This is a MIME Encoded Message --=_--- Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ---- Forwarded message from lists@sog.org.uk attached ---- --=_--- Content-Type: message/rfc822 Return-Path: <listadmin-bounces@rootsweb.com> Received: from punt3.mail.demon.net by mailstore for lists@socgen-adsl.demon.co.uk id 1F7htO-1N7GPo-03-EbZ; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:41:34 +0000 Received: from [194.217.242.211] (lhlo=lon1-hub.mail.demon.net) by punt3.mail.demon.net with lmtp id 1F7htO-1N7GPo-03 for lists@socgen-adsl.demon.co.uk; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:41:34 +0000 Received: from [212.53.64.112] (helo=coumail03.netbenefit.co.uk) by lon1-hub.mail.demon.net with esmtp id 1F7htO-0002Xy-0u for lists@socgen-adsl.demon.co.uk; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:41:34 +0000 Received: from mailmap by coumail03.netbenefit.co.uk with spam-scanned (NetBenefit 2.0) id 1F7htL-00005X-AI for lists@sog.org.uk; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:41:33 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.0 (2005-09-13) on coumail03.netbenefit.co.uk X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.0 required=5.0 tests=UNPARSEABLE_RELAY autolearn=disabled version=3.1.0 X-Spam-Level: Received: from mailmap by coumail03.netbenefit.co.uk with foot_add (NetBenefit 2.0) id 1F7htL-00005R-9N for lists@sog.org.uk; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:41:31 +0000 Received: from lists8.rootsweb.com ([66.43.27.27]:41395) by coumail03.netbenefit.co.uk with esmtp (NetBenefit 2.0) id 1F7htK-000053-WA for lists@sog.org.uk; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:41:31 +0000 Received: (from slist@localhost) by lists8.rootsweb.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) id k1ANfRgj025176 for SOG-UK-admin@lists8.rootsweb.com; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:41:27 -0700 Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:41:27 -0700 X-From_: Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk Fri Feb 10 16:41:27 2006 Received: from mail.rootsweb.com (mail.rootsweb.com [192.168.65.34]) by lists8.rootsweb.com (8.12.10/8.12.8) with ESMTP id k1ANfRfE025162 for <SOG-UK-L@lists8.rootsweb.com>; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:41:27 -0700 Received: from smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk (smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk [195.188.213.8]) by mail.rootsweb.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id k1ANfNtc028101 for <SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com>; Fri, 10 Feb 2006 16:41:24 -0700 Received: from [10.0.1.2] ([82.39.45.180]) by smtp-out5.blueyonder.co.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:42:29 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <a06230904c012d0ae72fa@[10.0.1.2]> Old-Date: Fri, 10 Feb 2006 23:41:08 +0000 To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com From: Brian Randell <Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Feb 2006 23:42:29.0227 (UTC) FILETIME=[A789C3B0:01C62E9B] X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.52 on 192.168.65.34 X-Diagnostic: Not on the accept list Subject: {not a subscriber} Port Books (Was: Chalders of Coals London) X-Envelope-To: SOG-UK-L X-NB-Virus-Scan: virus-free X-NB-Seen: InOVOJnug36R X-Mailmap-To: lists@sog.org.uk Hi: At 11:22 pm +0000 10/2/06, Brian Randell wrote: >I'm currently extracting entries concerning coastal voyages of >Clovelly sailing ships from some early 18th century Port Books for >Padstow, Cornwall held at the National Archives, Kew. I undertook a >similar exercise using Bideford Port books some time ago - the >results are at: > >http://genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/DEV/Clovelly/PortBooks.html > >Lots of the Padstow entries concern arrivals from across the Bristol >Channel, from Neath in particular, with "chalders of coal". (Chalder >is I find from the OED an "obsolete dry measure of capacity [which >for coal] varied from 32 to 64 imperial bushels".) > >However, the description of the cargo often takes a form such as "20 >chalders of Coals London". I don't think this relates to London as >an ultimate destination for the coal - I'm pretty sure the sailing >ships used would not have undertaken voyages to London. That I >assume had to await a further century and the coming of steam - and >I wondered whether it refers to a type of coal. (Another typical >cargo description might be "10 chalders of coal & 5 chalders of >culm", i.e. contain no mention of London - culm is I understand >anthracite.) > >Can anyone suggest the meaning of such references to London? (A >colleague wondered whether London related to the unit of measure, >rather than the type of coal.) From another mailing list I've obtained the answer to the above question - "shipments of coal ... were invariably measured in terms of caldrons (or chalders) of London measure---26 cwt per caldron". However I have a couple of more general questions about interpretation of port books that someone here might be able to help with. 1 - The port books (of inward voyages) I've been looking at usually have two dates or sometimes three associated with each item. One date is given in the left hand margin, a second above the text of each item, separating it from the preceding item. The first dates are not necessarily in calendar order. The second dates are in calendar order and are later than the first dates. The third dates, when present are given in the right hand margin and as far as I can tell later than the second dates. There is no indication of the significance of any of these dates - possible candidates are date of departure from last port, date of arrival at port, date of entry of record in port book. Can anyone confirm this or provide me with a definitive explanation of them? 2 - A typical entry in the port books I'm studying is: In the BETTY of Padstow James Lyle Master from Neath - Idem ind - 20 Chalders of Coal and Culm All contain the phrase "Idem ind" I'm not sure which previous word in the item the "Idem" refers to, or what the "ind" means - can anyone suggest an explanation? Cheers Brian Randell -- School of Computing Science, University of Newcastle, Newcastle upon Tyne, NE1 7RU, UK EMAIL = Brian.Randell@ncl.ac.uk PHONE = +44 191 222 7923 FAX = +44 191 222 8232 URL = http://www.cs.ncl.ac.uk/~brian.randell/ This email has been scanned for viruses by NetBenefit using Sophos anti-virus technology --=_-----