>A little disheartened I turned to my CDs and searched the included street index for an address where my VOUSLEY ancestors lived near the census date and when straight to this address on the CDs.< There is another aspect to this. Not only do the street indexes on these CDs tell you which roads are there, they also tell you which roads/areas are missing - missing or damaged pages. For example, in the 1861 census for London, the whole of Belgravia is missing - 55,000 people. The person you are looking for could be in one of those streets and could be the reason you can't find them. Jeanne Bunting

I thought I'd add to the (short) debate about the merits of purchasing census CDs versus online (or other) indexes by describing a recent experience of mine with both of these. I must start by saying that I don't often get the chance to visit the FRC in London to look at street indexes and census records which is why I tend to purchase the census CD sets to research at my leisure. However, if I could get to there often I would use the methods described below for my searches through census records at the FRC. I recently purchased a CD set for which there exists a complete index online. I searched the online index for references to two surnames I'm interested in HOOLE and VOUSLEY. I was unable to locate any of the people I was interested in on these indexes. VOUSLEY is an uncommon name so I had expected this to be mistranscribed but I thought I'd be OK with HOOLE (note my search was for all names beginning with HOOL so I'd pick up the obvious errors). A little disheartened I turned to my CDs and searched the included street index for an address where my VOUSLEY ancestors lived near the census date and when straight to this address on the CDs. There was my VOUSLEY family, very clearly written. Next, I looked up an address in the City of London where I'd found some HOOLE baptisms that I'm trying to link to my Woolwich HOOLEs and searched the whole of this street. No HOOLEs. So I broadened my search to the whole parish and discovered a street that I'd found a reference to in one of my Woolwich HOOLE wills but I'd been unable to locate the address in Woolwich. The address is Bloomfield Street, which I don't think is a common street name and the will mentioned the Bloomfield Street Savings Bank so I'm hoping this is something I can follow up which will maybe link the two HOOLE families together. If I hadn't trawled the whole parish (which isn't possible with online indexes) I wouldn't have found this address. Don't get me wrong I do think that the online indexes are very useful to quickly help locate surnames but they have their limitations. I think census CDs (or microfilms) and indexes (online or book form) complement each other and are both useful in different situations and I hope that the computerisation of both continue. Sorry for the long rambling but I hope I've illustrated my point. Regards Alison

In a message dated Fri, 30 Sep 2005 09:35:25 +0100 GMT Daylight Time, Ian Miller _ian.r.n.miller@btopenworld.com_ (mailto:ian.r.n.miller@btopenworld.com) writes: Christmas Day this year falls on a Sunday. My wife tells me that she had heard such a co-incidence being referred to as a "Poor Man's Christmas". The reason, apparently, was that on Sundays and Christmas Days the less well off families had a roast dinner and, if the two days are the same the family only had one. Has anyone heard of this, or something similar? It's not an explanation I have heard, and a quick Google on the phrase gives several versions. It is mainly used by the Jews as a description of Hannakah<sp?> and this appears to be partly ironic - it means Christmas lasts for eight days in a Jewish household! Before Charles Dickens invented the present version of Christmas celebrations in Pickwick Papers, employees were only allowed Christmas Day off as a holiday as one of the feast days as well as, of course, Sundays. I would think the expression was more connected with the fact that when Christmas Day fell on a Sunday the employee only got one day off instead of one for each day. But I speculate. In most cases a poor person would only have a chicken at Christmas time - unless, of course they kept the birds to eke out the family budget with eggs and for stewing the odd old bird. With wages generally being low, it was unlikely a genuinely poor man would be able to afford two of them at the same time. In fact, Sundays would normally be much like any other day with the idea of a Sunday Roast being a concept known only to richer folk. DaveD

Christmas Day this year falls on a Sunday. My wife tells me that she had heard such a co-incidence being referred to as a "Poor Man's Christmas". The reason, apparently, was that on Sundays and Christmas Days the less well off families had a roast dinner and, if the two days are the same the family only had one. Has anyone heard of this, or something similar? Ian Miller Puddletown Dorset

----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Amsden" <amsden@btinternet.com> To: <SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 12:37 PM Subject: Re: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days <<Well, this would be nice if it worked. Having registered I am now told that my registered email address is not recognised. If I try to re-register I am told that I am already registered.>> <<Not quite sure where to go from there. I have written to the help address, but I would imagine that by the time I get an answer then the free session will be over anyway.>> Remember that a great many UK public library ticket holders can have free home access at any time - and not just at this weekend. Usually this involves typing the barcode (without spaces) from your reader's ticket into the appropriate signing-in box. There is a list of libraries where you can always see the online DNB free of charge on the premises at: http://www.oup.com/oxforddnb/info/online/libraries/ Many of these libraries (but not all of them) also offer their registered members free home access. My own county library service is amongst them - I had been intending to take out a home subscription, but I now find there's no real need. AJ

They have apparently had a problem with "btinternet" addresses - no explanation as to why - but they sorted it for me quickly and effectively. Only problem is that I found no one I hoped might be there :-( John B Leic., Eng ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Amsden" <amsden@btinternet.com> To: <SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2005 5:26 PM Subject: Re: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days > Yes, the response was very quick. Mine arrived late last night!! > > Problem is now sorted. Probably there was a mass of people fighting to get > on to the register resulting in a traffic jam. > > > Peter Amsden > Argyll, Scotland

Yes, the response was very quick. Mine arrived late last night!! Problem is now sorted. Probably there was a mass of people fighting to get on to the register resulting in a traffic jam. Peter Amsden Argyll, Scotland > From: <jivsmith@tiscali.co.uk> > Reply-To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2005 14:26:53 +0100 > To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days > Resent-From: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Resent-Date: Sat, 24 Sep 2005 07:26:44 -0600 > > Further to my last message - I have now been activated. > It was a very quick response. > Joan. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Peter Amsden" <amsden@btinternet.com> > To: <SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 12:37 PM > Subject: Re: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days > > >> Well, this would be nice if it worked. Having registered I am now told >> that >> my registered email address is not recognised. If I try to re-register I >> am >> told that I am already registered. >> >> Not quite sure where to go from there. I have written to the help address, >> but I would imagine that by the time I get an answer then the free session >> will be over anyway. >> >> Has anyone else experienced this problem? >> >> Peter Amsden >> Argyll, Scotland >> >> >> >> >> >>> From: John Addis-Smith <genl@addisgen.com> >>> Reply-To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >>> Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 02:40:20 +0100 >>> To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >>> Subject: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days >>> Resent-From: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >>> Resent-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 19:40:10 -0600 >>> >>> The new Oxford Dictionary of National Biography celebrates its first >>> birthday with three days' free online access from 23 to 25 September. >>> See the website at: >>> http://www.oxforddnb.com/ >>> for further details. >>> >>> Remember that besides searching for the biography of a particular >>> individual you can also search for any name across all the 50,000 >>> biographies. >>> >>> >>> Cheers, John >>> >>> John Addis-Smith >>> Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England >>> >> >> >

Thanks to an answer to a previously posted query to this list, I have learned that listed in the records of the Church of St Mary and All Saints Willingham, a Richard Peters and his wife Mary were the parents of Valentine baptised 4 March 1651 and in the same church records Richard was buried 16 March 1658. Can anyone suggest where I might now turn to find out more about Richard and/or Mary. Any help will be very very much appreciated Joan Gilday Quebec Canada SOG #004277

Further to my last message - I have now been activated. It was a very quick response. Joan. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Amsden" <amsden@btinternet.com> To: <SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 12:37 PM Subject: Re: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days > Well, this would be nice if it worked. Having registered I am now told > that > my registered email address is not recognised. If I try to re-register I > am > told that I am already registered. > > Not quite sure where to go from there. I have written to the help address, > but I would imagine that by the time I get an answer then the free session > will be over anyway. > > Has anyone else experienced this problem? > > Peter Amsden > Argyll, Scotland > > > > > >> From: John Addis-Smith <genl@addisgen.com> >> Reply-To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 02:40:20 +0100 >> To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days >> Resent-From: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Resent-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 19:40:10 -0600 >> >> The new Oxford Dictionary of National Biography celebrates its first >> birthday with three days' free online access from 23 to 25 September. >> See the website at: >> http://www.oxforddnb.com/ >> for further details. >> >> Remember that besides searching for the biography of a particular >> individual you can also search for any name across all the 50,000 >> biographies. >> >> >> Cheers, John >> >> John Addis-Smith >> Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England >> > >

Yes, but in my case the "sign in" link was not live. I, too, am waiting for a reply! Joan. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Amsden" <amsden@btinternet.com> To: <SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, September 24, 2005 12:37 PM Subject: Re: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days > Well, this would be nice if it worked. Having registered I am now told > that > my registered email address is not recognised. If I try to re-register I > am > told that I am already registered. > > Not quite sure where to go from there. I have written to the help address, > but I would imagine that by the time I get an answer then the free session > will be over anyway. > > Has anyone else experienced this problem? > > Peter Amsden > Argyll, Scotland > > > > > >> From: John Addis-Smith <genl@addisgen.com> >> Reply-To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 02:40:20 +0100 >> To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days >> Resent-From: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Resent-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 19:40:10 -0600 >> >> The new Oxford Dictionary of National Biography celebrates its first >> birthday with three days' free online access from 23 to 25 September. >> See the website at: >> http://www.oxforddnb.com/ >> for further details. >> >> Remember that besides searching for the biography of a particular >> individual you can also search for any name across all the 50,000 >> biographies. >> >> >> Cheers, John >> >> John Addis-Smith >> Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England >> > >

Peter Amsden <amsden@btinternet.com> wrote on Sat, 24 Sep 2005: >Well, this would be nice if it worked. Having registered I am now told >that my registered email address is not recognised. If I try to >re-register I am told that I am already registered. Registration isn't complete until you've confirmed your address by responding to the e-mail they send you immediately after you've completed the web page form. Have you been through that stage? -- Iain Archer

Yes Peter, I had exactly the same problem. Patricia On 24 Sep 2005, at 12:37, Peter Amsden wrote: > Well, this would be nice if it worked. Having registered I am now told > that > my registered email address is not recognised. If I try to re-register > I am > told that I am already registered. > > Not quite sure where to go from there. I have written to the help > address, > but I would imagine that by the time I get an answer then the free > session > will be over anyway. > > Has anyone else experienced this problem? > > Peter Amsden > Argyll, Scotland > > > > > >> From: John Addis-Smith <genl@addisgen.com> >> Reply-To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 02:40:20 +0100 >> To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Subject: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days >> Resent-From: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com >> Resent-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 19:40:10 -0600 >> >> The new Oxford Dictionary of National Biography celebrates its first >> birthday with three days‚ free online access from 23 to 25 September. >> See the website at: >> http://www.oxforddnb.com/ >> for further details. >> >> Remember that besides searching for the biography of a particular >> individual you can also search for any name across all the 50,000 >> biographies. >> >> >> Cheers, John >> >> John Addis-Smith >> Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England >> > > >

Well, this would be nice if it worked. Having registered I am now told that my registered email address is not recognised. If I try to re-register I am told that I am already registered. Not quite sure where to go from there. I have written to the help address, but I would imagine that by the time I get an answer then the free session will be over anyway. Has anyone else experienced this problem? Peter Amsden Argyll, Scotland > From: John Addis-Smith <genl@addisgen.com> > Reply-To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 02:40:20 +0100 > To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [SoG] Free Accees to New DNB for next three days > Resent-From: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Resent-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 19:40:10 -0600 > > The new Oxford Dictionary of National Biography celebrates its first > birthday with three days’ free online access from 23 to 25 September. > See the website at: > http://www.oxforddnb.com/ > for further details. > > Remember that besides searching for the biography of a particular > individual you can also search for any name across all the 50,000 > biographies. > > > Cheers, John > > John Addis-Smith > Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England >

Many thanks to Peter, Martin, and Arthur for responses to my query. It all helps. Best regards, Lois in CA _________________________________________________________________ Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

The new Oxford Dictionary of National Biography celebrates its first birthday with three days’ free online access from 23 to 25 September. See the website at: http://www.oxforddnb.com/ for further details. Remember that besides searching for the biography of a particular individual you can also search for any name across all the 50,000 biographies. Cheers, John John Addis-Smith Thurleigh, Bedfordshire, England

Could it be "Wisbeach Road, Manea"? Manea is a village about 12 miles south of Wisbech (which is now spelt without the "a"), and may well have been in the North Witchford Registration District. Since there was also a Wisbech Registration District, it's hard to imagine that an address in the town would have been in a different one. Sorry - can't help with the other questions. Arthur Kennedy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lois Susanne Bakar" <lsb255@hotmail.com> To: <SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 7:37 AM Subject: [SoG] 19th C Diseases > Hello, > I would really appreciate your input in explaining a particular cause of > death please. In 1852, in Cambridgeshire, a 44 year old unmarried woman was > certified to have died of "Pressure on Brain". > > She died at "Wisbeach Road Manor" which leads to my second question. What > was this place? Was it a place where she probably worked, or was it a place > that kept her as a "patient"? I'm hoping that someone on the List is > familiar with that area of Cambridgeshire. (I've written "Wisbeach" as it > seems to appear on the death certificate, but perhaps it is Wisbech?? > Registration District was North Witchford). > > Thank you very much for assistance. > > Lois in California

Wisbech is small market town in Norfolk. Water on the brain implies to me a blockage in drainage system from the brain into the spine and can be caused by infections - meningitis, encephalitis or brain abscesses, tumours of the brain or clots in the brain as a result of a stroke, high blood pressure and nowadays the 'pill'. Best Wishes, Martin, Askett, Bucks. -----Original Message----- From: Lois Susanne Bakar [mailto:lsb255@hotmail.com] Sent: 22 September 2005 07:38 To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [SoG] 19th C Diseases Hello, I would really appreciate your input in explaining a particular cause of death please. In 1852, in Cambridgeshire, a 44 year old unmarried woman was certified to have died of "Pressure on Brain". She died at "Wisbeach Road Manor" which leads to my second question. What was this place? Was it a place where she probably worked, or was it a place that kept her as a "patient"? I'm hoping that someone on the List is familiar with that area of Cambridgeshire. (I've written "Wisbeach" as it seems to appear on the death certificate, but perhaps it is Wisbech?? Registration District was North Witchford). Thank you very much for assistance. Lois in California _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ________________________________________________________________________ Essential facts about burns and blast injuries: http://www.doctors.net.uk/burnsandblasts _______________________________________________________________________

It will be WISBEACH not Wisbech. There still is a Manor House in Wisbeach. You can find it on Google. Though Wisbeach Road Manor is an odd way to put it. Cambridgeshire archives look like a good place to search. Pressure on the brain could be something like meningitis. Peter Amsden Argyll, Scotland > From: "Lois Susanne Bakar" <lsb255@hotmail.com> > Reply-To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:37:43 -0700 > To: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [SoG] 19th C Diseases > Resent-From: SOG-UK-L@rootsweb.com > Resent-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 00:37:51 -0600 > > Hello, > I would really appreciate your input in explaining a particular cause of > death please. In 1852, in Cambridgeshire, a 44 year old unmarried woman was > certified to have died of "Pressure on Brain". > > She died at "Wisbeach Road Manor" which leads to my second question. What > was this place? Was it a place where she probably worked, or was it a place > that kept her as a "patient"? I'm hoping that someone on the List is > familiar with that area of Cambridgeshire. (I've written "Wisbeach" as it > seems to appear on the death certificate, but perhaps it is Wisbech?? > Registration District was North Witchford). > > Thank you very much for assistance. > > Lois in California > > _________________________________________________________________ > Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! > http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ >

If you find Ancestry's indexes 90% reliable, you are doing a LOT better than most! The error rate for my own one name study - on surnames alone - is close to 20% - and as for place errors and other mistranscriptions I've not bothered to count, but they are both absurd and practically innumerable - (such as "Romania" for Raw (NBL) for instance).. The census CD's I publish in my Drake Software guise continue to sell reasonably well: the indexes are much more comprehensive than Ancestry, wildcard searching is possibly on any field and on the upcoming OXF51 I anticipate allowing searches for up to 3 forenames of persons sharing the same household, surname unknown. The data can also be arranged to point to either a DVD with the images if available, or to online images. All my programs have comprehensive mapping down to parish level within a county, and sometimes to even finer granularity, and permit of a number of types of statistical analysis of populations etc. But most important of all, the transcriptions are the work of the local FHS's, have been rigourously checked and are fully annotated to describe both anomalies and peripheral notes by the enumerator. You dont get any of that on line! Not that the Ancestry /images/ are to be decried - their quality is in general good, and if you can manage to penetrate their abysmal indexing, most useful - i have now donwloaded around 2000 in pursuit of my AINSLEYs. So - the pure image CD without an index is probably struggling - but GOOD transcriptions with added value in the form of comprehensive search engines and analysis have a place for the serious genealogist and local historian - certainly enough to encourage me to keep on producing them! Hugh Ainsley - Drake Software and the AINSLEY one name study - GOONS #3926

Hello, I would really appreciate your input in explaining a particular cause of death please. In 1852, in Cambridgeshire, a 44 year old unmarried woman was certified to have died of "Pressure on Brain". She died at "Wisbeach Road Manor" which leads to my second question. What was this place? Was it a place where she probably worked, or was it a place that kept her as a "patient"? I'm hoping that someone on the List is familiar with that area of Cambridgeshire. (I've written "Wisbeach" as it seems to appear on the death certificate, but perhaps it is Wisbech?? Registration District was North Witchford). Thank you very much for assistance. Lois in California _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/