Liz Far, far more logical thinking than mine! Christine -----Original Message----- From: Liz Mason [mailto:liz@mason.ca] Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 12:26 AM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: SUT- 19th century parish populations The drop in population might not seem so much but if you compare it with a community of any size elsewhere in Britain, the 19th century saw an enormous %increase in the population as families were huge and infant and adult mortality rates were improved as hygiene and diet changed for the better. Some of these improvements would not have been so noticable up in an area like Rogart but instead of saying " the population dropped by 40% in 80 years" it would probably be more accurate to say" the population would have been 5 times higher by 1881 than in 1801 had it not been for the Clearances" . Of course people probably would have moved away South for better employment prospects anyway because of the fact that they couldn't buy their own land and had to put up with the nasty landlords. I have always wondered why my lot managed to stay put when so many were thrown out, but those statistics put it all in perspective.. in fact you had a fairly good chance of remaining provided you didn't annoy the folk in charge. Which is perhaps why my G-G-grandfather called one of his sons after the agent William Young just to keep on his good side. By the way Christine did you say something about the site being too quiet? Don't do that again!! Liz ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ ============================== Join the RootsWeb WorldConnect Project: Linking the world, one GEDCOM at a time. http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01

Ian, any Gordon's or Mackay's amongst your ancestors in Kerrow? Christine -----Original Message----- From: Iain Sutherland [mailto:iain_sutherland@totalise.co.uk] Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 8:34 PM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: Zorra There is a Kerrow a couple of miles from Cannich in Strathglass I had ancestors there in 1884 married Hugh Robertson Iain ----- Original Message ----- From: Lynn Munro <ornum@execulink.com> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:12 PM Subject: Re: Zorra > Christine, > I do not know where Kerrow is. I have some information passed on to me from > the historian of Clan MacKay W. Alex MacKay in which he stated the > following" My research into the Rogart MacKays has been superficial to-date, > but I can find no record of George and his wife residing in Rhilochan in > Rogart Parish. As you said their six children were born in Rogart between > 1796 and 1806. But they were all born in the township of Kerrow." He goes on > to say " The tenants in Rhilochan at that time were MacKays, a John and his > wife Christian Sutherland who had a son Angus there in 1797 and a son > William in 1799. In 1800 they were replaced by Murdoch and Kate MacKay. By > 1810 a George MacKay tenanted Rhilochan, but his wife was a Sibella McDonald > and between then and 1824 , they had four children Hector, Jane, John and > William. Could this be your George who remarried after Janet Gordon died and > at that time moved from Kerrow to Rhilochan? The reason why Janet Gordon's > first child was not born in Kerrow probably was that George and Janet > followed the usual Highland tradition where the birth of the first > grandchild takes place in the mother's parents home. Find William's > birthplace and perhaps you may find Janet's parents. Janet was a popular > Gordon name." Just thought you might be interested. Lynn > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Christine Stokes <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:33 AM > Subject: RE: Zorra > > > > Hi Lynn > > Langdale is in Strathnaver which is in Farr parish, in the north of the > > county. > > Blarich or Blairich is in Rogart parish. > > Both the IGI and the OPRs show children of Janet Gordon and George Mackay > > born in Rogart parish, probably at Rhelochan. Where is the Kerrow > township > > you mention? > > Both the Gordons of Langdale and the Munros of Blarich were from earlier > > 'substantial' families. > > The Munro family can trace back to Donald Balloch Mackay, born circa 1550, > > son of Iye Du Mackay. > > Bessie Munro was the daughter of Robert Munro of Blarich. Robert Munro's > > parents were Hugh Munro of Achany and Christian Mackay - so there are > plenty > > of Mackays in the family. > > The fact that your George's mother was said to be the wife of a blacksmith > > may well mean that Janet Gordon "married beneath" herself but in those > days, > > after the 1745, everything was changing anyway. Strathnaver would itself > be > > emptied only a few years later when the Clearances started to hit. > > Although William Gordon still styled himself 'of Langdale' I believe he > was > > living in Rogart when his children were born! > > I wish I knew more about this family because I am firmly of the opinion > that > > Barbara Gordon, my 4 x great grandmother, is also a daughter of William > > Gordon. I will keep on looking in the hope that one day it will all be > > solved. > > In the meantime any little snippets are most welcome!! > > Christine > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Lynn Munro [mailto:ornum@execulink.com] > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 6:47 PM > > To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: Zorra > > > > Christine, > > In answer to your question regarding Janet Gordon this is what I have. > Janet > > Gordon daughter of William Gordon of Langdale and Bessie Munro. Bessie's > > father was Robert Munro of Blarich. Can you tell me what or where is > > Langdale? I do not know where Janet and George Mackay's first son William > > was born. It has been suggested that if we find where he was born then we > > will be assured that Janet is in deed the daughter of William Gordon of > > Langdale. It has also been suggested that following highland tradition > Janet > > would have had her first child in the home of her parents which accounts > for > > why all the other children were listed as born in Kerrow township but > > William is not. Then maybe we can prove that Janet and Barbara were > sisters. > > Lynn > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Christine Stokes <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> > > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2001 3:58 AM > > Subject: Zorra > > > > > > > Hi again Lynn > > > Do you have any further information on Janet Gordon, wife of George > Mackay > > > of Rhelochan, Rogart? > > > I believe this Janet Gordon may be a sister of my 4 x great grandmother, > > > Barbara Gordon. > > > Any info would be helpful. > > > Many thanks > > > Best wishes > > > Christine > > > chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk > > > > > > Highland Hearts > > > http://www.highlandhearts.com/ > > > > > > > > > --- > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. > You > > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > > > ============================== > > > Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the #1 > > > Source for Family History Online. Go to: > > > http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You > > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > ============================== > > Visit Ancestry's Library - The best collection of family history > > learning and how-to articles on the Internet. > > http://www.ancestry.com/learn/library > > > > > > --- > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 > > > > --- > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. 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Rena you are magic! The Easter Kerrow you found is exactly where I wished it to be!! The ancestors in question were said to be at Rhelochan which is close to the area you just described. So yes, this most certainly could be the Kerrow I am looking for. You wrote about Robert Gordon or Alexander at Dalcharn and as I have been looking for more info on the Alexander at Balcharne I wondered could it be the same guy? ALEXANDER GORDON [1738-10/3/1816] married ISABELL SUTHERLAND [1743-12/12/1803] Alexander, Tacksman in Balcharne, is buried with his wife Isabell in Kildonan. A son: JOHN WILLIAM, erected the gravestone. Buried with them is: Isabella 1811-1895, a granddaughter? Thanks Christine -----Original Message----- From: Rena Singleton [mailto:rena@pathtech.org] Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 2:41 AM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Kerrow and Dalcharn There is/was an "Easter Kerrow" in the south-east of Rogart Parish. Easter Kerrow appears to be on (or very near) the River Brora. Scriberscross, in Clyne, looks to be directly north of it. Both are north of Knockarthur. Could this be Kerrow township? Dalcharn is/was located near the junction of the River Free and the River Helmsdale, north of Borrobol. Reisk is/was to the west of Dalcharn. I have not yet found a place called Balcharne. I'll keep looking. Can you give me a hint on where it might have been located? Rena ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ ============================== Shop Ancestry - Everything you need to Discover, Preserve & Celebrate your heritage! http://shop.myfamily.com/ancestrycatalog --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01

There is/was an "Easter Kerrow" in the south-east of Rogart Parish. Easter Kerrow appears to be on (or very near) the River Brora. Scriberscross, in Clyne, looks to be directly north of it. Both are north of Knockarthur. Could this be Kerrow township? Dalcharn is/was located near the junction of the River Free and the River Helmsdale, north of Borrobol. Reisk is/was to the west of Dalcharn. I have not yet found a place called Balcharne. I'll keep looking. Can you give me a hint on where it might have been located? Rena

Here is a site those on the list might like to check out http://www.ceantar.org/Dicts/ Ken

Rena Thanks for such a wonderful list. I have information on an Alexander Gordon in Balcharne (1738-1816). He married Isabell Sutherland and they are buried in Kildonan. Do you think there could be any chance that Balcharne and Dalcharn could be the same place? Does anybody know? This information from Rena would solve the problem of Robert Gordon's parentage if someone knows. Many thanks Christine -----Original Message----- From: Rena Singleton [mailto:rena@pathtech.org] Sent: Sunday, April 08, 2001 5:55 PM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Names in Kildonan Riots Good morning! In a previous message on the Kildonan Riots of 1813, I used my own notes and did not include all of those who were named in the "Minute for the Procurator fiscal". Since the list might help others researching their families in Sutherland, I am rectifying my omission. The information comes from Volume One of "Papers on Sutherland Estate Management", pages 135-142 but, where possible, I am using modern versions of the names (eg. I'll use Gunn for Gun). Named as witnesses: GORDON, ROBERT, in Reisk, son of ALEXANDER GORDON in Dalcharn, MACLEOD, GEORGE, in Kildonan, GUNN, ALEXANDER, in Kildonan, GUNN, DONALD, in Kildonan, (see note 1) GUNN, ROBERT, his son, (see note 2) SUTHERLAND, JOHN, in Kildonan, (see note 1) GUNN, ALEXANDER, in Kildonan, BANNERMAN alias McDAVY, JOHN, (see note 1) SUTHERLAND, DONALD, in Ulbster, SUTHERLAND, WILLIAM, "now in Balnavaliach formerly servant to Mr. SAGE in Kildonan", POLSON, GEORGE, in Grudseray, MELVILLE, JEAN, wife of DONALD MURRAY Dram seller in Suisgill, MACDONALD, GEORGE, in Dalvait, (see note 1) SUTHERLAND, JOHN, in Kenacoil (SEM gives Keanakyle), MACLEOD or MACKAY, INNES, in Auldbreakach, MACKAY, GEORGE, Catechist in Lirobol, SUTHERLAND, WILLIAM, in Balnavaliach, POLSON, DONALD, in Torrish, LESLIE, HUGH, Procurator fiscal, signed the Minute on 13 Jan. 1813. MACKID, ROBERT, the Sheriff substitute, on 27 Jan 1813, granted warrants to "search for seize" in order to compel the witnesses to appear at the Golspie Inn. BANNERMAN, DONALD, was the Sheriff Officer who was required to execute the warrants. MATHESON, JOHN, was Sheriff Officer at Kintraidwell. GRAY, ROBERT, was a Sheriff Officer "in the neighbourhood of Helmsdale", MATHESON and GRAY accompanied BANNERMAN on the trip to deliver the warrants. TURNBULL, JOHN, shepherd to Mr. HOUSTON, was summoned during the trip. His house is described as being at Suisgill. HOUSTON, THOMAS, was the tenant of Suisgill Sheep Farm. REID, GABRIEL, of Armadale, was the tenant of the new Kilcalmkill sheep farm. He and his (male) companion on the night (5 Jan. 1813) before the riot had stayed with Turnbull's family. The companion's name is given only as HALL. Named in JEAN MELVILLE'S testimony as being among the rioters on the morning of 6 Jan. 1813 were: GUNN, ROBERT, son of DONALD GUNN in Kildonan, MATHESON, ALEXANDER, in Auldbreakach. MCLEOD, WILLIAM, in Eldrable, POLSON, WILLIAM or JOHN, son of JOHN POLSON in Torrish. Among the officials at the Golspie Inn on 10 Feb. 1813, the day of the second riot were: SELLAR, PATRICK, Esquire at Culmaily, LESLIE, HUGH, Procurator fiscal, MACKID, ROBERT, Sheriff substitute, TAYLOR, WILLIAM, Sheriff Clerk of Sutherland, BANNERMAN, DONALD, Sheriff Officer, DAVIDSON, JOHN, Wright in Golspie, ++ Sorry, not sure whether Wright is an occupation MCKAY, GEORGE, Wright in Golspie,++ or surname. I went with occupation. DUNCAN, JAMES, Innkeeper at Golspie. When DONALD BANNERMAN called out the names of those who had been summoned to the court, all except for: GORDON, ROBERT, in Reisk, GUNN, ROBERT, in Kildonan, and GUNN, ALEXANDER, in Kildonan, answered. BANNERMAN identified these men among the crowd outside the Inn were: SUTHERLAND, JOHN, in Kildonan, POLSON, DONALD, in Torrish, BRUCE, ROBERT, in Loist. JAMES DUNCAN, the Innkeeper, identified BRUCE and MATHESON, SAMUEL, tenant in Kenaviad. Note 1: These men were among Lord Selkirk's settlers to the Red River in June 1813. Extract from a letter from Lord Selkirk to Miles McDonnell, 12 June 1813: "Of the Kildonan People -- there is scarcely anyone who can be pointed out as a leading man. "JOHN SUTHERLAND, DONALD BANNERMAN, DONALD GUNN, and GEORGE McDONALD were all among the neighbours of the insurrection against the sheep farmers; but none of them were previously under a bad name and the circumstances were such that I cannot consider their conduct on that occasion as any great imputation on their general character. According to the ideas handed down to them from their ancestors, long prevalent among high and low throughout the Highlands, they were only defending their rights and resisting a ruinous injust and tyrannical encroachment on their property. JOHN SUTHERLAND is spoken as amongst the most respectable people in the parish and his influence is said to have prevailed with the young people to refrain from acts of violence which they were on the point of committing. He has been from the first a zealous friend and ought to be treated with regard." GEORGE MCDONALD died 1 Sep 1813 at Churchill. JOHN SUTHERLAND died 2 Sep 1813 at Churchill. Note 2: Is this the ROBERT GUNN mentioned in Sage's "Memorabilia Domestica or Parish Life in the North of Scotland"? Sage said that ROBERT GUNN was killed in a skirmish at the Red River Colony. The 1813 "Prince of Wales" passenger list gives a ROBERT GUNN, piper, who traveled with his sister, MARY. Note 3: WILLIAM SUTHERLAND, in Balnavaliach, emigrated to the Red River in 1815. Regards, Rena ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ ============================== Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the #1 Source for Family History Online. Go to: http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01

Hi Christine, I have re-checked my copy of SEM. ROBERT GORDON is mentioned twice (pages 135 and 136) as "ROBERT GORDON in Reisk son of ALEXANDER GORDON in Dalcharn". There is a statement by DONALD BANNERMAN on page 137 that he was "informed by Lady Stafford's Ground Officer that ROBERT GORDON in Reisk one of the persons mentioned in the warrant was from home" (ie, not at home). Is it possible that the B in Balcharne was mistaken for a D when the statements were transcribed? Rena >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< On 4/8/2001, 1:24:49 PM, "Christine Stokes" <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> wrote regarding RE: Names in Kildonan Riots: > Rena > Thanks for such a wonderful list. I have information on an Alexander Gordon > in Balcharne (1738-1816). He married Isabell Sutherland and they are buried > in Kildonan. Do you think there could be any chance that Balcharne and > Dalcharn could be the same place? > Does anybody know? This information from Rena would solve the problem of > Robert Gordon's parentage if someone knows. > Many thanks > Christine

Forwarded with the permission of Doug McLean. I hope that no-one is bothered by the cross-posting. Lyndall ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug McLean" <dmclean@dcsi.net.au> To: <GENANZ-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 11:55 PM Subject: McLean and Genealogy Bulletin Board Please note the introduction of a new BULLETIN BOARD at http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Canyon/6387/Bul.html which is available for persons wishing to exchange information on the McLean surname (septs included) in particular, or genealogy information in general. Please note that this board is HTML compatible thus enabling postings including HTML script. The page commenced at 11.47pm EST on the 6th April, 2001. and will remain on line if utilised. Give it a try someone has to be the first. Doug McLean Clan McLean Connections Australia.

Hello Franklin Nancy is a form of Ann as you probably know already. Is this the Nancy you are looking for? From my Murray Families: 1-045 ALEXANDER MURRAY married CHRISTIAN SUTHERLAND [1779-1857] Alexander, a native of Sciberscross, Rogart, and Christian (Christy) had the following children: ELIZABETH (Elspet), born 1 December 1795 Craggy, Strathbrora (OPR) [died 1898] [married Peter Murray - see 5-127/2] (IGI); DONALD, born 5 July 1796 Rhilin, Rogart (OPR); CHRISTIAN, born 22 March 1798 Rhiline, Rogart (OPR); JANE (Jean), born 19 March 1801 Rhiline [died 1889] [married Robert Macdonald - see 4-056/5A] (OPR); ANNE (Nancy), born 23 April 1800 Craggie [died 1892] [married Alexander Sutherland - see 1-180/1A] (OPR); ANGUS, born 14 June 1802 Craggie [married Janet Mackay - see 1-167] (OPR); DONALD, born 20 July 1806 Craggie [died 1883] [married Ann Murray - see 2-115/1] (OPR); ISABEL, born circa 1808 [married John Graham - see 3-177/1]; HELLEN (Ellen), born 30 October 1808 Auldnan,Kildonan [died 1880 spinster] (OPR); WILLIAM, born 24 September 1811 Kildonan (IGI); WILLIAM, born 24 February 1813 Rhiske, Kildonan (OPR) CATHERINE, born 1813 [died 1885 spinster] (GM); CHRISTIAN, born 29 April 1816 Rhiske (OPR) and ROBERT, born 7 May 1817 Rhiske [married Ellen Murray - see 6-031/1] (OPR). After 1800 the family moved from Rogart to Altandoun, Borribol, Kildonan. In 1814 they were burned out in the clearance and survived that winter at Slethill near Forsinard in the heights of Strath Halladale. In the spring of 1815 they were evicted from Slethill and were relocated to Craigton further down the Halladale. In 1819 their daughters Nancy and Elizabeth emigrated to Earltown, Colchester County, Nova Scotia, with their husbands. Alexander and Christy followed them in 1821 leaving a daughter Jane and a son Angus behind. Jane eventually went out to Earltown in 1832 while Angus married and remained in Sutherland. William Murray, brother of Alexander, also went out to Nova Scotia. Alexander and Christy settled atop a hill overlooking the community of The Falls. The area is now uninhabited but was once the flourishing settlement of Cnoc na Spidial or Spittal Hill, possibly named after Sletill Hill in Halladale. Alexander and Christy are buried in Earltown Village Cemetery (GM/NS). If so and you wish to see any further references please ask for them by number. Christine -----Original Message----- From: Franklin Fiske [mailto:ffiske@north.nsis.com] Sent: Sunday, April 08, 2001 4:07 PM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Murray Help wanted;; Information on the following person. Nancy Murray borne 1800 in or near Rogart, Sutherlandshire Thank you Frank in Pictou,N.S. ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ ============================== Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the #1 Source for Family History Online. Go to: http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01

Good morning! In a previous message on the Kildonan Riots of 1813, I used my own notes and did not include all of those who were named in the "Minute for the Procurator fiscal". Since the list might help others researching their families in Sutherland, I am rectifying my omission. The information comes from Volume One of "Papers on Sutherland Estate Management", pages 135-142 but, where possible, I am using modern versions of the names (eg. I'll use Gunn for Gun). Named as witnesses: GORDON, ROBERT, in Reisk, son of ALEXANDER GORDON in Dalcharn, MACLEOD, GEORGE, in Kildonan, GUNN, ALEXANDER, in Kildonan, GUNN, DONALD, in Kildonan, (see note 1) GUNN, ROBERT, his son, (see note 2) SUTHERLAND, JOHN, in Kildonan, (see note 1) GUNN, ALEXANDER, in Kildonan, BANNERMAN alias McDAVY, JOHN, (see note 1) SUTHERLAND, DONALD, in Ulbster, SUTHERLAND, WILLIAM, "now in Balnavaliach formerly servant to Mr. SAGE in Kildonan", POLSON, GEORGE, in Grudseray, MELVILLE, JEAN, wife of DONALD MURRAY Dram seller in Suisgill, MACDONALD, GEORGE, in Dalvait, (see note 1) SUTHERLAND, JOHN, in Kenacoil (SEM gives Keanakyle), MACLEOD or MACKAY, INNES, in Auldbreakach, MACKAY, GEORGE, Catechist in Lirobol, SUTHERLAND, WILLIAM, in Balnavaliach, POLSON, DONALD, in Torrish, LESLIE, HUGH, Procurator fiscal, signed the Minute on 13 Jan. 1813. MACKID, ROBERT, the Sheriff substitute, on 27 Jan 1813, granted warrants to "search for seize" in order to compel the witnesses to appear at the Golspie Inn. BANNERMAN, DONALD, was the Sheriff Officer who was required to execute the warrants. MATHESON, JOHN, was Sheriff Officer at Kintraidwell. GRAY, ROBERT, was a Sheriff Officer "in the neighbourhood of Helmsdale", MATHESON and GRAY accompanied BANNERMAN on the trip to deliver the warrants. TURNBULL, JOHN, shepherd to Mr. HOUSTON, was summoned during the trip. His house is described as being at Suisgill. HOUSTON, THOMAS, was the tenant of Suisgill Sheep Farm. REID, GABRIEL, of Armadale, was the tenant of the new Kilcalmkill sheep farm. He and his (male) companion on the night (5 Jan. 1813) before the riot had stayed with Turnbull's family. The companion's name is given only as HALL. Named in JEAN MELVILLE'S testimony as being among the rioters on the morning of 6 Jan. 1813 were: GUNN, ROBERT, son of DONALD GUNN in Kildonan, MATHESON, ALEXANDER, in Auldbreakach. MCLEOD, WILLIAM, in Eldrable, POLSON, WILLIAM or JOHN, son of JOHN POLSON in Torrish. Among the officials at the Golspie Inn on 10 Feb. 1813, the day of the second riot were: SELLAR, PATRICK, Esquire at Culmaily, LESLIE, HUGH, Procurator fiscal, MACKID, ROBERT, Sheriff substitute, TAYLOR, WILLIAM, Sheriff Clerk of Sutherland, BANNERMAN, DONALD, Sheriff Officer, DAVIDSON, JOHN, Wright in Golspie, ++ Sorry, not sure whether Wright is an occupation MCKAY, GEORGE, Wright in Golspie,++ or surname. I went with occupation. DUNCAN, JAMES, Innkeeper at Golspie. When DONALD BANNERMAN called out the names of those who had been summoned to the court, all except for: GORDON, ROBERT, in Reisk, GUNN, ROBERT, in Kildonan, and GUNN, ALEXANDER, in Kildonan, answered. BANNERMAN identified these men among the crowd outside the Inn were: SUTHERLAND, JOHN, in Kildonan, POLSON, DONALD, in Torrish, BRUCE, ROBERT, in Loist. JAMES DUNCAN, the Innkeeper, identified BRUCE and MATHESON, SAMUEL, tenant in Kenaviad. Note 1: These men were among Lord Selkirk's settlers to the Red River in June 1813. Extract from a letter from Lord Selkirk to Miles McDonnell, 12 June 1813: "Of the Kildonan People -- there is scarcely anyone who can be pointed out as a leading man. "JOHN SUTHERLAND, DONALD BANNERMAN, DONALD GUNN, and GEORGE McDONALD were all among the neighbours of the insurrection against the sheep farmers; but none of them were previously under a bad name and the circumstances were such that I cannot consider their conduct on that occasion as any great imputation on their general character. According to the ideas handed down to them from their ancestors, long prevalent among high and low throughout the Highlands, they were only defending their rights and resisting a ruinous injust and tyrannical encroachment on their property. JOHN SUTHERLAND is spoken as amongst the most respectable people in the parish and his influence is said to have prevailed with the young people to refrain from acts of violence which they were on the point of committing. He has been from the first a zealous friend and ought to be treated with regard." GEORGE MCDONALD died 1 Sep 1813 at Churchill. JOHN SUTHERLAND died 2 Sep 1813 at Churchill. Note 2: Is this the ROBERT GUNN mentioned in Sage's "Memorabilia Domestica or Parish Life in the North of Scotland"? Sage said that ROBERT GUNN was killed in a skirmish at the Red River Colony. The 1813 "Prince of Wales" passenger list gives a ROBERT GUNN, piper, who traveled with his sister, MARY. Note 3: WILLIAM SUTHERLAND, in Balnavaliach, emigrated to the Red River in 1815. Regards, Rena

Hi Folks, In seeing all the Surnames of the area passing through the list I'm starting to wonder was there actually any Henderson's from the area. I see the Achany MacKay lines but nothing on George Henderson or his family. maybe the MacKays were mistaken from whence he came. Ken

Joan, I have a copy of the passengers on board the Prince of Wales 1813, by the Lord Selkirk Association of Rupert's Land. It shows #69 as Robert Gunn: Piper from Kildonan and his sister Mary. (no ages given). According to these records they did not stay in the settlement after 1815. I don't know where 'Ireland' came from. Pat Winnipeg ---------- >From: "Joan & Wayne Wilton" <panther@elgin.net> >To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Robert Gunn, piper >Date: Sun, Apr 8, 2001, 2:34 PM > > I believe the Robert Gunn listed on the Prince of Wales passenger list as > piper, with his sister Mary, came to Elgin Co. with the group of Scots who > left the Red River Settlement. The Robert Gunn who eventually became a Post > Master of Wallacetown, Elgin Co. also had a sister Mary and I suspect are > the same people Rena mentions. However, if my information is correct, it's > stated in the Manitoba archives passenger list of the Prince of Wales that > this Robert was born in Ireland and for that reason, I've not associated > him as being a son of the Gunns I'm researching. Now you have me wondering .... > Joan Wilton >

I believe the Robert Gunn listed on the Prince of Wales passenger list as piper, with his sister Mary, came to Elgin Co. with the group of Scots who left the Red River Settlement. The Robert Gunn who eventually became a Post Master of Wallacetown, Elgin Co. also had a sister Mary and I suspect are the same people Rena mentions. However, if my information is correct, it's stated in the Manitoba archives passenger list of the Prince of Wales that this Robert was born in Ireland and for that reason, I've not associated him as being a son of the Gunns I'm researching. Now you have me wondering .... Joan Wilton

Christine --- for some reason this message went out under my previous email address, and as a result got lost in limbo! Sometimes my computer seems to have a mind of its own. I hope the message isn't too late to be of use. I've edited it to take in a second thought. Sara ----- Original Message ----- From: "S E Thomas" <saraerskine@btinternet.com> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 8:02 PM Subject: Re: SUT - Re: 1863 Gaelic book re Donald SUTHERLAND Frances -- there's no 'twelfth' --- or any ordinal number in the text. Check with a native Gaelic speaker, but I believe the translation is cumha d' athair elegy/lament to (his) father (the 'a' meaning 'his' lost before vowel) a bh' ann am Brora an who was in Brora in Siorrachd Chatabh the Shire of Sutherland agus a dh'eug sa' mhios and who died in the month Mhaigh 1863 of May 1863 'cuimhnich', 'remember', has an 'n' in it . There's no 'n' here. '*of* your father' would be 't'athar' (no 'i'). 'To your father' would be 'do t'athair'. The 'd' meaning 'your' becomes 't' before a vowel according to Dwelly. 'of my father' would be (help somebody!) 'm'athar' . To my father - 'do m'athair'. Of course 'to his father' could refer to the writer in the third person. 'a' is the relative 'who', 'which', 'that' 'eug' = 'die'; the 'dh' ' (pronounced 'y' here) indicates the past tense, so 'dh'eug' = 'died' Sara > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Frances Bishop" <bishad@direct.ca> > To: "Sara Thomas" <sethomas@btinternet.com>; > <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 6:06 PM > Subject: SUT - Re: 1863 Gaelic book re Donald SUTHERLAND > > > > Hello, Sara > > Many thanks for your help. Your translation would make the title > read > > something like this: "Remember your father: Donald Sutherland born > at > > Brora in the Shire of Sutherland, and who died on the twelth of the > month > > of May, 1863." > > With best wishes to you and to Ian, > > Frances > >

Help wanted;; Information on the following person. Nancy Murray borne 1800 in or near Rogart, Sutherlandshire Thank you Frank in Pictou,N.S.

Lori, I know this an impossible question. Family tale is that My Alex MacKenzies & Barbara Grant left Sutherland (Golspie) and sailed to Montreal 1829-1830. They spent the winter with their good friends the Gilcrists. Then headed to Onrtario in the spring. Did you have anyone in Montreal? I have not been able to find a Passinger list to pinpoint the actual Date of arrival. Rick ----- Original Message ----- From: Lori Fletcher <loribyn@corplink.com.au> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 7:18 AM Subject: RE: Gilchrist Square > Hello Christine > > Have I been so slack that you have forgotten me already!? > > Sorry, I don't seem to have many family members in Sutherland - at least the > ones I > have weren't born, didn't marry or have children and didn't die! > > I'd love a map showing Gilchrist Square please and I promise I'll inundate > the list with > all my missing Gilchrists and their spouses asap. > > I did receive the book 'Gilchrists of Ospisdale' from the publisher. Thank > you Malcolm and > you Christine for your assistance there. It's wonderful. > > Regards > Lori > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Christine Stokes [mailto:chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk] > Sent: Thursday, 5 April 2001 9:53 p > To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Gilchrist Square > > > A while back there was a conversation about Gilchrist Square, Dornoch. I > cannot remember who it was who had a relative after whom the square was > named? > I now have a map of Dornoch showing the square. If whoever emails me > privately I will send a copy. > Christine > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > ============================== > Create a FREE family website at MyFamily.com! > http://www.myfamily.com/banner.asp?ID=RWLIST2 >

Hi Sara Your last two Gaelic contributions did make it to the list - check the archives. Regarding Kerrow I think we must look for another spot. We appreciate your help - you may consider yourself a learner but you know much more than I do! Many thanks Christine -----Original Message----- From: Sara Thomas [mailto:Sethomas@btinternet.com] Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 8:57 PM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: Zorra [Christine --- not sure if you really want this! --- (My last two Gaelic contributions don't seem to have made it to the list)] I'm strictly a *learner*, and I have *no* professional expertise in Scottish placenames -- Pictish, Gaelic, Norse or whatever. It's a minefield. For what it's worth, 'caorunn' means 'rowan' (mountain ash). The 'ao' has a curious sound, similar but by no means identical to Fr 'coeur' --- this could, I suppose, become 'ker' in non-Gaelic mouths--- no problem there. Also, no surprise that a 'u' could become 'ow', but I'm very surprised that the final 'nn' has disappeared, as this is a very strong sound which fills your mouth! The full name of these places is Leathad a' Chaoruinn; Meall a' Chaoruinn (Rowan Brae or Hillside; Rowan Mound or Hill): Here the vowel sound changes to 'i' and the 'nn' changes to the 'gn' sound in 'pinion' ('a' Chaoruinn' means *of* the Rowan) This seems far away from the '-ow' in 'Kerrow' --- you'd expect 'Kerrin'. But --- stranger things have happened, and if that's the only candidate..... (There are various other possible sources for the name 'Kerrow', but I don't want to outstay my welcome!) Sara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christine Stokes" <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 5:15 PM Subject: RE: Zorra > Sara, what do you think? Does this 'sound' as though Ann has found Kerrow? > You seem to be our Gaelic speaker. > Christine > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mhairi Mackay [mailto:mhairi@xtra.co.nz] > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:34 AM > To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ ============================== Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the #1 Source for Family History Online. Go to: http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01

----- Original Message ----- From: Iain Sutherland <iain_sutherland@totalise.co.uk> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 8:33 PM Subject: Re: Zorra > There is a Kerrow a couple of miles from Cannich in Strathglass I had > ancestors there in 1884 married Hugh Robertson Iain > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Lynn Munro <ornum@execulink.com> > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 10:12 PM > Subject: Re: Zorra > > > > Christine, > > I do not know where Kerrow is. I have some information passed on to me > from > > the historian of Clan MacKay W. Alex MacKay in which he stated the > > following" My research into the Rogart MacKays has been superficial > to-date, > > but I can find no record of George and his wife residing in Rhilochan in > > Rogart Parish. As you said their six children were born in Rogart between > > 1796 and 1806. But they were all born in the township of Kerrow." He goes > on > > to say " The tenants in Rhilochan at that time were MacKays, a John and > his > > wife Christian Sutherland who had a son Angus there in 1797 and a son > > William in 1799. In 1800 they were replaced by Murdoch and Kate MacKay. By > > 1810 a George MacKay tenanted Rhilochan, but his wife was a Sibella > McDonald > > and between then and 1824 , they had four children Hector, Jane, John and > > William. Could this be your George who remarried after Janet Gordon died > and > > at that time moved from Kerrow to Rhilochan? The reason why Janet Gordon's > > first child was not born in Kerrow probably was that George and Janet > > followed the usual Highland tradition where the birth of the first > > grandchild takes place in the mother's parents home. Find William's > > birthplace and perhaps you may find Janet's parents. Janet was a popular > > Gordon name." Just thought you might be interested. Lynn > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Christine Stokes <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> > > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 9:33 AM > > Subject: RE: Zorra > > > > > > > Hi Lynn > > > Langdale is in Strathnaver which is in Farr parish, in the north of the > > > county. > > > Blarich or Blairich is in Rogart parish. > > > Both the IGI and the OPRs show children of Janet Gordon and George > Mackay > > > born in Rogart parish, probably at Rhelochan. Where is the Kerrow > > township > > > you mention? > > > Both the Gordons of Langdale and the Munros of Blarich were from earlier > > > 'substantial' families. > > > The Munro family can trace back to Donald Balloch Mackay, born circa > 1550, > > > son of Iye Du Mackay. > > > Bessie Munro was the daughter of Robert Munro of Blarich. Robert > Munro's > > > parents were Hugh Munro of Achany and Christian Mackay - so there are > > plenty > > > of Mackays in the family. > > > The fact that your George's mother was said to be the wife of a > blacksmith > > > may well mean that Janet Gordon "married beneath" herself but in those > > days, > > > after the 1745, everything was changing anyway. Strathnaver would itself > > be > > > emptied only a few years later when the Clearances started to hit. > > > Although William Gordon still styled himself 'of Langdale' I believe he > > was > > > living in Rogart when his children were born! > > > I wish I knew more about this family because I am firmly of the opinion > > that > > > Barbara Gordon, my 4 x great grandmother, is also a daughter of William > > > Gordon. I will keep on looking in the hope that one day it will all be > > > solved. > > > In the meantime any little snippets are most welcome!! > > > Christine > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Lynn Munro [mailto:ornum@execulink.com] > > > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2001 6:47 PM > > > To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com > > > Subject: Re: Zorra > > > > > > Christine, > > > In answer to your question regarding Janet Gordon this is what I have. > > Janet > > > Gordon daughter of William Gordon of Langdale and Bessie Munro. Bessie's > > > father was Robert Munro of Blarich. Can you tell me what or where is > > > Langdale? I do not know where Janet and George Mackay's first son > William > > > was born. It has been suggested that if we find where he was born then > we > > > will be assured that Janet is in deed the daughter of William Gordon of > > > Langdale. It has also been suggested that following highland tradition > > Janet > > > would have had her first child in the home of her parents which accounts > > for > > > why all the other children were listed as born in Kerrow township but > > > William is not. Then maybe we can prove that Janet and Barbara were > > sisters. > > > Lynn > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Christine Stokes <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> > > > To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Wednesday, March 21, 2001 3:58 AM > > > Subject: Zorra > > > > > > > > > > Hi again Lynn > > > > Do you have any further information on Janet Gordon, wife of George > > Mackay > > > > of Rhelochan, Rogart? > > > > I believe this Janet Gordon may be a sister of my 4 x great > grandmother, > > > > Barbara Gordon. > > > > Any info would be helpful. > > > > Many thanks > > > > Best wishes > > > > Christine > > > > chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk > > > > > > > > Highland Hearts > > > > http://www.highlandhearts.com/ > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > > Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. > > You > > > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > > > > > ============================== > > > > Visit Ancestry.com for a FREE 14-Day Trial and enjoy access to the #1 > > > > Source for Family History Online. Go to: > > > > > http://www.ancestry.com/subscribe/subscribetrial1y.asp?sourcecode=F11HB > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. > You > > > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > > > ============================== > > > Visit Ancestry's Library - The best collection of family history > > > learning and how-to articles on the Internet. > > > http://www.ancestry.com/learn/library > > > > > > > > > --- > > > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 > > > > > > --- > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > > > Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. > You > > can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ > > > > > > ============================== > > > Visit Ancestry's Library - The best collection of family history > > > learning and how-to articles on the Internet. > > > http://www.ancestry.com/learn/library > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== > > You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. 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[Christine --- not sure if you really want this! --- (My last two Gaelic contributions don't seem to have made it to the list)] I'm strictly a *learner*, and I have *no* professional expertise in Scottish placenames -- Pictish, Gaelic, Norse or whatever. It's a minefield. For what it's worth, 'caorunn' means 'rowan' (mountain ash). The 'ao' has a curious sound, similar but by no means identical to Fr 'coeur' --- this could, I suppose, become 'ker' in non-Gaelic mouths--- no problem there. Also, no surprise that a 'u' could become 'ow', but I'm very surprised that the final 'nn' has disappeared, as this is a very strong sound which fills your mouth! The full name of these places is Leathad a' Chaoruinn; Meall a' Chaoruinn (Rowan Brae or Hillside; Rowan Mound or Hill): Here the vowel sound changes to 'i' and the 'nn' changes to the 'gn' sound in 'pinion' ('a' Chaoruinn' means *of* the Rowan) This seems far away from the '-ow' in 'Kerrow' --- you'd expect 'Kerrin'. But --- stranger things have happened, and if that's the only candidate..... (There are various other possible sources for the name 'Kerrow', but I don't want to outstay my welcome!) Sara ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christine Stokes" <chris@northants26.freeserve.co.uk> To: <SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 5:15 PM Subject: RE: Zorra > Sara, what do you think? Does this 'sound' as though Ann has found Kerrow? > You seem to be our Gaelic speaker. > Christine > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mhairi Mackay [mailto:mhairi@xtra.co.nz] > Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:34 AM > To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com

Sara, what do you think? Does this 'sound' as though Ann has found Kerrow? You seem to be our Gaelic speaker. Christine -----Original Message----- From: Mhairi Mackay [mailto:mhairi@xtra.co.nz] Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2001 12:34 AM To: SCT-SUTHERLAND-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: Zorra Hallo Lynn. Just looked up our large scale map of Rogart area and wonder whether Kerrow might be an English vesion of Chaoruinn. At the mouth of Strath Tollaidh is Leathad a'Chaoruinn and Meall a'Chaoruinn. They are the only names I can find anywhere near in sound. Some entries in the Rogart OPR refer to Strath Tollaidh. ( after all if Cnoc Ard an Tionail can be as it seems written as Knockarthur then possibilities are endless)! regards, Ann Mackay ==== SCT-SUTHERLAND Mailing List ==== You may, at times, wish to check out previous messages to this list. You can do this at http://archiver.rootsweb.com/SCT-SUTHERLAND-L/ ============================== Visit Ancestry's Library - The best collection of family history learning and how-to articles on the Internet. http://www.ancestry.com/learn/library --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.237 / Virus Database: 115 - Release Date: 3/7/01 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.244 / Virus Database: 119 - Release Date: 4/2/01