Hi jim, probably a combination of a) children who died b) birth date and christening date - not always correctly identified as such c) transcription error including wrong dates, wrong name, wrong place or even wrong family d) anecdotally families named more than one living child with the same name - I am considering whether I have just discovered the first example of this in my family though I'll be honest I am dubious. Moira ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Baird" <jbaird@hotmail.com> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 8:44 AM Subject: [Renfrew] Different Christening Dates on IGI > I hope one of our resident experts can answer this one: > > I've been researching the children of John BARR and Bethia ALLEN in Abbey > (Paisley). > > Of 5 children's names recorded, 4 are shown twice with different christening > dates viz. > > John 19 JUN 1768 > > > James 24 MAY 1772 > James 14 JUL 1773 > > Allan 18 DEC 1777 > Allan 27 JAN 1782 > > Alexander 03 MAY 1780 > Alexander 06 SEP 1784 > > Ann 16 NOV 1786 > Ann 18 DEC 1788 > > My first thought was that the children had died young and the names were > re-used, but that suggests a mortality rate that is terribly high. > > Does anyone have another logical explanation, please? > > All the best > Jim in sweltering Western Australia, > the state with the climate that Queensland thinks it has! > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html > >

FYI. Hugh Stevenson, writer, died at Glasgow on 29 Oct 1874. The sole beneficiary of his will was his sister, Alexa, who was living in Dumbarton at that time. Hugh was a son (possibly the youngest) of Hugh Stevenson, the Surveyor of Customs who died in Greenock in 1840. I have crossed him off (in pencil) my list of possible ancestors. David.

Jim asked about double dates, "Does anyone have another logical explanation, please?" Hi Jim Quite possibly dates of birth and baptism for each child. Regards Brian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Baird" <jbaird@hotmail.com> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 8:44 AM Subject: [Renfrew] Different Christening Dates on IGI > I hope one of our resident experts can answer this one: > > I've been researching the children of John BARR and Bethia ALLEN in Abbey > (Paisley). > > Of 5 children's names recorded, 4 are shown twice with different christening > dates viz. > > John 19 JUN 1768 > > > James 24 MAY 1772 > James 14 JUL 1773 > > Allan 18 DEC 1777 > Allan 27 JAN 1782 > > Alexander 03 MAY 1780 > Alexander 06 SEP 1784 > > Ann 16 NOV 1786 > Ann 18 DEC 1788 > > My first thought was that the children had died young and the names were > re-used, but that suggests a mortality rate that is terribly high. > > > > All the best > Jim in sweltering Western Australia, > the state with the climate that Queensland thinks it has! > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html >

I`m curious - does it say `head, wife, ` for them? I do have one Duffy in my tree but these are not them. I think this is sad - mean enumerator putting supposedly.. Anne ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela McMurtry" <palmtreeqld@optusnet.com.au> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 9:06 AM Subject: [Renfrew] Stray from 1891 Renfew > Anyone want to own up to having these people on their tree ? Wonder what > happened to them. > > 1891 > > En District 562 ( Pollockshaws ) > > Peter DUFFY Age 'about 60' b 'supposedly Ireland' tramp > Jane DUFFY Age 'about 50' b ' supposedly Ireland' tramp > Surname UNKNOWN , Jamie Age ' about 30 ' b 'supposedly Ireland' tramp > Surname UNKNOWN , Mary Age 'about 26' b ' supposedly Ireland ' tramp > > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > The Renfrewshire Query board is at > http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Renfrew > >

What's the IGI source? Is it simply someone who has guessed the date but is entering the name for baptism of the dead, etc. or is it extracted from an Old parish Record. If the latter, get the film and check it out. One may be a birth day, the other the day the birth was recorded which can be days, months or years later. Sandy -----Original Message----- From: Jim Baird [mailto:jbaird@hotmail.com] Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 12:45 AM To: SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Renfrew] Different Christening Dates on IGI I hope one of our resident experts can answer this one: I've been researching the children of John BARR and Bethia ALLEN in Abbey (Paisley). Of 5 children's names recorded, 4 are shown twice with different christening dates viz. John 19 JUN 1768 James 24 MAY 1772 James 14 JUL 1773 Allan 18 DEC 1777 Allan 27 JAN 1782 Alexander 03 MAY 1780 Alexander 06 SEP 1784 Ann 16 NOV 1786 Ann 18 DEC 1788 My first thought was that the children had died young and the names were re-used, but that suggests a mortality rate that is terribly high. Does anyone have another logical explanation, please? All the best Jim in sweltering Western Australia, the state with the climate that Queensland thinks it has! ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== ********************************************************************** To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html

Hi Sandy, Thank you for your e-mail. I had found Agnes McBride and Lachlan McNeil in Paisley and in the IGI it states these are the parents of Donald, Mary Ann and Catherine. Also in the IGI it claims that Ann Brodie is the Mother to Mary Ann only. This was submitted by a Patron. But on the death certificates of Donald & Mary Ann (in Australia) the Mother's name is Ann Brodie. My theory is that Agnes died and Lachlan married Ann Brodie. As the children were too young to remember their Mother they called Ann their Mother. Donald's son Robert signed the death certificate so obviously he thought of Ann Brodie as his Grandmother. Lachlan and Ann couldn't have moved too far away as the three children all married in Abbey Parish. Someone suggested that maybe they stayed with Grandparents - if so, I haven't found them either. Lachlan does not turn up on the 1841 or 1851 census for Paisley. He's my brick wall and it's driving me crazy. Will keep searching and one of these days I am bound to find them. Thank you for your interest. Regards Wilma - Canada

Hi List Is anyone able to check the 1971 census for Renfrew Co., Scotland for the family listed below, (McQuoid / McQuaid). 1881 Census?? Dwelling: 70 Ann Street, > Census Place: West Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland. (Husband?? - deceased Samuel McQuaid / McQuoid) Christina McQuaid, W, 40, F, Perth, Perth, Scotland, Rel: Head, Occ: Washer Woman. Thomas McQuaid, U, 16, M, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland, Rel: Son, Occ: Apprentice Dyer. Christina McQuaid, 13, F, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland, Rel: Daur, Occ: Serv. Robert McQuaid, 9, M, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland, Rel: Son, Occ: Scholar, Isabella McQuaid, 6, F, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland, Rel: Daur. Susan Peterson, M, 20, F, Greenock, Renfrew, Scotland, Rel: Boarder, Occ: Sailors Wife. Thanks, Maureen Ontario, Canada tracer@bis.on.ca

Hi There , I have just transcribed the entire 1891 Eaglesham Census if anyone wants a lookup. Angela PS Please limit to 2 surnames at a time.

Hi Angela... Any reference to the name BRADSHAW would be appreciated. Regards Chris Bradshaw ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela McMurtry" <palmtreeqld@optusnet.com.au> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 6:10 AM Subject: [Renfrew] 1891 Census Eaglesham > Hi There , > I have just transcribed the entire 1891 Eaglesham Census if anyone wants a > lookup. > Angela > > PS Please limit to 2 surnames at a time. > > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html >

Hi Sandy, I would like to know the info on the Gemmel/ Grant baptism please. If not too cheeky could I also have Bennie/ Haddow info too please. Thanks, Irene in New Zealand.

Cogratulations Angela,that is quite an accomplishment,good for you. I'm sure I speak for everyone in saying a big thank you for your efforts. I don't think that I have any ancestors in that area,but there will certainly be others that have and will thank you for this offer. Regards Frank McGonigal Ont. Canada. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela McMurtry" <palmtreeqld@optusnet.com.au> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 6:10 AM Subject: [Renfrew] 1891 Census Eaglesham > Hi There , > I have just transcribed the entire 1891 Eaglesham Census if anyone wants a > lookup. > Angela > > PS Please limit to 2 surnames at a time. > > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html > >

Is the original marriage certificate in old "copperplate" writing? If so, then Tom is possibly correct as the "I"....vatts could really be Watts! You might need to check some old handwriting sites. Janelle Canberra, Australia jcmch@cyberone.com.au Researching Davie, Halliday, Menzies, Taylor, Barr in Scotland Hi Tom, This is what we had thought for years, but upon receiving a copy of the original marriage certificate of their son , it definitely reads Ivatts. Thanks for your interest. Joan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Gardiner" <gardiner@cooloola.net> To: <sct-renfrew-l@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 2:18 PM Subject: [Renfrew] Re: SCT-RENFREW-D Digest V03 #37 > > Hi Marv & Jo > > > Is it possible that the name was "Watts" and incorrectly written as > Ivatts. ? > > Tom > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > Subject: > > [Renfrew] Moodie / Ivatts > > From: > > Marv and Jo Stevens <jomarv@shaw.ca> > > Date: > > Wed, 05 Feb 2003 18:47:35 -0800 > > To: > > SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com > > > > > > > >James Peterkin Stephen b 1797 Meigle Perth( part owner of Shaw Whitehead Merch. of Paisley and Singapore) > > m Emily Ivatts > > d 1851 Renfrew > > c George Clark b 1831 Singapuri Orrisa India m Catherine Gray d 1865 Skye > > > > > > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > The Renfrewshire GenWeb page is at > http://www.rootsweb.com/~sctrfw/ > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== ********************************************************************** To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 27/01/03

Hi Listers, Searching for an Ann Brodie married to a Lachlan McNeil(l). All along I have thought Agnes McBride was the wife of Lachlan McNeil. That is until I got his son's Death certificate and it states his Mother was Ann Brodie. Children: Donald, Mary Ann and Catherine were married in Paisley (Abbey) 1851, 1844, 1847. Cannot find Lachlan or Ann Brodie anywhere in Paisley. Any help would greatly be appreciated. Regards Wilma - Canada

Hi, Lachlan McNeil could have married Agnes after he married Ann Brodie who gave birth to a son and then died. Or he could have married Agnes and then Ann. Sandy -----Original Message----- From: wilma [mailto:claymore@execulink.com] Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 10:26 AM To: SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [Renfrew] RE: Brodie Hi Listers, Searching for an Ann Brodie married to a Lachlan McNeil(l). All along I have thought Agnes McBride was the wife of Lachlan McNeil. That is until I got his son's Death certificate and it states his Mother was Ann Brodie. Children: Donald, Mary Ann and Catherine were married in Paisley (Abbey) 1851, 1844, 1847. Cannot find Lachlan or Ann Brodie anywhere in Paisley. Any help would greatly be appreciated. Regards Wilma - Canada ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== ********************************************************************** The Renfrewshire GenWeb page is at http://www.rootsweb.com/~sctrfw/

"Gemmel Robert S.L. of Alexander Gemmel and Janet Grant Born 9, Registered Sept 1851." This is register of June 1838, pg. 156, film #1041090 as is below. "Bennie John Haddow S.L. of Hugh Bennie, Wright, Hurlet & Elizabeth Haddow Born 12, Registered 9"(then a line). This is under 9 Nov. registration on above line with a line under month so may be a ditto. The line above that is 18 Sept 1838. Thusly: Dow Registered 28 Sept 1838 Sim Registered 9 Nov------- Bennie Reg. 9----------- Also, the Hurlet is carefully printed in tiny block letters Everything else is in cursive. The Haddow is written directly beneath the John and is also printed in tiny block letters. Elsewhere on the page, locations are written in tiny block letters: e.g. Carriagehill. -----Original Message----- From: Irene Polkinghorne [mailto:polk@ihug.co.nz] Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 7:28 PM To: SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [Renfrew] OPR Paisley Abbey, June 1838,baptism names Hi Sandy, I would like to know the info on the Gemmel/ Grant baptism please. If not too cheeky could I also have Bennie/ Haddow info too please. Thanks, Irene in New Zealand. ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== ********************************************************************** The Renfrewshire Query board is at http://cgi.rootsweb.com/~genbbs/genbbs.cgi/Scotland/Renfrew

Hi Angela, Not wishing to overwhelm you, so do you have it on a website anywhere? Jim Bundy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela McMurtry" <palmtreeqld@optusnet.com.au> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 3:10 AM Subject: [Renfrew] 1891 Census Eaglesham > Hi There , > I have just transcribed the entire 1891 Eaglesham Census if anyone wants a > lookup. > Angela > > PS Please limit to 2 surnames at a time. > > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html > >

> Hi Marv & Jo Is it possible that the name was "Watts" and incorrectly written as Ivatts. ? Tom > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Subject: > [Renfrew] Moodie / Ivatts > From: > Marv and Jo Stevens <jomarv@shaw.ca> > Date: > Wed, 05 Feb 2003 18:47:35 -0800 > To: > SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com > > > >James Peterkin Stephen b 1797 Meigle Perth( part owner of Shaw Whitehead Merch. of Paisley and Singapore) > m Emily Ivatts > d 1851 Renfrew > c George Clark b 1831 Singapuri Orrisa India m Catherine Gray d 1865 Skye > >

Hi Angela Would you please look up the name Brown? I know that my gggrandfather name was John. His wife's name may be Agnes. My great aunt in not sure. Thank you Frances Ontario, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: "Angela McMurtry" <palmtreeqld@optusnet.com.au> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 6:10 AM Subject: [Renfrew] 1891 Census Eaglesham > Hi There , > I have just transcribed the entire 1891 Eaglesham Census if anyone wants a > lookup. > Angela > > PS Please limit to 2 surnames at a time. > > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > To search the archived lists, including this list go to http://archiver.rootsweb.com/search.html >

Dear Lana, Below is a book that may interest you found on line a few dars ago ! I have found it or similar in the Sydney Mitchell Library so you may find it also in a large US library. I would love to be able to justify buying it !! Regards, John Carswell researching Carswell , Howie, Stevenson, Gemmell, McKay tenant farmers Neilston Parish. "CRAWFURD G & ROBERTSON G A General Description of the Shire of Renfrew Including and Account of the Noble Families,... To Which is Added a Genealogical History of the Royal House of Stewart & Notable & Illustrious Families from 1034 to 1710 Continued by G Robertson Paisley: Printed By J Neilson, 1818. 1\2 Leather. Good. First Edition. 4to - over 9¾" - 12" tall. frontis.,engravings,folding maps (one coloured],facsimile of charter,appendix,minor annotaions,522 errata,teg.,newer eps & 1\2 morocco,raised bands gilt some scuffing. Bookseller Inventory #8705 Price: US$ 305.12 (Convert Currency) Bookseller: Brian Annesley Scottish Books, HELENSBURGH, STD, United Kingdom (Search this Seller's Books)(Ask Bookseller a Question) " Other Historys of the Shire of Renfrew are by -Hamilton of Wishell in 1700. -George Crawfurd in 1710. -William Semple in 1782 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lana Renfro Moye" <ylanamoye@earthlink.net> To: <SCT-RENFREW-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 3:37 AM Subject: [Renfrew] History of Renfrew > Can anyone suggest a good source for the History of Renfrew? I am looking > for information about the early history of the area. Also history about the > Baron of Renfrew. > > My Renfro (Renfrew) family left the area sometime before 1530. Family oral > history is that we descend from the Baron of Renfrew. > > Searching for any history on the Renfrew family (all spelling variations) in > Scotland. > > Thank you, > > Lana in Oklahoma, USA > > > ==== SCT-RENFREW Mailing List ==== > ********************************************************************** > Need an LDS film number to order a film at your local LDS library? Try > http://geocities.com/Heartland/Garden/1311/13300-scottishreference.htm > >

Hi there, I thought I would add my bit to the Stevenson discussion. I have Stevenson connections in Neilston at West Uplaw, Brimsdyke and Dunsmuir farms. Are they of interest to anyone? Please contact me direct. Bruce Hosie in Mid Wales