I notice that I have another slave ancestor, Diana vd Kaap. Susanna Biebow is the daughter of Detlef Biebow v. Mecklenburg. de Villiers / Pama (p. 660, Odendaal) does not name her mother. In SA Genealogies 1 p. 275, her mother is given as Diana vdK. I would appreciate any references to information about Diana. (I have found three articles in Familia on Biebow.) Thank you, Keith

Dear Fellow listers Forgive me for what seemed like lurking in the past month. I have buried my partner/companion and my little sister of 55 years old in the past month and am now in the process of getting back on track. Starting with a mountain of mails in my inbox Regards Lucky

Good evening Keith, In the following book I found: Groep Sonder Grense; HF Heese page 97 BIEBOUW, Detlef (vader van Hendrik Bibault) B.E. Diana (slavin van C. Linnes) K: Susanna gedoop 1687 (trou 1711 Willem Odendaal) Hoge, p.31. Then in the TANAP documents: In KAB MOOC 8/1.47 the name Kornelis P:s Linnes ; Landdros, is mention and his wife. But no document about this Linnes could be found where Diana is mention as a slave. There is many ohter documents containing/mention a Diana as slave. Regards Petrus Fourie On 5/7/11, Keith Meintjes <umfundi@usa.net> wrote: > I notice that I have another slave ancestor, Diana vd Kaap. > > Susanna Biebow is the daughter of Detlef Biebow v. Mecklenburg. de Villiers > / > Pama (p. 660, Odendaal) does not name her mother. In SA Genealogies 1 p. > 275, > her mother is given as Diana vdK. > > I would appreciate any references to information about Diana. (I have found > three articles in Familia on Biebow.) > > Thank you, > > Keith > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Keith, On 2011/05/07 06:51 PM, you wrote: > I notice that I have another slave ancestor, Diana vd Kaap. > > Susanna Biebow is the daughter of Detlef Biebow v. Mecklenburg. de Villiers / > Pama (p. 660, Odendaal) does not name her mother. In SA Genealogies 1 p. 275, > her mother is given as Diana vdK. > > I would appreciate any references to information about Diana. The mother of Susanna Bibault has never been positively identified. There is circumstantial evidence she was Diana van Madagascar, see: http://www.e-family.co.za/ffy/p5134.htm and http://www.e-family.co.za/ffy/p5140.htm There will be a small change to Diana van Madagascar's page in the next update of the project. Delia

Hello Keiith and Delia, Keith wrote: >> I notice that I have another slave ancestor, Diana vd Kaap. >> >> Susanna Biebow is the daughter of Detlef Biebow v. Mecklenburg. de >> Villiers / Pama (p. 660, Odendaal) does not name her mother. In SA >> Genealogies 1 p. 275, her mother is given as Diana vdK. >> >> I would appreciate any references to information about Diana. Delia wrote: D> The mother of Susanna Bibault has never been positively identified. D> There is circumstantial evidence she was Diana van Madagascar, see: http://www.e-family.co.za/ffy/p5134.htm D> and http://www.e-family.co.za/ffy/p5140.htm D> There will be a small change to Diana van Madagascar's page in the D> next update of the project. I have always found it very difficult to follow the various write-ups that derive slave ancestry and relate one slave transaction to another and to baptism register and slave lodge records. The baptism entry for Susanna Biebouw is, however, very unusual among the entries in the Cape Town NGK church records of the 17th and early eighteenth century in naming the father of a slave born child: 1687 den 23 dito (Febr.) Susanna Diedelof Biebou en Diana, slavin van Cornelis Linnes Diedelof Biebou and Diana are definitely in the column headed 'ouders(parents)' - there are no witnesses listed for this baptism. The web pages indicated by Delia provide various references which, apparently, try to identify the Diana in question. The most interesting comes from Slaves and Freeblacks at the Cape (A.J.Boeseken, Tafelberg, 1977) and Robert Shell's Cape Slave Transactions. Transcripts can be found here: http://www.stamouers.com/Boeseken.PDF http://www.stamouers.com/Shell.PDF The name Diana appears a good number of times, with varying places of birth as identity labels and various sellers and buyers - also a good number of transactions where no name is given for the slave. There are 3 of interest, quoted on Delia's page: 1686.05.05 Diana from Madagascar aged 20/21 from Will Deeron, Captain of the ship the John and Mary, to Jan Vlock, 48 Rds. (Boeseken page 145) (he was presumably a slave dealer, selling a great number of slaves, all from Madagascar, through April and May 1686). 1691.05.02 Diana from Madagacar aged 25/26 sold by Joris van Stralen to Christiaan Freser for 65 Rds. (Boeseken page 158) 1693.12.__ Diana from Madagascar (24/25), sold by Christiaan Freser to Didlof Bidouw for 90 Rds. (Boeseken page 164) In the third transaction Shell changes the age to 28, presumably to relate it better to the earlier transaction. These transactions could well all relate to the same slave but there is an obvious gap in the chain of evidence - no mention of a slave named Diana being bought or sold by Cornelius Linnes (see the baptism entry above for Susanna) although he certainly bought a good number of slaves. There are other records in the Cape Archives which detail slave transactions, notably the series: Obligatien - Transporten van Slaven en Schultbrieven - (CJ 3023-3072 Gemengde Notariele Stukke. 1686-1793, CJ 3074-3127 Gemengde Notariele Stukke. 1715-1792 ) as listed in the article by De Wet: http://www.eggsa.org/familia/08_01_1971_16_20.htm Unfortunately I have not had the opportunity of examining any of these records. It would be interesting to know if these have been extracted and tabulated. ------------- Unless someone has more evidence available than the above I do not see how Susanna Bibouw's mother can be given with any assurance as other than 'Diana, slave of Cornelius Linnes'. I may well be missing something here, and certainly I have no experience of Slave research, but anything else seems to me to be pure speculation? Richard -- Richard Ball, Norfolk, England http://www.ballfamilyrecords.co.uk richard.ball@ballfamilyrecords.co.uk