Hello Friends, The following came to me this morning from a friend in Australia. Bob - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Edward Longshanks (Edward I of England) comes to Scotland to conquer the Scots. He brings 4,000 men with him. As he nears the battlefield there suddenly appears a solitary figure on the crest of the hill. A short, ginger-haired guy in a kilt. "Hammer o' the Scots?" yells the wee Scottish guy on the hill. "Come up here, ya English bastard, and I'll give ye a hammerin'!" Edward turns to his commander. "Send 20 men to deal with that little Scottish upstart, there's a good chap!", he says. The commander sends twenty of his best men over the hill to kill the Scotsman. Ten minutes later, at the crest of the hill, the little Scot appears again. "Ya English bampots!", he yells. "Come on the rest of ye!! Come on, I'll have ye a'!!!" Edward is getting somewhat annoyed. He turns to his commander. "Send 100 men to kill that little guttersnipe!" The commander sends a hundred man over the hill to do the job. Ten minutes later, the little Scot appears at the top of the hill once more, his hair all sticking up, his shirt a wee bit torn. "Ya English SCUM!", he yells. "I'm just warming up!! Come and get me, ya English gits!!" Edward losses patience. "Commander, take 400 men and personally WIPE HIM OFF THE EARTH!", he yells. The commander gulps, but leads four hundred men on horseback over the crest of the hill. Ten minutes later, the little Scotsman is back. His clothing is all torn, his face is covered in blood, snot and Irn-Bru. "Is that the best ye can do??? You're bloody WIMMIN!!! Come on!! Come and have a go ya bunch of Jessies!!!", he yells. Edward turns to his second in command. "Take 1000 men over that hill and don't come back till you've killed him!" he commands. The second in command gathers the men and they ride off over the hill to their fate. Ten minutes later, one of the English troops appears back at the top of the hill. He's covered in blood and his clothes are all torn. "Your Majesty!! he yells. "It's a trap!!! There's TWO of them!!! http://thefrasers.com This site is dedicated to all people of the name FRASER and - SCOTLAND-

In a message dated 30/08/00 8:14:09 AM Central Daylight Time, fraser2@starpower.net writes: << He's covered in blood and his clothes are all torn. "Your Majesty!! >> This has to be one of the oldest jokes in the world, probably started by Wallace himself, but every time I read it or hear it I can see the wee bandie legged mannie and I laugh for hours all day. Cheers Dave PS This is one of the best versions I have seen

In a message dated 29/08/00 10:06:30 PM Central Daylight Time, MURCHISOA001@hawaii.rr.com writes: << Dave, And thus ranting his heart's truth emerged. "...Amazing grace a slaver tune,..." ? "...an Englishman at that..." ? ...wee his cowardy custard minister pal." ? There is obviously a history to the tune that I am not aware of. Am I the only one? Could you expand a bit on what seems an interesting tune tale? Arthur Murchison Researching the Murchison family murchiso001@hawaii.rr.com >> Captain John (what ever, Smith I think) was sailing a slave ship from Africa to, I presume America, when he hit a major storm. Being the good Christian Gentleman he was he fell to his knees to make a bargain that if he were to survive the voyage he would never master a slave ship again and would change his evil ways. He was saved, (there is some thought he may of thrown a few slaves over board to lighten the load, but the slaves were not Christian, and many were women or very young children so no real loss there). Any way After unloading the slaves, The bargain between him and the Lord did not include the present cargo and profit, he retired as a slaver and has been thought of as a good man ever since. He then wrote the story of the the incodent, (leaving out the slave part, which we know did not matter much) and the story was about him. Perhaps Africans do not have souls. Then his friend the minister wrote the words to the song that is now one of the most popular in the world. Amazing Grace how sweet thy song that saved a wretch like me, (Note no mention of the Africans tossed over the side or sold into slavery) I once was lost,, but now am found. (no mention of them ever finding the sold slaves or the bodies of those tossed over the side) etc etc. Whoile I am all for redemption and soul saving, it seems that before the sale and slaughter would of perhaps been more appropriate. Dave M. PS: It is a lovely tune though, but don't tell anyone I said that.

Dave, And thus ranting his heart's truth emerged. "...Amazing grace a slaver tune,..." ? "...an Englishman at that..." ? ...wee his cowardy custard minister pal." ? There is obviously a history to the tune that I am not aware of. Am I the only one? Could you expand a bit on what seems an interesting tune tale? Arthur Murchison Researching the Murchison family murchiso001@hawaii.rr.com ---------- >From: ScotHeritage@aol.com >To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [SCT-INV-L] Re: Macisaac site >Date: Tue, Aug 29, 2000, 11:37 AM > > In a message dated 29/08/00 4:00:47 PM Central Daylight Time, > peter_mcdonald@sftw.com writes: > > << The Scottish Festival in Pleasanton is the oldest and biggest in the > world, > run by the Caledonian Club of SF. > I go for the Scottish pastries and the Band Competition which is out of > this world, all different grades of from all different countries. Then on > Sunday they have all of the bands in a massed organisation in the front of > the grandstand, playing "Amazing Grace" and others. > Its a tear jerker.... > Peter >> > > That Amazing grace a slaver tune, and an Englishman at that wee his cowardy > custard minister pal. Give this lad Scotland the Brave, The Old Black Bear, > The Mist Covered Mountains, and Flower of Scotland. Grand tunes nae thon > stinky slow things. I'm no there to cry I'm there to Festival. The Inverness > Gathering, Ball of Kerrie Muire and such a good dram and a sing song, not > thoin stand and clap and be polite. Boy I needed that rant, > AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHhh that feels better. Haven't had a meaningless rant in days. > Cheers Dave >

At this stage of my family tree search I am desperately in need of help. I have traced my family line back to Alexander McDonald, a weaver and Janet (Fraser) both born c.1790, he in Leek and her in Kilmonivaig, Inverness. The OPR's show no death or burial records nor any marriage records, in fact they don't show much of anything for that period. They had seven sons, two of whom are recorded in OPR's at Leek.Oneof these, Ewen (Hugh) came to Australia in 1852 with another brother unknown (possibly Duncan). I have not been able to trace any of the other brothers. The Clan Donald records provide very detailed family tree info from the 1600's when John Og McDonald was first granted tenure of Leek (a farm on Loch Oich). Subesquent elder sons held tenure of these lands until John McDonald of Leek (1712-1813) and his brothers from Aberchalder and Collachie led around 600 of their clan from Leek and adjoining farms to Canada aboard the Pearl in 1773. Because Alexanders parents did not migrate with their leader, I have assumed that they were not closely related to, or part of the ruling family. The first records of my family apart from the OPR birth records of two sons, are the 1841 census which showed some 13 McDonald familes remaining at Leek and by 1851 they had virtually all gone.Most of these family groups were remnants anyway, ie. a mother and two daughters, single member familes etc. None of the 1841 familes provided enough family naming pattern details to link my family to them. Where next? Can I use the Scotish naming pattern for sons to predict what the name of Alexander's father & brothers might be, or is this unreliable at the time in question (late 1700's) Alexanders seven sons carried the same names as John McDonald of Leek and his six brothers but I accept this proves little. I would appreciate any suggestions as to what direction I should proceed in as I have run out of ideas. David McDonald Port Fairy Australia

The Scottish Festival in Pleasanton is the oldest and biggest in the world, run by the Caledonian Club of SF. I go for the Scottish pastries and the Band Competition which is out of this world, all different grades of from all different countries. Then on Sunday they have all of the bands in a massed organisation in the front of the grandstand, playing "Amazing Grace" and others. Its a tear jerker.... Peter At 12:16 AM 8/29/00 -0700, Jim MacIsaac wrote: >Peter -- >Replies interjected below. >Jim > >"Peter J. McDonald" wrote: > > > Did Cecily tell you I have found the ex-owner of "Kinlochmoidart" who is > > the 14th and last Laird. His name is David Somerlund Robertson Macdonald, > > who is directly related to Donald Macdonald who led us in 1745. They sold > > out to the Stewarts in 1883. > > He has a mound of information as his grandfather recorded it all, yes > > Grandfather, he is 74 which would mean his father was born around > > 1890/1900, and his grandfather would be born around 1860/1870. If I get > > permission I will share all of what I get.... > >Wow! What a gold mine you have found. I certainly would be interested in the >stories and information you assemble. > > > > > Have you any Maicisaac web sites that have our History? > >I have started a MacIsaac/MacEachain Family site on MyFamily.com, but have >been >waiting to get more of my information uploaded before I send out >invitations for >others to join in. It is an invitational site requiring a Username and >Password to >visit, and free if you don't mind the advertising stuff. It is very >flexible for >uploading and sharing pictures, trees, history and family news >information. I will >send you an invitation when I decide to launch it. It includes a tree >tracing my >MacEachen lines back to Eachuinn MacLean, 1st of Lochbuie (b/c1300). His >blood >traces into the Lords of the Isles and from there the legendary trace goes >name by >name back to a pagan high king of Ireland b.c125. I will be uploading my >history >of Highland Scotland that has been a most fascinating study for >me. Eventually it >will all come together in a book titled: Our Highland Scots -- the >MacIsaac/MacEachain Family. > > > Do you have other macisaac's you are in contact with? > > > >I have identified nearly all descendants of my 1849 immigrant Neil MacIsaac. >However, they are not nearly so numerous as the MacEachen/in branches of >his wife >and dtr/law. So my site will likely be more visited by the McEachin family >interests. I have had a number of contacts from MacIsaac families in Cape >Breton, >N.S. (there are 500 M(a)cIsaac families listed in the phone book for the >western >county of Cape Breton alone). Most of those families emigrated from Scotland >during the late 1700s and early 1800s with a large component coming from >Clanranald's Inner Isle estates of Rhum, Eigg and Canna. We all trace back to >Moidart; but since it will be impossible to establish direct relationships >I have >not pursued the Cape Breton/P.E.I. branches. > > > > > I noticed how many Macisaac's were from South Uist in the LDS register. > > > >That is very interesting. I found nothing in LDS records for S.Uist >families when >I did a cursory review many years ago. Someday I will have to visit their >files >again. > > > > > Are they restoring the Castle? > > > >When I visited the castle in 1998 it was closed to entry inside the walls >due to >safety. There was a notice of some kind of coming restoration >activities. I don't >know it it is yet happening. > > > > > Thank you Jim for all your info, > > I will be at the Scottish Festival in Pleasanton, CA if you are coming down > > for Sept 2 +3, I go every year. If you need a place to stay.`I can offer > > you that. > > Peter > > > >Do you live in California? I enjoy the Highland Games gatherings here in >WA on >occasion. But I'm not really into all of this clan stuff. So many people >like to >walk the talk and wear the tartans, but actually know little about their real >heritage. As you may know, the tartan was banned after The '45 and the >Highlanders >went through great sacrifice to construct new clothes to wear. But even >as the >Highlanders were being massively cleared, the Lowlanders and English were >adopting >their former attire and bagpipes. Very few of the poor Highlanders ever >wore their >traditional garb again. > >Slainte Math! >Jim

Back in the 1950s i had a history teacher who was a Scotswoman. Her name was Nancy and she said that Nancy was a witch's name in Scotland. Shirley Arabin. Mount Maunganui, NEW ZEALAND "If at first I don't succeed there is always next year"

In a message dated 29/08/00 3:27:58 PM Central Daylight Time, arabin@wave.co.nz writes: << "If at first I don't succeed there is always next year" >> Aye and the wife will bring it up year after year too. Behind every great man there is a woman, aye and behind every bum too. Why do so many men die 10 years before their wices?? Its an option. Dave

In a message dated 29/08/00 4:00:47 PM Central Daylight Time, peter_mcdonald@sftw.com writes: << The Scottish Festival in Pleasanton is the oldest and biggest in the world, run by the Caledonian Club of SF. I go for the Scottish pastries and the Band Competition which is out of this world, all different grades of from all different countries. Then on Sunday they have all of the bands in a massed organisation in the front of the grandstand, playing "Amazing Grace" and others. Its a tear jerker.... Peter >> That Amazing grace a slaver tune, and an Englishman at that wee his cowardy custard minister pal. Give this lad Scotland the Brave, The Old Black Bear, The Mist Covered Mountains, and Flower of Scotland. Grand tunes nae thon stinky slow things. I'm no there to cry I'm there to Festival. The Inverness Gathering, Ball of Kerrie Muire and such a good dram and a sing song, not thoin stand and clap and be polite. Boy I needed that rant, AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHhh that feels better. Haven't had a meaningless rant in days. Cheers Dave

As I understand it, "second sight" is primarily a Celtic trait or inheritance. It is a strange thing about people with Celtic blood - even if one is born sixth or seventh generation Australian (or wherever,other than Scotland, Ireland,etc), there is a strange, unexplainable pull there to things Celtic. The mere sound of the pipes, and the photos of the Isles.....indeed "the blood is strong"! AEnone McRae-Clift in Tasmania (who has never been to the British Isles......yet!)

In a message dated 29/08/00 6:57:57 AM Central Daylight Time, aenone@globalfreeway.com.au writes: << As I understand it, "second sight" is primarily a Celtic trait or inheritance. It is a strange thing about people with Celtic blood - even if one is born sixth or seventh generation Australian (or wherever,other than Scotland, Ireland,etc), there is a strange, unexplainable pull there to things Celtic. The mere sound of the pipes, and the photos of the Isles.....indeed "the blood is strong"! AEnone McRae-Clift in Tasmania (who has never been to the British Isles......yet!) >> You know one of the greatest joys of my life is when I meet someone at a festival or fair, etc., and they look at me, sort of push back their Stetson hat and ask. "Yeah y'all, ma names James Donald, is thar any Scottish connection thar?" We begin to tell them about Clan Donald etc. You can see the face light up with a minor interest. The next year they are there to tell us what they learned, or they have been using our web pages or emails etc. Now I know why Mrs. MacKenzie battered me with that dam belt to learn ma history. Dave M

In a message dated 28/08/00 4:09:31 PM Central Daylight Time, iain-mckenzie@sol.co.uk writes: << Foyers is in the parish of Boleskine - Registration District No.92. Try that. Regards, Iain McKenzie >> Iain are you any releation to Charlie MacKenzie from Inverness, the cabinet maker. Dave

In a message dated 28/08/00 10:14:34 AM Central Daylight Time, mmrbm@ameritech.net writes: << As a child I heard that the 7th son of a 7th son was psychic -- I think the term my grandmother (Jane) used was, "could see things." I never knew whether this bit of superstition came from the Scot or German sides of her ancestry. (She was the 7th child of a 7th son and seemed to know in advance when someone close to her was dying.) Perhaps this is the wrong list for this posting but my gr-grandmother, Jane MacDonald MacLean came from Skye. Marion Markham >> It is called " The Second Sight" and it is believed in by a lot of people. Dave M.

Foyers is in the parish of Boleskine - Registration District No.92. Try that. Regards, Iain McKenzie ---------- > From: MSte295632@aol.com > To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: [SCT-INV-L] Foyers > Date: 28 August 2000 19:45 > > I have the 1881 census CD and am looking for the village of FOYERS . Can SKS > please tell me how to view the Foyers census, also was Upper Foyers and > Foyers seperate villages in 1881.I have entered Foyers and other villages > nearby but cannot get anything on screen, did the village come under a nearby > village for census purposes? > Any help most welcome. > Michael in Worthing West Sussex >

Hello all, I am trying to trace the roots of my great grandmother Jean Grant. The info I have to date is as follows:- Born to a Scottish father and an Irish mother in Inverness in c 1835 Married William BAKER in Melbourne Australia. They were there with the 40th Regiment of Foot, British Army. Regards to all of you Harold DRIVER (Australia) _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com.

I have the 1881 census CD and am looking for the village of FOYERS . Can SKS please tell me how to view the Foyers census, also was Upper Foyers and Foyers seperate villages in 1881.I have entered Foyers and other villages nearby but cannot get anything on screen, did the village come under a nearby village for census purposes? Any help most welcome. Michael in Worthing West Sussex

I was interested in Jen's posting about bad-luck names, because Jane was the bad-luck name in my family and my grandmother was very upset when we named our daughter Jane. Have noticed in tracing my Scot ancestors in the US that all the Janes called themselves Jennie. A connection? Now a question about another belief. As a child I heard that the 7th son of a 7th son was psychic -- I think the term my grandmother (Jane) used was, "could see things." I never knew whether this bit of superstition came from the Scot or German sides of her ancestry. (She was the 7th child of a 7th son and seemed to know in advance when someone close to her was dying.) Perhaps this is the wrong list for this posting but my gr-grandmother, Jane MacDonald MacLean came from Skye. Marion Markham

Do not expect the naming patterns to be applied too rigidly in the past 100 years or so. In my own family, my grandmother was convinced that the name Roderick, the next on the list for a son, always brought bad luck in our family, so, when my uncle was born they called the dog Roderick and my uncle was christened Alexander. Regards, Iain Mckenzie ---------- > From: Jennifer Lambert Tracey <jtracey@heritagearchaeology.com.au> > To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: RE: [SCT-INV-L] Help- Scottish Naming Patterns > Date: 28 August 2000 04:16 > > My sincere thanks to the many people who have replied with details of the > Scottish Naming Patterns. I really do appreciate your help. Now it is just a > case of seeing if this family of ours complied with tradition! > > Best wishes, > Jen > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Jennifer Lambert Tracey > HERITAGE ARCHAEOLOGY > Archaeological & Heritage Assessment Consultants > PO Box 4265 > KINGSTON ACT 2604 AUSTRALIA > Tel / Fax: (02) 6295 6795 > Mobile Tel: 0419 011 860 > http://www.heritagearchaeology.com.au > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AEnone McRae-Clift [mailto:aenone@globalfreeway.com.au] > Sent: Saturday, 26 August 2000 3:07 PM > To: Jennifer Lambert Tracey; SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [SCT-INV-L] Help- Scottish Naming Patterns > > > Hello Jen, > I found this among my many "useful" printout lists for genealogy. I think it > is the Scottish naming pattern: > > 1st Son after Paternal Grandfather. > 2nd son after Maternal Grandfather. > 3rd son after Father. > 4th son after Father's brother. > and so on until no brothers left, then moving on to the mother's > brothers,etc. > > 1st daughter after Maternal Grandmother. > 2nd daughter after Paternal Grandmother. > 3rd daughter after Mother. > 4th daughter after Mother's sister. > and so on, until no sisters left, then moving on to Father's sisters,etc. > > Hope this helps. > Cheers from Tasmania > AEnone. > > >

I have received the following information from a search of pension records for William Mcintosh. >From Bob O'Hara," I searched the pension records in WO22/131 and WO22/132, which are returns for Inverness for 1842-52 and 1852-62. The returns record any changes to pension payments in their district. This includes deaths, admissions, and people moving in or out of the pension district. There are no lists of people receiving a pension. I went through the above two volumes, and found several men by the name of William McIntosh: 1. W.M. of 93rd regiment, admitted to pension 8 October 1834, transferred to Inverness district June 1848 (from N. Argyle), transferred to N. Argyle June 1850. 2. W.M. of 5th Garrison Battalion, admitted to pension 27 July 1808, died 21 December 1847, age 86. 3. W.M. of 79th regiment, admitted 20 March 1816, pension renewed February 1853, died 29 July 1859, age 72. 4. W.M. of 73rd regiment, admitted 5 July 1820, died 4 March 1856, age 71. 5. Sergeant W.M. of Inverness Militia, admitted 11 November 1835, died 8 May 1858, age 63. 6. W.M. of 93rd, admitted 24 August 1858. 7. W.M. of 42nd regiment, admitted to pension 24 June 1845. " William McIntosh (No 1) above was born in Urquhart in 1795 and it was he, I was interested in. I have posted the list in case it is of interest to someone. Cheers, John http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~johnmc46lc/

My sincere thanks to the many people who have replied with details of the Scottish Naming Patterns. I really do appreciate your help. Now it is just a case of seeing if this family of ours complied with tradition! Best wishes, Jen ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Jennifer Lambert Tracey HERITAGE ARCHAEOLOGY Archaeological & Heritage Assessment Consultants PO Box 4265 KINGSTON ACT 2604 AUSTRALIA Tel / Fax: (02) 6295 6795 Mobile Tel: 0419 011 860 http://www.heritagearchaeology.com.au ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -----Original Message----- From: AEnone McRae-Clift [mailto:aenone@globalfreeway.com.au] Sent: Saturday, 26 August 2000 3:07 PM To: Jennifer Lambert Tracey; SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [SCT-INV-L] Help- Scottish Naming Patterns Hello Jen, I found this among my many "useful" printout lists for genealogy. I think it is the Scottish naming pattern: 1st Son after Paternal Grandfather. 2nd son after Maternal Grandfather. 3rd son after Father. 4th son after Father's brother. and so on until no brothers left, then moving on to the mother's brothers,etc. 1st daughter after Maternal Grandmother. 2nd daughter after Paternal Grandmother. 3rd daughter after Mother. 4th daughter after Mother's sister. and so on, until no sisters left, then moving on to Father's sisters,etc. Hope this helps. Cheers from Tasmania AEnone.