Name of the deceased: Elizabeth MUIR alias MUIRE born CAMPBELL Birthplace and Nationality of the deceased: Graffenell?, Colonial Scotch Name and addresses of the parents of the deceased: Father: Dead Mother: Dead Age of the deceased: Forty nine years - months Occupation in life of the deceased, or, if a women of her husband: Shoemaker Ordinary place of residence of the deceased or, if a woman, of her husband: Grahamstown Married or unmarried, widower or widow: Married Name of surviving spouse if any and whether married in community of property or not: Matthew MUIRE died 27 Dec. 1912. Married in community of property. Name or names and approximate date of death of predeceased spouse or spouses: Place of last marriage: Grahamstown The day of decease on: 2 April 1903 Where the person died: House: Town or place: Port Alfred District: of Bathurst Names of children of deceased and whether majors or minors: Ethel Winnifred MUIRE - major Daisy Adelaide MUIRE - major Matthew William George MUIRE - minor State separately the children born of different marriages and give the date of birth of each minor. Names must be written out in full. If there are no children, and either or both parents be dead, then give the names and addresses of the brothers and sisters of the deceased. N/S Has the deceased left any movable property? Yes Has the deceased left any immovable property? Yes Is it estimated that the estate exceeds L300 in value? No Has the deceased left a will? No Dated at: Orange Grove Transvaal the 23rd day of June, 1914 (Signature) Ethel Winnifred MUIRE Daughter present at the place of death . Source: Depot KAB Source MOOC Type Leer Volume_NO 6/9/755 System 01 Rererence 1565 Part 1 Description MUIR, Elizabeth. Alias MUIRE. Nee CAMPBELL. Death Notice. Starting 19140000 Ending 19140000

Name of Deceased: Catherine WARD Birthplace: Grahamstown Nationality: Father: John JOLLY Deceased Mother: Winifred JOLLY Deceased Age at Death: 25 years Condition in Life: Wife of Edwin WARD (Tailor) Ordinary Residence: n/s Marital Status: Married Surviving Spouse: Predeceased Spouses: n/s Date of Death Date of Death: 20 March 1867 Place of Death: At the residence of her husband in Victoria Street, Port Elizabeth Place of Last Marriage: n/s Children: Caroline WARD Minor Winifred Jessie WARD Minor Left Property: Property Type: none Was a Will Left: n/s Signed at: Port Elizabeth Dated on: 23 March 1867 Signed by: Edwin WARD In capacity of: ************************************************************************** Source: Depot Kab Source Mooc Type Leer Volume_No 6/9/119 System 01 Reference 3398 Description WARD, Catherine. (Nee JALLY). Death Notice Starting 1867 Ending 1867 Received in error - unknown to me G.C. **************************************************************************

Name of Deceased: Annie COOKE Birthplace: Kubusie Nationality: English Father: John CANNON - Shack 6, East London (sic) Mother: Maria CANNON - Shack 6, East London Age at Death: 37 years Condition in Life: Chargeman S.A.R. (Husband's occ) Ordinary Residence: 16 Moore St, East London Marital Status: Married Surviving Spouse: William COOKE. In C of Property Predeceased Spouses nil And Dates of Death: / Date of Death: 5 December 1922 Place of Death: Frere Hospital, East London Place of Last Marriage: n/s Children: Irene E COOKE Harold H COOKE Phyllis A COOKE William COOKE Robert C COOKE MINORS Movable Property: nil Immovable Property: / Estate Exceeds £: no Was a Will Left: no Signed at: n/s Dated on: n/s Signed by: William Cooke In capacity of: Husband at death **************************************************************************** ** Source: Depot Kab Source Mooc Type Leer Volume_No 6/9/2395 System 01 Reference 3344 Description COOKE, Annie. Nee CANNON. Estate Papers Starting 1922 Ending 1922 **************************************************************************** **

Name of Deceased: Henry WARD Birthplace: Leicestershire, England Nationality: Father: n/s Mother: n/s Age at Death: 52 years Condition in Life: Contractor Ordinary Residence: n/s Marital Status: Widower Surviving Spouse: Predeceased Spouses: n/s Date of Death: Date of Death: 8 September 1867 Place of Death: At his own residence near Salt River Place of Last Marriage: n/s Children: Sarah Ann WARD - minor Louisa WARD - minor Left Property: Property Type: Landed & Movable Was a Will Left: n/s Signed at: n/s Dated on: n/s Signed by: Sarah Ann Ward In capacity of: n/s ************************************************************************** Source: Depot Kab Source Mooc Type Leer Volume_No 6/9/120 System 01 Reference 3754 Description WARD, Henry. Death Notice Starting 1867 Ending 1867 Received in error - unknown to me G.C. **************************************************************************

Hallo :-) GGSA is busy (with the help of loads of volunteers) transcibing the 1972 Voterslist.  As far as I know most/all? voterslists are available at the archives.  I'm not sure which ones though. Kind regards Sunelia Heath :-) ________________________________ From: John Deare <dearej@mweb.co.za> To: south-africa@rootsweb.com Sent: Wed, June 22, 2011 8:28:41 PM Subject: Re: [SOUTH-AFRICA] Voters List No one is supposed to have one...what info are you looking for? Tell me off-list - John -----Original Message----- From: south-africa-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:south-africa-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Desre Bean Sent: 22 June 2011 06:03 PM To: south-africa-l@rootsweb.com Subject: [SOUTH-AFRICA] Voters List Dear Listers, Does anyone have access to the SA Voters Roll/List Thank you Desre ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1382 / Virus Database: 1513/3719 - Release Date: 06/22/11 ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you Nick, and all the others who replied. I now have lots about the POWs . It was a super camp for those guys. I rmember there were two Italian POWs builders who on parole built the church in Nigel. What I now want is which part of Zonderwater/Premier Mine/Cullinan was the WAAS/WAAF dispersal camp after VJ day. I remember being housed in a series of terraced brick houses, mine houses I am sure. It was a huge camp Some several thousands or so women being there waiting for discharge from the army. It was separate from a men's camp, lots of swains waiting at the orderly room door and hundreds men and women packed 8 to a compartment going on weekend leave form the station, (called Z PM or C) changing at Germiston for East or West Rand. I have looked at maps but present day ones make it impossible to see what was where. Any clue how to research that topic? The dispersal camp part? Most gratefully received Patricia Frykberg -------------------------------------------------- From: "Niki Cronje" <nikiwkskin@gmail.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 6:22 PM To: "Marielle Ford" <marielle@intekom.co.za>; <south-africa-immigrants-british@rootsweb.com> Cc: <south-africa-l@rootsweb.com>; <south-africa-eastern-cape@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [SOUTH-AFRICA] [ZA-IB] WW 2 ZONDERWATER > Hi > > The following website could perhaps be of some help. > > http://www.francoforleo.co.za/Zonderwater.html > Regards > > Niki Cronje > (Jooste/Nell/Kitching/Gerber/Furstenburg/Smuts) > On Tue, Jun 21, 2011 at 8:05 AM, Marielle Ford > <marielle@intekom.co.za>wrote: > >> There is now a prison of this name in Gauteng. Not sure where exactly. >> >> Regards >> Marielle >> From: Pat Frykberg >> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 1:45 PM >> To: south-africa@rootsweb.com >> Subject: WW 2 ZONDERWATER >> >> >> Can anyone tell me about this place? My memory has snippets thus >> It became a dispersal camp for the WAAS (Womens Auxiliary Army Service) >> after VJ day August 1945. >> We were billeted in a row of Victorian terrace houses. >> The nearby train station was either Premier Mine or Cullinan. >> Had these houses been part of the mine employees' houses? >> Where in relation to this was the Italian POW camp? >> Any information and reference to that part of the world would be more >> than >> welcome. >> Many thanks all. >> >> Patricia Frykberg >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> SOUTH-AFRICA-IMMIGRANTS-BRITISH-request@rootsweb.com with the word >> 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the >> message >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 10.0.1382 / Virus Database: 1513/3716 - Release Date: 06/20/11 >

Hallo everyone Just an interesting titbit. A few years ago a friend took me to a hall in Cullinan to look at murials painted by prisoners of WW2. They were stunning but I am not sure if they were rerstored. Kind regards. Magda Begeman Sent from my BlackBerry® -----Original Message----- From: Pat Frykberg <patfryk@clear.net.nz> Sender: south-africa-bounces@rootsweb.com Date: Tue, 21 Jun 2011 19:20:53 To: <south-africa@rootsweb.com> Reply-To: south-africa@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [SOUTH-AFRICA] [ZA-IB] WW 2 ZONDERWATER Thank you Nick, and all the others who replied. I now have lots about the POWs . It was a super camp for those guys. I rmember there were two Italian POWs builders who on parole built the church in Nigel. What I now want is which part of Zonderwater/Premier Mine/Cullinan was the WAAS/WAAF dispersal camp after VJ day. I remember being housed in a series of terraced brick houses, mine houses I am sure. It was a huge camp Some several thousands or so women being there waiting for discharge from the army. It was separate from a men's camp, lots of swains waiting at the orderly room door and hundreds men and women packed 8 to a compartment going on weekend leave form the station, (called Z PM or C) changing at Germiston for East or West Rand. I have looked at maps but present day ones make it impossible to see what was where. Any clue how to research that topic? The dispersal camp part? Most gratefully received Patricia Frykberg -------------------------------------------------- From: "Niki Cronje" <nikiwkskin@gmail.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 6:22 PM To: "Marielle Ford" <marielle@intekom.co.za>; <south-africa-immigrants-british@rootsweb.com> Cc: <south-africa-l@rootsweb.com>; <south-africa-eastern-cape@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [SOUTH-AFRICA] [ZA-IB] WW 2 ZONDERWATER > Hi > > The following website could perhaps be of some help. > > http://www.francoforleo.co.za/Zonderwater.html > Regards > > Niki Cronje > (Jooste/Nell/Kitching/Gerber/Furstenburg/Smuts) > On Tue, Jun 21, 2011 at 8:05 AM, Marielle Ford > <marielle@intekom.co.za>wrote: > >> There is now a prison of this name in Gauteng. Not sure where exactly. >> >> Regards >> Marielle >> From: Pat Frykberg >> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 1:45 PM >> To: south-africa@rootsweb.com >> Subject: WW 2 ZONDERWATER >> >> >> Can anyone tell me about this place? My memory has snippets thus >> It became a dispersal camp for the WAAS (Womens Auxiliary Army Service) >> after VJ day August 1945. >> We were billeted in a row of Victorian terrace houses. >> The nearby train station was either Premier Mine or Cullinan. >> Had these houses been part of the mine employees' houses? >> Where in relation to this was the Italian POW camp? >> Any information and reference to that part of the world would be more >> than >> welcome. >> Many thanks all. >> >> Patricia Frykberg >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> SOUTH-AFRICA-IMMIGRANTS-BRITISH-request@rootsweb.com with the word >> 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the >> message >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 10.0.1382 / Virus Database: 1513/3716 - Release Date: 06/20/11 > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi The following website could perhaps be of some help. http://www.francoforleo.co.za/Zonderwater.html Regards Niki Cronje (Jooste/Nell/Kitching/Gerber/Furstenburg/Smuts) On Tue, Jun 21, 2011 at 8:05 AM, Marielle Ford <marielle@intekom.co.za>wrote: > There is now a prison of this name in Gauteng. Not sure where exactly. > > Regards > Marielle > From: Pat Frykberg > Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2011 1:45 PM > To: south-africa@rootsweb.com > Subject: WW 2 ZONDERWATER > > > Can anyone tell me about this place? My memory has snippets thus > It became a dispersal camp for the WAAS (Womens Auxiliary Army Service) > after VJ day August 1945. > We were billeted in a row of Victorian terrace houses. > The nearby train station was either Premier Mine or Cullinan. > Had these houses been part of the mine employees' houses? > Where in relation to this was the Italian POW camp? > Any information and reference to that part of the world would be more than > welcome. > Many thanks all. > > Patricia Frykberg > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > SOUTH-AFRICA-IMMIGRANTS-BRITISH-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Keith Thank you for sharing, it gives me hope with my brick walls Lucky

Hi Keith, What interesting reading - and your research in going to such measures and zest to find the solution to the mystery. Take care, Glynis -----Original Message----- From: south-africa-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:south-africa-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Keith Meintjes Sent: 18 June 2011 06:20 AM To: SA List Subject: [SOUTH-AFRICA] Botma (Bothma) murder mystery in Kruisvallei, Tulbagh (1861) An interesting story: http://www.quaggabooks.co.za/Newsletter/QuaggaJune2011.html Keith ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

An interesting story: http://www.quaggabooks.co.za/Newsletter/QuaggaJune2011.html Keith

Keith Good morning. I am interested in the first two books Brit Residents in the cape and The settlers handbook. Plse can you let me know how I can contact you off line? Thanks Charlie -----Original Message----- From: south-africa-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:south-africa-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Keith Meintjes Sent: Friday, June 17, 2011 3:45 AM To: SA List Subject: [SOUTH-AFRICA] Genealogy Books for Sale All, As you may know, I have accumulated an amazing library of ZA genealogy books over the last 20 years. I recently had an opportunity to make a substantial addition to my library, but I had to buy an entire collection. So, I have the following "extra" books, duplicates of my previous acquisitions. The books are now in South Africa, where I will be traveling next month. If I have not re-sold them there, I will bring them back to the USA. I am not a book dealer, I am not interested in making a profit, I am simply interested in covering some of my costs. So, I am offering the following books: Each book: USD 35, postage paid in the USA; or ZAR 250, postage paid in RSA. Payment in advance. Postage additional to other countries. P Philip: British Residents at the Cape. MD Nash: The Settler Handbook. (ex Library.) Y Miller: Acutts in Africa. FM Williams: Geslagsregister van die Familie Bruwer. EM Neethling: Die Neethlings in Suid-Afrika. PJ Retief: Die Retief-Familie in Suid-Afrika DJ van Zyl: Die Van Zyl-Familie in Suid-Afrika L Zollner: Die Nasate van die Rynse Sendelinge in Suid-Afrika. CW Hutton: Autobiography of Sir Andries Stockenstrom. 2 Volumes, price for each. (1964) This price is far below the going rate for each book, as you might find at www.addall.com/used (If you happen to find a lower price there, buy it there.) If you are interested, send an e-mail directly to me: umfundi@usa.net. DO NOT reply to the list. Sometime in August I will offer lookups in the 15+ books that are my new acquisitions. Best wishes, Keith ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Charlie, > Plse can you let me know how I can contact you off line? I should have said "off list". email to umfundi@usa.net keith

All, As you may know, I have accumulated an amazing library of ZA genealogy books over the last 20 years. I recently had an opportunity to make a substantial addition to my library, but I had to buy an entire collection. So, I have the following "extra" books, duplicates of my previous acquisitions. The books are now in South Africa, where I will be traveling next month. If I have not re-sold them there, I will bring them back to the USA. I am not a book dealer, I am not interested in making a profit, I am simply interested in covering some of my costs. So, I am offering the following books: Each book: USD 35, postage paid in the USA; or ZAR 250, postage paid in RSA. Payment in advance. Postage additional to other countries. P Philip: British Residents at the Cape. MD Nash: The Settler Handbook. (ex Library.) Y Miller: Acutts in Africa. FM Williams: Geslagsregister van die Familie Bruwer. EM Neethling: Die Neethlings in Suid-Afrika. PJ Retief: Die Retief-Familie in Suid-Afrika DJ van Zyl: Die Van Zyl-Familie in Suid-Afrika L Zollner: Die Nasate van die Rynse Sendelinge in Suid-Afrika. CW Hutton: Autobiography of Sir Andries Stockenstrom. 2 Volumes, price for each. (1964) This price is far below the going rate for each book, as you might find at www.addall.com/used (If you happen to find a lower price there, buy it there.) If you are interested, send an e-mail directly to me: umfundi@usa.net. DO NOT reply to the list. Sometime in August I will offer lookups in the 15+ books that are my new acquisitions. Best wishes, Keith

Thanks Philip, and thanks to the others I heard from and perhaps I haven't replied to off-list. I will have to do some further digging and ask my father if he knows more. I have hit that wall before on my dad's side as well, with the registrations only starting in 1837 - most frustrating, but I guess that's all part of the geneology research, and why we love it and hate it at the same time! Thanks again to all, Wendy --- On Wed, 6/15/11, Philip Curtis <russellf97@gmail.com> wrote: > From: Philip Curtis <russellf97@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: [SOUTH-AFRICA] Parry > To: south-africa@rootsweb.com > Date: Wednesday, June 15, 2011, 12:26 AM > Hi, > > The only Mary Maria Parry births registered in England > anywhere near 1864 > are in 1870 (Holborn, London) & 1879 (Weobley, > Herefordshire). > > Was her mother's name a married name? There is only one > Mary Rebecca Parry > birth registered which was in 1848 (Holywell, Flintshire). > > Her birth may not have been registered because although > official > registration started in 1837, it didn't become mandatory > until 1875. And I > know from my own family tree, that some birth registrations > were missed well > after 1875. > > Do you have any other information which might help to find > them in the UK > census? > > Regards, > > Phil Curtis > > > > On 15 June 2011 04:42, Wendy O'Brien <wob303@yahoo.com> > wrote: > > > Hello All, > > > > I am trying to find out more about my paternal > great-grandmother's side of > > the family.  Her maiden name was Mary Maria > Parry.  She was married in South > > Africa to my great-grandfather, James Howells. I am > copying the SA and Essex > > lists, since she was born in the UK and died in South > Africa. > > > > The information I have is that she was born in England > in May 1864, and > > died in South Africa on 15 August 1944.  Her > mother's name was Mary Rebecca > > Parry, and I am trying to find out her maiden name and > her husband's name. > > > > Any help or information would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Thank you, and kind regards, > > Wendy > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to SOUTH-AFRICA-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the > subject and the body of the message >

On 16 Jun 2011 at 15:13, Richard Ball wrote: > I would hardly call it a 'service'. It is an attempt, like so many > of this sort of web site, to gather free material to sell on to other > individuals and commercial enterprises. To use your material as their > stock in trade and to profit from it. Quite. > Essentially to join up you agree to provide anything and everything > you post to their web site freely and forever to their use, to sell on > or amend as they see fit. > > In return they specifically grant you no rights whatever to use or > store anything on their web with a few esceptions which may be stored > on your own personal computer only. And in so doing they encourage cut and paste genealogy. > You would effectively be granting Ancestry.com copyright in your > material and gaining nothing in return. > > Even by signing up to view the 'free' beta version you are granting > them these rights, including that to use your personal information as > they see fit. > > Read the 'terms': > > http://www.mundia.com/gb/TermsConditions > > among others: > > 5. Your content > For each item of content that you post, you grant to us and our > affiliates a world-wide, royalty free, fully paid-up, non-exclusive, > perpetual, irrevocable, transferable, and fully sublicensable > (including to other Website users) license, without additional > consideration to you or any third party, to: (i) reproduce ... > (effectivlely by any means possible) > > (ii) exercise all trademark, publicity and other proprietary rights > with regard to such content; > > (iii) use your name, photograph, portrait, picture, voice, likeness > and biographical information as provided by you in connection with > your content for the Service, in each case, in connection with your > content. For example, after your registration or subscription has > ended, we may continue to use and display any content that you > previously posted, and other users may continue may access, change, > edit, add to, subtract from or otherwise amend such content. > > If you do not want to grant us the rights set out in these Terms of > Use, please do not post any content on the Website. That is one of the reasons I have posted no content and do not intend to, nor do I intend to invite any of my family to make use of the service, or at least not until they have remedied the defects. > 6. Our content > Our Website contains software, trademarks, graphics, information, > data, editorial and other content ("Our Content"). We, our > affiliates or our respective licensors own, licensee or otherwise > have rights to use all intellectual property rights in and to our > Website and all Our Content. All such rights are reserved. ... > nothing in these Terms of Use gives you any right in respect of any > intellectual property ... > > 3. Your personal information > We collect, use and disclose your personal information in accordance > with our privacy policy (“Privacy Policy”) ... > > We may disclose your personal information: > * to our Affiliates ... > * to our third party service providers ... > * to trusted third party partners to allow them to send you > promotional offers. ... > > * to third party sponsors of promotions (irrespective of whether > those promotions are sponsored by us), ... > * to an Affiliate or other third party ... > * as we believe to be appropriate: Which is why I think it important for REAL genealogists to give them feedback on these and other problems, so that they can't say they have not been warned. My wife has been using the site, because we recently discovered a link to other genealogies that give another 8 generations back on her side of the family. She has discovered an enormous number of people who seem to be interested in this family (ELLWOOD of Cumbria - not a South African family). Yet though we have put this interest on various place3s on the internet, not one of them has bothered to contact us. Some have worked at duplicating the same research. One did most of the work in going back to the earlier generations, and the rest appeared to have just copied their work. She had written to them to discuss collaboration ans rouces, but the rest are just leeches, copying other people's work without a workd of thanks. And Ancestry encourages this, because they have tried very hard to lock people in by only make it possible to communicate within their site. That's where commercial motives come in. If, for example, you what to ask the source for something, they don't give you an e-mail address or web site to contact the person -- you can only send them an internal message in the site, which they would only see next time they log on, which they may not do for six months, a year, or never, and in the mean time everyone is being enabled to mcopy spurious information from their tree. So please, if you visit the site, click their "feedback" thingy and let them know what you think! -- Steve Hayes E-mail: shayes@dunelm.org.uk Web: http://hayesstw.tumblr.com/ (follow me on Tumblr) Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com Phone: 083-342-3563 or 012-333-6727 Fax: 086-548-2525

> That is one of the reasons I have posted no content > and do not intend to, nor do I intend to invite any > of my family to make use of the service, or at > least not until they have remedied the defects. "until they have remedied the defects"? Steve, you are an incredible optimist. Keith

Greetings all, Tobi Swart has generously compiled a list of births which took place in the Irene Nylstroom Concentration Camp between September 1901 to May 1902, and which now appears on e-family.co.za Best regards, Ron

On this day, 16 June 1896, the Drummond Castle was off Ushant and within one day´s steaming of home. The sea was calm but visibility was poor. The strong currents converging on the island of Molene, off Ushant, make the locality one of the most dangerous in the world for navigators. She hit some rocks and went down. 243 persons drowned, only 3 were saved. Just found reference to one of those who drowned, in his fathers file, - William David Easton Martin of Woodstock, Cape Town. His name was not recorded as a fatality. Cheers Jennifer Graham & Jennifer Lloyd [Genealogical & Historical Research] 2 Constantia Court River's End Road Plumstead 7800 Cape Town South Africa Tel: +0027 (0)21 7974875 Mobile: 0824037343 email: lacey@yebo.co.za www.southafricanfamily.com I'm not stuck, I'm Ancestrally challenged Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass It's about learning to dance in the rain

Hello Steve, SH> I recently discovered "Mundia", a service of Ancestry.com. SH> www.mundia.com I would hardly call it a 'service'. It is an attempt, like so many of this sort of web site, to gather free material to sell on to other individuals and commercial enterprises. To use your material as their stock in trade and to profit from it. Essentially to join up you agree to provide anything and everything you post to their web site freely and forever to their use, to sell on or amend as they see fit. In return they specifically grant you no rights whatever to use or store anything on their web with a few esceptions which may be stored on your own personal computer only. You would effectively be granting Ancestry.com copyright in your material and gaining nothing in return. Even by signing up to view the 'free' beta version you are granting them these rights, including that to use your personal information as they see fit. Read the 'terms': http://www.mundia.com/gb/TermsConditions among others: 5. Your content For each item of content that you post, you grant to us and our affiliates a world-wide, royalty free, fully paid-up, non-exclusive, perpetual, irrevocable, transferable, and fully sublicensable (including to other Website users) license, without additional consideration to you or any third party, to: (i) reproduce ... (effectivlely by any means possible) (ii) exercise all trademark, publicity and other proprietary rights with regard to such content; (iii) use your name, photograph, portrait, picture, voice, likeness and biographical information as provided by you in connection with your content for the Service, in each case, in connection with your content. For example, after your registration or subscription has ended, we may continue to use and display any content that you previously posted, and other users may continue may access, change, edit, add to, subtract from or otherwise amend such content. If you do not want to grant us the rights set out in these Terms of Use, please do not post any content on the Website. 6. Our content Our Website contains software, trademarks, graphics, information, data, editorial and other content ("Our Content"). We, our affiliates or our respective licensors own, licensee or otherwise have rights to use all intellectual property rights in and to our Website and all Our Content. All such rights are reserved. ... nothing in these Terms of Use gives you any right in respect of any intellectual property ... 3. Your personal information We collect, use and disclose your personal information in accordance with our privacy policy (“Privacy Policy”) ... We may disclose your personal information: * to our Affiliates ... * to our third party service providers ... * to trusted third party partners to allow them to send you promotional offers. ... * to third party sponsors of promotions (irrespective of whether those promotions are sponsored by us), ... * to an Affiliate or other third party ... * as we believe to be appropriate: Good luck, Richard -- Richard Ball, Norfolk, England http://www.ballfamilyrecords.co.uk richard.ball@ballfamilyrecords.co.uk