more destructive to the documents than camera flashes. When working at the archives I go every hour to wash and dry my hands as the uric acid on our hands does immense damage - far greater than a flash of light. I do agree however that flash's should be removed. The only way we can go forward is to digitise all the documents and with this we need thousands of dedicated volunteers who will transcribe documents from "digital images" - as this is the most effective and fastest way to get copies of images.!! Doe this mean the LDS must be stopped from using there camera's as well as the staff at the archives ? I rest my case Heather Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will be moving on 19th September to www.familytree.co.za Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sharon Warr" <snw@absamail.co.za> To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 10:16 AM Subject: [South-Africa-Cape-Town] Restrictions on Digital Cameras at Archives??? Good Day All I know that many on the list are also subscribed to other South African Lists and might have seen the posting by Delia Robertson on the rumour that the Pretoria Archives might be about to ban the use of digital cameras. It is important that we discuss this issue amongst ourselves so that we can come up with some kind of standpoint before it becomes official. We as genealogists are dedicated users of Archival facilities and must go out of our way to preserve the material from wear and tear but when a non destructive method of copying a document (without a flash if the experts feel that it might damage material in the long term) is about to be banned then I think we should put our heads together and talk about it. Regards Sharon Warr View 1800s SOUTH AFRICAN PASSENGER LISTS at http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/DataArchive.htm SCRIBES PUBLISHING for Colonial Books on CD - visit http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/Scribes.htm ==== SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN Mailing List ==== FamilyTree.co.za.......it's the place to hang out and do your Family Tree ============================== Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237

I have just visited the Metropolitan Museum in New York, where we were allowed to use cameras without flash for any exhibit. Ivy Trott. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sharon Warr" <snw@absamail.co.za> To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 10:16 AM Subject: [South-Africa-Cape-Town] Restrictions on Digital Cameras at Archives??? > Good Day All > I know that many on the list are also subscribed to other South African Lists and might have seen the posting by Delia Robertson on the rumour that the Pretoria Archives might be about to ban the use of digital cameras. It is important that we discuss this issue amongst ourselves so that we can come up with some kind of standpoint before it becomes official. We as genealogists are dedicated users of Archival facilities and must go out of our way to preserve the material from wear and tear but when a non destructive method of copying a document (without a flash if the experts feel that it might damage material in the long term) is about to be banned then I think we should put our heads together and talk about it. > Regards > Sharon Warr > > View 1800s SOUTH AFRICAN PASSENGER LISTS at http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/DataArchive.htm > SCRIBES PUBLISHING for Colonial Books on CD - visit http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/Scribes.htm > > > ==== SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN Mailing List ==== > FamilyTree.co.za.......it's the place to hang out and do your Family Tree > > ============================== > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237 >

Good Day All I know that many on the list are also subscribed to other South African Lists and might have seen the posting by Delia Robertson on the rumour that the Pretoria Archives might be about to ban the use of digital cameras. It is important that we discuss this issue amongst ourselves so that we can come up with some kind of standpoint before it becomes official. We as genealogists are dedicated users of Archival facilities and must go out of our way to preserve the material from wear and tear but when a non destructive method of copying a document (without a flash if the experts feel that it might damage material in the long term) is about to be banned then I think we should put our heads together and talk about it. Regards Sharon Warr View 1800s SOUTH AFRICAN PASSENGER LISTS at http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/DataArchive.htm SCRIBES PUBLISHING for Colonial Books on CD - visit http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/Scribes.htm

Evening all Just a reminder about the open day for the Cape Town Family History Society. Date: 18th September Time: 2 until 5 Place: Wynberg Boys High School, Lovers Walk Wynberg Also open will be the School Museum and the Ryno Greenwall Anglo Boer War Museum Hope to see you there kind regards Heather Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will be moving on 19th September to www.familytree.co.za - don't try and get in the front door as it is still locked !! Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm

Hi Heather Yes I've received my D List thank you, Helen New England NSW >From: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com >Reply-To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D@rootsweb.com >Subject: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #92 >Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2004 21:00:37 -0600 > >Content-Type: text/plain > >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest Volume 04 : Issue 92 > >Today's Topics: > #1 RE: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Diges ["Helen Woodward" ><helipegs@hotmail] > #2 National Archives Error ["Heather MacAlister" ><heather@ance] > >Administrivia: >To unsubscribe from SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D, send a message to > > SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com > >that contains in the body of the message the command > > unsubscribe > >and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software >requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. > >To contact the SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D list administrator, send mail to >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-admin@rootsweb.com. > >______________________________ >X-Message: #1 >Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2004 18:16:21 +1000 >From: "Helen Woodward" <helipegs@hotmail.com> >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >Message-ID: <BAY8-F27s7nlT2NqFJ30001a7bb@hotmail.com> >Subject: RE: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #91 >Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed > >Hello Heather, >I would like to express my appreciation for all you've done in the past on >the List and the friendship and assistance you've offered to me and >everyone >else. >All the best to you for your new venture and I wish you well. Thank you so >much for all your assistance to us, the people (some like me, thousands of >miles away across the oceans!) who are seeking their links with your >incredible country. >Best and warm regards to you and a big welcome to your replacement, >Helen W >New England NSW Australia > > > >From: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com > >Reply-To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com > >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D@rootsweb.com > >Subject: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #91 > >Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2004 02:00:39 -0600 > > > >Content-Type: text/plain > > > >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest Volume 04 : Issue 91 > > > >Today's Topics: > > #1 New List Owner ["Heather MacAlister" > ><heather@ance] > > > >Administrivia: > >To unsubscribe from SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D, send a message to > > > > SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com > > > >that contains in the body of the message the command > > > > unsubscribe > > > >and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software > >requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. > > > >To contact the SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D list administrator, send mail to > >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-admin@rootsweb.com. > > > >______________________________ > >X-Message: #1 > >Date: Sun, 12 Sep 2004 15:50:00 +0200 > >From: "Heather MacAlister" <heather@ancestors.co.za> > >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com > >Message-ID: <00be01c498cf$76dd8de0$650aa8c0@heatherpc> > >Subject: New List Owner > >Content-Type: text/plain; > > charset="iso-8859-1" > > > >Afternoon All > > > >I am proud to announce that you will be having a new list owner on the >Cape > >Town Mailing list from tomorrow. > >Her name is Sharon Warr and she will be here to help and guide you. > >scribes@sagenealogy.co.za > > > >I am not leaving town but leaving to run a new web site that will be > >launched on Carte Blanche next Sunday during the program "So where do we > >come from" > >The new web site will be called www.familytree.co.za > > > >I will be running two specialised forums one on adoption and another of > >British Immigrants. There will eight others as well. I will be managing > >this web site with a team of about 30 other people and cannot find the >time > >to run this mailing list in my spare time as well. > >If you need any help or questions that need answering you can still get >me > >on heather@ancestors.co.za > > > >thanks everyone for everything > >Heather > > > >Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will >be > >moving on 19th September to www.familytree.co.za > > > >Join the Cape Town Family History Society > >www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm > >_________________________________________________________________ >Searching for that dream home? Try http://ninemsn.realestate.com.au for >all your property needs. > >______________________________ >X-Message: #2 >Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2004 17:20:53 +0200 >From: "Heather MacAlister" <heather@ancestors.co.za> >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >Message-ID: <031001c499a5$75400540$650aa8c0@heatherpc> >Subject: National Archives Error >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > >Evening all > >Can anyone tell me if they get the message : >Search Manager sign on error - Please try again later ? > >kind regards >Heather > >Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will be >moving on 19th September to www.familytree.co.za > >Join the Cape Town Family History Society >www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm _________________________________________________________________ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

Hello Heather, I would like to express my appreciation for all you've done in the past on the List and the friendship and assistance you've offered to me and everyone else. All the best to you for your new venture and I wish you well. Thank you so much for all your assistance to us, the people (some like me, thousands of miles away across the oceans!) who are seeking their links with your incredible country. Best and warm regards to you and a big welcome to your replacement, Helen W New England NSW Australia >From: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com >Reply-To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D@rootsweb.com >Subject: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #91 >Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2004 02:00:39 -0600 > >Content-Type: text/plain > >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest Volume 04 : Issue 91 > >Today's Topics: > #1 New List Owner ["Heather MacAlister" ><heather@ance] > >Administrivia: >To unsubscribe from SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D, send a message to > > SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com > >that contains in the body of the message the command > > unsubscribe > >and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software >requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. > >To contact the SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D list administrator, send mail to >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-admin@rootsweb.com. > >______________________________ >X-Message: #1 >Date: Sun, 12 Sep 2004 15:50:00 +0200 >From: "Heather MacAlister" <heather@ancestors.co.za> >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >Message-ID: <00be01c498cf$76dd8de0$650aa8c0@heatherpc> >Subject: New List Owner >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > >Afternoon All > >I am proud to announce that you will be having a new list owner on the Cape >Town Mailing list from tomorrow. >Her name is Sharon Warr and she will be here to help and guide you. >scribes@sagenealogy.co.za > >I am not leaving town but leaving to run a new web site that will be >launched on Carte Blanche next Sunday during the program "So where do we >come from" >The new web site will be called www.familytree.co.za > >I will be running two specialised forums one on adoption and another of >British Immigrants. There will eight others as well. I will be managing >this web site with a team of about 30 other people and cannot find the time >to run this mailing list in my spare time as well. >If you need any help or questions that need answering you can still get me >on heather@ancestors.co.za > >thanks everyone for everything >Heather > >Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will be >moving on 19th September to www.familytree.co.za > >Join the Cape Town Family History Society >www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm _________________________________________________________________ Searching for that dream home? Try http://ninemsn.realestate.com.au for all your property needs.

Evening all Can anyone tell me if they get the message : Search Manager sign on error - Please try again later ? kind regards Heather Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will be moving on 19th September to www.familytree.co.za Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm

Afternoon All I am proud to announce that you will be having a new list owner on the Cape Town Mailing list from tomorrow. Her name is Sharon Warr and she will be here to help and guide you. scribes@sagenealogy.co.za I am not leaving town but leaving to run a new web site that will be launched on Carte Blanche next Sunday during the program "So where do we come from" The new web site will be called www.familytree.co.za I will be running two specialised forums one on adoption and another of British Immigrants. There will eight others as well. I will be managing this web site with a team of about 30 other people and cannot find the time to run this mailing list in my spare time as well. If you need any help or questions that need answering you can still get me on heather@ancestors.co.za thanks everyone for everything Heather Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will be moving on 19th September to www.familytree.co.za Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm

----- Original Message ----- From: "Nortje" <caroln@iprimus.com.au> To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 8:03 PM Subject: Re: [ZA-EC] Researching NORTJE > Hi Becky > Thanks for this info. Letty Elizabeth Nortje was my husbands Mother, not > Grandmother. I am busy trying to get a birth certificate for Petrus > Cornelius Nortje, so we can see who his parents were. I am wondering if you > have any records of Nortje's buried in Port Elizabeth, as there were a lot > of our Nortje's living there. You certainly do a wonderful job helping > everyone. > Bye for now, > Carol > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Becky Horne" <beckyjh@telkomsa.net> > To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, September 03, 2004 5:24 AM > Subject: [ZA-EC] Researching NORTJE > > > > Hi Carol > > > > Welcome to the EC-List. I hope that you will be very happy with us. > > > > I suggest that you contact the Department of Home Affairs, > > http://home-affairs.pwv.gov.za/ for a copy of your father-in-law's Birth > > Certificate. [contact details are on the website]. > > Death notices can be searched for at www.national.archives.gov.za Here is > > your reference. > > > > Depot TAB, Ref: 8650/63, 1963 > > Description: NORTJE, Petrus Cornelius > > Remarks: Surviving Spouse: Letty Elizabeth NORTJE > > > > All that remains now is for you to confirm with your husband if this was > the > > name of his grandmother. If this is the link you are searching for, you > will > > have to contact a researcher and request this document. I do have names of > > some researcher's, but haven't obtained their permission to supply their > > details on List. Will get this for you shortly. > > > > I have two reference books pertaining to Jansenville, namely, > 'Jansenville, > > yesterday and today' and 'Of them I spoke' by Sid FOURIE. I found a NORTJE > > who took part in a school play in Jansenville. > > > > <During the Centenary Celebrations scholars in the Jansenville High School > > staged a Fancy Dress Parade. > > Sub B (grade 2) > > Elma NORTJE as Red Riding Hood>> > > > > Sadly, nothing more is recorded in the index.regarding NORTJE. > > > > Please let us know how you are getting along. > > > > Best wishes > > Becky > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Nortje" <caroln@iprimus.com.au> > > To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 11:17 AM > > Subject: {not a subscriber} Subscribe > > > > > > > Hello, > > > My name is Carol Nortje and I live in Queensland, Australia. I am > trying > > to research research my husbands side of the family. His father was > Petrus > > Cornelius Nortje born 30 Nov 1908 in Jansenville, Cape Province and died > in > > > Johannesburg on 21 October 1963. I am trying to find out who his > parents > > were and how I can locate a copy of his Birth Certificate. > > > Kind regards > > > Carol > > > > > > > > ==== SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE Mailing List ==== > > Remember to make use of the archives. > > Search the SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE archives > > Browse the SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE archives > > > > ============================== > > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration > > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237 > > >

Morning All Just to let you know that there is a lady in Cape Town that run's scrap booking classes and has just sent me the most beautiful samples of Family Tree and genealogy related paper for scrap booking - it is really stunning. I have not seen them on her web site yet but she did send me an email of the samples - if anyone would like to see these samples please contact me off the list. http://www.memoriesbydesign.co.za I am not in any way involved in this company, before you all get too worried. kind thanks Heather Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za will be moving on the 19th September to www.familytree.co.za Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.ancestors.co.za/society/socweb.htm Join the Cape Town Mailing list at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/ZAF/SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN.html

----- Original Message ----- From: "Nortje" <caroln@iprimus.com.au> To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 8:03 PM Subject: Re: [ZA-EC] Researching NORTJE > Hi Becky > Thanks for this info. Letty Elizabeth Nortje was my husbands Mother, not > Grandmother. I am busy trying to get a birth certificate for Petrus > Cornelius Nortje, so we can see who his parents were. I am wondering if you > have any records of Nortje's buried in Port Elizabeth, as there were a lot > of our Nortje's living there. You certainly do a wonderful job helping > everyone. > Bye for now, > Carol > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Becky Horne" <beckyjh@telkomsa.net> > To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, September 03, 2004 5:24 AM > Subject: [ZA-EC] Researching NORTJE > > > > Hi Carol > > > > Welcome to the EC-List. I hope that you will be very happy with us. > > > > I suggest that you contact the Department of Home Affairs, > > http://home-affairs.pwv.gov.za/ for a copy of your father-in-law's Birth > > Certificate. [contact details are on the website]. > > Death notices can be searched for at www.national.archives.gov.za Here is > > your reference. > > > > Depot TAB, Ref: 8650/63, 1963 > > Description: NORTJE, Petrus Cornelius > > Remarks: Surviving Spouse: Letty Elizabeth NORTJE > > > > All that remains now is for you to confirm with your husband if this was > the > > name of his grandmother. If this is the link you are searching for, you > will > > have to contact a researcher and request this document. I do have names of > > some researcher's, but haven't obtained their permission to supply their > > details on List. Will get this for you shortly. > > > > I have two reference books pertaining to Jansenville, namely, > 'Jansenville, > > yesterday and today' and 'Of them I spoke' by Sid FOURIE. I found a NORTJE > > who took part in a school play in Jansenville. > > > > <During the Centenary Celebrations scholars in the Jansenville High School > > staged a Fancy Dress Parade. > > Sub B (grade 2) > > Elma NORTJE as Red Riding Hood>> > > > > Sadly, nothing more is recorded in the index.regarding NORTJE. > > > > Please let us know how you are getting along. > > > > Best wishes > > Becky > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Nortje" <caroln@iprimus.com.au> > > To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 11:17 AM > > Subject: {not a subscriber} Subscribe > > > > > > > Hello, > > > My name is Carol Nortje and I live in Queensland, Australia. I am > trying > > to research research my husbands side of the family. His father was > Petrus > > Cornelius Nortje born 30 Nov 1908 in Jansenville, Cape Province and died > in > > > Johannesburg on 21 October 1963. I am trying to find out who his > parents > > were and how I can locate a copy of his Birth Certificate. > > > Kind regards > > > Carol > > > > > > > > ==== SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE Mailing List ==== > > Remember to make use of the archives. > > Search the SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE archives > > Browse the SOUTH-AFRICA-EASTERN-CAPE archives > > > > ============================== > > Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration > > Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237 > > >

Hi to all Cape Listers, Would someone please help me with this query. I am searching for a marriage entry in Anglican Registers. Marriage around <1870> These people lived in Wynberg district. I have contact details for the various parishes but do not know when they opened or were consecrated. Was there a parish in Wynberg at this time? If yes, which one would that be? If not, would the couple have been married in Cape Town and at which parish? Would appreciate some enlightenment. Thanks in advance, Elva

Hi Elva The main Anglican church in Wynberg in the 1870's was St John's. St John's registers begin in 1831 and are held at the church. Regards Sharon Warr View 1800s SOUTH AFRICAN PASSENGER LISTS at http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/DataArchive.htm SCRIBES PUBLISHING for Colonial Books on CD - visit http://www.sagenealogy.co.za/Scribes.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Elva Hanly" <theaviary@bigpond.com> To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004 3:09 AM Subject: [South-Africa-Cape-Town] CAPE TOWN and WYNBERG-ANGLICAN > Hi to all Cape Listers, > > Would someone please help me with this query. I am searching for a > marriage entry in Anglican Registers. > > Marriage around <1870> > > These people lived in Wynberg district. I have contact details for the > various parishes but do not know when they opened or were consecrated. > Was there a parish in Wynberg at this time? > If yes, which one would that be? > If not, would the couple have been married in Cape Town and at which > parish? > > Would appreciate some enlightenment. > Thanks in advance, > > Elva > > > ==== SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN Mailing List ==== > Heather's South African Genealogy Help List > www.genealogy.co.za > > ============================== > You can manage your RootsWeb-Review subscription from > http://newsletters.rootsweb.com/ > >

Afternoon all Saturday 18th September the Cape Town Family History Society will be holding their Open Day at Wynberg Boy's High School in Lover's Walk,Wynberg from 2 until 5. Please come and support us by joining our members for a cup or tea and chat and view all our wonderful displays. The school Museum will also be opened for us as well as the Ryno Greenwall Anglo Boer War Museum. kind regards Heather and the rest of the members Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za is soon due to be re-vamped and re-launched. This web site will have more content and more surprises.......please keep watching my home page for the latest announcements. Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.genealogy.co.za/society/socweb.htm Join the Cape Town Mailing list at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/ZAF/SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN.html

Hi Helen, My great grandfather William Henry CLAYTON 1875-1912, is stated on his death notice as having died at Keerom Street, Paarl, Drakenstein district. This is in the Western Cape. If you do a google search for PAARL you will find plenty of interesting information and history. You can find a map for almost any place in South Africa at this site: http://www.multimap.com/index/SF2.htm Hope this helps a bit. Elva Queensland, Australia > X-Message: #1 > Date: Mon, 06 Sep 2004 15:12:31 +1000 > From: "Helen Woodward" <helipegs@hotmail.com> > To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <BAY8-F25dff1tbqJt3P00048e7a@hotmail.com> > Subject: RE: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #85 > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed > > Hello List > I'm new to the List and really happy to be here. > I found the history of Port Elizabeth really interesting and am > wondering if > there is similar historical information re the port at The Cape ? > My interest lies in that my ancestor was William Bridekirk born > Yorkshire UK > who was Deputy Port Captain in 1806, Tide Surveyor in 1809 and in 1808 > was > Port Captain & Tide Surveyor. > From Peter Philip's book "British Residents at The Cape" details of > which > kindly sent to me by List members of Sth African British List: his > address > was 14A Keerom Str. and 4 Strand Str. > Would anyone be able to tell me where these streets were or are now ? > He > died in 1826, buried Somerset East. Is there a map of Cape Town in the > early 1800s accessible to the Net ? I believe there was (and perhaps > still > is) a "Bridekirk Way" in Cape Town also. > > Would anyone be able to tell me more about the Port at this time, > and/or his > duties, responsibilities, or "set the historical scene" for me at this > time > ? Anything relevant would be very much appreciated as I virtually know > nothing about the Port at that time in SA history. > Thanking you in advance, > Helen Woodward > New England Australia >

Hello Helen My great grandfather was a "Looker & tidewaiter" in Port Nolloth as well as in the Cape Town Docks. I can send you a map of Cape Town from about 1855 - much of the street names are still the same and most of them are still there. Yes William Bridekirk married by special license on 15/7/1828 to Eliza Griffiths. With thanks to the invention of OCR and scanning and the book Waterfront and Harbour by Neil Veitch here is some interesting background to Cape Town Harbour and Docks: Of proper landing facilities for the orderly disembarkation of His Britannic Majesty's soldiers, however, there were none. Years after the First British Occupation of the Cape a local observer commented on the arrival of the transport steamer Rosamond, "The men of the 90th Regiment landing today were completely drenched, the wind blowing so hard from the south-east." The hiring of boats and lighters for work on Table Bay had provided a whole class of people with a liveli­hood along the waterfront throughout the Dutch period of rule, and it soon became quite clear that neither the British authorities nor the Batavians who followed them so briefly were going to embark on any major port improvements. It was felt that the level of economic activity at the Cape did not justify the huge expense which a breakwater or other harbour facilities would incur. Table Bay could remain, in the opinion of their Lordships of the British Admiralty, simply a place for emergency repairs and temporary refitting. A treaty of peace between Great Britain, France and the Batavian Republic was signed at Amiens on 27 March 1802. By its terms, the Cape reverted to Dutch rule early in 1803, under the command of Lieut General J W Janssens and High Commissioner J A de Mist. However, this last period of direct Dutch influence on the Cape, and one notable for its enlightened and liberal policies, was brought to an end a short three years later by the resumption of hostilities between Britain and the Batavian Republic. At the Battle of Blaauwberg on 10 January 1806 the Dutch defenders of the Cape capitulated to the attack of a superior British force. At first this change of rule seemed, once again, to be a temporary occupation; Britain held the Cape only by conquest until 1814. However, in that year it became, by international treaty agreement, a British colony, and many Capetonians can have been forgiven for thinking that a strong maritime power with extensive imperial obligations would now make a start on securing and developing Table Bay as a port of the first rank. The great architect and military engineer Louis Michel Thibault, whose hand is detected on many Cape buildings of distinction dating from this period, was retained by the British as Inspector of Government Buildings. Although he had plans for a new wharf at Rogge Bay close to the Amsterdam Battery, "large enough to comprise a harbour, an enclosure for the fishing boats, offices and a guard house", he seems not to have been encouraged to venture into marine civil engineering. Instead we find him examining the state of the jetty at the start of the Second British Occupation and finding it "badly damaged - reposing on a conglomeration of wooden poles, constantly at the mercy of the tide, and although repeatedly strengthened, needing complete reconstruction." Although he was permitted the use of yellowwood beams and stinkwood from Government stores as well as the hire of a primitive pile-driver - "a wonderful apparatus" - nothing much seemed to have changed from Van Riebeeck's day. It was recommended to Thibault that the open spaces between piles be filled with stones, although such an approach, it seemed to him, would hinder the embarkation process by diminishing the depth of water alongside the jetty. The importance of this single jetty as the sole commercial artery of the Colony was clear to the British, and by 1809 almost all the tonnage duty imposed on callers using the Table Bay anchorage was being spent on keeping it in a reasonable state of repair. Thibault, whose great talents were partially engaged in this patching-up policy, strongly advised the Governor, the Earl of Caledon, to make a thorough job of harbour improvement and consult a marine engineer. The exile of Napoleon Bonaparte to the island of St Helena in 1815 led to an increase in the size of the Cape garrison and a flurry of naval activity between Table Bay and the island. Better market conditions were experienced at the Cape for a few years, and the coming of the 1820 Settlers played its part in improved econ growth. However, with the third decade of the 19th century a general econ decline set in, which badly affected chances of long-term developments in Cape bour facilities. An economic slump in Britain in 1825 and further financial d turns in the 1830s and 1840s set the seal on official British policy towards the Colony. Debates in the British House of Commons on colonial affairs in these seemed to concentrate not so much on how the colonies of the empire might uplifted as on how they could be jettisoned. They were referred to as "great ponderous appendages", and as such were merely there to supply cheap raw ma als and provide markets for expensive manufactured goods. The initiative towards building better harbour facilities was now taken up individuals and private organisations in Cape Town. More ships were calling Table Bay than ever before, trade tonnage had doubled in volume between I and 1818 to reach 30 775 tons, and there was a sense of expectation in the air. James Callander, an ex-forestry official, was adamant that the old wooden had more than served its time and should be replaced by a stone one. John Mars a former ship's captain, pleaded that his invention of a floating dock should accepted by the Government on the grounds of its cheapness. The Governor, L Charles Somerset, considered and rejected various private ship-repair propos including that of John Osmond who had pioneered ship repairs at Simonstown Batavian days, but finally accepted the plan of Messrs Aken & Monteath. This fi proposed a regular ship-repair yard and, helped no doubt by the memory of t storm of July 1822 in which seven vessels were stranded, the Government promp granted a piece of land on the beach next to Muntingh's Whale-fishery at the end Bree Street. Plans also abounded for a comprehensive harbour, and the Comptroller Customs, William Bird, seriously misjudged the economic climate by advocating mile-long breakwater costing one million rixdollars! So incensed was a tradin schooner captain, Robert Knox, at the near-stranding of his vessel the Laura on Woodstock beach, that he submitted his own harbour plan with three variations. A trader, marine surveyor and talented amateur civil engineer, Knox had taken the trouble to survey Table Bay, and addressed an emphatic memorandum to the Governor: "If we take a survey of every Port in His Majesty's dominions, and compare their importance with the great and increasing commercial importance of the Cape Colony, Table Bay will be found, in the Winter Season, the most dangerous loading and delivering Port and anchorage in the world." Knox was worried about the safety aspect, but many merchants in Cape Town were more agitated over delays in the shipping and landing of cargoes. A great deal of merchandise had still to be lifted through the breakers by porters and manhandled into lighters for conveyance to ships in the bay, while only a limited proportion of Cape Town's goods could be carried Out along the deteriorating jetty and swung into lighters alongside by means of the single ramshackle crane. These laborious handling procedures took time, and there was always the possibility of goods being ruined by salt water in the course of loading. Often, too, the sea was simply too rough to allow any movement of cargo at all, and without proper port facilities businessmen and shipping agents fumed as delays lengthened and Table Bay's poor reputation grew. A new urgency was added by the arrival in Table Bay on 13 October 1825 of the small auxiliary paddle-steamer Enterprise. Powered by two 60-horsepower engines, each driving a 4,5-metre paddle, she had taken 58 days from Falmouth to the Cape, steaming for only 35 of those. The Enterprise eventually took 113 days to reach Calcutta, but her commander, Lieut J H Johnston, thought the length of the voyage could be reduced to 80 days if the Cape could effectively serve as a bunkering depot. These revelations were not lost on the Cape merchant community, who saw immense possibilities in regular scheduled sailings by steamers which would not be at the mercy of the exposed bay at the Cape. While not wanting to be seen to be dragging its feet over maritime safety matters, but lacking the finance to tackle anything substantial, the Cape Government considered the question of a lighthouse at the entrance to the bay. The stranding of the Feniscowles at Green Point in 1819 and a number of other shipwrecks in the 1820s brought the issue of night arrivals in Table Bay and the necessity for a permanent light once again to the forefront. The Green Point lighthouse was built by Herman Schutte, who quoted £1 000 for the work, and it was fitted originally with two lanterns giving a fixed beam, first glimpsed by ships in the roadstead in April 1824. The twin lanterns were later replaced by one revolving light, giving the Green Point lighthouse the additional name of the "Flash" lighthouse, and making it easily distinguishable from the later Mouille Point lighthouse, built in 1843 a mile further east and fitted with a periodic beam. Wreckings at the western headland of Table Bay became less frequent with the construction of these two lighthouses, but they were by no means eliminated in either the 19th or 20th centuries. Ideas for improving amenities in Table Bay came thick and fast, with the Port Captain, Lieut James Bance, pressing hard for the establishment of an iron boat-slip. This was to be situated near Muntingh's Whale-fishery in the vicinity of the Amsterdam Battery, and was to be the station from which rescue boats and others carrying anchors and cables were to be launched. There was also pressure for the construction of a stone pier, a topic which aroused great heat and interminable discussion for the rest of the decade. In the meantime a gale which sprang up in late June 1828 drove four ships in Table Bay ashore and resulted in everyone interested in shipping in Cape Town petitioning the Government for the construction of a stone boat-launching jetty. While enthusiasm was still running high, a group of individuals organised a subscription for a first-class launch for the purpose of delivering spare mooring lines and anchors to vessels in distress. James Lowe's firm of shipwrights was commissioned and the launch, most suitably named the Northwester, was ready for service under the command of a Table Bay boatman, James Buckley, on 22 October 1828. As the Government had not itself taken any step to improve amenities, the same group of concerned citizens considered raising another sum to finance the boat-slip. Shipping agents, merchants and a group of boatmen went ahead and within a short time collected £3 300 to pay for a stone landing-place near the Whale-fishery. Having cautiously advised London of the initiative being so vigorously taken by private enterprise, Sir Lowry Cole was able to inform the citizens that the project would receive Government backing after all. The stone pier, only the second permanent harbour amenity constructed in Table Bay, was begun in 1833, sited just south of the Amsterdam Battery and protected slightly by a small reef. With the lifting of the depression at the end of the 1820s, helped by extensive wool exports, there was a shift in the centre of commercial activity in Cape Town. Congestion at the old jetty led to shippers preferring the less cluttered space in the vicinity of the as-yet incomplete stone jetty near Bree Street. Sheds and goods yards were built there, and with trade tonnage rising to 63 000 tons in 1837, the waterfront presented a spectacle at this time of intense activity and also considerable confusion. Wagons bringing cargo down to the landing places came and went, churning up the rough ground, piles of wool bales stood about in the absence of proper warehouses, and boatmen and porters working quantities of merchandise off the jetty or into lighters beyond the surf swarmed along the waterfront. Fishermen plied the trade in the bay and sold their catches in the general melee, and townsfolk conducted business in commercial buildings which were starting to encroach on th Amsterdam Battery and had to contend with the obnoxious smells of the open drains and the piles of rubbish swept down the streets to the beach front, as well a the noisome proximity of the slaughterhouse at the bottom of the Heerengracht. Only 277 vessels had called at Table Bay in 1832, compared with over 500 it 1839, and the inadequacies of the harbour facilities were glaringly apparent. A dwarf jetty was constructed near the Castle in the late 1830s in an effort to take tht pressure off the old South Jetty until the new stone pier could be completed. To tht bewilderment of the Cape Government, private enthusiasm had waned over th stone pier project when the immense cost of it became evident, and work was suspended while alternatives were considered. Eventually, as with the old Mouille Point breakwater, the sea took its toll, eroding it away almost to nothing, and the decision was taken to construct a new or North Jetty of wood and stone and of more modest proportions. With revived interest, shippers and chandlers quickly bought an appropriate site at the foot of Bree Street and ceded it to the Government. This jetty, which eventually cost far mote than the estimated £2 331 lOs 7d, stood for many years serving the new commercial quarter at the northern end of the town. The Imperial Cold Storage building was later erected on this site, and during its restoration in the 1990s fragments of the jetty were uncovered. Table Bay trade figures were now growing enormously, as revealed by the volume of wool exports - 171 297 kg in 1839, compared with 1848's figure of 721 655 kg. Even as it was being constructed, the North Jetty was altered and extended to give it both greater length and breadth. The number of vessels entering the anchorage at night also increased in the 1830s, and several ships came to grief so close to Green Point lighthouse as to cast doubt on its efficiency as a warning to vessels, as well as its position which many thought to be too far to the west. The Singapore in 1832 and the Muigrave Castle some years earlier had piled up on the rocks almost beneath the lighthouse, and when the Royal William went ashore there in 1837 the Governor, Sir George Napier, gave the order for the construction of a new lighthouse on the rocks at Mouille Point, the westerly headland guarding the approach to the bay. Provision had also to be made somewhere along the increasingly untidy waterfront for the storage of coal for the steamships which were starting to call more frequently. Lord Yarborough's yacht, the 170-ton Falcon; a small coasting steamer, the Sophia Jane; as well as the East India Company's 600-ton Atlanta, had called at Table Bay in the 1830s, and Capetonians were losing their sense of awe as vessels came churning into the anchorage apparently on fire. These tiny pioneer steamers were driven by paddles for the most part and, although fitted with masts and rigging for sails, were in urgent need of bunkers by the time they reached the Cape. As early as 1840 a sailing ship, the Udny Castle, was wrecked on a voyage to the Cape while bringing a cargo of coal, possibly for ships' bunkers as well as domestic use. Cape Town's harbour as well as its later comprehensive port facilities may really be said to have had their origin in the establishment of the commission of June 1844 appointed by the Governor to study a design for a breakwater submitted by the Port Captain, Lieut James Bance RN. Up to now short term plans, ad hoc arrangements and an overwhelming reluctance to spend money had characterised all efforts to create a good, safe harbour in Table Bay. There had been several grandiose plans offered, but each had been wrecked on the shoals of their cost and the desire on the part of successive Cape Governors to avoid increasing the Colony's debt. Sir Peregrine Maitland chose four good men for his commission: Lieut Bance, the civil engineer Major C C Michell, the Rev James Adamson and the editor of the South African Commercial Advertiser, John Fairbairn. It was hoped that included in the new plans for a harbour there could be provision for improvement of the actual waterfront, particularly the area between the North Jetty and the old Castle wharf. Cape Town became a municipality in 1840, and its representatives were anxious that the derelict buildings, reeking abbatoir and growing rubbish dumps which had been sorry features of the waterfront could be cleared up and a sea wall built as the perimeter to a small area reclaimed from the bay. In the meantime the Imperial Government had given the go-ahead for the raising of loans to build a breakwater to guard the anchorage from the north-west storms. Here, however, the breakwater saga must rest for twelve years or so, because Great Britain experienced a change of government and William Ewart Gladstone, favourably disposed towards the project, was replaced as Colonial Secretary by Earl Grey, who was simply horrified at the costs involved. It is to a later, more courageous Cape Governor and the energetic Cape mercantile community that credit for taking the final step towards a proper breakwater and harbour of refuge at the Cape is due. In the meantime the North Jetty, the dwarf South Jetty and the old Castle wharf were taking increasing strain as exports from Table Bay mounted in volume and the town grew well beyond its original bounds of the Buitengracht, Buitensingel (the lowest part of Roeland Street) and Buitenkant. The new Governor, Sir Harry Smith, not a man to waste time on red tape, listened to representations concerning the harbour, at once appointed a commission to improve it, and was delighted to observe work commencing on a new jetty extending into the sea from the bottom of the Heerengracht. This was the Central Jetty, and it was ready for use on 11 March 1850. Sir Harry Smith had good reason to be pleased with the uneventful completion of the Central Jetty. Shortly before, he had been involved in one of the stormiest incidents in the Colony's history. The British Colonial Office informed the Governor that convict labour was to be used on the harbour extensions, and that a contingent of some 300 British convicts was already en route to the Cape aboard the sailing ship Neptune. The immediate reaction of the colonists was fury at the idea of the Cape being turned into a penal colony, especially as an earlier attempt in 1842 had been strongly rejected. The issue became a cause célèbre taken up by Cape newspapers and the populace as a whole, culminating in a giant protest meeting held at the Commercial Exchange building in Cape Town on 4 July 1849. Signatures were gathered, committees formed and persistent questions were asked in the British House of Commons - notably by the champion of the anti-convict agitation in Britain, C B Adderley. High feelings led to a boycott of the Neptune by the colonists when she arrived in Simon's Bay on 19 September 1849, and a constitutional crisis was narrowly averted. The Governor was informed clearly by the Anti-Convict The great Anti-Convict protest meeting held on Association that the colonists wanted nothing to do with the convicts and that the the Grand Parade in Cape Town on 4 July Neptune should be sent on her way. The Association would neither accept military 1849. Lithograph by T W Bowler. lawbreakers nor have the Cape turned into a penal colony. Work on the harbour extensions might have proceeded more briskly with the help of the convicts, but when the Neptune sailed for Van Diemen's Land on 21 February 1850 with her unwelcome human cargo still on board, special prayers were offered in places of worship in Cape Town, public buildings were illuminated, and grand dinners were held in celebration of the Colony's narrow escape. It was a truism to say that 'a good harbour meant a good life for town and citizens nothing less that that". In 1835, 367 ships called at Table Bay, and this had grown to a volume of 607 vessels by the year 1850. It was starting to become clear to all but the most backward-thinking that the Cape, for so long a crossroads and turning-point of the great oceanic trade routes, could no longer remain only an emergency port of call. The problem was that each of the numerous proposals for harbour improvement which had been put forward, from 1822 until 1850, had failed to provide either one or the other of two key elements: protection for shipping and landing facilities. The Bird plan of 1822 had envisaged a single breakwater with no docks or jetties. Knox's plan of three years later offered two curved breakwater arms enclosing a tiny harbour area but without any landing facilities. The Bell plan of 1828 proposed a curious detached breakwater out in the bay, providing little protection for the anchorage and no facilities for embarkation or landing cargo. In 1833 the stone pier project provided a jetty but no protection for vessels in the anchorage. Two schemes submitted by Michell in 1844 and 1847 proposed the enclosure of a large area, but with little or no attention paid to landing facilities. A sufficiently comprehensive plan was still wanting. kind regards Heather Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za is soon due to be re-vamped and re-launched. This web site will have more content and more surprises.......please keep watching my home page for the latest announcements. Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.genealogy.co.za/society/socweb.htm Join the Cape Town Mailing list at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/ZAF/SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Helen Woodward" <helipegs@hotmail.com> To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 06, 2004 7:12 AM Subject: [South-Africa-Cape-Town] RE: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #85 Hello List I'm new to the List and really happy to be here. I found the history of Port Elizabeth really interesting and am wondering if there is similar historical information re the port at The Cape ? My interest lies in that my ancestor was William Bridekirk born Yorkshire UK who was Deputy Port Captain in 1806, Tide Surveyor in 1809 and in 1808 was Port Captain & Tide Surveyor. >From Peter Philip's book "British Residents at The Cape" details of which kindly sent to me by List members of Sth African British List: his address was 14A Keerom Str. and 4 Strand Str. Would anyone be able to tell me where these streets were or are now ? He died in 1826, buried Somerset East. Is there a map of Cape Town in the early 1800s accessible to the Net ? I believe there was (and perhaps still is) a "Bridekirk Way" in Cape Town also. Would anyone be able to tell me more about the Port at this time, and/or his duties, responsibilities, or "set the historical scene" for me at this time ? Anything relevant would be very much appreciated as I virtually know nothing about the Port at that time in SA history. Thanking you in advance, Helen Woodward New England Australia >From: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com >Reply-To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D@rootsweb.com >Subject: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #85 >Date: Sun, 5 Sep 2004 22:01:43 -0600 > >Content-Type: text/plain > >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest Volume 04 : Issue 85 > >Today's Topics: > #1 Early Development of the Port Eliz ["Becky Horne" ><beckyjh@telkomsa.ne] > >Administrivia: >To unsubscribe from SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D, send a message to > > SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com > >that contains in the body of the message the command > > unsubscribe > >and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software >requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. > >To contact the SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D list administrator, send mail to >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-admin@rootsweb.com. > >______________________________ >X-Message: #1 >Date: Sun, 5 Sep 2004 11:16:16 +0200 >From: "Becky Horne" <beckyjh@telkomsa.net> >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >Message-ID: <026401c49329$00886ee0$6899ef9b@TelkomSA2156> >Subject: Early Development of the Port Elizabeth Harbour - Part IV >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > >This is the forth and final part of the follow-up material on the >Breakwater >Project extracted from Looking Back, Sept 1992 Vol. 31 No. 2. > >The Early Development of the Port Elizabeth Harbour >Avinash Govindjee and Darshan Daya >Grey High 1992 > >SIGNIFICANT WORKS (1871-1899) >A new jetty at the bottom of Jetty Street was approved. Stone from the old >breakwater was used for the masonry approach to the new jetty. The ironwood >piles from the breakwater were not able to be used as they were badly >worm-eaten. >Therefore the resident engineer at that time, James BISSET had to obtain >sneezewood from the Alexandria forest. In January 1870 the construction of >the timber jetty began and it was eventually completed in April 1872. Sir >John COODE who had been appointed Consulting Engineer to the Harbour Board >in February 1868, submitted his report on the Harbour in which he >agreed with the steps that had been taken. In the report he recommended >that a 1600 feet long retaining wall be constructed from the new jetty to >the Baakens River to induce a scour and thereby remove sand. The widening >of the jetty commenced in May 1874. The construction of a second jetty at >the bottom of Fleming Street also commenced. During the same year sand >began to accumulate at the bottom of both the jetties and it decided that >the second jetty, which was still under construction at that time, was to >be discontinued. The Cape St. Francis Lighthouse was commissioned on 4 July >1878. > >In December 1876 Sir John COODE arrived in Port Elizabeth to make a >personal inspection over a period of five weeks. The Number One timber >jetty was replaced by an iron-piled jetty which became known as the North >Jetty. COODE also authorized the building of an 800 foot iron-piled jetty >in December 1879. This was to be known as the South Jetty and it >was completed in July 1884. The retaining wall which COODE had recommended >in his report in 1870 was built in the same period from the North Jetty to >the Baakens River and it extended to beyond the South Jetty. The North and >the South jetties were of COODE's design. By 1884 the South Jetty had been >completed. The North Jetty was lengthened and widened and it was completed >in July 1894. The five old steam cranes on both jetties were also replaced >by modern hydraulic cranes. > >THE DOM PEDRO JETTY >The story of how the Dom Pedro Jetty got its name is a very interesting >one. In 1839 the Queen passed the Slave Suppression >Act. This meant that the trading of slaves was forbidden. In the Mozambique >Channel, Her Majesty's brig the CURLEW, was hunting down the salve traders >who were violating the recently passed act. The commander of the brig. >Lieut. ROSS had seized the ship YARUGA when he came upon another >suspicious-looking vessel. He sent a party over to question the Arab >skipper as to his cargo and destination. The vessel in question was the DOM >PEDRO. On board 19 slaves were discovered. She was taken over by the >British brig and together with the YARUGA set sail for the South African >station. > >It was soon discovered that the YARUGA was unseaworthy and she could never >have made the voyage. The crew and cargo were transported to the DOM PEDRO. >The second officer in charge of the CURLEW, Mr H.C. LEW, was promoted to >captain of the DOM PEDRO. The next day, the YARUGA was sent to the bottom >of the sea. > >As they were travelling, the DOM PEDRO lost sight of the CURLEW which was a >superior ship. It eventually took 49 days to make it to Algoa Bay. The >reason for this was that she struck a severe storm and lost all her masts >and sails. She drifted into Algoa Bay on May 20th, 1840. There she lay for >three months at anchor awaiting the decision of the Prize Court at >Simonstown as to her ultimate fate. News came through that the slaver was >not worth repairing for passage to Simonstown. Orders were given that all >it carried was to be sold by public auction. Her motley cargo was disposed >of by John Owen >SMITH on 10 Aug 1840. The ship did not fetch a bid so it was decided to >beach her near some protruding rocks near the mouth of the Baakens River. >Her timbers must have been strong for she lay there over 40 years. The >outline could still be seen when the jetty due to bear her name was being >designed in 1898. On the site of the remains the Dom Pedro Jetty was >erected. > >In 1899 works began on the 840 by 60 feet Dom Pedro Jetty. It was >originally intended to be completed in 1902, but a further extension of 620 >feet was decided on. This by 1902 sailing vessels were being berthed >alongside the jetties. At long last a modest sailing port had been >provided. > >BIBLIOGRAPHY >Sources used: >Literature >1. Leigh, Ramon Lewis: The City of Port Elizabeth, 448-453, 1966. >2. Redgrave, J.J.: P.E. in Bygone Fays, 33, 233-250, 1947. > >Literary Sources: >1. Inggs, E.J.: Early P.E. Harbour >Development, Wits. Dept. of Economic History. 1983. (Unpublished thesis) >2. Huisman, H.: Port Elizabeth: Harbour Engineers. Port Elizabeth, 1985 > >Best wishes >Becky _________________________________________________________________ Protect yourself from junk e-mail: http://microsoft.ninemsn.com.au/protectfromspam.aspx ==== SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN Mailing List ==== Cape Town Family History Society www.genealogy.co.za/society/socweb.htm ============================== Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237

Hello List I'm new to the List and really happy to be here. I found the history of Port Elizabeth really interesting and am wondering if there is similar historical information re the port at The Cape ? My interest lies in that my ancestor was William Bridekirk born Yorkshire UK who was Deputy Port Captain in 1806, Tide Surveyor in 1809 and in 1808 was Port Captain & Tide Surveyor. From Peter Philip's book "British Residents at The Cape" details of which kindly sent to me by List members of Sth African British List: his address was 14A Keerom Str. and 4 Strand Str. Would anyone be able to tell me where these streets were or are now ? He died in 1826, buried Somerset East. Is there a map of Cape Town in the early 1800s accessible to the Net ? I believe there was (and perhaps still is) a "Bridekirk Way" in Cape Town also. Would anyone be able to tell me more about the Port at this time, and/or his duties, responsibilities, or "set the historical scene" for me at this time ? Anything relevant would be very much appreciated as I virtually know nothing about the Port at that time in SA history. Thanking you in advance, Helen Woodward New England Australia >From: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com >Reply-To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D@rootsweb.com >Subject: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest V04 #85 >Date: Sun, 5 Sep 2004 22:01:43 -0600 > >Content-Type: text/plain > >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D Digest Volume 04 : Issue 85 > >Today's Topics: > #1 Early Development of the Port Eliz ["Becky Horne" ><beckyjh@telkomsa.ne] > >Administrivia: >To unsubscribe from SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D, send a message to > > SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D-request@rootsweb.com > >that contains in the body of the message the command > > unsubscribe > >and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software >requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. > >To contact the SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-D list administrator, send mail to >SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-admin@rootsweb.com. > >______________________________ >X-Message: #1 >Date: Sun, 5 Sep 2004 11:16:16 +0200 >From: "Becky Horne" <beckyjh@telkomsa.net> >To: SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com >Message-ID: <026401c49329$00886ee0$6899ef9b@TelkomSA2156> >Subject: Early Development of the Port Elizabeth Harbour - Part IV >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > >This is the forth and final part of the follow-up material on the >Breakwater >Project extracted from Looking Back, Sept 1992 Vol. 31 No. 2. > >The Early Development of the Port Elizabeth Harbour >Avinash Govindjee and Darshan Daya >Grey High 1992 > >SIGNIFICANT WORKS (1871-1899) >A new jetty at the bottom of Jetty Street was approved. Stone from the old >breakwater was used for the masonry approach to the new jetty. The ironwood >piles from the breakwater were not able to be used as they were badly >worm-eaten. >Therefore the resident engineer at that time, James BISSET had to obtain >sneezewood from the Alexandria forest. In January 1870 the construction of >the timber jetty began and it was eventually completed in April 1872. Sir >John COODE who had been appointed Consulting Engineer to the Harbour Board >in February 1868, submitted his report on the Harbour in which he >agreed with the steps that had been taken. In the report he recommended >that a 1600 feet long retaining wall be constructed from the new jetty to >the Baakens River to induce a scour and thereby remove sand. The widening >of the jetty commenced in May 1874. The construction of a second jetty at >the bottom of Fleming Street also commenced. During the same year sand >began to accumulate at the bottom of both the jetties and it decided that >the second jetty, which was still under construction at that time, was to >be discontinued. The Cape St. Francis Lighthouse was commissioned on 4 July >1878. > >In December 1876 Sir John COODE arrived in Port Elizabeth to make a >personal inspection over a period of five weeks. The Number One timber >jetty was replaced by an iron-piled jetty which became known as the North >Jetty. COODE also authorized the building of an 800 foot iron-piled jetty >in December 1879. This was to be known as the South Jetty and it >was completed in July 1884. The retaining wall which COODE had recommended >in his report in 1870 was built in the same period from the North Jetty to >the Baakens River and it extended to beyond the South Jetty. The North and >the South jetties were of COODE's design. By 1884 the South Jetty had been >completed. The North Jetty was lengthened and widened and it was completed >in July 1894. The five old steam cranes on both jetties were also replaced >by modern hydraulic cranes. > >THE DOM PEDRO JETTY >The story of how the Dom Pedro Jetty got its name is a very interesting >one. In 1839 the Queen passed the Slave Suppression >Act. This meant that the trading of slaves was forbidden. In the Mozambique >Channel, Her Majesty's brig the CURLEW, was hunting down the salve traders >who were violating the recently passed act. The commander of the brig. >Lieut. ROSS had seized the ship YARUGA when he came upon another >suspicious-looking vessel. He sent a party over to question the Arab >skipper as to his cargo and destination. The vessel in question was the DOM >PEDRO. On board 19 slaves were discovered. She was taken over by the >British brig and together with the YARUGA set sail for the South African >station. > >It was soon discovered that the YARUGA was unseaworthy and she could never >have made the voyage. The crew and cargo were transported to the DOM PEDRO. >The second officer in charge of the CURLEW, Mr H.C. LEW, was promoted to >captain of the DOM PEDRO. The next day, the YARUGA was sent to the bottom >of the sea. > >As they were travelling, the DOM PEDRO lost sight of the CURLEW which was a >superior ship. It eventually took 49 days to make it to Algoa Bay. The >reason for this was that she struck a severe storm and lost all her masts >and sails. She drifted into Algoa Bay on May 20th, 1840. There she lay for >three months at anchor awaiting the decision of the Prize Court at >Simonstown as to her ultimate fate. News came through that the slaver was >not worth repairing for passage to Simonstown. Orders were given that all >it carried was to be sold by public auction. Her motley cargo was disposed >of by John Owen >SMITH on 10 Aug 1840. The ship did not fetch a bid so it was decided to >beach her near some protruding rocks near the mouth of the Baakens River. >Her timbers must have been strong for she lay there over 40 years. The >outline could still be seen when the jetty due to bear her name was being >designed in 1898. On the site of the remains the Dom Pedro Jetty was >erected. > >In 1899 works began on the 840 by 60 feet Dom Pedro Jetty. It was >originally intended to be completed in 1902, but a further extension of 620 >feet was decided on. This by 1902 sailing vessels were being berthed >alongside the jetties. At long last a modest sailing port had been >provided. > >BIBLIOGRAPHY >Sources used: >Literature >1. Leigh, Ramon Lewis: The City of Port Elizabeth, 448-453, 1966. >2. Redgrave, J.J.: P.E. in Bygone Fays, 33, 233-250, 1947. > >Literary Sources: >1. Inggs, E.J.: Early P.E. Harbour >Development, Wits. Dept. of Economic History. 1983. (Unpublished thesis) >2. Huisman, H.: Port Elizabeth: Harbour Engineers. Port Elizabeth, 1985 > >Best wishes >Becky _________________________________________________________________ Protect yourself from junk e-mail: http://microsoft.ninemsn.com.au/protectfromspam.aspx

This is the forth and final part of the follow-up material on the Breakwater Project extracted from Looking Back, Sept 1992 Vol. 31 No. 2. The Early Development of the Port Elizabeth Harbour Avinash Govindjee and Darshan Daya Grey High 1992 SIGNIFICANT WORKS (1871-1899) A new jetty at the bottom of Jetty Street was approved. Stone from the old breakwater was used for the masonry approach to the new jetty. The ironwood piles from the breakwater were not able to be used as they were badly worm-eaten. Therefore the resident engineer at that time, James BISSET had to obtain sneezewood from the Alexandria forest. In January 1870 the construction of the timber jetty began and it was eventually completed in April 1872. Sir John COODE who had been appointed Consulting Engineer to the Harbour Board in February 1868, submitted his report on the Harbour in which he agreed with the steps that had been taken. In the report he recommended that a 1600 feet long retaining wall be constructed from the new jetty to the Baakens River to induce a scour and thereby remove sand. The widening of the jetty commenced in May 1874. The construction of a second jetty at the bottom of Fleming Street also commenced. During the same year sand began to accumulate at the bottom of both the jetties and it decided that the second jetty, which was still under construction at that time, was to be discontinued. The Cape St. Francis Lighthouse was commissioned on 4 July 1878. In December 1876 Sir John COODE arrived in Port Elizabeth to make a personal inspection over a period of five weeks. The Number One timber jetty was replaced by an iron-piled jetty which became known as the North Jetty. COODE also authorized the building of an 800 foot iron-piled jetty in December 1879. This was to be known as the South Jetty and it was completed in July 1884. The retaining wall which COODE had recommended in his report in 1870 was built in the same period from the North Jetty to the Baakens River and it extended to beyond the South Jetty. The North and the South jetties were of COODE's design. By 1884 the South Jetty had been completed. The North Jetty was lengthened and widened and it was completed in July 1894. The five old steam cranes on both jetties were also replaced by modern hydraulic cranes. THE DOM PEDRO JETTY The story of how the Dom Pedro Jetty got its name is a very interesting one. In 1839 the Queen passed the Slave Suppression Act. This meant that the trading of slaves was forbidden. In the Mozambique Channel, Her Majesty's brig the CURLEW, was hunting down the salve traders who were violating the recently passed act. The commander of the brig. Lieut. ROSS had seized the ship YARUGA when he came upon another suspicious-looking vessel. He sent a party over to question the Arab skipper as to his cargo and destination. The vessel in question was the DOM PEDRO. On board 19 slaves were discovered. She was taken over by the British brig and together with the YARUGA set sail for the South African station. It was soon discovered that the YARUGA was unseaworthy and she could never have made the voyage. The crew and cargo were transported to the DOM PEDRO. The second officer in charge of the CURLEW, Mr H.C. LEW, was promoted to captain of the DOM PEDRO. The next day, the YARUGA was sent to the bottom of the sea. As they were travelling, the DOM PEDRO lost sight of the CURLEW which was a superior ship. It eventually took 49 days to make it to Algoa Bay. The reason for this was that she struck a severe storm and lost all her masts and sails. She drifted into Algoa Bay on May 20th, 1840. There she lay for three months at anchor awaiting the decision of the Prize Court at Simonstown as to her ultimate fate. News came through that the slaver was not worth repairing for passage to Simonstown. Orders were given that all it carried was to be sold by public auction. Her motley cargo was disposed of by John Owen SMITH on 10 Aug 1840. The ship did not fetch a bid so it was decided to beach her near some protruding rocks near the mouth of the Baakens River. Her timbers must have been strong for she lay there over 40 years. The outline could still be seen when the jetty due to bear her name was being designed in 1898. On the site of the remains the Dom Pedro Jetty was erected. In 1899 works began on the 840 by 60 feet Dom Pedro Jetty. It was originally intended to be completed in 1902, but a further extension of 620 feet was decided on. This by 1902 sailing vessels were being berthed alongside the jetties. At long last a modest sailing port had been provided. BIBLIOGRAPHY Sources used: Literature 1. Leigh, Ramon Lewis: The City of Port Elizabeth, 448-453, 1966. 2. Redgrave, J.J.: P.E. in Bygone Fays, 33, 233-250, 1947. Literary Sources: 1. Inggs, E.J.: Early P.E. Harbour Development, Wits. Dept. of Economic History. 1983. (Unpublished thesis) 2. Huisman, H.: Port Elizabeth: Harbour Engineers. Port Elizabeth, 1985 Best wishes Becky

Hello Colin Welcome to the mailing list. Do you have any idea who Roberts parents names were or his brothers ? Do you have his death notice ? I found his wife's reference number to her death notice and a document pertaining to his bookbinding business. Hope fully her death notice will tell you when he died ( before 1907) and whether or not she had a will. Not all wills are listed on the NAAIRS site and sometimes need to be asked for manually over the counter at the archives. DEPOT KAB SOURCE MOOC TYPE LEER VOLUME_NO 13/1/1699 SYSTEM 01 REFERENCE 63 PART 1 DESCRIPTION SCOTT, ANN ELIZA. WIDOW OF ROBERT. LIQUIDATION AND DISTRIBUTION ACCOUNT. STARTING 19070000 ENDING 19090000 DEPOT KAB SOURCE CO TYPE LEER VOLUME_NO 4244 SYSTEM 01 REFERENCE S27 PART 1 DESCRIPTION MEMORIAL. ROBERT SCOTT. REGARDING AGREEMENT FOR BOOKBINDING. STARTING 18840000 ENDING 18840000 hope this helps kind regards Heather Heather's South African Genealogy Help List at www.genealogy.co.za is soon due to be re-vamped and re-launched. This web site will have more content and more surprises.......please keep watching my home page for the latest announcements. Join the Cape Town Family History Society www.genealogy.co.za/society/socweb.htm Join the Cape Town Mailing list at http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/ZAF/SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN.html ----- Original Message ----- From: <cjedwards@xsinet.co.za> To: <SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 5:49 PM Subject: [South-Africa-Cape-Town] FROM COLIN EDWARDS Hi Listers I am new to this list and am interested in any info I can obtain on the SCOTT family of Robert SCOTT b. Tayport, Fifeshire . He was a bookseller in Long St. Cape Town. Robert was married to Ann Eliza STOCKLEY and they had the following children: 1. Louisa SCOTT 2. John SOTT 3. Sarah SCOTT 4. Elisa SCOTT 5. Robert SCOTT (my wife's Gf.) 6. William Dav SCOTT I have most of the info I need on Robert but would dearly to know what happened to his brothers and sisters and any of their families. Kind regards Colin Edwards I am also researching DICKS (1820's), EDWARDS (not 1820's), BOTHA --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.587 / Virus Database: 371 - Release Date: 12/02/04 ==== SOUTH-AFRICA-CAPE-TOWN Mailing List ==== Heather's South African Genealogy Help List www.genealogy.co.za ============================== Gain access to over two billion names including the new Immigration Collection with an Ancestry.com free trial. Click to learn more. http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=4930&sourceid=1237