Hello Dario and welcome to the list Your first posting was most interesting and I am intrigued by your suggestion of murder! I have been researching families in Sutherland for many years and it has always struck me as strange the number of people who apparently died without reason - I have instances of death certificates which contain as the reason for death "unknown". Folks would never get away with it nowadays. Malcolm is in Sutherland right now but I think he is due back soon. No doubt he will contact you with his sources. I wonder if it would be worthwhile trying to find a police record of this event - possibly in the Highland Archives at Inverness? I contacted the Police Archives at Dundee while searching for information on one of my Murray family and the help they gave was first class. Even told me what my man was wearing on the day! I have quite a bit of information in my "Murray Families of Sutherland" relating to Benjamin Leslie and his marriage into the Murrays. I post it here for interest. 5-012 LOUISA MURRAY married BENJAMIN LESLIE [28/10/1836-18/5/1921] [8/11/1832-25/1/1870] Louisa was born at East Brora, daughter of James Murray and Ann Gunn - see 4-008. Benjamin is the son of George Leslie and Christina Munro. Louisa and Benjamin married on 8 November 1861 in Clyne (IGI). They had the following children (LESLIE): Christina, born 26 August 1862 Ridorrach Lodge, Loch Broom [married William Murray - see 6-119A] (GY); Andrew Murray, born 5 April 1864 Ridorrach Lodge [died 20 February 1892 at 13 Bruntsfield Place, Edinburgh - bachelor, assistant warehouseman - death certificate signed by aunt Hughina Murray] (GY); George, born 24 February 1867 Ridorrach Lodge [married Margaret Wilson in 1890 Dundee - had daughter Louisa born 1890 in Golspie (BC)] (MC) and Benjamin, born circa 1870 [married Margaret Lyall Murray - see 5-032A]. Benjamin Leslie was a servant to the Duke of Sutherland. He moved from Dunrobin to look after Rhidooroch Lodge in Lochbroom around 1861. Rhidooroch was on the Cromartie estate which at that period was amalgamated with th Sutherland estate through the marriage of the Duke to the Mackenzie heiress. Benjamin's death ws reported in the Newspapers (Inverness Advertiser 1 February 1870). He died aged about 37 when walking back through the hills from Strath Oykel. The body was found about one and a half miles from his house. He probably died of exposure. His son Benjamin was born soon after. In 1891 Louisa was in East Brora where she was a Boarding House Keeper. Louisa died in Brora. Benjamin senior had died at Rhidarroch, Ullapool. They are buried in Golspie (GY268/30). 4-008 JAMES MURRAY married ANN GUNN [1783-12/2/1888] [11/8/1798-4/11/1879] James, a collier at Brochroby, Clyne, is the son of Andrew Murray and Christy Bruce - see 1-128 (DC). Ann was born in Golspie, daughter of Hugh Gunn and Jane McLeod (DC). James and Ann of Rogart married on 26 December 1820 in Clyne (SCR). The 1841 census shows them farming at East Brora. They had the following children, born in Brora (OPR): CHRISTIAN [Christy], born 11 October 1821[died 13 January 1903] [married Donald Baillie - see 2-057] (NC41); ISABELLA, born circa 1823 [died 27 August 1919] [married William Sutherland - see 3-192] (NC41); JANE [Jean], born 1 April 1826 [died 13 February 1904] [married Alexander McKay and Grant Murray - see 3-095] (NC41); JANET [Jessie], born 2 February 1829 [died 11 September 1908 East Brora - laundry maid and crofter - death certificate signed by her grandnephew, Alexander Sutherland] (NC41/61); twins ANN 19 April 1831[died 3 August 1903] [married Donald Gilchrist - see 1-184] (GY/NC41) and HUGH, born 19 April 1831 [died 15 March 1833] (GY); twins ANDREW, born 26 February 1834 [died 8 December 1858] (GY/NC41/51) and WILLIAMINA, born 26 February 1834 [died 5 April 1919 East Brora, spinster, crofter - death certificate signed by Andrew Murray, grandnephew] (NC41-61/DC); LOUISA [Lucy], born 28 October 1836 [died 18 May 1921] [married Benjamin Leslie - see 5-012] (NC41/51) and HUGHINA, born 21 September 1843 [died 31 August 1932 East Brora, spinster, retired housekeeper] (NC51/61). In 1851 the family were at North Brora where James was described as a lotter. An Ann Murray, born 1831 in Clyne, in 1851 as a house servant in the Grant home in Brora village. In 1861 the family were in Brora with their daughter Williamina, spinster and domestic servant. In 1871 the family included two grandchildren: Dorothy Sutherland, 17 years old and Williamina Gunn, aged 9 years. Williamina Gunn or Murray was born in Clyne on 9 July 1861 the daughter of Williamina Murray and John Gunn (IGI94). Young Williamina later married her cousin Alexander Sutherland, son of her aunt Isabella. The 1881 census shows James crofting at East Brora, aged 82 years. The five-roomed house was also home to his daughter Janet, aged 54 years, a laundress; Williamina, housekeeper and Williamina Gunn, grandaughter. Also with the family was James's great grandson, Alexander Sutherland, aged three years. Hughina Murray was working as a cook domestic servant in Edinburgh where she was recorded at 29 Walker Street in 1881. James died in 1888 and was buried with his wife in Clyne. In 1891 Janet was head of the household and a crofter. Her sister, Williamina was a laundrymaid and Williamina Gunn and young Alexander Sutherland continued to live on the croft (GY47/77). If you can add anything, or if you would like to see the further references mentioned above please email me direct. Best wishes Christine Highland Hearts http://www.highlandhearts.com/ -----Original Message----- From: Dario Leslie [mailto:darioleslie@hotmail.com] Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2001 3:21 PM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: SUT: LESLIEs of Backies (and Rhidorroch) This is my first post to the list. It is quite long and complicated. Apologies for that and any lapses of etiquette. By way of introduction. My name is Dario LESLIE and as my surname suggests I have Scottish ancestors. I was born in London and still live in southern England, but both my father and grandmother were LESLIEs brought up in Brora in Sutherland where the family home was. Unusually, the LESLIE surname was passed down through the maternal line in the case of my grandmother who reverted to her maiden name by deed poll when she was widowed at the age of twenty-three. I have recently begun tracing my family history and so was delighted to find the thread on the LESLIE family of Backies in the Feb 2001 mailing list as this clearly refers to my family. I thought I would post to share and seek additional information. Taking Benjamin LESLIE first. Benjamin LESLIE was my great great grandfather and was born in Golspie in 1832 the son of George LESLIE of Backies. He died in Rhidorroch in 1870 and is buried in the graveyard of St Andrew's church Golspie along with other LESLIEs (of which more later). Our family oral tradition regarding Benjamin is interesting: it says that he was a factor at Rhidorroch where he died not of natural causes, but murder. Apparently he was shot by poachers. I was told this by my grandmother (his granddaughter) Bertha. Although Bertha would not have known Benjamin, she would have just known his wife Louisa who died when Bertha was seven. The story must have been passed down from Louisa as she lived to be 85, dying in 1921 in Brora (just a few miles from Golspie), and would have had plenty of time to tell her children and grandchildren about Benjamin. In May 2001 I travelled to Brora with my family to inter Bertha's remains, and stayed for a week during which I tried to verify the oral history of the family. Much of it was accurate, but I was unable to confirm the murder tale. However, the Dingwall registrar considered Benjamin's death record to be unusual as it was registered by the procurator fiscal, and his parent's names are not recorded. The cause of death is given as apoplexy. These records and the information in Malcolm Bangor-Jones' posts in February leave a little room in my mind to suspect that Benjamin's death may have been unusual. I wonder if he may have been shot at and was either injured or just shocked enough to die subsequently. I have also wondered if there are any reasons why the murder might have been hushed up. I would welcome any comments and additional information. I would be interested to know if Malcolm Bangor-Jones has found any other information about Benjamin since his post in February, and would be grateful if he could tell me how I can get copies of the sources he cites in that post. I would also be grateful if Isabella McGregor can post any additional information on Benjamin's children. My own line, which I know quite well, runs through his posthumous son Benjamin. Moving on to the other LESLIES of Backies. I was very interested in Sheryl Sharp's family history - we are clearly very distant cousins both in terms of relationship and geography! My own research confirms much of Sherl's history, but I have been unable to conclusively demonstrate that George LESLIE born 1754 was the same George LESLIE who married Christina MCPHERSON in 1796. My concern is that generation times seem to be about 20 years back then rather than the 40 plus years in this case. The records from Golspie for this period seem to be very patchy and don't help much. Furthermore, I am having trouble tying in the records for this period with the stones in the local graveyard. In the graveyard of St Andrew's Church Golspie, I found a cluster of LESLIE graves including a well preserved standing stone for Benjamin LESLIE of Rhiddoroch fame, and another for George LESLIE born 1797, who was the son of George LESLIE and Christina MCPHERSON. There is no stone which can obviously be attributed to George LESLIE and Christina MCPHERSON. However, there is a pair of older flat stones roughly ascribed to George LESLEY and Elen MACLEOD. I note that there is a record of a Helen MCLEOD being born in Golspie in 1756 and so I wonder whether she was the spouse of George born 1754, and that the paired flat stones are their graves. One of the flat stones has a rough date inscription which could be 1751 but is more accurately represented in type as / 7 5 ) but there is no indication of what the date refers to. As a point of interest there was an even older flat stone inscribed Gorg LESLY nearby. Maybe the marriage to Christina MCPHERSON was George LESLIE's second marriage. Maybe he first married Helen MCLEOD who bore him no children. She died or they parted, and he then married Christina MCPHERSON in his later years. The other possibility, which would tidy up the generation times, is that there is an extra generation not recorded in the Golspie records. George LESLIE born 1754 could have had a son (named George) in the 1770s who married Christina in 1796. I have found no hard documentary evidence to support either possibility. The only incidental evidence I can find is that in Margaret Wilson Grant's book "Golpsie's Story" the list of Golspie parish men liable for military service in 1810 does not include George LESLIE. Eligibility for this list depends on being aged between 18 and 45 years. If George had been born in 1754 then he would indeed have been too old. If there were an additional generation in the 1770s then that George would have been eligible. I would be interested to know what Sheryl's sources are, and whether anyone can help help to confirm this period of the LESLIE family. Aside from all that, my own research indicates that George LESLIE b. 30-4-1754 was the son of another George LESLIE of Golspie. No spouse is given for the elder George, but Golspie records show the birth of the following other children to George LESLIE (spouse unnamed) at this time: George b. 21-12-1740 Donald b. 15-5-1743 Florence b. 26-7-1745 John b. 24-7-1748 According to Margaret Wilson Grant's book "Golpsie's Story" the list of seat holders in Golspie Kirk in 1752 contains only one LESLIE: George LESLIE, tenant of Backies, so I suspect that all of the above children were siblings of George LESLIE born 1754. Well that's about all I have for now. Any comments or further info would be very welcome. Dario Leslie Wiltshire, England _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. 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Hi Christine, I have noticed that there appear to have been a number of GUNNs in the Sutherland area and that you have a GUNN connection. In your searches, have you ever come across a BRYSON-GUNN? The chap I am looking for would have been born around 1880 and by the 1930s was a G.P. practising in Manchester, England. I don't know his first name. BW Brenda the.triggersons@sympatico.ca Researching: MACLENNAN, MACKAY, MACLEAN, MACRAE, MUNRO, MATHESON, HOSSACK & MACKENZIE all in the Highlands.

Trying to catch up with my huge pile of mail today. I have looked at everything I have and find no reference to Bryson-Gunn. Sorry Christine Highland Hearts http://www.highlandhearts.com/ -----Original Message----- From: The Triggersons [mailto:the.triggersons@sympatico.ca] Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2001 1:33 PM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: BRYSON-GUNN Hi Christine, I have noticed that there appear to have been a number of GUNNs in the Sutherland area and that you have a GUNN connection. In your searches, have you ever come across a BRYSON-GUNN? The chap I am looking for would have been born around 1880 and by the 1930s was a G.P. practising in Manchester, England. I don't know his first name. BW Brenda the.triggersons@sympatico.ca Researching: MACLENNAN, MACKAY, MACLEAN, MACRAE, MUNRO, MATHESON, HOSSACK & MACKENZIE all in the Highlands. ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ ============================== Shop Ancestry - Everything you need to Discover, Preserve & Celebrate your heritage! http://shop.myfamily.com/ancestrycatalog --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.255 / Virus Database: 128 - Release Date: 5/17/01 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.255 / Virus Database: 128 - Release Date: 5/17/01