Hi everyone, I am looking information on my grandfather's family - MacINNES My grandfather, Michael McINNES was born in 1904 in Boisdale, South Uist to Duncan McINNES and Mary McINNES (m.s. McINNES). He grew up in Ru Ban (RhDhu Ban) near the town of Eriskay, South Uist before coming to Canada in 1928. He traveled to Canada with two other men also with the last name of McInnes but of no relation to him. His father Duncan McINNES was born in 1862 in Boisdale to Donald McINNES and Margaret McINNES (m.s. McINNES). He was listed on the 1881 census in Ru Ban, South Uist with his mother Margaret McINNES and sister Marion. He died in 1938. His mother Mary McINNES was born in 1864 in Boisdale to Donald McINNES and Merion McINNES (m.s. MCPHEE). She was listed on the 1881 census in the Town of Eriskay, South Uist with her parents and siblings. She died in 1928. Would love to hear from anyone with possible connections. Regards, Dawn T. BC, Canada

Dear Dave, How do titles like Earl or Sir work? Do they extinguish with death or are they hereditary? Thank You. Regards, Mike - -------------------------- Subject: Re: [SCT-INV-L] Re: New Campbell Chief????. Resent-Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 14:57:50 -0700 Resent-From: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 17:57:39 EDT From: ScotHeritage@aol.com To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com I just got this off of Rueters. Thought all might be interested. LONDON (Reuters) - A Hungarian former taxi driver living in Budapest has emerged as the heir to a Scottish earldom, according to the genealogist who unearthed his claim. Huba Andras Campbell, 55 -- who grew up in poverty in rural communist Hungary and is now a trucker and car importer -- is next in line to the earldom of Breadalbane and Holland, genealogist Robert Noble told the Daily Telegraph Tuesday. The Hungarian's noble lineage stems from his great grandfather's marriage to a descendant of the Marquess of Huntly in 1873 while he was building bridges across the Danube, the genealogist said. "The family knew of the Scottish connection, but had no idea that they were now the most senior line," he said. But even if it is successful, Campbell's claim, being prepared by a Scottish peerage lawyer, will yield only the title of the earldom, which dates back to 1681. The Campbell clan were once one of the biggest landowners in Scotland, but their wealth and lands declined over the years and the last of the clan's estate was sold off in the 1980s Dave

Could someone help me to get a complete copy of these 2 Census rolls? Peter in CA

I know there is a Roman Catholic and Presbyterian cemetry over on the Island in the middle of the Glen and thought there was one up the back of the Church in the abandoned town of Mingarry. Peter At 01:43 PM 10/3/00 -0400, you wrote: >This posting and request on the Inverness, Scotland, site asks for MacIsaac >headstone information at Mingarry. It is interesting in that I've never >heard that there is a cemetery there. > >I've stayed at the Yuzon Holiday Lodge/B&B (the latter is the old Rectory or >"Manse" as they call it) right next door to the church five times, have >talked with any number of people in the area about MacIsaac, Gillis, >MacDonald and MacLeod families and never heard of a cemetery. > >Perhaps Bill Green, who lives about an hour away from there, may know if >there is one. > >Dick MacLeod >Return-Path: <SCT-INVERNESS-D-request@rootsweb.com> >Received: from rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (rly-zc01.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.1]) >by air-zc05.mail.aol.com (v76_r1.8) with ESMTP; Tue, 03 Oct 2000 04:01:34 -0400 >Received: from lists6.rootsweb.com (lists6.rootsweb.com [63.92.80.125]) >by rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (v75_b3.9) with ESMTP; Tue, 03 Oct 2000 04:01:15 -0400 >Received: (from slist@localhost) > by lists6.rootsweb.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) id e9380jp10126; > Tue, 3 Oct 2000 01:00:45 -0700 >Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2000 01:00:45 -0700 >Message-Id: <200010030800.e9380jp10126@lists6.rootsweb.com> >From: SCT-INVERNESS-D-request@rootsweb.com >Subject: SCT-INVERNESS-D Digest V00 #290 >X-Loop: SCT-INVERNESS-D@rootsweb.com >X-Mailing-List: <SCT-INVERNESS-D@rootsweb.com> archive/volume00/290 >Precedence: list >MIME-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" >To: SCT-INVERNESS-D@rootsweb.com >Reply-To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com >X-Mailer: Unknown > >Content-Type: text/plain >To: undisclosed-recipients:; >MIME-Version: 1.0 > >SCT-INVERNESS-D Digest Volume 00 : Issue 290 > >Today's Topics: > #1 [SCT-INV-L] Mail Returned [Marion Markham > <mmrbm@ameritech.ne] > #2 [SCT-INV-L] St. Mary's Roman Catho ["Peter J. McDonald" > <peter_mcdonal] > #3 [SCT-INV-L] George Murdoff ["Donald Russell" > <donruss@QuixNet.] > #4 [SCT-INV-L] Re: McLean [mclean@ctaz.com] > >Administrivia: >To unsubscribe from SCT-INVERNESS-D, send a message to > > SCT-INVERNESS-D-request@rootsweb.com > >that contains in the body of the message the command > > unsubscribe > >and no other text. No subject line is necessary, but if your software >requires one, just use unsubscribe in the subject, too. > >______________________________ >X-Message: #1 >Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2000 08:12:11 -0500 >From: Marion Markham <mmrbm@ameritech.net> >To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com >Message-Id: <4.2.0.58.20001002080933.00992360@127.0.0.1> >Subject: [SCT-INV-L] Mail Returned >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >MIME-Version: 1.0 > > >Has anyone else had this problem? This may be the reason I have not heard >from a few people on the list that I emailed directly. >I still have the ameritech. net address but I also have mmrbm@juno.com if >anyone is having trouble reaching me. > >Computers, bah! > >Marion > >______________________________ > >X-Message: #2 >Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2000 15:15:41 -0700 >From: "Peter J. McDonald" <peter_mcdonald@sftw.com> >To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com >Message-id: <4.3.1.2.20001002150541.00c00660@mailhost.sftw.com> >Subject: [SCT-INV-L] St. Mary's Roman Catholic Cemetry, Mingarry >Ardnamurchan, Inverness-shire >Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >MIME-Version: 1.0 > > >Has anyone out there completed a tombstone inventory of the headstones at >the St. Mary's Roman Catholic Church at Mingarry? Before 1832 they were >not allowed to write them down in a register. >I am looking for the headstone of little Duncan M'Isaak/Macisaac.... >Peter >+Sometime in 1852 before the Macisaac's left Scotland, they changed their >name to McDonald and left for Geelong, Victoria on the "Allison" with the >Highland and Island Emigration Society. >_____________________________________________________________________________ >1841 Census Ardnamurchan, Acharacle, Inverness (Taken, 7 June 1841) >Address, Kylesmore (Acharacle) 1/2 acre Crofter >- >------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Angus MacIsaac age 45, Agricultural labourer, born in the county ..b1795c >Mary MacIsaac age 40, born in the county >...................................b1799c, (McDonald) >John MacIsaac age 15, born in the county >....................................b1822c >Roger (sic) MacIsaac age 15, born in the county >...........................b1824c >Mary MacIsaac age 12, born in the county >....................................b1830c >Duncan Macisaac (See Below) b1831 >Donald MacIsaac age 7, born in the county >....................................b1834c >John MacIsaac age 5, born in the county >.......................................b1836c >Catherine MacIsaac age 2, born in the county >................................b1839c >_______________________________________________________________________________ >1851 Census Ardnamurchan, Acharacle, Moidart, Inverness-shire (Taken 30th >March 1851) >Address, Kylemore (Acharacle) 1/2 acre Crofter >- >---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Angus McIsaac age 63, Agricultural labourer, born in the county >...........b1795c >Mary McIsaac age 52, born in the county >............................................b1799c, (McDonald) >John McIsaac age 28, born in the county ... >.......................................b1822c >Rodrick (sic) McIsaac age 26, born in the county .. >...............................b1824c >Mary McIsaac age 21, born in the >county ............................................b1830c ><(Donald McIsaac age 17, born in the county missing from household....b1834c> >John McIsaac age 14, born in the >county .............................................b1836c >Catherine McIsaac age 12, born in the county >.......................................b1839c >Ronald McIsaac age 9, born in the county >.............................................b1842c >___________________________________________________________________________________ >The Roman Catholic Baptismal Register of Mingarry in Moidart, first >recording, 1829. >___________________________________________________________________________________ >1) "John McIsaac, born 19 March 1836, the lawful child of Angus McIsaac >and of Mary McDonald, >Kylesmore, was baptised by me 21 March 1836; sponsor was John McDonald, >Merchant Kylesmore >Alexr. McDonald Priest" >2) "Ranald lawful son of Angus McIsaac and Mary McDonald, Caolas, born 17 >Augt 1841 was baptised by me on the 18th, ditto, Sponsor was John >McDonald, Dorlin (?) Ranald Rankin (priest)" Portphilip 1852 >3) "Catherine lawful daughter of Angus McDonald and Mary McDonald, >Caolasmore was born on 11 November and baptised 20th November 1838, >Sponsors Archy and Ann McDonald, Glenuig" >_____________________________________________________________________________________ >1831 >4) "April 10, I have this day baptised Duncan MacIsaac, born same day the >son of A----- MacIsaac and Mary McDonald his wife residing at >Kylesmore, Allan MacDonald residing at Kylesbeg being Sponsor" >_______________________________________________________________________________________ > >______________________________ > >X-Message: #3 >Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 22:17:12 -0600 >From: "Donald Russell" <donruss@QuixNet.net> >To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com >Message-ID: <000b01c02cf0$cfc45e60$86a82581@don> >Subject: [SCT-INV-L] George Murdoff >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >MIME-Version: 1.0 > >Looking for George Murdoff and Nancy Agnes Murdoff, Son Born John Murdoff, >1772. Regards Don > >______________________________ >X-Message: #4 >Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2000 22:04:35 -0700 >From: mclean@ctaz.com >To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com >Message-Id: <200010030513.e935DtA07251@newmail.rootsweb.com> >Subject: [SCT-INV-L] Re: McLean >Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII >Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT >MIME-Version: 1.0 > >Can anyone help us find out what happened to some people who >arrived on the ship The Sarah in 1801? Looking for info on Donald >and Mary McLean (possible children for this couple are John, >Catherine, William); also William and Margaret McLean (prob. >Donald's parents). William was listed as a farmer; Donald is listed >as a laborer on the passenger list. > >Any help is as always appreciated, >Rob McLean

I just got this off of Rueters. Thought all might be interested. LONDON (Reuters) - A Hungarian former taxi driver living in Budapest has emerged as the heir to a Scottish earldom, according to the genealogist who unearthed his claim. Huba Andras Campbell, 55 -- who grew up in poverty in rural communist Hungary and is now a trucker and car importer -- is next in line to the earldom of Breadalbane and Holland, genealogist Robert Noble told the Daily Telegraph Tuesday. The Hungarian's noble lineage stems from his great grandfather's marriage to a descendant of the Marquess of Huntly in 1873 while he was building bridges across the Danube, the genealogist said. "The family knew of the Scottish connection, but had no idea that they were now the most senior line," he said. But even if it is successful, Campbell's claim, being prepared by a Scottish peerage lawyer, will yield only the title of the earldom, which dates back to 1681. The Campbell clan were once one of the biggest landowners in Scotland, but their wealth and lands declined over the years and the last of the clan's estate was sold off in the 1980s Dave

Peter, Certainly there is the cemetery at Eilean Fhianain (St. Finnian's Island) in Loch Shiel -- at the end of the track from the main road (A861) by Dalelea just north and east of Mingarry. It is said to be the oldest cemetery in the British Isles still in use. The Chapel alter still has a cup on it secured with a small chain that's been there as long as anyone can recall. I visited the Island for a couple of hours in 1997 when a kind foreman at the salmon fisheries site by Dalelea had a guy give me a ride out on his powerboat. There are a lot of MacDonalds but I don't recall any MacIsaacs among the headstones -- but that was my first few days on my first trip into the Highlands and the Mingarry-Moidart-Arisaig area. Worth another visit if someone doesn't already have a list. I'm retired US Air Force (not a pilot). While I was out there on the Island, two jet fighters flew over at about 100-200 feet. I turned and shouted to the empty island: "That's a salute from the present to any relatives and friends of theirs who may be buried here!" A local guy in Mingarry (current area by the church) said he'd take me to the old Mingarry and several other deserted villages on his motorcycle next time I go over. He didn't say anything about a cemetery, but that would be an exciting find if there are extant headstones. If you don't already have it, perhaps your bookstore has (or you can order) the Arisaig & Lochaber map #50 in the Bartholomew map series. [John Bartholomew & Son LTD, Duncan St., Edinburgh EH9 1TA Scotland.] This is quite a detailed map and shows all of the MacDonald lands from Loch Shiel to Morar, including the Isles of Eigg and Muck, plus the entire Ardnamurchan Peninsula in the south and Glenelg in the north. Dick MacLeod

In message <200010030513.e935DtA07251@newmail.rootsweb.com>, mclean@ctaz.com writes >Can anyone help us find out what happened to some people who >arrived on the ship The Sarah in 1801? Looking for info on Donald >and Mary McLean (possible children for this couple are John, >Catherine, William); also William and Margaret McLean (prob. >Donald's parents). William was listed as a farmer; Donald is listed >as a laborer on the passenger list. > >Any help is as always appreciated, >Rob McLean > Hi did I miss something ? Where did they arrive ? Or even where did they leave from ? -- George D. Christie " Change is not made without inconvenience, even from worse to better "

Can anyone help us find out what happened to some people who arrived on the ship The Sarah in 1801? Looking for info on Donald and Mary McLean (possible children for this couple are John, Catherine, William); also William and Margaret McLean (prob. Donald's parents). William was listed as a farmer; Donald is listed as a laborer on the passenger list. Any help is as always appreciated, Rob McLean

Looking for George Murdoff and Nancy Agnes Murdoff, Son Born John Murdoff, 1772. Regards Don

Has anyone out there completed a tombstone inventory of the headstones at the St. Mary's Roman Catholic Church at Mingarry? Before 1832 they were not allowed to write them down in a register. I am looking for the headstone of little Duncan M'Isaak/Macisaac.... Peter +Sometime in 1852 before the Macisaac's left Scotland, they changed their name to McDonald and left for Geelong, Victoria on the "Allison" with the Highland and Island Emigration Society. _____________________________________________________________________________ 1841 Census Ardnamurchan, Acharacle, Inverness (Taken, 7 June 1841) Address, Kylesmore (Acharacle) 1/2 acre Crofter - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Angus MacIsaac age 45, Agricultural labourer, born in the county ..b1795c Mary MacIsaac age 40, born in the county ...................................b1799c, (McDonald) John MacIsaac age 15, born in the county ....................................b1822c Roger (sic) MacIsaac age 15, born in the county ...........................b1824c Mary MacIsaac age 12, born in the county ....................................b1830c Duncan Macisaac (See Below) b1831 Donald MacIsaac age 7, born in the county ....................................b1834c John MacIsaac age 5, born in the county .......................................b1836c Catherine MacIsaac age 2, born in the county ................................b1839c _______________________________________________________________________________ 1851 Census Ardnamurchan, Acharacle, Moidart, Inverness-shire (Taken 30th March 1851) Address, Kylemore (Acharacle) 1/2 acre Crofter - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Angus McIsaac age 63, Agricultural labourer, born in the county ...........b1795c Mary McIsaac age 52, born in the county ............................................b1799c, (McDonald) John McIsaac age 28, born in the county ... .......................................b1822c Rodrick (sic) McIsaac age 26, born in the county .. ...............................b1824c Mary McIsaac age 21, born in the county ............................................b1830c <(Donald McIsaac age 17, born in the county missing from household....b1834c> John McIsaac age 14, born in the county .............................................b1836c Catherine McIsaac age 12, born in the county .......................................b1839c Ronald McIsaac age 9, born in the county .............................................b1842c ___________________________________________________________________________________ The Roman Catholic Baptismal Register of Mingarry in Moidart, first recording, 1829. ___________________________________________________________________________________ 1) "John McIsaac, born 19 March 1836, the lawful child of Angus McIsaac and of Mary McDonald, Kylesmore, was baptised by me 21 March 1836; sponsor was John McDonald, Merchant Kylesmore Alexr. McDonald Priest" 2) "Ranald lawful son of Angus McIsaac and Mary McDonald, Caolas, born 17 Augt 1841 was baptised by me on the 18th, ditto, Sponsor was John McDonald, Dorlin (?) Ranald Rankin (priest)" Portphilip 1852 3) "Catherine lawful daughter of Angus McDonald and Mary McDonald, Caolasmore was born on 11 November and baptised 20th November 1838, Sponsors Archy and Ann McDonald, Glenuig" _____________________________________________________________________________________ 1831 4) "April 10, I have this day baptised Duncan MacIsaac, born same day the son of A----- MacIsaac and Mary McDonald his wife residing at Kylesmore, Allan MacDonald residing at Kylesbeg being Sponsor" _______________________________________________________________________________________

Has anyone else had this problem? This may be the reason I have not heard from a few people on the list that I emailed directly. I still have the ameritech. net address but I also have mmrbm@juno.com if anyone is having trouble reaching me. Computers, bah! Marion

Hello Sorry to do this but if Marion Markham is still on this list, I keep getting mail returned that I send to her. They are going to keep trying it until Friday, Oct. 6. Just wanted to let her know. Thanks Lorraine Ottawa, Canada Marion Markham <mmrbm@ameritech.net

Hello fellow listers, I wonder if SKS with access to 1851 census or beyond (not 1881) might be able to look up an Alexander Mackenzie born Kirkhill, Inverness 1839. His parents are Kenneth and Janet McKenzie, and with possible siblings Margaret, Janet and Kenneth. I have the 1881 census at home, and Alexander is not on there, although his wife, Mary and his 2 sons are. His sons were born 1867/1869 so it looks like he died sometime between 69 and 81 (or maybe he was just out of the house). The 1881 census has them living in Inverness, Inverness. So if anyone has anything in Inverness or Kirkhill I would be very grateful. As a sideline, are the censuses (1841 onwards) freely available online, or are they available to purchase. I know about Scots origins but it's best to widen my options. Many thanks Alan Mackenzie

Hello Everyone: Sorry to post this on the list, but I would appreciate it if anyone has the words to this song and could reply to me off-list rather than clog things up. We are planning a little family show for my grandsons as they did one for us. This would be much appreciated, I have searched the web and asked all my Scottish friends. Thanks Lorraine Ottawa, Canada MacTavish was Pipe Major in the Highland Scot's Brigade. He's the pride of Bonnie Scotland so they say, But what made the Jerry's run, it was not his tommy gun, 'Twas the toorie on his bonnet, the red toorie on it. His red Toorie-oor-ie-oor-ie-ay. And when swinging into action, he's the centre of attraction da da da da da da -----------------??????????

Now I know about the HEIS ships to Australia (their on my webpage) - <grin> but I've been trying to find out more about the HEIC (Honorable East Indian Company - Merchant Ships....in particular I'm looking for any documentation showing that the British hired them from HEIC in 1749 for transportation to Halifax, Nova Scotia.....it seems that there is some confusion as during the same time period there were also British Navy Ships (with the same names - no less) as the HEIC ships..... The names of the specific ships that I'm looking for are shown on my webpage at http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/bryanfkeddy/immigrantships.html and in particular - my main search is on the Winchelsea - as this is the ship that my Keddy ancestors came here on - and I am hoping if I find out enough information to start building a scale model over the winter.... Any help would be appreciated, but I've been in contact with a number of researchers in England and haven't had much luck yet.... Thanks, Bryan Keddy Halifax, N.S. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi all, I am going off line for a while. We have sold our home and must now pack up and move. We are also going to visit family in Melbourne, Australia. I expect to back on line about mid Nov. Researching:- Kennedy, Cameron, MacDonald and McMillan in Gien Roy, Roy Bridge, Glen Spean and Brackletter. Regards to all and see you soon, Greg Blackburn in Paekakariki, soon to be in Raumati, New Zealand

Hello Listers, Can any Invernessian tell me anything about Donald Dallas, the singer/comedian whose records were popular in the 50's? I think that he might well have belonged to Inverness or somewhere towards Aberdeen. I would be delighted to hear again his "Looking for the Loch Ness Monster" etc. which I could add to my family tree sound archive. Bill.

Hi all, I too have come across this name change. I have found a family of MacDonalds in Donald Whyte's Dictionary of Scottish Immigrants to Canada, Vol. 1 and then when I looked in Vol. 2, they were listed as MacEachen alias MacDonald. Sure screwed my head up!! They were from the Isle of Eigg, by the way, Donald , John & Hector, three brothers, emigrated to Canada around 1802-1803 time frame. Sound familiar to anyone? Pat Marshall Nova Scotia ----- Original Message ----- From: Julie Mclean <mclean1@iprimus.com.au> To: <SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2000 4:40 PM Subject: Re: [SCT-INV-L] MacSorlies to Cameron, Macisaac to McDonald, name change > I have come across something similar Isobel McIlip became Isabel McDonald > after mariage and one child. > Does anyone know if Any more McDonalds became McIlip's or vise versa. > thanks Julie > -----Original Message----- > From: Jane Macgillivray <jane@providence2000.freeserve.co.uk> > To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com <SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com> > Date: Monday, September 25, 2000 5:33 PM > Subject: Re: [SCT-INV-L] MacSorlies to Cameron, Macisaac to McDonald, name > change > > > >>That was interesting with the change of last name. That happened to my > >>family also.... See below. Was this a common practice back then? I also > >>noticed a lot of MacVarish's in the 1841 and 51 census, I do not see them > >>today. > > > >Whence the expression to Varish into thin air. Sorry, couldn't resist. > > > > >

Dear Patricia and Peter, I would like some information on MCCaskil-MacDonald, but it would seem to be a different couple: > There was a familyof MacAskills in Harris in early 19th century, John MacAskill married to Christina Munro with children Murdo, Janet, Christina, John, Mary. > > Mudo emigrated to Cape Breton, Christina and John to Nova Scotia. > > There was a related MacDonald family in Harris, with daughter Helen who married Hugh MacDonald. They too went to Nova Scotia. Does anybody have mention of them? I would be grateful if you have any info, Jane -----Original Message----- From: Peter J. McDonald <peter_mcdonald@sftw.com> To: SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com <SCT-INVERNESS-L@rootsweb.com> Date: 27 September 2000 03:41 Subject: Re: [SCT-INV-L] north uist >Hi Patricia, >You can see the ship he came out on "HMS Hercules" at >http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/bryanfkeddy/HIES1.html >Peter >At 04:48 PM 9/26/00 +1000, Darren and Mary Flowers wrote: >>hi >>am new to this and am interested in hearing from anyone that may have >>macaskill or macdonald in their family trees. my margaret macaskill >>married james macdonald on board HMS Hercules at Campbeltown Dec 1852 >>prior to arrival in south australia july 1853. james was a >>stowaway. believe several macaskills stayed at north uist - not too sure >>about james - his father was alexander >>hopeful for any news >>patricia flowers >>broken hill nsw australia > >______________________________

Hello Listers My great grandmother Jane was born in Inverness c. 1835. My information shows that she was half Irish-half Scottish. Which half we do not know. The best guess I can make is that her father was Irish, i.e. STUTHERS and her mother GRANT, of course Scottish. Can anyone help me discover the absolute truth? You are all wonderful. Harold from too far away to look myself. Adelaide Australia.