Hello Ian I would be very interested to compare notes with you regarding your Brand(s) and Raw(y)er from Auchabrack and Birse in general. In particular I am interested to find out who the William Brand(s) is who is married to Elizabeth Gordon - and indeed the identity of Elizabeth herself. Also I came across some enigmas with the Raw(y)er family - There is a George Rawyer married to a Margaret Farquharson, Crathie & Bramar 1864. I will have to check my file to see what the problem was with this group, its been a while since I touched on it. However, if either of their two gentleman come into your research then I would really appreciate your help. Thank you for your offer of the photo of the gravestone of John Coutts and Isabella McCondach. They are my my 3x gt grandparents. I would appreciate a copy of your photo since mine is very poor indeed. Regards Sharon researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE

Valentine lair records Fettercarin 8 Erected by the Family in the memory of their Farther & Mother John Valentine a Gardener at Fettercairn Died 22 / Jan / 1879 age 85 & Elizabeth Uddeny Died 24 / Nov / 1881 age 84 Also their brother John died 1827 age 4 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 9 In loving memory of my husband Alexander Valentine died Fasque 21 / Apr / 1910 age 68 His wife Agnes Cobban died Dundee 13 / Dec / 13 / Dec / 1929 age 85 Their Daughter Agnes Died there 9 / Dec / 1968 No age given --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 43 In memory of Elizabeth Valentine died 16 / Sep / 1916 age 69 also her Father Joseph Valentine died 12 / Jan / 1849 no age given --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 74 Erected to the memory of John Valentine late Tenant in Pitcarles died 11 / Oct / 1846 age 71 also his wife Jane Ross Died Stonehaven 16 / Sep / 1875 age 84 their Daughter Elizabeth Austine Valentine died there 9 / Sep / 1868 age 38 their son Robert died Bervie 18 / Aug / 1875 age 47 also his son John Valentine M.B. House Surgeon in Salford Royal Hospital died there 24 / Jan / 1894 age 25. Mrs Elizabeth Michie or Valentine Widow of the said Robert Valentine died Oldham 20 / Oct / 1911. Robert Valentine M.b., L.R.C.P. son of the said Robert & Elizabeth Valentine died Oldham 11 / Jan / 1912 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 97 Erected in the memory of Elizabeth Charters Wife of Adam Valintine died Birkhall 10 / May / 1900 age 70 also their sons Adam died the Burn 22 / Dec / 1871 age 9 William died Newton of stracathro 15 / Feb 1873 age 21 Anthony died Dingwall Hospital 11 / Aug / 1900 age 41. The above Adam Valentine late Sawmiller the Burn Died Brechin 27 / May / 1904 age 80. John Valentine died from the result of accident 5 / May / 1905 age 49. James died London 30 / Oct / 1918 age 62 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 183 Erected by Christina Valentine in memory of her husband William Valentine late Farmer of Mains of Drumhendry died 2 / Feb / 1870 age 72. the above Christina Valentine died 30 / Dec / 1884 age 72 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: <DoreenGen@aol.com> To: <SCT-KINCARDINE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 6:47 PM Subject: Re: [SCT-KINCARDINE] Valentine - Fettercairn > > Thanks Bob. > Unfortunately not my John Valentine. I'll have to try and find out where > the > lair records are kept. > > Thanks again, > Doreen

Hello Bernadine - my husband has Blues in his family but not quite matching yours (could be siblings of yours). There is a great Blues website - which we and our children and grandchildren are on!! So.....go to http://ca.geocities.com/bluesandsamec and you ought to be able to find your relatives. Diana

Hi Jim Sorry, I can't help with Johnshaven - I only have Strachan. Cheers Sharon Are you able to do 1851 or 1861 lookups for Johnshaven? I am paticularly interested in James and Helen McFarlan(e). Cheers Jim Murray ______________________________

hello I am hoping somebody out there might be able to supply me with any information on my grandfather his name was John Blues he was a fisherman in Gourdon I think somewhere along the line the name Coull also appears..He was married to my gran Catherine Ritchie and they had 4 children Christine Tom Elizabeth(my mum) then Catherine;he died when he was only in his 40's

Sharon Thank you for replying even if in the negative!! Jim

Hello Sharon, I have a relative who died at Auchabrack and connections to all the BRAND or BRANDS or RAWER or RAWYER surnames in Birse and Strachan. Are you related to George COUTTS, son of John COUTTS and Isabella McCONDACH? They are not my relatives, but if you are interested I have a photo of their headstone in Birse Churchyard. Best wishes, Ian Edwards Montrose, Angus -----Original Message----- From: Sharon E Jameson [mailto:sharon-j@bigpond.net.au] Sent: 12 June 2005 02:09 To: SCT-KINCARDINE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [SCT-KINCARDINE] Parishes of Strachan and Birse - Glass, Emslie, Coutts, McCondach, Gordon Hi folks While we are on the subject of Coutts, I would like to add my interests. STRACHAN: Alexander Emslie (father William) married Helen Ferries 31 July 1852. Four children, James, Margaret, Alexander and Francis. I am also interested in anyone who connects with the Glass line at Bowbutts and any Gordons there! BIRSE: Auchabrack .... if your family lived at Auchabrack or indeed any of the Forest of Birse I would love to hear from you. I have quite a number of records for this area and am always interested in help to link any of these families together! My family names include: McCondach Glass in Auchabrack - they are all my ancestors! Coutts at Murly / Wester Clune / Haughend but am interested to hear from anyone who have Coutts in Birse. Gordon - especially any and all Gordons! Associated families with the above include - Harper, Milne, Kelman, Smith, Mortimer. Sharon researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

thank you so much. irene C -----Original Message----- From: Jan Bell [mailto:newsdesk1_2000@yahoo.co.uk] Sent: 12 June 2005 19:43 To: SCT-KINCARDINE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [SCT-KINCARDINE] Re: 1851 census Strachan Hello List, Could the step dau mentioned on 1851 Census possibly be [CROCKET], not COCERT. Found in IGI Elizabeth CROCKET Born 14th Dec. 1843, Ch. 31/3/1844 Banchory -Ternan, Kincd. Father: George CROCKET, Mother:Elizabeth STEWART The above Elizabeth may have then married John COUTTS [16/10/1846 , Strachan] mentioned on census. There is also a servant named Stewart, could she have been a relation of Elizabeth. Just a thought. Jan Jan Bell Newsdesk1_2000@yahoo.co.uk Newsdesk1@excite.com --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PCcalling worldwide with voicemail ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

Hello List, Could the step dau mentioned on 1851 Census possibly be [CROCKET], not COCERT. Found in IGI Elizabeth CROCKET Born 14th Dec. 1843, Ch. 31/3/1844 Banchory -Ternan, Kincd. Father: George CROCKET, Mother:Elizabeth STEWART The above Elizabeth may have then married John COUTTS [16/10/1846 , Strachan] mentioned on census. There is also a servant named Stewart, could she have been a relation of Elizabeth. Just a thought. Jan Jan Bell Newsdesk1_2000@yahoo.co.uk Newsdesk1@excite.com --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PCcalling worldwide with voicemail

on 6/10/05 9:42 AM, Gresercher@aol.com at Gresercher@aol.com wrote: > > Bev, > > This looks like your Coutts family in the 1881 Census, still living in > Strachan. > > Regards Cathy > > > Mossside Cottage, > Strachan, Kincardine, Scotland > > FHL Film 0203471 GRO Ref vOLUME 268 EnumDist 3 Page 4 > > > John Coutts, Head Crofter 4 Acres Mar. Age 73 Male Birthplace Birse Aberdeen > Scotland > > Elizabeth Stewart ,Wife Mar. Age 64 Female Birthplace Duris, Kincardine, > Scotland > > James Copland, Gd Son, Scholar Age 10 Male Birthplace Strachan, Kincardine > > John Henry, Gd Son Age 5 Male Birthplace Strachan, Kincardine > > William Findlay, Gd Son Age 2 Male Birthplace Strachan, Kincardine > > Elizabeth Duncan, Gd Daur Age 2 Female Birthplace Aberdeen Aberdeen > > > >> >> Bev, >> >> Would you happen to know where and when your John Coutts died. >> >> The online Family search site has this couple married 1846 in Strachan, > also >> gives children as Margaret born 1847 Jane 1849 John 1851 Mary 1854 all in >> Strachan >> >> Regards Cathy > > > > > > > ============================== > View and search Historical Newspapers. Read about your ancestors, find > marriage announcements and more. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13969/rd.ashx Hi Cathy Yes this is my family. My grandfather is the John Henry aged five. His name was actually John Harvey and his father's name was apparently John Harvey. My grandfather used the double-barreled name Harvey Coutts on the 1891 census. No wonder I couldn't find him. Bev

on 6/10/05 4:09 AM, Sharon E Jameson at sharon-j@bigpond.net.au wrote: > Could some kind soul please look for John Coutts b. Brise and his wife > Elizabeth Stewart. I would like to know who all is in the family and where > they were living in 1851. Thanks in advance. > > > Hello Bev > > Here is John Coutts in Strachan. I would be interested to know if you have > located his parents, there are so many Coutts in Birse! > > 1851 census Strachan: Living at Curran, district 3 page 5 > COUTTS John Head M 44 Ag lab ABD Birse > COUTTS Elizabeth wife M 35 KCD Durris > COUTTS Hellen dau Un 6 scholar KCD Strachan > COUTTS Margaret dau 3 KCD Strachan > COUTTS Janet dau 1 KCD Strachan > COUTTS John son 1 month KCD Strachan > CROCERT (sic) step dau 7 scholar KCD Banchory > STEWART Jane servant 14 house servant ABD Aberdeen > > Sharon > researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON > in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire > special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE > > > > > > > ============================== > Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. > New content added every business day. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx Hi Sharon, Cathy, Irene, Jan and all who replied Sharon and Irene I have seen your messages on the boards before. I think I wrote to you but because I didn't have much information except that there was a Jane Coutts in the family you were not able to help me. I have just recently found out that Jane's (Jean or Janet) parents were Elizabeth Stewart and John Coutts. Now after reading all the new messages I guess I have now found John Coutts' parents. Bev Does this Coutts family belong to any of you? Are we related.

Can anyone shed any more light on the Step Dau with surname concert many thanks Irene M cunningham Hello Bev Here is John Coutts in Strachan. I would be interested to know if you have located his parents, there are so many Coutts in Birse! 1851 census Strachan: Living at Curran, district 3 page 5 COUTTS John Head M 44 Ag lab ABD Birse COUTTS Elizabeth wife M 35 KCD Durris COUTTS Hellen dau Un 6 scholar KCD Strachan COUTTS Margaret dau 3 KCD Strachan COUTTS Janet dau 1 KCD Strachan COUTTS John son 1 month KCD Strachan CROCERT (sic) step dau 7 scholar KCD Banchory STEWART Jane servant 14 house servant ABD Aberdeen Sharon researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE ============================== Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. New content added every business day. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx ============================== Search the US Census Collection. Over 140 million records added in the last 12 months. Largest online collection in the world. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13965/rd.ashx

It looks like your John is the brother of elizabeth below Descendants of Margaret Duncan 1 Margaret Duncan b: Abt. 1809 .. +John Coutts m: 29 Dec 1796 in Birse Aberdeen Scotland 2 elizabeth couttes b: 1810 in birse aberdeenshire ... +Andrew Birse b: 16 Mar 1803 in boghead birse m: 04 Feb 1829 in birse Do you agree. Smile God loves you Irene M Cunningham

Hi folks While we are on the subject of Coutts, I would like to add my interests. STRACHAN: Alexander Emslie (father William) married Helen Ferries 31 July 1852. Four children, James, Margaret, Alexander and Francis. I am also interested in anyone who connects with the Glass line at Bowbutts and any Gordons there! BIRSE: Auchabrack .... if your family lived at Auchabrack or indeed any of the Forest of Birse I would love to hear from you. I have quite a number of records for this area and am always interested in help to link any of these families together! My family names include: McCondach Glass in Auchabrack - they are all my ancestors! Coutts at Murly / Wester Clune / Haughend but am interested to hear from anyone who have Coutts in Birse. Gordon - especially any and all Gordons! Associated families with the above include - Harper, Milne, Kelman, Smith, Mortimer. Sharon researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE

Cathy ... I am always interested! <g> - thank you very much. If John Coutts is your line I can add the following (source Birse Parish Registers): His baptism: 17 May 1806 John Couts Jnr in Auchabrack had a son baptised named John. Witnesses Peter Coutts and John Gillespie His parents marriage: 29 December 1796 Contracted John Coutts and Margaret Duncan both in this parish and after regular proclamations and no objections made were married December the 29th, 1796. His father's baptism: 16 March 1764 John Coutts in Auchabrack Forest of Birse had a son baptised named John. Witnesses the congregation. Lists of Inhabitants exist for Birse (source: National Archives in Edinburgh) In 1792 the above John Coutts is living at Auchabrack with his father John Coutts and mother Martha Middleton. The following is recorded below. I will make this comment - the 1792 listing is the most complete giving ages in decades (i.e. 7 = between 60 - 70). It also records married couples and religion. There are some other minor annotations .. just depends. John Couts (7) -m- Martha Middleton (6) Living with this couple .... John Couts (3) (SEJ: future spouse of Margaret Duncan) Peter Couts (2) Janet Couts (1) William Couts (1) Charles Couts (1) I hope this helps you a little. Sharon researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE

Jim wrote: Can you tell me how you gain access to 1851 census data for Kincardineshire please. 1841 census for Strachan is now online at http://freecen.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl If you choose Strachan from the "Census place" box then you can search this parish exclusively. I am happy to do lookups for the 1851 and 1861 census for anyone who is interested. Sharon researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE

Hi Sharon, Are you able to do 1851 or 1861 lookups for Johnshaven? I am paticularly interested in James and Helen McFarlan(e). Cheers Jim Murray

There are several John Vallentine's buried in Fettercairn Kirkyard, but only one who died 1841 -1851 - "John Valentine late tenant in Pitcaries d 11 Oct 1846 aged 71 also his wife Jane Ross d Stonehaven 16 Sept 1875 ................" So age a bit different and wrong wife. You can view index of MI's online at www.anesfhs.org.uk (Aberdeen and North East Scotland Family History Society website) on front page near bottom under Principal Projects you can search for MI. On next page just carry out surname search. There is 31 Valentines listed as buried in Fettercairn and some half dozen Thow's. Also some Thow's in Strachan Kirkyard. Have a look at surname index and if you want full details of MI's, contact me offlist. I have the MI booklets for both Fettercairn and Strachan. Regards Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: <DoreenGen@aol.com> To: <SCT-KINCARDINE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 8:31 PM Subject: [SCT-KINCARDINE] Valentine - Fettercairn > Could someone with the pre 1855 MI's for Kincardine please do a lookup for > me. > > I have John Vallentine and Margaret Thow, both in their 70's, in > Fettercairn > in 1841. By 1851, Margaret is a widow, age 87. I can't find her death on > SP, > so assume she died before 1855. > > I would also be interested in any Thow's from Strachan. > > Failing that, can anyone tell me where I would need to go to find the lair > records for Fettercairn. > > Thanking you in anticipation. > > Doreen Cuthbert > > Fife > > > > ============================== > Jumpstart your genealogy with OneWorldTree. Search not only for > ancestors, but entire generations. Learn more: > http://www.ancestry.com/s13972/rd.ashx > > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.6.7 - Release Date: 10/06/2005 > >

Bev, & Sharon, I have death certificate for John Coutts aquired from Scotlandspeople web site thought you both might be interested in the details. John died June 9th 1898 at (looks like) Haughland, Strachan aged 92 Widower of Elizabeth Stewart, Parents -- Father John Coutts "Crofter" dec. Mother Margaret Coutts ms Duncan, dec. cause of death Senile Decay, and the informant was John Coutts, his son from Glasgow Kind Regards Cathy Could some kind soul please look for John Coutts b. Brise and his wife Elizabeth Stewart. I would like to know who all is in the family and where they were living in 1851. Thanks in advance. Hello Bev Here is John Coutts in Strachan. I would be interested to know if you have located his parents, there are so many Coutts in Birse! 1851 census Strachan: Living at Curran, district 3 page 5 COUTTS John Head M 44 Ag lab ABD Birse COUTTS Elizabeth wife M 35 KCD Durris COUTTS Hellen dau Un 6 scholar KCD Strachan COUTTS Margaret dau 3 KCD Strachan COUTTS Janet dau 1 KCD Strachan COUTTS John son 1 month KCD Strachan CROCERT (sic) step dau 7 scholar KCD Banchory STEWART Jane servant 14 house servant ABD Aberdeen Sharon researching GLASS EMSLIE COUTTS McKONDACH and GORDON in Aberdeenshire and Kincardineshire special interests in parish of BIRSE, and the area of the FOREST OF BIRSE ============================== Find your ancestors in the Birth, Marriage and Death Records. New content added every business day. Learn more: http://www.ancestry.com/s13964/rd.ashx