I am researching a Susannah LEYBURN who on various documents declared she was from Wigtownshire.  She was born approx. 1782 +/- 1 year.  In the 1851 census she is listed as from Mochrum, Wigtownshire; 1861 census from Fort William, Wig.  Question 1: Does anyone have any information about LEYBURN's in Wigtownshire?  Susannah was married to a John Duncan of Kincardine O'Neil who served with the 92nd regiment of Foot.  They had 3 sons born 1818, 1820 and 1825 in Mochrum, Wigtown.  Question 2:  was Fort William part of Wigtown during this era?  The map I looked at showed Fort William as part of Inverness. Thank you, Linda from the Land of Enchantment

Hi Bill Maybe I am wrong, but I always thought that a Ballop Relation was someone born on the wrong side of the blanket (another saying) in other words, not through a legitimate union. Best wishes Ian A McClumpha Need help with your Scottish Family History research? Let Imchad Ancestry assist you. Please look at our website: www.imchad.freeola.com -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of DOUGAN WILLIAM Sent: 14 February 2011 14:29 To: Wiglist Subject: [WIG LIST] Language An expession that I recall is "ballop relation". The ballop is the old fashioned flap on trousers, such as on Royal Navy trousers nowadays. I can only assume that it refers to relatives through marriage and not blood relatives. Another expression was "he's a frien o' oors" which meant a distant relative. Older close family friends whether related or not were often referred to as Auntie and Uncle. Very confusing to the budding genealologist. Bill ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello Sam and fellow listers, the word foonart as Diana descibes it, is very much alive in Wigtownshire, I have used it on many occasions myself, and still do, we had an expression, used on very cold days, on entering the house and taking up a positiion in front of a good fire, one would say '' it wud foonar a boar oot there ''. Little doubt it is a derivative of founder. It also brings to mind another expression or two much used in Wigtownshire, and I quote, '' oot o' this warl an' in tae Kircown '' meaning, the unbelievable. Oh !! he's fae Penpont, whar the seagulls flee backwards, tae keep the stoor oot o' their een, I'll let you guess the meaning o' that ane. Then there is the words ' foughten ' meaing, done out, and ' forfoughten ' meaning worn out, in my Wigtownshire, we said ' fair forfoughert, the meaning is the same. Len.

An expession that I recall is "ballop relation". The ballop is the old fashioned flap on trousers, such as on Royal Navy trousers nowadays. I can only assume that it refers to relatives through marriage and not blood relatives. Another expression was "he's a frien o' oors" which meant a distant relative. Older close family friends whether related or not were often referred to as Auntie and Uncle. Very confusing to the budding genealologist. Bill

Hi Len   Being a Kirkcowan lassie mysell ( a guid few years ago noo) I always thought we must be either very special or very strange when I heard that saying.   Mary --- On Tue, 15/2/11, leonard miller logan <[email protected]> wrote: From: leonard miller logan <[email protected]> Subject: [WIG LIST] Foonart To: [email protected] Date: Tuesday, 15 February, 2011, 4:06 Hello Sam and fellow listers,                                                   the word foonart as Diana descibes it, is very much alive in Wigtownshire, I have used it on many occasions myself, and still do, we had an expression, used on very cold days, on entering the house and taking up a positiion in front of a good fire, one would say '' it wud foonar a boar oot there ''. Little doubt it is a derivative of founder. It also brings to mind another expression or two much used in Wigtownshire, and I quote, '' oot o' this warl an' in tae Kircown '' meaning, the unbelievable. Oh !! he's fae Penpont, whar the seagulls flee backwards, tae keep the stoor oot o' their een, I'll let you guess the meaning o' that ane. Then there is the words ' foughten ' meaing, done out, and ' forfoughten ' meaning worn out, in my Wigtownshire, we said ' fair forfoughert, the meaning is the same.                                         Len. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Sam We were from Glasgow and my mother used to say she was "foonered" meaning freezing cold. She also used it to say it when she was full up or had too much too eat. We could have done with a bit of the freezing "foonering" last week when Sydney was sizzling.. Pity I can't ask my mother or father. We used to have a lot of fun with the auld words. Cheers Ella Ross My sister here in Brisbane where our temperatures just now range between 20 °C and 30 °C commented recently, when it was feeling a bit coolish relatively speaking, that she could have got a 'foonerin' ......... as in 'got a chill or worse from the cold weather'. Does the word 'foonerin' ring a bell with anyone else? I understand that it is from the word 'founder' as in 'to perish or be benumbed with cold'.

My sister here in Brisbane where our temperatures just now range between 20 °C and 30 °C commented recently, when it was feeling a bit coolish relatively speaking, that she could have got a 'foonerin' ......... as in 'got a chill or worse from the cold weather'. Does the word 'foonerin' ring a bell with anyone else? I understand that it is from the word 'founder' as in 'to perish or be benumbed with cold'. It is an interesting old Scottish word and I am curious as to how wide spread it was or is still used. In the older Scots language there was a tendency to drop the 'd' at the end of words and the 'ou' was pronounced as 'oo' hence 'fooner' from 'founder'. Sam Heron

Diana and listers I love the expression "we hae nane the noo". What an economy of words! (translates as "We do not have any at the moment" - not nearly as expressive) My husband born 1948 in Cumnock Ayrshire often tells me he got a foonerin while out in the cold. I hope we do not lose these rich expressions. Using Scots when I was at school was looked down upon as being a bit common. Now there is a backlash and it is being promoted in schools and by the Scottish government. I moved to Ayrshire from Glasgow and although the accent is not much different there are different words: baffies for slippers, pawkies for mitts, the puggies for slot machines so it is not the same. What is spoken though is basically English (not Gaelic) with a lot of words from Norse and German eg kirk, bairn. There are some sound clips here http://www.bbc.co.uk/voices/recordings/ They may not word outside of the UK though. Kay McMeekin Ayrshire

Thanks! That's probably what ancestral McKinstry's sounded like. Maybe a tad more reserved. Grin. Yours, Villandra Thorsdottir Austin, Texas ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kay McMeekin" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2011 9:02 AM Subject: Re: [WIG LIST] Scottish words 'foonerin ' > > There are some sound clips here http://www.bbc.co.uk/voices/recordings/ > They may not word outside of the UK though. > > Kay McMeekin > Ayrshire > >

Hi Kay, Many thanks for introducing that BBC web site. It does work just fine in the USA too, so not as restrictive as much BBC stuff. It is worth listening to some of these clips, as it is clearly very difficult indeed to get a feel for today's language when you have never lived in a place, or at least don't have close family members or friends who have. I grew up in Yorkshire in England, but my Dad's Scotticisms even after 60 years living as a professional in England, strongly reflected Ayrshire where he grew up. I have placed a link to the site on the "links" page of the "Wigtownshire Pages" http://freepages.history.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~leighann/index.html Crawford. On Sun, Feb 13, 2011 at 10:02 AM, Kay McMeekin <[email protected]> wrote: > Diana and listers > I love the expression "we hae nane the noo".  What an economy of > words! (translates as "We do not have any at the moment" - not nearly > as expressive) > > My husband born 1948 in Cumnock Ayrshire often tells me he got a > foonerin while out in the cold. > I hope we do not lose these rich expressions. Using Scots when I was > at school was looked down upon as being a bit common. Now there is a > backlash and it is being promoted in schools and by the Scottish > government. > > I moved to Ayrshire from Glasgow and although the accent is not much > different there are different words: baffies for slippers, pawkies for > mitts, the puggies for slot machines so it is not the same. > > What is spoken though is basically English (not Gaelic) with a lot of > words from Norse and German eg kirk, bairn. > > There are some sound clips here http://www.bbc.co.uk/voices/recordings/ > They may not word outside of the UK though. > > Kay McMeekin > Ayrshire > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

OK, trying this one more time. > It won't surprise me if noone here can answer this question. It's rather > on > ancient history. I want to account for the sudden explosion of a > particular > M284 (Y DNA I2b1a) haplotype in Scotland around 300 AD. Not asking for > help with the genetics, only the history. > > M284 may be indigenous to Britain and certainly was in England at that > point. Its pattern suggests that it spread to Scotland from England. > THen > a single haplotype suddenly exploded there, allegedly 1700 years ago. I > don't think they can have that 300 AD date exactly pinned down. > > On the Internet I found a vague reference to a famine in Scotland > stretching > from 100 BC to 300 AD, followed by a sudden population explosion, which > certainly fits with the behavior of this subclade. But the only specific > information I can find is data collected by the Romans on the weather. > There were intermittent extreme weather and famines all over Eurasia, but > these did not focus on that time period or on Scotland. There were > atleast > two major volcanic eruptions someplace, one thinks most likely Iceland, > during that time, that caused red rain or red snow. These events did not > affect the weather for more time than you'd expect them to. (Major > volcanic events commonly disrupt agriculture badly but only for two to > fifteen years.) The north Atlantic may have been having a warm and wet > event. Which should have led to good crops, I would think. > > Beyond that, I need any information on what the population north of the > Scottish border was in that time, if the population was lower say in the > west than in the rest of southern Scotland, and if there were any influxes > of people from England or from Europe in that time - besides Romans. > However, major settlements of Rhineland German or Belgian (eg Frankish or > Saxon) soldiers might fit the bill if that had happened. Don't think it > did > in Scotland. Apparently under the Romans the Scottish border was pretty > much where it is now, though some Roman generals had bases established > farther north, like Hadrian's wall. > > Does anyone have any information, or any ideas where to look? > > Yours, > Villandra Thorsdottir > Austin, Texas > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I'm fascinated. I just tuned in; please direct me to the archives if the question has already been answered. What dialect do they speak in these three counties? Is it still Gaelic? I fail to recognize only the last word, and the rest sound far more like Scottish, which is really an Angle dialect of Old English. Typically Scottish is very similar to English but vowels and word endings differ, and Gaelic sounds like nothing you ever heard of in your life, and you'd hardly correctly guess what the words mean (unless of course you're a native speaker). "We have none the ___" What does that last word mean? Does Ayrshire include the Glasgow area, when you're speaking of this dialect? I'm interested in the genesis of the name McKinstry. Allegedly it is Scots Gaelic for "son of a traveler" or "son of a wanderer", but a single Scots Gaelic scholar decided that, and looking at all those very similar Scots Gaelic names I think he could conceivably be wrong. Also the name seemingly dates to just before 1500, atleast in the land and probate records. Allegedly at the time the people of Galloway spoke Scots Gaelic, and they stopped speaking it late. They lived upstream on the Cree River. I understand that Gaelic was spoken until the 17th or 18th century in Galloway, and that Scots Gaelic once dominated Scotland, but that by late medieval times Scottish dominated Scotland. I understand that the spread of Scottish and the demise of Scots Gaelic spread across Galloway in such a way that people along the Cree River were arguably still speaking it just past 1500. I wouldn't be surprised if I had any part of that oversimplified. Yours, Villandra Thorsdottir Austin, Texas ----- Original Message ----- From: "Diana Henry" <[email protected]> To: "Sam Heron" <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2011 7:54 AM Subject: Re: [WIG LIST] Scottish words 'foonerin ' Hi Sam, to be "foonert" is still used here today and very often is! I have not heard of foonering though. I was in a shop in Stranraer on Saturday only to be told that (sorry) "wi hae nane the noo" about a certain product which I was asking for. Going along the street hearing snatches of conversation I am sure no one outside Dumfries and Galloway and Ayrshire could possibly understand what was being said. I think people are getting "broader" in their speech. Best wishes, Diana ________________________________ From: Sam Heron <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Sun, February 13, 2011 7:17:23 AM Subject: [WIG LIST] Scottish words 'foonerin ' My sister here in Brisbane where our temperatures just now range between 20 °C and 30 °C commented recently, when it was feeling a bit coolish relatively speaking, that she could have got a 'foonerin' ......... as in 'got a chill or worse from the cold weather'. Does the word 'foonerin' ring a bell with anyone else? I understand that it is from the word 'founder' as in 'to perish or be benumbed with cold'. It is an interesting old Scottish word and I am curious as to how wide spread it was or is still used. In the older Scots language there was a tendency to drop the 'd' at the end of words and the 'ou' was pronounced as 'oo' hence 'fooner' from 'founder'. Sam Heron ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

It won't surprise me if noone here can answer this question. It's rather on ancient history. I want to account for the sudden explosion of a particular M284 (Y DNA I2b1a) haplotype in Scotland around 300 AD. Not asking for help with the genetics, only the history. M284 may be indigenous to Britain and certainly was in England at that point. Its pattern suggests that it spread to Scotland from England. THen a single haplotype suddenly exploded there, allegedly 1700 years ago. I don't think they can have that 300 AD date exactly pinned down. On the Internet I found a vague reference to a famine in Scotland stretching from 100 BC to 300 AD, followed by a sudden population explosion, which certainly fits with the behavior of this subclade. But the only specific information I can find is data collected by the Romans on the weather. There were intermittent extreme weather and famines all over Eurasia, but these did not focus on that time period or on Scotland. There were atleast two major volcanic eruptions someplace, one thinks most likely Iceland, during that time, that caused red rain or red snow. These events did not affect the weather for more time than you'd expect them to. (Major volcanic events commonly disrupt agriculture badly but only for two to fifteen years.) The north Atlantic may have been having a warm and wet event. Which should have led to good crops, I would think. Beyond that, I need any information on what the population north of the Scottish border was in that time, if the population was lower say in the west than in the rest of southern Scotland, and if there were any influxes of people from England or from Europe in that time - besides Romans. However, major settlements of Rhineland German or Belgian (eg Frankish or Saxon) soldiers might fit the bill if that had happened. Don't think it did in Scotland. Apparently under the Romans the Scottish border was pretty much where it is now, though some Roman generals had bases established farther north, like Hadrian's wall. Does anyone have any information, or any ideas where to look? Yours, Villandra Thorsdottir Austin, Texas

Hi Sam, to be "foonert" is still used here today and very often is!  I have not heard of foonering though. I was in a shop in Stranraer on Saturday only to be told that  (sorry) "wi hae nane the noo" about a certain product which I was asking for.  Going along the street hearing snatches of conversation I am sure no one outside Dumfries and Galloway and Ayrshire could possibly understand what was being said.  I think people are getting "broader" in their speech. Best wishes, Diana ________________________________ From: Sam Heron <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Sun, February 13, 2011 7:17:23 AM Subject: [WIG LIST] Scottish words 'foonerin ' My sister here in Brisbane where our temperatures just now range between 20 °C and 30 °C commented recently, when it was feeling a bit coolish relatively speaking, that she could have got a 'foonerin' ......... as in 'got a chill or worse from the cold weather'. Does the word 'foonerin' ring a bell with anyone else? I understand that it is from the word 'founder' as in 'to perish or be benumbed with cold'. It is an interesting old Scottish word and I am curious as to how wide spread it was or is still used. In the older Scots language there was a tendency to drop the 'd' at the end of words and the 'ou' was pronounced as 'oo' hence 'fooner' from 'founder'. Sam Heron ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello listers, Could anyone give me a link to locate a birth record for a James Dalrymple, born.1 Jan. 1761, County Cork, Ireland, and died 9 March, 1837 Kennetcook, Nova Scotia? I am looking for his parents, who must have gone there from Wigtownshire. I believe he was part of Royal Highland Regiment in Nova Scotia. His family went there when he was only a child. I have looked on the ancestry world records and only found his name, birth and death dates, at Cork. He had military records in Nova Scotia. Thank you, Carolyn Achata -- Carolyn Achata

Hi' List, I request assistance in finding the marriage of Charles Godden, born1872, Brixton Surrey , spouses fore names only, Emily Ann. no marriage date to hand. 1881 Census, Family living at 9 Bedford St. Poplar, Middlesex, London Parents, Charles Edward Godden and Mary Elisabeth Godden. Family History Library film 1341114. National Archives Ref. RG11. Any help really appreciated. Len.

Hello Sinead I dont know if there is any connection i have Morrissey in my ancestors names they are connected to my Watson Egan family Kind regards Jean in Aussie > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: DBlainWill Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.wig.general/580.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: If you have not gone further in your research, I believe I can help you. I believe your husband's ancestor is part of my BLAIN ancestry. Dianne BLAIN Williamson Alabama Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

With permission from Jean Rice, Ireland Gen. Maisie ---------------------------------- GENETICS My father's in my fingers, but my mother's in my palms. I lift them up and look at them with pleasure - I know my parents made me by my hands. They may have been repelled to separate lands, in separate hemispheres, may sleep with other lovers, but in me they touch where fingers link to palms. With nothing left of their togetherness but friends who quarry for their image by a river, at least I know their marriage by my hands. I shape a chapel where a steeple stands. And when I turn it over, my father's by my fingers, my mother's by my palms demure before a priest reciting psalms. My body is their marriage register. I re-enact their wedding with my hands. So take me with you, take up the skin's demands for mirroring in bodies of the future. I'll bequeath my fingers, if you bequeath your palms. We know our parents make us by our hands. -- Sinead Morrissey Check out the Ireland GenWeb website at: http://www.irelandgenweb.com/

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: grizziesgirl Surnames: Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.scotland.wig.general/1032.4.1.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: A member of the Galway Preservation Society said that she and a friend had researched the question of Galway vs. Galloway and they found that the Galway Baptist Church records show the name as New Galloway until 1792 when the Town was formed and from then on the church records show it as Galway. She said the oral history says that the County Clerk was Irish and he changed it. This member of the Society and her friend never chose to go to the Clerk's office and research any further as they thought the Baptist Church records were truly written and they left it at that. Actually, there were only a few Irish people in the area whereas the majority of them were from Scotland. Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.