Very interesting. I knew there were irregular marriages once civil registration started where couples could declare themselves married in the presence of ?two witnesses and were then considered legally married as I've come across such a case between two of my cousins* (who were themselves both 1st and 3rd cousins to each other) in 1926 Glasgow where the record shows that it was 'by declaration in the presence of' and then listed the witnesses' names and address. Allan MacCormick (1892) and Marion 'Morag' McDonald MacCormick (c1895-1958) both from Mull families. Linda On 7/30/2011 6:38 PM, margaret wrote: > I guess so, or perhaps they couldn't be bothered or were too poor to pay the > fees. Certainly so in the case of my McKechnie great great grandparents who > lived on the Ross of Mull, and for whom we have never been able to trace any > marriage record, so concluded they never actually married. Also I believe > that Scottish law recognised civil partnerships. According to my Scottish > father, Cormick's grandson, if a couple lived together in Scotland for a > number of years they were seen as being married in common law and there was > less social stigma than say in England. > > Margaret > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Linda M. Towne"<[email protected]> > To:<[email protected]> > Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 11:26 PM > Subject: Re: [SCT-ISLEOFMULL] Donald McCormick and Margaret McKinnon > > >> Margaret - >> Thank you for the additional information. I wonder if there was an >> informal 'marriage' without the benefit of the clergy that was later >> formalised? Is that something that happened in remote parts of Scotland >> the way it did in some other remote parts of the world including >> frontier America? I'm finding that the more research I do, the more >> questions I have about the customs and life of the times. >> >> Linda >> >> On 7/30/2011 6:06 PM, margaret wrote: >>> Hi Elaine >>> >>> That was me. >>> >>> Margaret and her brother Duncan (father of Professor Donald McKinnon) >>> were >>> the only children of Janet and Angus McKinnon not to emigrate to Ontario. >>> Janet was the sister of Catherine McKinnon who went to Russia as a nanny >>> to >>> Alexander II. >>> >>> I think I concluded after discussions with Jo Currie, that Margaret and >>> Donald had Betty and Catherine 1 out of wedlock as ministers were a bit >>> thin >>> on the ground in remote parts of Mull. Jo was pretty sure that they were >>> the parents of both sets of children. Perhaps Betty and Catherine 1 >>> died >>> in infancy as there is no further record of them. I think the list of >>> their >>> other children, including my ancestor Cormick, was entered in the >>> register >>> in the 1850s and was probably to set their house in order as Janet, >>> Malcolm >>> and Catherine 2 emigrated to Oregon at the end of the decade. >>> >>> On this note, I have never been able to trace Janet (who was married to >>> John >>> McFarlane and had a small son also called John) in the US though I have >>> traced Malcolm and Catherine 2. I'd be delighted to hear from anyone who >>> can give me information about Janet. From family correspondence, she >>> kept >>> in touch with Catherine and her husband Robert Bruce . >>> >>> Margaret McKechnie Gallagher >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Elaine Robinson"<[email protected]> >>> To:<[email protected]> >>> Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 2:10 PM >>> Subject: Re: [SCT-ISLEOFMULL] Donald McCormick and Margaret McKinnon >>> >>> >>>> Hi >>>> Sorry I haven't been paying strict attention to the discussion on this >>>> couple so I am not sure who is looking for what. However, this Margaret >>>> McKinnon daughter of Angus McKinnon and Janet McKinnon was the only >>>> member >>>> of her family NOT to come to Ontario. The rest of them lived in Erin >>>> Township, and I think some of the McCormack children must have come, as >>>> I >>>> have seen a letter from a McCormack living near here to a McKinnon in >>>> Erin >>>> beginning "dear cousin". There was someone at MUGG called Margaret who >>>> is >>>> descended from this couple and had done extensive work on them. I am >>>> pretty >>>> sure if you check back in the Mull website archives you will find emails >>>> from her. I have not worked on my McKinnon files in quite a while, and >>>> that >>>> plus a new computer, makes this answer a little vague. I hope in the >>>> fall >>>> to >>>> get back to them. Hope this helps a little. >>>> >>>> Elaine Robinson >>>> Georgetown Ontario >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: margaret murray >>>> Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 3:36 AM >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Subject: Re: [SCT-ISLEOFMULL] Donald McCormick and Margaret McKinnon >>>> >>>> The marriage entry in the OPR's (Scotlandspeople) show the marriage took >>>> place right enough but has been written in later in 1854, along with the >>>> entries of all their issue underneath. Perhaps a mistake was made during >>>> transcription by the session Clerk John McDonald at the time, although >>>> their >>>> first child is mentioned as born 1825. >>>> >>>> Donald McCormick Ardchiavaig and Margrate McKinnan were married on the >>>> 11 January 1823 >>>> John McCormick born 20 May 1825 >>>> Janet McCormick born 28 July 1827 >>>> Cormick MCormick born 14 July 1829 >>>> Angus McCormick 28 April 1831 >>>> Malcolm McCormick born 12 August 1833 >>>> Catherine McCormick born 14 August 1836 >>>> No mention of Betty there although her birth is in the records in 1820 >>>> to >>>> a >>>> Donald McCormick Crofter in Uisken and Margaret McKinnon, so perhaps 2 >>>> couples with same name, although records do not show any marriages for >>>> either couple at the time only this later mention. >>>> Usually if a child had been illegitimate it was made legitimate on the >>>> marriage of the parents. >>>> >>>> Margaret (Melrose) >>>> On Sat, Jul 30, 2011 at 5:07 AM, Linda M. Towne >>>> <[email protected]>wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hello all. >>>>> In the baptism registers (OPR), when it says 'lawful' son or >>>>> daughter, that means that the parents were married at the time of the >>>>> baptism, correct? >>>>> >>>>> I'm asking because I have Donald McCormick marrying Margaret McKinnon >>>>> 11 >>>>> Jan 1823 but their lawful daughter Betty baptised 18 Nov 1820 >>>>> >>>>> Does that mean that there were probably TWO couples with those names at >>>>> the time? Or am I mis-interpreting the meaning of lawful? >>>>> >>>>> I checked Ian's site (www.mullgenealogy.co.uk) as well as Michael's >>>>> site >>>>> (www.mullfamilies.co.uk) and they both show Betty as a daughter of the >>>>> Donald McCormick and Margaret McKinnon who married in 1823. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Thoughts? Thanks! >>>>> >>>>> Linda >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Linda MacCormick Towne >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>>> the >>>> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> -- >> Linda MacCormick Towne >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- Linda MacCormick Towne