Iain There are quite a few references to Lady's Loch in my Murray's work alone. Thought you may be interested to read the following: 1-084 ALEXANDER MURRAY married JANET GORDON [15/11/1818-c1885] [1822-25/11/1881] Alexander, a slater, is the son of Angus Murray and Grisel Mackay - see 1-158. He married Janet, daughter of David Gordon, Free Church elder, and Helen Sutherland, on 6 February 1846 in Clyne (SCR). The Old Parish Record tells that Alexander lived at Rhalan and Janet at Ardchu at the time of their marriage. They had the following children, born at Ardchue, Clyne (IGI): ANGUS, born 9 December 1846 [died 5 April 1881] (DC/NC51-81); ALEXANDER, born 11 May 1848 [died 20 January 1864] (NC51/61/DC); his twin DAVID, [died 25 January 1864] (NC51/61/DC); HECTOR, born 9 February 1850 (NC51-71); GEORGINA LAWSON, born 4 March 1852 Lady's Loch (OPR/NC61/81/91); WILLIAMINA GORDON, born 7 April 1854 Achue (OPR/NC61/71); ROBERT GORDON, born 23 March 1857 (NC61-91); ANN, born 22 May 1859 (NC61-81); ANDREW, born 10 June 1861 (NC71/81); JAMES, born 25 July 1863 (NC71/81) and DAVID ALEXANDER, born 23 August 1864 (NC71-91). Alexander was recorded as a slater. The 1851 and 1861 census records show Alexander and Janet at Ardochy. The twins, Alexander and David died from diptheria in 1864. In 1871 [now written Ardchu] his sons are shown as slater and builders labourers. In 1871 Georgina was working as a domestic servant in the Grant home at Shoemaker Street, Clyne. Written Ardacha in 1881 - the house had five rooms. Two of his sons were coalminers and Angus was an unemployed slater. Angus died, aged 34 years, in 1881 at Ardchu. His death certificate tells that he was a slater, journeyman and a bachelor. Living with the family was a grandaughter, JOHANNA MURRAY, aged 1 year. In 1891 (now Ardachue) Alexander and Janet had passed away and their son Robert had taken over as head of the household. His sister Georgina was housekeeping; David was a labourer in the brick and tile works and an 11 year old niece Hannah Sutherland lived with them. 2-071 CHRISTY MURRAY married JOHN MACKAY [c1803-22/1/1872] [1799-1/8/1870] Christy is a daughter of Donald Murray and Elizabeth Ross - see 2-129D. She and John, son of Alexander Mackay and Janet McLeod (DC), had the following children (MACKAY), born in Clyne (IGI): Elizabeth, born circa 1830 [died 11 October 1863 East Clyne] [married John Mackay, carpenter] (DC); Marion, born 18 September 1838 Lady's Loch (OPR); Jessie, born c1840 (DC); Williamina, born 24 October 1841 Badnellan (OPR) and George Loch, born 28 January 1844 North Brora (OPR). Christy died, a widow, at Badnellan. 2-074 CHRISTINA MURRAY married JOHN McKENZIE [1805- 12/9/1839] Christina of East Brora and John of Lady's Loch married on 5 January 1833 in Clyne (OPR). Christina died on 12 September 1839 aged 34 years. A few months earlier she had given birth to a daughter: Lexina MACKENZIE, born 14 May 1839 North Brora (OPR). She is buried in Clyne where her gravestone, which was erected by her husband, tells that they lived at North Brora (GY53/233). 2-136 DONALD MURRAY married ISABELLA GRANT [9/3/1841-2/1/1910] [c1850-9/7/1938] Donald was born in Rogart son of Angus Murray and Marion McIntosh - see 1-174 (MC). He married Isabella on 8 April 1875 at the Royal Hotel, Inverness. Donald was then a gamekeeper of Dunrobin Mains, Golspie. Isabella, aged 24, of Drumnadrochit, Inverness-shire, was the daughter of Lewis Grant, farmer and Mary Fraser. Isabella had two sisters and a brother born in Duthill, Rothiemurchus, Morayshire - she may have been born in the same place. Donald and his wife, Isabella, lived in Clyne. They had the following children: MARION, born 7 January 1876 [died 11 May 1964] (NC81/BC); LEWIS, born circa 1877 [died 3 May 1877]: MARY ANN, born circa 1878 [died 2 June 1935 Poles, Dornoch] (NT/NC81/91); JANET (Jessie), born February 1881 [died 9 July 1969] (NC81/91/GY); MABEL, born circa 1883 [died 19 February 1964 Yorkshire] (NC91/GY); ANGUS, born circa 1885 [died 13 April 1898] (NC91); ELIZABETH JANE, born 21 July 1886 (BC); WILLIAM GRANT born circa 1890 [died 16 April 1918 France -killed in action] (NC91); LOUISA ELSPETH, born 2 July 1891 Clyne [died 25 April 1983 Inverness] [married William Gray of Nigg on 8 December 1922 at Tain] (BC/DC/MC) and ALEXANDER, born circa 1895 [killed in action Tuesday, 8 June 1915 France - 1/5 Seaforth Highlanders]. The 1881 census shows the family living in an eight-roomed house at Corryveil, Clyne, where Donald was a gamekeeper. In 1891 they were at Ben Armine, Clyne, in an eleven-roomed house. Sometime between this and Donald's death in 1910 the family moved to Poles, Dornoch, where he was recorded as a farmer. In 1891 a Marion Murray, born circa 1872 in Clyne, was at Lady's Loch, Clyne, a dressmaker with Alexa McKenzie. This Marion? Second Lieutenant William Grant Murray, 7th Battalion Seaforth Highlanders, was killed on Tuesday, 16th April 1918. He is remembered with honour on the Tyne cot Memorial, Zonnebeke, West-Vlaandreren, Belgium. Donald and Isabella are buried in Golspie (GY291/82). (editor's note: Donald Murray's death certificate states that he is the son of Angus Murray and Marion Matheson but it is believed that he is the son of Angus Murray and Marion McIntosh of Achnagarrin, Rogart - see 1-174. Donald's marriage certificate bears this out - on 8 April 1875 at the Royal Hotel, Inverness - Donald Murray, aged 32, gamekeeper, bachelor, Dunrobin Mains, Golspie, father Angus Murray, farmer, mother Marion Murray, maiden surname Mcintosh.) (2/01) T2 2-204A ELIZABETH MURRAY married WILLIAM SUTHERLAND [born circa 1820] Elizabeth (Elspet) and William, shoemaker of Lady's Loch, Clyne, had the following children (SUTHERLAND): Janet, born 15 February 1850 Clyne (OPR) and James, born 5 December 1851 Clyne (OPR). 3-192 ISABELLA MURRAY married WILLIAM SUTHERLAND [1824-27/8/1919] [1825-10/4/1857] Isabella of East Brora is the daughter of James Murray and Ann Gunn - see 4-008. William of Lady's Loch, Clyne, is the son of Alexander Sutherland and Margaret Sutherland. Isabella and William married on 18 September 1846 in Clyne (OPR). They are buried in Helmsdale (GY49/126). They had the following children (SUTHERLAND) born in Clyne: Alexander, born 12 December 1846 [married secondly to Williamina Gunn - see note below] (IGI94/MC); Anne, born 26 July 1848 (IGI94); Dora Jane, born 5 January 1854 (OPR) and Margaret, born 24 March 1856 (IGI94). Dora Jane was baptised by Reverend John McDonald privately before William Sutherland and Alexander Sutherland, witnesses. Alexander Sutherland, son of Isabella and William, married secondly to Williamina Gunn, daughter of John Gunn and Williamina Murray - see 6-173/1. Alexander was shown as a widower on this marriage certificate. He married Williamina on 29 October 1897 in Clyne. He was, at that time, a Master Shoemaker. He and Williamina had a son: William Alexander SUTHERLAND, born circa 1901 [married on 31 December 1926 in Glasgow to Rebecca Fenwick, daughter of John Allan Fenwich, music teacher, and his wife Catherine Arrow] (MC). As always if anyone can add or correct anything above be delighted to hear from you. Christine Highland Hearts http://www.highlandhearts.com/ -----Original Message----- From: Iain Sutherland [mailto:iain_sutherland@totalise.co.uk] Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 7:19 PM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: interests I always understood that Lady's Loch was a wee place has anybody any idea how many families lived there? In 1859 when John Sutherland aged 47 married Jessie Bannerman both lived at Lady's Loch. John's parents John Sutherland and Henrietta (McKay ) lived at Lady's Loch also.No relationship between the 2 Sutherland families is known but I have a Death Certificate 1867 for Margaret McBeath at Doll the daughter of Isabella Ross m.s. Sutherland Regards Iain ----- Original Message ----- From: Isabella McGregor <isabella@mcgregori.fsnet.co.uk> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 8:57 AM Subject: Re: interests > > I have a William Sutherland b.c. 1824 who was a shoemaker and lived in Ladys > Loch. > His parents were Alexander Sutherland and Margaret Sutherland. > He married 18-9-1846 Isabella Murray daughter of James Murray and Ann Gunn > who fit into my tree. > William died in 1857 and I have five children for him > Alex. , Ann, James, Dora Jane(Dorothy) and Margaret. > > If you think there is any connection, get back to me. > But there were other families of Sutherland in Ladys Loch. > > Isabella. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Iain Sutherland" <iain_sutherland@totalise.co.uk> > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2001 8:56 PM > Subject: interests > > > > My parents married in Inverness Castle in 1939 and were the descendants of > good Highland Stock. I am seeking information on Sutherlands who have a > continuity in Brora from the early 1800,s starting at Ladies Loch, Gower > Street and Moray Terrace where sadly my 90 year old Auntie died on 3rd. > July. My McBeath ancestors were in Reisk in 1798 and Achnagarrin Rogart in > 1881 then to Inchomnie Rogart. My Robertsons came from it appears the > attentions of the Estate Factor at Erchless Estates to a Chisholm sister of > a local Catholic Farmer and my Grandfather lived at Lochside Rogart. I have > Maclennans of Contin then Kerrow .Scotts appear in Cannich. My Reid ancestor > married a Swanson at Loth in 1840 and my Dads Uncle who liked a wee dram > put his Fathers first wifes parents (and initially name) on his own Mothers > Death Certificate. I enjoy this list immensly and have learned a lot from it > but one thing sticks in my mind more than any other You can,t ask folk > about your Ancestors whe! > > n they,ve gone ! ask now before it,s too late. Thank you all and > particularly Christine Iain > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > ============================== > > Search over 1 Billion names at Ancestry.com! > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/rwlist1.asp > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > ============================== > Create a FREE family website at MyFamily.com! > http://www.myfamily.com/banner.asp?ID=RWLIST2 > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. 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Thanks I also have Christina SUTHERLAND marrying James McBEATH at Bona Free Church in 1871 she died in 1874 and was the Daughter of William SUTHERLAND and CHRISTINA SUTHERLAND m.s. MURRAY in 1871 living at Knockarthur Iain ----- Original Message ----- From: Christine Stokes <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 7:58 PM Subject: RE: interests - Lady's Loch > Iain > There are quite a few references to Lady's Loch in my Murray's work alone. > Thought you may be interested to read the following: > > 1-084 ALEXANDER MURRAY married JANET GORDON > [15/11/1818-c1885] [1822-25/11/1881] > Alexander, a slater, is the son of Angus Murray and Grisel Mackay - see > 1-158. He married Janet, daughter of David Gordon, Free Church elder, and > Helen Sutherland, on 6 February 1846 in Clyne (SCR). The Old Parish Record > tells that Alexander lived at Rhalan and Janet at Ardchu at the time of > their marriage. They had the following children, born at Ardchue, Clyne > (IGI): ANGUS, born 9 December 1846 [died 5 April 1881] (DC/NC51-81); > ALEXANDER, born 11 May 1848 [died 20 January 1864] (NC51/61/DC); his twin > DAVID, [died 25 January 1864] (NC51/61/DC); HECTOR, born 9 February 1850 > (NC51-71); GEORGINA LAWSON, born 4 March 1852 Lady's Loch (OPR/NC61/81/91); > WILLIAMINA GORDON, born 7 April 1854 Achue (OPR/NC61/71); ROBERT GORDON, > born 23 March 1857 (NC61-91); ANN, born 22 May 1859 (NC61-81); ANDREW, born > 10 June 1861 (NC71/81); JAMES, born 25 July 1863 (NC71/81) and DAVID > ALEXANDER, born 23 August 1864 (NC71-91). Alexander was recorded as a > slater. The 1851 and 1861 census records show Alexander and Janet at > Ardochy. The twins, Alexander and David died from diptheria in 1864. In > 1871 [now written Ardchu] his sons are shown as slater and builders > labourers. In 1871 Georgina was working as a domestic servant in the Grant > home at Shoemaker Street, Clyne. Written Ardacha in 1881 - the house had > five rooms. Two of his sons were coalminers and Angus was an unemployed > slater. Angus died, aged 34 years, in 1881 at Ardchu. His death certificate > tells that he was a slater, journeyman and a bachelor. Living with the > family was a grandaughter, JOHANNA MURRAY, aged 1 year. In 1891 (now > Ardachue) Alexander and Janet had passed away and their son Robert had taken > over as head of the household. His sister Georgina was housekeeping; David > was a labourer in the brick and tile works and an 11 year old niece Hannah > Sutherland lived with them. > > 2-071 CHRISTY MURRAY married JOHN MACKAY > [c1803-22/1/1872] [1799-1/8/1870] > Christy is a daughter of Donald Murray and Elizabeth Ross - see 2-129D. She > and John, son of Alexander Mackay and Janet McLeod (DC), had the following > children (MACKAY), born in Clyne (IGI): Elizabeth, born circa 1830 [died 11 > October 1863 East Clyne] [married John Mackay, carpenter] (DC); Marion, born > 18 September 1838 Lady's Loch (OPR); Jessie, born c1840 (DC); Williamina, > born 24 October 1841 Badnellan (OPR) and George Loch, born 28 January 1844 > North Brora (OPR). Christy died, a widow, at Badnellan. > > 2-074 CHRISTINA MURRAY married JOHN McKENZIE > [1805- 12/9/1839] > Christina of East Brora and John of Lady's Loch married on 5 January 1833 in > Clyne (OPR). Christina died on 12 September 1839 aged 34 years. A few months > earlier she had given birth to a daughter: Lexina MACKENZIE, born 14 May > 1839 North Brora (OPR). She is buried in Clyne where her gravestone, which > was erected by her husband, tells that they lived at North Brora (GY53/233). > > 2-136 DONALD MURRAY married ISABELLA GRANT > [9/3/1841-2/1/1910] [c1850-9/7/1938] > Donald was born in Rogart son of Angus Murray and Marion McIntosh - see > 1-174 (MC). He married Isabella on 8 April 1875 at the Royal Hotel, > Inverness. Donald was then a gamekeeper of Dunrobin Mains, Golspie. > Isabella, aged 24, of Drumnadrochit, Inverness-shire, was the daughter of > Lewis Grant, farmer and Mary Fraser. Isabella had two sisters and a brother > born in Duthill, Rothiemurchus, Morayshire - she may have been born in the > same place. Donald and his wife, Isabella, lived in Clyne. They had the > following children: MARION, born 7 January 1876 [died 11 May 1964] > (NC81/BC); LEWIS, born circa 1877 [died 3 May 1877]: MARY ANN, born circa > 1878 [died 2 June 1935 Poles, Dornoch] (NT/NC81/91); JANET (Jessie), born > February 1881 [died 9 July 1969] (NC81/91/GY); MABEL, born circa 1883 [died > 19 February 1964 Yorkshire] (NC91/GY); ANGUS, born circa 1885 [died 13 April > 1898] (NC91); ELIZABETH JANE, born 21 July 1886 (BC); WILLIAM GRANT born > circa 1890 [died 16 April 1918 France -killed in action] (NC91); LOUISA > ELSPETH, born 2 July 1891 Clyne [died 25 April 1983 Inverness] [married > William Gray of Nigg on 8 December 1922 at Tain] (BC/DC/MC) and ALEXANDER, > born circa 1895 [killed in action Tuesday, 8 June 1915 France - 1/5 Seaforth > Highlanders]. The 1881 census shows the family living in an eight-roomed > house at Corryveil, Clyne, where Donald was a gamekeeper. In 1891 they were > at Ben Armine, Clyne, in an eleven-roomed house. Sometime between this and > Donald's death in 1910 the family moved to Poles, Dornoch, where he was > recorded as a farmer. In 1891 a Marion Murray, born circa 1872 in Clyne, was > at Lady's Loch, Clyne, a dressmaker with Alexa McKenzie. This Marion? > Second Lieutenant William Grant Murray, 7th Battalion Seaforth Highlanders, > was killed on Tuesday, 16th April 1918. He is remembered with honour on the > Tyne cot Memorial, Zonnebeke, West-Vlaandreren, Belgium. Donald and Isabella > are buried in Golspie (GY291/82). (editor's note: Donald Murray's death > certificate states that he is the son of Angus Murray and Marion Matheson > but it is believed that he is the son of Angus Murray and Marion McIntosh of > Achnagarrin, Rogart - see 1-174. Donald's marriage certificate bears this > out - on 8 April 1875 at the Royal Hotel, Inverness - Donald Murray, aged > 32, gamekeeper, bachelor, Dunrobin Mains, Golspie, father Angus Murray, > farmer, mother Marion Murray, maiden surname Mcintosh.) (2/01) T2 > > 2-204A ELIZABETH MURRAY married WILLIAM SUTHERLAND > [born circa 1820] > Elizabeth (Elspet) and William, shoemaker of Lady's Loch, Clyne, had the > following children (SUTHERLAND): Janet, born 15 February 1850 Clyne (OPR) > and James, born 5 December 1851 Clyne (OPR). > > 3-192 ISABELLA MURRAY married WILLIAM SUTHERLAND > [1824-27/8/1919] [1825-10/4/1857] > Isabella of East Brora is the daughter of James Murray and Ann Gunn - see > 4-008. William of Lady's Loch, Clyne, is the son of Alexander Sutherland > and Margaret Sutherland. Isabella and William married on 18 September 1846 > in Clyne (OPR). They are buried in Helmsdale (GY49/126). They had the > following children (SUTHERLAND) born in Clyne: Alexander, born 12 December > 1846 [married secondly to Williamina Gunn - see note below] (IGI94/MC); > Anne, born 26 July 1848 (IGI94); Dora Jane, born 5 January 1854 (OPR) and > Margaret, born 24 March 1856 (IGI94). Dora Jane was baptised by Reverend > John McDonald privately before William Sutherland and Alexander Sutherland, > witnesses. Alexander Sutherland, son of Isabella and William, married > secondly to Williamina Gunn, daughter of John Gunn and Williamina Murray - > see 6-173/1. Alexander was shown as a widower on this marriage certificate. > He married Williamina on 29 October 1897 in Clyne. He was, at that time, a > Master Shoemaker. He and Williamina had a son: William Alexander > SUTHERLAND, born circa 1901 [married on 31 December 1926 in Glasgow to > Rebecca Fenwick, daughter of John Allan Fenwich, music teacher, and his wife > Catherine Arrow] (MC). > > As always if anyone can add or correct anything above be delighted to hear > from you. > > Christine > Highland Hearts > http://www.highlandhearts.com/ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Iain Sutherland [mailto:iain_sutherland@totalise.co.uk] > Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 7:19 PM > To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: interests > > I always understood that Lady's Loch was a wee place has anybody any idea > how many families lived there? In 1859 when John Sutherland aged 47 married > Jessie Bannerman both lived at Lady's Loch. John's parents John Sutherland > and Henrietta (McKay ) lived at Lady's Loch also.No relationship between the > 2 Sutherland families is known but I have a Death Certificate 1867 for > Margaret McBeath at Doll the daughter of Isabella Ross m.s. Sutherland > > Regards Iain > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Isabella McGregor <isabella@mcgregori.fsnet.co.uk> > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2001 8:57 AM > Subject: Re: interests > > > > > > I have a William Sutherland b.c. 1824 who was a shoemaker and lived in > Ladys > > Loch. > > His parents were Alexander Sutherland and Margaret Sutherland. > > He married 18-9-1846 Isabella Murray daughter of James Murray and Ann Gunn > > who fit into my tree. > > William died in 1857 and I have five children for him > > Alex. , Ann, James, Dora Jane(Dorothy) and Margaret. > > > > If you think there is any connection, get back to me. > > But there were other families of Sutherland in Ladys Loch. > > > > Isabella. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Iain Sutherland" <iain_sutherland@totalise.co.uk> > > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2001 8:56 PM > > Subject: interests > > > > > > > My parents married in Inverness Castle in 1939 and were the descendants > of > > good Highland Stock. I am seeking information on Sutherlands who have a > > continuity in Brora from the early 1800,s starting at Ladies Loch, Gower > > Street and Moray Terrace where sadly my 90 year old Auntie died on 3rd. > > July. My McBeath ancestors were in Reisk in 1798 and Achnagarrin Rogart in > > 1881 then to Inchomnie Rogart. My Robertsons came from it appears the > > attentions of the Estate Factor at Erchless Estates to a Chisholm sister > of > > a local Catholic Farmer and my Grandfather lived at Lochside Rogart. I > have > > Maclennans of Contin then Kerrow .Scotts appear in Cannich. My Reid > ancestor > > married a Swanson at Loth in 1840 and my Dads Uncle who liked a wee dram > > put his Fathers first wifes parents (and initially name) on his own > Mothers > > Death Certificate. I enjoy this list immensly and have learned a lot from > it > > but one thing sticks in my mind more than any other You can,t ask folk > > about your Ancestors whe! > > > n they,ve gone ! ask now before it,s too late. Thank you all and > > particularly Christine Iain > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. > You > > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > > > ============================== > > > Search over 1 Billion names at Ancestry.com! > > > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/rwlist1.asp > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > ============================== > > Create a FREE family website at MyFamily.com! > > http://www.myfamily.com/banner.asp?ID=RWLIST2 > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > ============================== > Create a FREE family website at MyFamily.com! > http://www.myfamily.com/banner.asp?ID=RWLIST2 > > > --- > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.263 / Virus Database: 135 - Release Date: 6/22/01 > > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.263 / Virus Database: 135 - Release Date: 6/22/01 > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > ============================== > Shop Ancestry - Everything you need to Discover, Preserve & Celebrate > your heritage! > http://shop.myfamily.com/ancestrycatalog > >